HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s - page 454.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: plasmoske on November 08, 2013, 12:50:27 AM

Gen2 sometime in march, altech/knc announcing work already underway on 16/20nm designs.

Yes it was an assumption on my part. It may not be 16nm (looking now - too early/costly) but I think knc will have something to announce soon for 2014. 20nm in march might be a stretch but nothing is impossible.

Well TSMC 20nm line starting in 2014 is CLN20SOC, for low powered devices (think mobile phones, <10W, system on a chip type designs). TSMC high performance 20nm line won't be available til Q3-2014 and even then prices are extremely high and availability very limited. So yes I would say impossible not a stretch but we will see.

Maybe I should make a wager on bitbet could probably clean up.

plasmoske

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The realist

Gen2 sometime in march, altech/knc announcing work already underway on 16/20nm designs.

Yes it was an assumption on my part. It may not be 16nm (looking now - too early/costly) but I think knc will have something to announce soon for 2014. 20nm in march might be a stretch but nothing is impossible.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Volume just means non-prototype. The article I linked to was a month old. There are plenty of similar ones only days old. The number of 20nm designs for the entire year is a couple dozen. Did KNC secure one of those coveted slots I doubt it given the number of industry giants who likely will be excluded from 20nm in 2014.

Still your first claim was:

Quote

KNC also looking to come out with their 16/20nm miner around March 2014.

I think we can agree
a) KNC said nothing of the such
b) March isn't even a possibility for 20nm.
c) 2014 isn't even a possibility for 16nm.

I put money on 2015 at the earliest you may disagree but at least you admit than any 1620nm in ~~March~~ sometime in 2014 is your assumption not a statement by KNC.

plasmoske

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Quote

TSMC has taped out several 20nm chips and expects to let customers start designing 16nm FinFET chips before the end of the year. By the end of 2014 it expects it will have taped out 25 20nm designs and be far along in work on 30 16nm chips.

Your article is about ~~9 months old~~ 20 days old (curse you american dates). Read mine which is the latest and most accurate. They're not expecting 20nm tapeouts for late 2014 anymore. That's old news.

Quote

TSMC also revealed plans to initiate volume production of 20nm chips in early 2014

vol·ume (vlym, -ym)
4. A large amount.

Yeah kncminer hasn't directly said anything yet but, they already working on the designs so I think there might be something to announce soon for 2014. Otherwise what's the point of designing one so early.

And their partner alchip ain't no small player.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Or a 2015 thing.

Quote

Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co. is making steady progress on its next two nodes, bringing advances in performance and low power. The bad news is it's widely expected the latest nodes add less transistor density and more cost than in the past.

TSMC has taped out several 20nm chips and expects to let customers start designing 16nm FinFET chips before the end of the year. By the end of 2014 it expects it will have taped out 25 20nm designs and be far along in work on 30 16nm chips.

http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1319679

Let that sink in. TSMC expect by the end of next year to only have taped out two dozen designs. Now think about all the billion dollar semiconductor companies in the world, AMD, NVidia, NXP, Infineon, Texas Instruments, etc. TSMC isn't talking about thousands of 20nm chip tapeouts or even hundreds but a staggering two dozen to be taped out by the end of the year.

16/14nm isn't even a possibility for 2014. The only one who will have it is Intel who spends $10B a year on R&D and builds their own fabs. Even Intel is pushing back 16nm chips to the later half of 2014 due to yield issues. So saying 16nm and 2014 in the same sentence even with "maybe" is just wrong.

TSMC is just starting production 20nm in Q3-2014. It has never been done before, costs will be extremely high, tons of risk, yields are unknown, double patterning will be required for the first time which present a whole host of design and production challenges, and we are talking about two dozen designs for the entire planet. Still think KNC said they will have a 20/16nm chip in 2014? (Hint: they didn't.)

plasmoske

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The realist

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on November 07, 2013, 11:47:35 PM

Well KNC will be droppping 2.5 PH/s in Nov so I think difficulty will do "something".

Well that's already expected to happen and I think well known to everyone. Just stating that now HF is delayed, difficulty won't go up too much (over the expected) otherwise it would've been a bloodbath.

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on November 07, 2013, 11:47:35 PM

KNC never said they are looking to launch 16 or 20 nm miner in March 2014. TSMC isn't even looking to do tapeouts of 16nm in 2014 so unless KNC is going to build their own $15B fab that timeline is impossible. Of course KNC never claimed something so silly.

Indeed they did not but they did state a long time ago that by around that time, they would be looking to do a gen2 chip. I'm assuming it would have to do something with 16 or 20nm since they did the announcement few days back. Their partner is Alchip who has connection/access to pretty much every major foundry out there (with access to 18 to 20nm tech). http://www.alchip.com/about_partnership.php?url=4

You're probably right about the 16nm not happening in March. I think that's more of a late 2014 thing. Most likely it'll be 20nm if it ever happens (or even 18nm (not at TSMC)).

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20131022PD211.html

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:HA-FvV2foBgJ:www.digitimes.com:8080/news/a20131022PD211.html+http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20131022PD211.html&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au

Visesrion

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GIF by SOCIFI

Quote from: HashFast on November 07, 2013, 07:18:52 PM

Quote from: Visesrion on November 07, 2013, 06:14:14 PM

Now they do not upload this update to their webpage ? Or they do not post the same thing in twitter every 2 hours ?

I suppose they will wait to have the photos of the wafers and then upload them and they wont say a word of the delays. This marketing strategies seems quite ilegal to me. There is no somewhere we can go to at least shut down their webpage so they do not engage someone else ?

They could send us more emails if they want, the updates are useless same as the order chain and the hashfast customer help, so the only reason to have the webpage is to catch up more customers

By the way they will post photos soon... I think this sounds familiar to me....

The shipping dates in the website have been updated.

-The HashFast Team

Where ?

I do not see this update into you blog...

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: plasmoske on November 07, 2013, 11:08:52 PM

Oh well at least we know the difficulty won't be going up too much over the next 30+ days.

Well KNC will be droppping 2.5 PH/s in Nov so I think difficulty will do "something".

Quote

KNC also looking to come out with their 16/20nm miner around March 2014. So that's something to watch out for.

KNC never said they are looking to launch 16 or 20 nm miner in March 2014. TSMC isn't even looking to do tapeouts of 16nm in 2014 so unless KNC is going to build their own $15B fab that timeline is impossible. Of course KNC never claimed something so silly.

plasmoske

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The realist

Damn looks like HF customers are pretty screwed.

Oh well at least we know the difficulty won't be going up too much over the next 30+ days.

Tell you what's going to happen. That mid-dec shipping estimate date is most likely going to turn into mid-Jan shipping. Watch as all the parts come towards mid-Dec and then assemble and stuff can't happen due to the xmas/new years~1-2 weeks break nearly every assembly plant/manufacturer has.

And that is just batch 1 customers.

KNC also looking to come out with their 16/20nm miner around March 2014. So that's something to watch out for.

DPoS

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Quote from: cedivad on November 07, 2013, 10:33:50 PM

Quote from: Minor Miner on November 07, 2013, 10:19:35 PM

I would like a question answered though. Am I reading correctly that the wafers were only FINISHED yesterday and will only get to the packager tomorrow?
Doesn't that mean (considering TSMC has a completely transparent portal allowing customers to see their wafers progress) that HF has known the date of the wafers coming out of the fab for 30-60 days? I would appreciate a company rep answering this.

That is why with the TSMC contract in hand, disclosed by a judge, they will be proved scammers.

mining cryptos is like alley dice game.. no judge will bother

cedivad

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Quote from: Minor Miner on November 07, 2013, 10:19:35 PM

I would like a question answered though. Am I reading correctly that the wafers were only FINISHED yesterday and will only get to the packager tomorrow?
Doesn't that mean (considering TSMC has a completely transparent portal allowing customers to see their wafers progress) that HF has known the date of the wafers coming out of the fab for 30-60 days? I would appreciate a company rep answering this.

That is why with the TSMC contract in hand, disclosed by a judge, they will be proved scammers.

Minor Miner

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Be A Digital Miner

Just curious when we can expect another blog from Amy denigrating the competition on their timetable? Seems pretty petty now doesn't it?

I would like a question answered though. Am I reading correctly that the wafers were only FINISHED yesterday and will only get to the packager tomorrow?
Doesn't that mean (considering TSMC has a completely transparent portal allowing customers to see their wafers progress) that HF has known the date of the wafers coming out of the fab for 30-60 days? I would appreciate a company rep answering this.

starsoccer9

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Well I will ask the next logical question, Once the 90 days go by and it is not possible to ROI on the units how soon will hashfast give us our new modules to start mining with?

cedivad

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Knc everywhere on HF threads...
I can't disapprove this advertising, anyway.

j03

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Sounds like Hashfast customers are screwed. That sucks. Time is, of course, everything for mining. KnC was only 11 days late and for some of us it means no profit and just breaking even. I get to break even, yay. It's a pretty cool machine to show off to my friends, yeah!

You're gonna need at least a TH in hand by the end of the month or forget it. I'm currently at 0.5BTC per day with 552GH/s.

I'm curious to see if Cointerra will flop now too...

amer

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Quote from: HashFast on November 07, 2013, 07:18:52 PM

The shipping dates in the website have been updated.

-The HashFast Team

Where are the shipping dates?

Where is the "as part of our overall commitment to transparency, we’re posting a live schedule that will allow you to follow the progress of the rigs, and better anticipate when yours will arrive. We’ll be updating the schedule in real time as we get the latest information."

Where is the Batch 2 Order Chain?

Thanks in advance.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: Wesly on November 07, 2013, 08:25:35 PM

"For First Batch Baby Jets, the start date of the program will be retroactive to October 30th."

What exactly does that mean? It is clear that you will receive the extra MPP hash sooner, 90 days from Oct 30th, so around beginning of February. But how are they calculating the 90-day ROI when there is less than 90 days between the mid-December ship date and end of January? Are they calculating the 90-day ROI starting on Oct 30th as if you have received Baby Jets?

The MPP calculates what you would earn each day (based on hashrate and difficulty). Pretty clear that days prior to shipment will be 0 BTC. The days after shipment until 28 Jan (the end of 90 day window) will depend on hashrate and difficulty for each of those days.

Wesly

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"For First Batch Baby Jets, the start date of the program will be retroactive to October 30th."

What exactly does that mean? It is clear that you will receive the extra MPP hash sooner, 90 days from Oct 30th, so around beginning of February. But how are they calculating the 90-day ROI when there is less than 90 days between the mid-December ship date and end of January? Are they calculating the 90-day ROI starting on Oct 30th as if you have received Baby Jets?

Wesly

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Quote from: MrTeal on November 07, 2013, 05:50:37 PM

Quote from: starsoccer9 on November 07, 2013, 05:40:56 PM

Has someone done a nice chart yet if its is even possible to get a full ROI. Otherwise im going to start hoping they just dont deliver and refund in full BTC

Not withstanding what was said to one guy in a closed office, do you really think they are going to take a 200% loss refunding essentially every BTC payment batch 1 customer at $300/BTC (if the price stays the same until December) when most of them paid at $100/BTC?

That is a rhetorical question BTW, as this is a company that accepted orders under one set of Terms and Conditions, and then sent out order confirmations a week later with an updates terms link on the bottom that added a new "guaranteed" date to the end of the year all while claiming the new conditions apply retroactively and that refunds are not possible prior to then.

They'll do what they please.

You have the option of paying through Bitpay or directly to a HashFast's Bitcoin address when you placed an order.

HashFast kept 3,000 Bitcoins in this address and probably more in other addresses, so yes they can indeed afford to refund BTC for BTC without taking a loss.

https://blockchain.info/address/1KFrqkEGy6Yq7X4SYCbYoj8HEwfbWVUDJ9

Paladin69

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The worst part is the lack of refunds. I think that sucks to hold peoples money hostage until Dec 28th.

Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s - page 454. (Read 880816 times)