Topic: Health and Religion - page 45. (Read 210871 times)

''God, listening to the prayer of people, induces scientists through cause and effect, to build artificial limbs for people. '' So god does everything eh? He is also the responsible for people going to hell or being evil, therefore god is evil. End of the debate.

''The point is, we have a complete science fiction story about the age of the earth'' How ironic coming from someone who believes in the bible, science fiction heh.

We know that some are human fossils. We also know that they some of them could be animal fossils... and, indeed, some have proven to be animal in the past. We know that they could be diseased, mutated malformations of modern man. We know our dating system is very contradictory, and is a accepted as it is by arbitrary decision rather than absolute knowledge that it is even close to accurate. Some people simply choose to believe these things for the sake of choice.

The point is, we have a complete science fiction story about the age of the earth and evolution. When it is believed to be truth, it becomes religion.

The age-old Bible religion - and even Islam - have way better truth than science does with the prehistoric man fictional ideas.

Placebo effect has been around long before science.

God, listening to the prayer of people, induces scientists through cause and effect, to build artificial limbs for people.

Everything is absolutely God through C&E if not God through something else. God, in love, set Himself up to answer the requests of people, whether the requests are good or whether they are evil. But He has overcome the evil by preparing a life for all of us after this one, giving the people the thing they ask for, Heaven or Hell. So, the doctor's free will is in the way that he has faith in God, not in the things that he does.

The funny thing is, it takes a lot of prayer with knowledge of God the right way to pray a limb back, few if any people have ever done this kind of study and prayer.

The point is, religion and health go hand in hand whether or not science is included in the mix.

How did you determine that you are smarter than a lot of scientists? ''Placebo effect has cured more people than science could ever think of curing'' Placebo effect is science LOL.

''Absolutely church, but at least prayer to God, however, if I went to the doctor, it would still be God, not the doctor, doing any good work in me.''

Show me the last time praying gave someone its limb back.

So you claim it's god the one doing the work and the one that gets the credit if a doctor heals you because he created him and made him smart. Then when someone doesn't accept god or does evil things, it's also god's fault because he created him too, also doesn't the doctor have free will? Why are you saying it's god that did the work?

So what do you think the interpretation is lol, it's quite clear to me. We know they are human fossils and we have found many of them, we can also date them.

We should be very careful not to overstate our understanding of reality.

You are way off base.

You can't seem to get it through your head that it isn't the existence of fossils that is the point. The point is the interpretation of where they came from and why they exist. The story about the fossils is the fiction, not the fossils themselves.

You can't seem to get it through your head that it isn't the existence of fossils that is the point. The point is the interpretation of where they came from and why they exist. The story about the fossils is the fiction, not the fossils themselves.

Theoretical physicists and astrophysicists, investigating irregularities in the cosmic microwave background (the 'afterglow' of the Big Bang), have found there is substantial evidence supporting a holographic explanation of the universe—in fact, as much as there is for the traditional explanation of these irregularities using the theory of cosmic inflation.

I'm still waiting for you to tell me what religion has found out in the last 5000 years.

The list of inventions created in the Middle Ages would exhaust the patience of an historian. I will mention only in passing a few off the top of my head: the stirrup, the spur, the horse collar, the horse shoe, the wheelbarrow, the chimney, the paper mill, windmills, escapement and clockworks, the pointed arch, the flying buttress, the jib sail, the stern-mounted rudder, the button, the steel crossbow, the quadrant, the almanac, the hour glass, the eyeglass, oil paintings, and most important of all, the university.

While all cultures, even the most primitive have learning, and all civilizations have scholars, only the Christians ever invented the university, an self governing institution solely devoted to the investigation of the trivium and quadrivium. It is not coincidence that to this day the terms used for logical syllogisms and logical fallacies are in Latin; it is no coincidence that the scientific names for everything from beasts to chemicals is in Latin, the language of science.

One of the astonishing things I discovered after my conversion, or at least, it was an astonishment to me, was that nearly everything I knew about history was false. When England and Germany broke away politically, religiously and culturally as much as they could from the rest of the European civilization, they did their level best to rewrite and reinterpret history into a revised form that denigrated all the accomplishments of the universal and ecumenical catholic Christian Church, and offer alternate explanations or alternate origins for her accomplishments.

Under this revised history, or, to be precise, mythology, the Roman Empire fell due to the invasion of virile outer barbarians racially distinct from the Imperial civilization, and everything from free elections to chivalry toward women sprang from the barbaric rather that civilized sources.

Moreover, according to this mythology, the Middle Ages were a time of magic, when men burned witches; whereas the previous Hellenic civilization was a time of enlightened investigation of the natural world, a time of logic and philosophy.

Allow me to quote from my fellow science fiction writer and good friend Mike Flynn:

The philosophers of the “Age of Reason” called the Middle Ages the “Age of Faith,” and claimed that because “God did it!” was the answer to everything, no one searched for natural laws. Some have since imagined a “war” between science and religion, and accused the medievals of suppressing science, forbidding medical autopsies, and burning scientists. Bad times for science and reason!

Or was it? In fact, the Middle Ages were steeped in reason, logic, and natural philosophy. These subjects comprised virtually the entire curriculum of the universities. The first medical autopsies were done in medieval Europe. And no medieval philosopher was ever prosecuted for a conclusion in natural philosophy. In his twelfth-century Dragmaticon, William of Conches wrote, “[They say] ‘We do not know how this is, but we know that God can do it.’ You poor fools! God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so.” Not even the “Age of Reason” could have said it better.

Well, the most famous philosopher of the Hellenic culture, Socrates, was condemned to death for his investigations, while Aristotle fled into exile. The Hellenes were a people soaked in magic and mysticism, to which the clean intellectualism of Christianity was a shocking and refreshing change. Julian the Apostate, eager to reintroduce the Old Religion, in order to foretell the outcome of his war in Persia, had a slave girl disemboweled and her entrails examined by haruspices, official readers of entrails.

The reason why we think of the Greek as logical and philosophical culture is that the monks of the Dark Ages carefully preserved the ancient writings concerning grammar, rhetoric, logic, arithmetic, geometry, music and astronomy.

The monks did not preserve the mystery religions, the mysticism, no more than did the Romans after the conversion of the Empire preserve the barbaric customs and traditions of their pagan fathers, such as slavery, gladiatorial combat, exposing unwanted infants, the right of the father to kill disobedient sons, temple prostitution, temple sodomy prostitution, and no fault divorce.

The people the Church persecuted were not scientists. She upheld and supported the sciences—it was not the secular power, after all, that funded and founded the universities, that was all done by the Church. The people the Church persecuted were astrologers and alchemists. By clearing the strangling underbrush of magic away, the Church is the only thing that permitted science to exist at all.

The Church crushed astrology to allow astronomy to flourish. The oldest astronomical observatory still in use anywhere in the world, significantly enough, is the Vatican observatory.
...
Science arose in Christendom because it could arise nowhere else.

Allow me by way of introduction to quote again from the indispensable Mike Flynn

To summarize briefly, the Latins believed that:

The universe was rationally ordered because a single rational God had willed it into being,
This order was knowable by autonomous human reason by ‘measuring, numbering, and weighing’ (and reason could be trusted in this regard),
Matter could act directly on matter in “the common course of nature;” and because God was true to his promises, these actions were dependable and repeatable; and
The discovery of such relations was a worthwhile pursuit for adults.
They also embedded this pursuit in their culture through broad-based cultural institutions:

Creating independent, self-governing corporations in the social space between Church and State.
Accepting with enthusiasm the work of pagan philosophers and Muslim commentators and reconciling them with their religious beliefs.
Teaching logic, reason, and natural philosophy systematically across the whole of Europe in self-governing universities, in consequence of which:
Nearly every medieval theologian was first trained in natural philosophy, which created enthusiasm for rather than resistance to the study of nature.
Encouraged freedom of inquiry and a culture of “poking into things” by means of the Questions genre and the disputatio.

The reason it could arise nowhere else is that, while scientific breakthroughs are made by particular geniuses, and which refinements of technique are possible in any civilization, scientific progress itself is a orderly group effort, and must be sustained by the consensus of the general society. You cannot have a generally literate society, as Europe had in the Late Middle Ages, without a university system that enjoyed academic freedom.

Science or natural philosophy cannot be maintained by the consensus of society unless that same consensus accept the metaphysical and theological axioms on which natural science is based.

You can go to museums and check the fossils for yourself unless you are saying all of them are fabricated.

''then BB is God.'' The definition of the big bang is clearly not the definition of god in the bible, I don't see how you can say that if the big bang was real then the big bang would be god, the big bang would be the creator of the universe but the big bang is not a sentient being let alone an omniscient omnipotent one. - Precisely why BB is not real.

''Science doesn't have a clue HOW God did it. They can't even put 2 + 2 together enough to understand that it WAS God Who did it.'' But you are smarter than all of them and you do know, right? - Obviously, I and a lot of non-scientific people are way smarter than a lot of scientists.

''After all, if science knew what it was doing, it would cure everybody.'' Fallacy. After all if religion knew what it was doing and was inspired by God it would cure everybody, right? - Religion is curing everybody, one way or the other. The only religion that offers the cure to eternal life that people are asking for, is the Christian religion - Jesus salvation. The rest of the religions, including the religions of modern science, are offering the "cure" of damnation that the people are asking for by believing them. Science has cured infinitely more people than religion because religion has cured 0 people. - Placebo effect has cured more people than science could ever think of curing. God has cured many people in the various religious communities. Science has cured essentially none, since science uses things of nature that God palced there to do the curing attempts that they do. As I said before, do you go to a church to pray when you are sick or do you go to your doctor? - Absolutely church, but at least prayer to God, however, if I went to the doctor, it would still be God, not the doctor, doing any good work in me. I'm still waiting for you to tell me what religion has found out in the last 5000 years. - Religion has found that it is right, because Bible prophesy has been proven out to be accurate.

You can clearly see the differences:







Your B.S. tables are simply a science fiction story. They are a religion that distracts from reality. They are destroying the health of people simply by getting people to believe in falsehood.

Health and religion.

''don’t know how many hominin fossils there are in the world. There is no tabulation. The pace of discovery now is too fast to track. Each year for the last decade, anthropologists have unearthed hundreds of fossil specimens from extinct hominin species and populations.

By 2012, the Sima de los Huesos hominin assemblage, near Burgos, Spain, numbered more than 6500 specimens from at least 28 individuals. Many more fossils are recovered in every field season. In South Africa, the Rising Star hominin sample today numbers more than 2000 specimens from at least 18 individuals. This deposit of hominin fossils was completely unknown until 2013. From just two caves, that is nearly 9000 fossil hominin specimens.''

https://medium.com/@johnhawks/how-much-evidence-have-scientists-found-for-human-evolution-355801dfd35c

https://anthropologynet.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/fossil-hominid-skulls.jpg

You can clearly see all the differences.

''The earth and life are so extremely complex and marvelous, that science doesn't really have a clue about how it all came into being... from a scientific standpoint... be it by God or by BB or by something else'' So you admit there is no scientific proof for god, ok. Did you miss my little word "how" that you quoted? Did you not see the part where I said, "If BB is the cause behind the universe (something that science is only guessing at), then BB is God." Science doesn't have a clue HOW God did it. They can't even put 2 + 2 together enough to understand that it WAS God Who did it. And you can't even think enough to recognize the answers to your questions, even when you copy them to rebut the things I say. You are proving that you are devolving.



Since there is only devolution, why should there be any modern changes made in ages old religions? They have always had the best. If they didn’t, they would have been gone long ago.

However, the religion of science has found things out, many of which just aren’t true, although people often believe them: BB Theory, Black Hole Theory, Age-of the earth ideas, etc., many things. Such things are religion since people believe them, but don’t realize that they are not true.

When you believe religions of science to be true, your health is affected negatively when you place your trust in them. The only reason your health might be affected in good ways is, the ability of your mind to use placebo effect regarding your health, is the thing that makes you healthy even though you have beliefs in the false religions of science. After all, if science knew what it was doing, it would cure everybody. So, it is a false religion.

Health and religion go hand in hand. It's just that many people have an imprecise or incorrect understanding of which religion is affecting their health, and how.

You are believing the wrong studies. Time changes, but people don't. All you need to do to see this is look qt people of the past to see that they had heads, arms, hands, feet, legs, torsos, etc. just like we have.

People still live in caves in various parts of the world. If there were an abundance of caves right now in parts of California, people would be living there rather than in the tent cities.


All the skeletons and parts of skeletons of prehistoric man that we have, are so few in number that they could fit on one table. Their differences from modern mankind suggest genetic or other deformities in a few people or animals, rather than evolution. Evolution, including the timeline and formally accepted age of the earth, is a complete fable.

Time for you to start learning what is real, rather than what you want to believe.

''The earth and life are so extremely complex and marvelous, that science doesn't really have a clue about how it all came into being... from a scientific standpoint... be it by God or by BB or by something else'' So you admit there is no scientific proof for god, ok.

''Religion is the key to health and knowledge about God. Science will take way too long to be practical.'' What is religion? Why is religion the key to health or knowledge? What has religion found out in the last 5000 years?

I don't believe these studies at all, times have changed and the problem is always extremist people. Judging by religions is a mistake at this time. Or are we still living in caverns