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Topic: Historic Cryptogenic Bullion thread - CLOSED - page 85. (Read 286624 times)

hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
I woke up this morning and saw my 100 CGB @ .00101 buy order got filled.  Cheesy

Should have put my buy order even lower, but hey.. you can't have it all  Wink

I wonder where all these sellers are coming from?  There's only 1mm coins.  It could be just day traders realizing there is such a hard support line at .001.  It's a really easy trade to buy every time the price is close to .001.  I'm already satisfied with my position but I think I will do the same and just stick some orders in at .001 and maybe slightly below.
legendary
Activity: 1382
Merit: 1002
...

Viral Marketing Concepts

Got Crypto?: I believe that this phrase has the power to turn Cryptogenic Bullion's slightly awkward name into an advantage. Not only is it a professional name appealing to the investment community, but it can be called 'Crypto' for short. No other coin can logically take this title with more credit than Cryptogenic Bullion.

CGB Vault: This viral concept involves locating high quality vault images and replacing the circular entrance with a translucent CGB logo. This can then include a slogan and or CGB Strengths.
...

Just wanted to say that I liked the idea of strong storage and wealth saving. Using the vaults strengthens the image of CGB as something valuable and not just for throwing away.

Got Crypto? is really catchy, we should try to use this and high-light the phrase whenever possible.
sr. member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 368
I woke up this morning and saw my 100 CGB @ .00101 buy order got filled.  Cheesy

Should have put my buy order even lower, but hey.. you can't have it all  Wink
sr. member
Activity: 616
Merit: 250
sr. member
Activity: 616
Merit: 250

FYI, unlocking your wallet every 90 days will assure you of earning max PoS interest (1.5% annually). 30 days will get you 1.2% annually.
Hi,
 So I finally got around to doing the stake minting, but it failed to accept my pass-phrase which was verified as the correct phrase. I followed the prior instructions, again, and again. That was a couple of weeks ago.

Then last week I noticed I was using the prior Qt wallet, not the newest one.

1. Was that the problem possibly - the Qt wallet was not the newest one???

2. Or was I just not doing something correctly instead???  

I am a bit baffled.

3. Lastly, can we simply not stake mint for several months or longer, and still get our stakes eventually, and
    will they be just as large as the "every 90 days" stake minting percentage returns??? Or More??? Or less???

4.  Or is the every 90 days minting the most Optimum point to get maximized returns???

     I ask this because of course it was pointed out that every 30 days is less than optimum, so I can only
    wonder if I did minting only once a year it would also be less than Optimum??? Or Not??
...

Let me see if I can help here, I hope I address all of your questions. You can always reach out to the team via the website support https://cryptogenicbullion.org as well.

- You should download the new client from the website mentioned above
- The old client will still work for your interest earnings, so that was not your issue
- Unlocking your wallet every 30 days will get you 1.2% interest per year, every 90 days 1.5% interest
- 90 days is the max weight so waiting > 90 days will still earn you the interest accrued over the 90 days (1 year would equal 90 days as an example)
- I will get with the dev team regarding your Armory request

Command for unlocking you wallet to collect interest (remember to do this every 30 days at the minimum and every 90 days as the maximum - every 90 days is the ideal for max interest) - NOTE: Do not type the < > symbols.

PC:
walletpassphrase 999999

Mac:
walletpassphrase <"passphrase"> 999999

Hope this helps and thanks for the feedback and advice - good stuff! I am going to send you a CGB for the input Smiley Please provide you addy

Would just like to add to elamberts post.

I'm on windows and when I first tried to unlock for minting I kept getting an error.

The problem was I used a pass-phrase with spaces between the words.

Here is an example of how not to do it if you use a phrase with spaces:


walletpassphrase my wallet passphrase 99999


Error: Error parsing JSON:passphrase

Eventually I realized I needed to put it in like this.

walletpassphrase 'my wallet passphrase' 99999

Was nice to see that stubborn little catch flip open on the lock on my client.

Hope this helps if this is the case.

 Thank You! This worked. I will confirm below what did end up working for myself.

 This Last tip unlocked my wallet for minting.

=====================================================


Step 1. Open your CGB Qt Wallet Client

Step 2. Let the wallet update and fully sync up to date.

Step 3. After sync is complete then click HELP/DEBUG WINDOW/CONSOLE tab

Step 4. enter the correct command as shown by example below into the bottom
           of the Debug window where the input box is, after the correct input phrase
           then click ENTER on your keyboard. The inputted command you just typed
           will then display on the screen in the Debug Window. Wait until minting as
           expected is completed. That may, or may not take a little while.
          
Notes:  You can close up the Debug window to monitor the Minting Progress in the
           Overview/main screen while you wait. A popup window will announce any
           received minted coins.

Note:    Note your beginning CGB balance so if you miss the popup receive notice
           you'll instantly realize they came. Or check the Transactions window/tab to
           check if the minted coins arrived if you didn't note the beginning balance.

 Note: Simply close the Qt Client to end the minting session and to re-lock the wallet.



 To confirm exactly what to input:

 if one's pass-phrase is for example = password123  

then this is exactly what I inputted below to make minting begin.

 This is exactly correct command phrase, per example format:


for example one's password = password123
enter exactly what's below this line, on the next line, note the spaces too:


walletpassphrase 'password123' 99999


 Just don't forget the quotes around your pass-phrase, they may, or may not be required. First try with the quotes, and if that doesn't work then try without the quotes wrapped around one's correct 'passphrase'.

 This unlocked the CGB Qt Wallet for my own minting purposes. It's extremely easy to do once one does it once. Then I left it open until the minting is done, note the balance before beginning in case one misses the popup message indicating newly minted cgb coins have been received.

the  '   ' wrapped around the password123 was what was needed here, without the '   '  it simply didn't work no matter what else I tried before. But apparently for some Windows PC's that's not the case.

 So at least some windows PC's will need those quotes rapped around the persons 'passphrase' to unlock the wallet for minting purposes. Seems odd some Windows PC's need that, and some don't, but at least that is solved.

 That's really easy once one knows exactly how to do it, and I will assume that soon it will be refined even more.

 Just realize that if one mined those CGB that the first minting session will result in minting that trickles in over a while, in small drips and drabs per say (that's my own situation, and it's trickling in a little at a time, with one transaction after another, for myself starting about 10 or so minutes after starting the minting routine).


 
 Thanks Again for that last tip, it was golden,

RE:

 Eventually I realized I needed to put it in like this.

walletpassphrase 'my wallet passphrase' 99999


Best Regards
hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
Awesome PSD!  Maybe MercSuey can give you some words to add about MADEsparq.
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
Hey Team. As promised here is my outline for what I believe is needed to take this coin to the next level (and then the next). I have carefully constructed the points for mass appeal but certainly welcome ANY criticism. Please take some time to chew on this and get some discussion going. I will be checking back often but must let you all know that I have to keep my own life in balance. Cheers!!!


**Cryptogenic Bullion (CGB)**

**Open Source Community Development and Marketing Strategy**

This document contains a collaborative framework for the community development and marketing strategy of the Cryptogenic Bullion cryptocurrency. It is intended to be updated by any member of the CGB community who has a new idea or believes they can refine an existing one. The document is open to the public because it serves as a document of logic and open debate. I believe that releasing the strategy itself might provide other deserving cryptos with some guidance to take their logical place in the ecosystem. This document contains the strengths of CGB, misconceptions about CGB, community resources, community development, viral marketing concepts and highlighted communities.

This document will be posted at http://www.reddit.com/r/GotCrypto/comments/1x7j2w/cgb_open_source_community_development_and/ and https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.4983827. Anyone who wishes to discuss any part or offer updates can reply to either post. I will try to keep the post up to date. Please understand that I am an independent community advocate like yourself. I am only a small piece of the bigger picture and each must take their own initiative in order for this campaign to succeed.

**Cryptogenic Bullion Strengths**

Proof of Stake Eco-Security: Cryptogenic Bullion is a second generation cryptocurrency employing an advanced hybrid of legacy Proof of Work mining and Proof of Stake minting to secure the blockchain. This multi-pronged approach makes the "51% attack" a thing of the past. Not only would an attacker have to control half of the CPU power on the CGB network, but they would also have to own half of all of the currency supply of CGB in order to attempt a "double-spend" attack. Although Proof of Stake can be used alone to protect the network, the legacy Proof of Work aspect of CGB remains as an additional security layer.

The power consumption of CGB will remain far lower than any other legacy Proof of Work cryptocurrency as most of the reward for securing the network is provided through Proof of Stake minting which can be completed quickly on a smart phone, instead of a supercomputer cluster.

Interest Bearing (1.5%): A major benefit of Proof of Stake minting is that you can pay yourself 1.5% interest on savings, without the need for a bank to take its cut. Compared to legacy Proof of Work systems which reward only those with mining equipment, the benefit is made directly to the people who maintain a savings of Cryptogenic Bullion. A Proof of Work mining incentive of 0.5% brings the yearly production of CGB to 2.0%; a rate modelled after the supply of gold.

Inflationary Stage Completed (rare): In order to distribute coins to the widest population base, cryptographic currencies rely on a mining protocol called Proof of Work. This puts new coins into the hands of those with mining equipment like a gaming PC, or a cutting edge server. It gives everyone a fair chance to adopt and spread the currency, but creates the volatility and downward price pressure seen in so many other cryptocurrencies. Cryptogenic Bullion is the only second generation cryptocurrency to have completed this inflationary stage due to its accelerated reward halving. Without this relentless dumping of new coins that almost all other cryptocurrrencies are now struggling against, Cryptogenic Bullion is ready to meet its market potential.

Active Developers and Community: The development team has proven itself to be publicly accountable to the CGB community and has built a reputation for dependability, transparency, and forward thinking. With this foundation, the CGB community is able to focus on extensive advertising and promotional efforts which have drawn in a diverse collection of individuals to the merits of Cryptogenic Bullion. With a social media focus we have been actively engaging many different markets through the use of, among other media, our Facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Cryptogenic-Bullion/134177020124803), which has over 15,000 likes and CGB's twitter feed (https://twitter.com/CryptogenicBull) with a current following of over 400 individuals.

**Misconceptions about Cryptogenic Bullion**

Fast Mining/Inflation Stage: One common misconception about Cryptogenic Bullion is that its shorter mining/inflation stage has not given a wide enough range of individuals the chance to participate as early adopters. We must appreciate that this deployment method was chosen to avoid the long period of inflation which increases the volatility and stagnates most other cryptocurrencies in use today. The CGB community has been very active making every effort to get the word out about CGB and make it available on multiple exchanges. What is not realized is that CGB is still in the early adoption phase but instead of mining coins, the low price is what now enables early adopters to participate in this opportunity. CGB is only just now beginning to realize its potential to the discerning investor.

**Community Resources**

 - [This document](http://goo.gl/X1DQGB) - http://goo.gl/X1DQGB
 - [Cryptogenic Bullion Website](http://www.gotcrypto.net)
 - [Cryptogenic Bullion on Bitcointalk Forums](https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=245086.new#new)
 - [Cryptogenic Bullion on Reddit](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/)
 - [Cryptogenic Bullion on Facebook](https://www.facebook.com/pages/Cryptogenic-Bullion/134177020124803)
 - [Cryptogenic Bullion on Twitter](https://twitter.com/CryptogenicBull)
 - [CGB Marketing Campaign Headquarters](http://www.reddit.com/r/GotCrypto/)
 - [Official CGB Block Explorer](http://blocks.gotcrypto.net)
 - [CGB Block Explorer on Coinplorer](https://coinplorer.com/CGB)
 - [CGB Offline Paper Wallet Generator](https://cgbaddress.org/) - Thanks to x0rcist for coding and peshosanches for the wallet image!
 - [CGB Reddit Tip Bot](http://www.reddit.com/u/GotCrypto) - Thanks to Artiface for coding!  
  
**Highlighted Documents and Links**  

 - [Understanding Crypto-Currency Market Dynamics and the Role of BTC, DOGE, and CGB](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1y74jl/understanding_cryptocurrency_market_dynamics_and/)
 - [Technical Analysis of CGB All-time Chart Feb 13, 2014](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1y4dz7/technical_chart_analysis_alltime_cgb_chart_in_btc/)
 - [Technical Analysis of CGB All-time Chart Feb 27, 2014](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1z5ido/cryptogenic_bullion_cgbbtc_alltime_chart_feb_27/)
 - [How to buy CGB with Paypal](http://imgur.com/VSFpujX). Also see [this page](https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Buying_Bitcoins_%28the_newbie_version%29) for a more exhaustive list of methods
 - [How can CGB sort of step in and take the role of being a store of wealth?](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1yolhr/this_is_the_cryptogold_standard_right/) - /u/PVKT
 - [Cold offline Revlar CGB wallet](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1xp2oy/cold_offline_revlar_cgb_wallet/) - /u/LarryHardcore
 - [Do you have the hands?](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1yj0ut/do_you_have_the_hands/) - /u/Killiz
 - [Effect of Block Halving on Price](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoMarkets/comments/1ywhv0/effect_of_block_halving_on_price/) note: This no longer has a major impact on CGB.  
  
**Community Development**  

In addition to helping to spread the word, there are other tasks which need to be undertaken in order to support the growth of our community. Any suggestions about areas of development are welcome.  
  
 - Lightweight Blockchain Client**:** (Research Stage) See [this post](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1yjfph/developing_a_cgb_java_backend_and_its/). This gives a client the ability to conduct transactions with a subset of the blockchain. It's useful for mobile applications and offline transaction signing. eg. BitcoinJ, [Armory](https://bitcoinarmory.com/about/) and [Electrum](https://electrum.org/offline_wallets.html)  
 - Expanded Wallet features**:** (Research Stage) We are looking to add some exciting new features to our wallet software including CGB network statistics and an RSS feed like functionality. All suggestions welcome!
 - Offline Transaction Signing**:** (Research Stage) This requires the above Lightweight Blockchain Client. eg. [Bitcoin Trezor](http://www.bitcointrezor.com/): This device contains a static environment which holds your private key for **offline** signing of transactions. This kind of technology is seriously needed for long term viability.  
 - Dedicated CGB Forum**:** (In progress) A dedicated forum would be a nice touch.  
 - CGB Wiki**:** (In testing phase) This will be of great value to us as we can logically create and arrange how-to documentation and all other kinds of information in an easy to navigate and reference repository.  
 - Reddit Formatted Advertisements**:** (Requesting Ideas) We are in need of advertisements for CGB which are formatted 300px wide x 250px tall. These can be generic advertisements or targeted to a specific subreddit. These advertisements will link back to the /r/CryptogenicBullion subReddit to bring in new community members. For now buying ad space is voluntary but perhaps we may involve some kind of fund to help in the future. (Thanks /u/hybridsole for bringing this up)    Update: These functinos might not be as useful as we become more reliant on PoS for security, but might not be a bad idea anyhow, research required. (Artiface) In the future I would like to have the client have a nice visualisation of POS showing stake weight and an estimate of when stake should be generated.
 - Statistical Data**:** (Requesting Data) We need information to compare CGB to other coins.  See: http://bitinfocharts.com/ This includes all kinds of data like technology comparison, coin variables, distribution, and all relevant attributes to be compared with each other.

**Viral Marketing Concepts**  

Got Crypto?: I believe that this phrase has the power to turn Cryptogenic Bullion's slightly awkward name into an advantage. Not only is it a professional name appealing to the investment community, but it can be called 'Crypto' for short. No other coin can logically take this title with more credit than Cryptogenic Bullion. For example: http://i.imgur.com/BU1HSdC.jpg  

CGB Vault: This viral concept involves locating high quality vault images and replacing the circular entrance with a translucent CGB logo. This can then include a slogan and or CGB Strengths. For example: http://i.imgur.com/JgSQkHw.jpg

CGB Bull: This viral concept involves making reference to spanish traditions of running with the bulls. A bull market is one which has established an up-trend in valuation. "2014 - Year of the BULLion!" "Run with the CGB Bulls!" etc. Any imagery involving actual bull runs and possibly subtle market chart imagery. Be careful not to appeal to greed, we don't need that kind of volatility. For example: http://i.imgur.com/Fe17cZE.png and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa-nfIksY4o

Crypto-Asset Trinity: As explained in [this paper](http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptogenicBullion/comments/1y74jl/understanding_cryptocurrency_market_dynamics_and/). A well functioning cryptographic asset market requires three roles to be filled: market gateway, adopted currency, and store of wealth. Bitcoin is the gateway that allows us to access so many markets especially USD of course. Dogecoin is riding a wave of excitement to be accepted by a wide array of merchants and businesses, creating an economy that doesn't require conversion back to government issued fiat as the people choose their own currency. Cryptogenic Bullion is the first crypto-currency to display all of the properties of money, while providing the bearer with interest for holding it. It is portable, divisible, fungible, scarce, low inflation, durable, non-consumable, and a store of wealth.
  
Crypto Stacking: I know I am not the only one who calls the contents of my CGB wallets a "stack." Some of us have found interest in crypto-currencies for the same reason that we may also hold physical Silver or Gold. Any parallels that can be drawn in imagery or wording to the "[Silver Bug](http://www.reddit.com/r/Silverbugs/)" community can be a fun way to promote value and inclusion.  

**Highlighted Communities**  

This marketing campaign will first focus on Reddit as our organization and jumping platform to other opportunities. The most effective ways that we can communicate with any community on Reddit is through submission of new ideas, content or links, and through discussion surrounding such a submission. The idea is to try to become more active in the community through informative discussion.  If you are not familiar with Reddit, it is a place for content and link, sharing and discussion. It is important that you upvote only those comments and posts with true merit, and instead of downvoting, try to leave an informative or helpful comment. Try to promote CGB only where it is on-topic to do so. Otherwise, general discussion and debate often leads itself to such an opportunity.

When someone has located a post with discussion that could use some CGB community support, they will post a link to the post in the /r/GotCrypto subreddit with the prefix "Opportunity - ". /r/GotCrypto will be the collection point for opportunities that arise in various communities to convey logic, reason, and positive messages.

It's important to remember that every community we wish to interact with has its own unique perspective and strategies for contact. We know that any community is made up of members who belong to many other groups and communities; there is a lot of overlap. Our message needs to be as clear as possible and some of the best insights will come from these people. The purpose of this section is to enable these and all other CGB supporters to learn about and understand the most effective ways to communicate with the highlighted community. As this document is updated we should try to build a full picture of each community including:

 - Where they can be found
 - General level of understanding
 - Interaction Notes
 - Opportunities
 - Common Misconceptions

Communities:  

 - [Community on Reddit at /r/CryptoMarkets](http://www.reddit.com/r/GotCrypto/comments/1xf923/highlighted_community_on_reddit_at_rcryptomarkets/)  
 - [Community on Reddit at /r/Dogecoin](http://www.reddit.com/r/GotCrypto/comments/1xput0/highlighted_community_on_reddit_at_rdogecoin/)
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
Quote from: mercSuey

I reverted to the previous version.  I just wasn't feeling the new design.  It's too simple and the color scheme wasn't an improvement to the 'darkness' of the previous site.

This wasn't my decision to change the site, but I agreed to it.  Now I'm stepping in and reverting to the previous version.

I want the new site, whenever it may be released, to be jaw dropping awesome, both visually and practically.  I'm sure Ben will work on it until it reaches that level.
ou
Thanks for your opinions.

I know it's easy to criticize but I breathed with relief to see you reverted to the previous version of the site. I'm not in design business but the new version looked like we traveled in time to 2002, with colors acting as a successful deterrent to many people who would like to read the content.  I understand the old version is quite heavy but the new one was definitely a step back or more.

As we need a new website, does it mean that the html code for translation will change substantially? The Polish translation is nearly finished and I would prefer to work on a new file to avoid duplicate work.


Thanks for your contribution.  

The html will not change substantially for now.

We have other matters that we need to concentrate our efforts and a new website design is not an immediate priority.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
Quote from: mercSuey

I reverted to the previous version.  I just wasn't feeling the new design.  It's too simple and the color scheme wasn't an improvement to the 'darkness' of the previous site.

This wasn't my decision to change the site, but I agreed to it.  Now I'm stepping in and reverting to the previous version.

I want the new site, whenever it may be released, to be jaw dropping awesome, both visually and practically.  I'm sure Ben will work on it until it reaches that level.
ou
Thanks for your opinions.

I know it's easy to criticize but I breathed with relief to see you reverted to the previous version of the site. I'm not in design business but the new version looked like we traveled in time to 2002, with colors acting as a successful deterrent to many people who would like to read the content.  I understand the old version is quite heavy but the new one was definitely a step back or more.

As we need a new website, does it mean that the html code for translation will change substantially? The Polish translation is nearly finished and I would prefer to work on a new file to avoid duplicate work.
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1002
Pecvniate obedivnt omnia.
some of the services and some of these sites are probably not appropriate, but, it would look good on the website
newbie
Activity: 21
Merit: 0
Quote
As for Craptsy, i meant actually the buy orders of the last days that are slowly skooping away all CGB without whaling Wink

I bought 200 yesterday on Cryptsy, however the order took many hours to fill. Over those hours the order was filled in drips and drabs ... 0.5 cgb here, another 15 about thirty minutes later, and so on, etc. Although today I keep getting the "502 Bad gateway" message when I try to look at Cryptsy.

The banners look great. Will put them on a site I have in the next few days.
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
I successfully sent an email to [email protected].  Maybe just a server/network hiccup.

Ahh. I think Google is having issues. It seems to have gone through using a different webmail provider. Thanks!
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
You can contact Ben at [email protected] to discuss your ideas.  Thanks!

Oops..

Quote
Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:

     [email protected]

Technical details of permanent failure:
Google tried to deliver your message, but it was rejected by the server for the recipient domain cryptogenicbullion.org by smtp.secureserver.net. [68.178.213.37].

The address appears to be typed correctly. I tried sending to support as well. This is using a gmail.com account so I think it might point to an issue on the CGB server.  Shocked

I successfully sent an email to [email protected].  Maybe just a server/network hiccup.
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
You can contact Ben at [email protected] to discuss your ideas.  Thanks!

Oops..

Quote
Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:

     [email protected]

Technical details of permanent failure:
Google tried to deliver your message, but it was rejected by the server for the recipient domain cryptogenicbullion.org by smtp.secureserver.net. [68.178.213.37].

The address appears to be typed correctly. I tried sending to support as well. This is using a gmail.com account so I think it might point to an issue on the CGB server.  Shocked
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
wow...the new website design feels like 2 steps back.
I could see that work with black, grey and white but the blue is just...almost random...why that awful blue ?

I think its the two different blues that are being used here. I do like the cool steel blue on the sides but the top needs to be changed.. perhaps the top banner can be a very dark shade of the steel blue or something else.

So, my own opinion about the website is similar.  I think it's easier to navigate this new website, but it's a bit too simple.  I let Ben run with it just to keep things fresh.

Let me know what are your suggestions.  I personally like the previous version better.  But this is a lighter version and there were a few complaints about the older site being too dark.

The website design will never satisfy everyone's tastes, but let me know how Ben should modify it.  If we get a resounding response to go back to the previous version then we'll do so...

I agree that the website has made a jump forward in respect to useability. The old site was good for presentation but poor for navigation. I'm liking the social media tabs on the side but even their color scheme may have room for improvement as far as leaning towards a little more professional. Its great that we are making changes and keeping it fresh!

I believe the lighter scheme can work, but it has to focus on professional image which might be easier in a dark scheme. Perhaps we can Photoshop some other suggestions together as a community and post them here to see if anyone likes it. For now, if we can do something about that blue on the top I think we will be doing alright.

Regarding my marketing ideas I have jumped in with such excitement that I forgot to check if I'm reinventing the wheel. Does Ben frequent this board or what's a good way to spark some collaboration?






You can contact Ben at [email protected] to discuss your ideas.  Thanks!
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