How succesful will AI projects be to win the house? - page 21.

delfastTions

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Quote from: acroman08 on March 16, 2023, 03:19:09 AM

Quote from: Kakmakr link=topic=5444560.msg61921280#msg61921280 date=1678946803
but what happens if AI found an exploit? (Can the exploit be used to clean the house?)
[/quote

they can't, sooner or later the casino will notice the account and its activity and would most likely flag it for suspicious activity and freeze the account while they conduct their investigation.

[quote author=Kakmakr link=topic=5444560.msg61921280#msg61921280 date=1678946803
Casinos are now up against a new challenge to protect their profits, but they can also use AI to "test" their games and also to test their security to prevent any exploits that might be found by the AI and provided to the players. Wink

If someone created an AI program to test the casino's games for possible exploitation? yeah, I think they can.

It would be strange if such a new modern technology as AI would not gradually penetrate the gambling industry. It goes without saying that this is the case. And here are two opposite directions of AI activity. This includes participation in gambling itself and analysis of big data in order to know for sure that a particular casino uses a provable honesty algorithm.
This is how I see what AI is for in the gambling industry

acroman08

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Quote from: Kakmakr on March 16, 2023, 01:06:43 AM

but what happens if AI found an exploit? (Can the exploit be used to clean the house?)

they can't, sooner or later the casino will notice the account and its activity and would most likely flag it for suspicious activity and freeze the account while they conduct their investigation.

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 16, 2023, 01:06:43 AM

Casinos are now up against a new challenge to protect their profits, but they can also use AI to "test" their games and also to test their security to prevent any exploits that might be found by the AI and provided to the players. Wink

If someone created an AI program to test the casino's games for possible exploitation? yeah, I think they can.

worle1bm

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Quote from: Daltonik on March 12, 2023, 06:59:56 AM

A bot that makes sports betting predictions, according to the author of the first video, it seems to me that it may well be a useful tool that makes it easier for players to bet on a possible winner, because not everyone is deeply immersed in the events of different sports and an extra analysis will always be useful.

The results will be based on past events or how the team/players have performed in recent matches so the algorithm will be giving out predictions based on it but the actual results can totally vary because the current performance can be better or worse so can't say AI will give best results in sportsbetting.

klidex

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Quote from: tusandii on March 15, 2023, 07:21:21 PM

Actually Al could beat the house edge but his chances are still low because after all no one can ever beat the house.
Even if one can make their own strategy and see what's going on it's still no guarantee of winning the house.
Unless luck is on your side, victory is inevitable, because nothing can stop someone's luck except the person himself.
So far only a few people can beat the house and even then it's very rare to even have only 1 or 2 people in a thousand.

What do you mean there are few people who can beat the house? Who is it ?
In all my time in gambling I've never come across a gambler who can beat the house, that's impossible.
Or maybe you mean the person you said was just because you got a big win after that you said you could beat the house?
A gambler who gets a big win doesn't mean that it seems like he can beat the house, but look at the numbers he has lost and won to see if they are comparable.
It's funny when you say anyone can beat the house.

Kakmakr

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Ok, so I read through all the posts that was posted in my thread and it seems as though the majority of the people are saying that AI will not be able to "beat the house".

Now, I have to agree with them, because the "house edge" are fixed, so casinos are designed to win, even if AI are used... but what happens if AI found an exploit? (Can the exploit be used to clean the house?)

Casinos are now up against a new challenge to protect their profits, but they can also use AI to "test" their games and also to test their security to prevent any exploits that might be found by the AI and provided to the players. Wink

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Quote from: ethereumhunter on March 16, 2023, 12:37:44 AM

Quote from: coinerer on March 15, 2023, 08:31:33 AM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on March 15, 2023, 01:31:04 AM

Quote from: coinerer on March 14, 2023, 11:28:37 PM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on March 14, 2023, 10:28:43 PM

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 14, 2023, 01:00:54 AM

The question is..... Is gambling still fun for many people or do they grind out many hours of gambling with zero profit at all. The house edge is so bad on many of these casinos, that you hardly see any good wins anymore.

I think many people will enjoy it more, if they can find a way to get a little more profit to extend their gambling time. I am not saying that they must find an exploit and then drain all the money in the casinos .... but rather to find a mathematical advantage to increase their win chance, with a good strategy. Grin

Playing gambling is still fun for people who treat gambling as entertainment. But people who use gambling to make money will try to win using AI and probably spend hours gambling or looking for other sports bets. With the help of AI, they feel that they can win some money and maybe even more money because AI can provide even more information than they can find out on their own.

But surely, there will be people who will experience a lot of losses because the presence of AI can make them feel comfortable in gambling and placing bets. When a person finds comfort, he can spend more time than other people, leading to difficulties later.

By using AI (artificial intelligence ) a gambler can also increase his chances of winning in gambling but since a virtual robot will work here a gambler will never get the full enjoyment of gambling as here AI will act as a third person. But for the person who uses gambling as a source of his income, AI will be very helpful for them. Since AI depends on a program, if a program with good analytics and predictive capabilities is used for it, it will work much better for gambling and will be able to make decisions several times faster than a human.

Maybe it was because they weren't looking for information as they used to before. After all, they had started relying on AI. But the presence of AI can indeed help people to get information, and maybe that information will be more than what they got before.

And the existence of AI will bring changes in the gambling business and maybe there will be many developers who offer this AI technology to gamblers. And from the casino itself will issue AI technology to help casinos continue operating and will not allow gamblers always to win using AI. Obviously, this will make competition in the gambling business even tighter with the presence of AI.

When AI technology is used in gambling then everyone will use this technology as a result of which the casino sites will also bring their more updates due to which even using Ai it will not be possible to win gambling very easily. As Sportbet is not a part of gambling site and it does not follow any algorithm it is played live on the field and the results are based on that score so by analyzing the previous game Ai can give a gambler a possible prediction in a short period of time. It will be a successful use of AI for gambling

But get that success still needs more time until AI technology can develop as expected. In the meantime, we can continue to use the methods we have done before while waiting for updates from each developer regarding their AI technology. Maybe in a year or two, there will be AI technology that is more advanced than the current one that will be introduced to the public so this will trigger AI for the gambling business to be launched. We cannot imagine how this AI can develop in the future, including if AI is included in the gambling business. It will become more interesting and the gambling business will be tighter because each casino can offer something different, and the developers will provide AI to gamblers.

Since the launch of ChatGPT, AI has been the talk for everyone. And AI is being considered for crypto as well. And now a lot of hype has started about it. And artificial intelligence has gained a lot of popularity among all as a possible technology of the future. So surely AI will be more advanced in coming days and AI will be used in almost all fields. And it will also be widely used for gambling. Just as gamblers will use AI, gambling companies will also use AI as an advanced technology on their sites

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Quote from: coinerer on March 15, 2023, 08:31:33 AM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on March 15, 2023, 01:31:04 AM

Quote from: coinerer on March 14, 2023, 11:28:37 PM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on March 14, 2023, 10:28:43 PM

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 14, 2023, 01:00:54 AM

The question is..... Is gambling still fun for many people or do they grind out many hours of gambling with zero profit at all. The house edge is so bad on many of these casinos, that you hardly see any good wins anymore.

I think many people will enjoy it more, if they can find a way to get a little more profit to extend their gambling time. I am not saying that they must find an exploit and then drain all the money in the casinos .... but rather to find a mathematical advantage to increase their win chance, with a good strategy. Grin

Playing gambling is still fun for people who treat gambling as entertainment. But people who use gambling to make money will try to win using AI and probably spend hours gambling or looking for other sports bets. With the help of AI, they feel that they can win some money and maybe even more money because AI can provide even more information than they can find out on their own.

But surely, there will be people who will experience a lot of losses because the presence of AI can make them feel comfortable in gambling and placing bets. When a person finds comfort, he can spend more time than other people, leading to difficulties later.

By using AI (artificial intelligence ) a gambler can also increase his chances of winning in gambling but since a virtual robot will work here a gambler will never get the full enjoyment of gambling as here AI will act as a third person. But for the person who uses gambling as a source of his income, AI will be very helpful for them. Since AI depends on a program, if a program with good analytics and predictive capabilities is used for it, it will work much better for gambling and will be able to make decisions several times faster than a human.

Maybe it was because they weren't looking for information as they used to before. After all, they had started relying on AI. But the presence of AI can indeed help people to get information, and maybe that information will be more than what they got before.

And the existence of AI will bring changes in the gambling business and maybe there will be many developers who offer this AI technology to gamblers. And from the casino itself will issue AI technology to help casinos continue operating and will not allow gamblers always to win using AI. Obviously, this will make competition in the gambling business even tighter with the presence of AI.

When AI technology is used in gambling then everyone will use this technology as a result of which the casino sites will also bring their more updates due to which even using Ai it will not be possible to win gambling very easily. As Sportbet is not a part of gambling site and it does not follow any algorithm it is played live on the field and the results are based on that score so by analyzing the previous game Ai can give a gambler a possible prediction in a short period of time. It will be a successful use of AI for gambling

But get that success still needs more time until AI technology can develop as expected. In the meantime, we can continue to use the methods we have done before while waiting for updates from each developer regarding their AI technology. Maybe in a year or two, there will be AI technology that is more advanced than the current one that will be introduced to the public so this will trigger AI for the gambling business to be launched. We cannot imagine how this AI can develop in the future, including if AI is included in the gambling business. It will become more interesting and the gambling business will be tighter because each casino can offer something different, and the developers will provide AI to gamblers.

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Quote from: acroman08 on March 15, 2023, 11:01:16 PM

Quote from: Coin_trader on March 13, 2023, 09:27:16 AM

Quote from: acroman08 on March 13, 2023, 06:50:38 AM

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 12, 2023, 05:13:28 AM

Do you think AI will be more successful to get a working gambling strategy to win the house... and if they do, what will be the impact on casinos?

unless an AI can somehow create a strategy that is foolproof and ignores the casino's house edge, I don't think they can. but let's say they did, what I think would happen or the impact it will have on casinos, is casinos will ban the strategy because if they don't, it can ruin their business and possibly the gambling market.

There’s no way to remove or ignore house edge because all gambling games is designed with the rules that will make the house edge. The only way to create a strategy that will ignore it is to use a software to cheat for the result so that you can guarantee win on every bet.

yeah, I know that the only way a "strategy" can ignore house edge is if they cheat. that's why I said, "I don't think they can." to be honest, I think if AI ever created a Strategy for Gambling it would probably just be similar to the already existing strategies out there like how to manage your bankroll, what games you should play etc...

But again, it is impossible to cheat in a casino, mostly if there are no exploits in the casino, so still, it is very difficult. The only thing AI can do is calculate what the probabilities are that what is the best move or, like, what to bet on because they run calculations on it. I think AI can still predict, but that doesn't mean it's 100% true and you can win. They are still basing their decisions on the history or statistics of it to decide who will win or what is the best bet to increase the chances of winning.

acroman08

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Quote from: Coin_trader on March 13, 2023, 09:27:16 AM

Quote from: acroman08 on March 13, 2023, 06:50:38 AM

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 12, 2023, 05:13:28 AM

Do you think AI will be more successful to get a working gambling strategy to win the house... and if they do, what will be the impact on casinos?

unless an AI can somehow create a strategy that is foolproof and ignores the casino's house edge, I don't think they can. but let's say they did, what I think would happen or the impact it will have on casinos, is casinos will ban the strategy because if they don't, it can ruin their business and possibly the gambling market.

There’s no way to remove or ignore house edge because all gambling games is designed with the rules that will make the house edge. The only way to create a strategy that will ignore it is to use a software to cheat for the result so that you can guarantee win on every bet.

yeah, I know that the only way a "strategy" can ignore house edge is if they cheat. that's why I said, "I don't think they can." to be honest, I think if AI ever created a Strategy for Gambling it would probably just be similar to the already existing strategies out there like how to manage your bankroll, what games you should play etc...

tusandii

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Quote from: gunhell16 on March 15, 2023, 02:03:45 AM

In the first place, the AI is not accurate, that's why it is called "Artificial" or "Fake". So I doubt the AI will beat the house edge.

If the person who has emotions and own strategy and can see what is happening now has a hard time beating the house edge, unlike AI, it doesn't have it. Especially AI machines are incapable of doing that.

Actually Al could beat the house edge but his chances are still low because after all no one can ever beat the house.
Even if one can make their own strategy and see what's going on it's still no guarantee of winning the house.
Unless luck is on your side, victory is inevitable, because nothing can stop someone's luck except the person himself.
So far only a few people can beat the house and even then it's very rare to even have only 1 or 2 people in a thousand.

Nrcewker

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No matter whatever strategy you use, how many AI you integrate, the house always wins in the legacy gambling games. I cannot explain you with a proof, but I am sure many of the gamblers will agree with me. The seeds are designed in a such manner that it’s probably fair, but at the same time it, favours the house. Moreover I don’t like AI managing our money, as at the end of the day, these are robots only. So if any mistake happens, then no one can be kept accountable for it. So I don’t think AIs will be successful in beating the house.

aioc

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Quote from: Kakmakr on March 12, 2023, 05:13:28 AM

We are seeing more and more projects that are almost 100% built on Artificial Intelligence, like ChatGPT. Here are a few experiments that are linked between ChatGPT and gambling....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDthta5sUGQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xw3pc-47weg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYegYNkwjR0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlFrI6cLD0E

Do you think AI will be more successful to get a working gambling strategy to win the house... and if they do, what will be the impact on casinos?

Based on these videos you can because AI's out output is based on experts' opinions and tutorials on how to set up a method or gambling strategy but making it 100% effective is another subject, so far no one come down here to post how effective his strategies that are based on AI input, these Youtube videos are meant to increase views and generate profits but not 100% effective, you could have a good win ratio but that's not different from having years of experience of following sports that you're betting, you can still lose and your chances are still based on your analysis and years of following and getting familiar on the sports you're betting.

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Quote from: RILWAN on March 15, 2023, 03:59:34 PM

I have never hard hopes for AI success in gambling as its users can not aid any positive outcome in game season,

If there's one rule in AI and gambling, it is that you never go against the house.

Quote from: RILWAN on March 15, 2023, 03:59:34 PM

but then I do know why there is so much hype in this development as against the traditional way of doing things.

Not against to the traditional things we do and tasks that we make. It is making things productive and that's why it is on the hype, it can write a code, write articles, talk to you one on one but its basis will only be the information that has been extracted on the web.

They've said that gpt 4 is more powerful than the past that we've been hyped around. But let's see on how vast the development of it if they'll also learn how to see things in the future accurately to predict an outcome of a sporting event. Grin

Kidding aside, it's not giving any opinion but more with factual basis that it gathers quickly.

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Quote from: fullhdpixel on March 15, 2023, 03:52:19 PM

Snip

I've had some deep thoughts about this whole AI stuff, and if it's integrated into casinos, I think it's still possible that it can make more wins than human intelligence. Just as you have said, the past results of bets do not determine what will happen in future bets. I was giving deep thought to this AI, and I wondered: if the technology behind it is able to understand how the casino games are programmed and how the intervals of winning can come, it definitely will give more losses to the casino owners, and I can tell they will not want to even integrate it into their site.

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I have never hard hopes for AI success in gambling as its users can not aid any positive outcome in game season, but then I do know why there is so much hype in this development as against the traditional way of doing things.

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Quote from: Accardo on March 12, 2023, 04:28:29 PM

It'll be a treatening moment for the Online Casino platforms due to the capacity of the deep learning that backs up an AI. It specializes on analytical problems and storing large data of past events, which can be used to determine the outcome of a game from the past results already displayed on the gambling machine. Though steady winning can't be guaranteed, but its certain that AI, if so much money and time is spent on the Deep Learning, can predict games that'll be positive. Hence, the house won't seat back and watch, they can easily integrate a fast rule for players that use AI or launch their own version of AI that'll track AI activities.

As far as I know, the system of gambling works in a random fashion and the past results doesn't dictate if what can happen in the future, this is why AIs won't still have the chance to beat the house. If let say some are successful to make the ultimate AI, it will still be suspicious if they will use it to milk money in gambling sites. The winnings will only be confiscated and the account of that AI user will be banned.

The money and time spent to built that AI is not worth it but if they only use those in other things (things that are legal) many people are going to be proud of them and maybe they can get some kind of recognition or award with it.

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Quote from: Bushdark on March 15, 2023, 10:09:26 AM

Quote from: inthelongrun on March 15, 2023, 01:19:23 AM

AIs can only provide what is available to them. They cannot change the odds nor capable of rigging certain games and odds. Maybe AI in the future can assess whether odds are fair, overstated, or understated so we can avoid and take advantage of the odds that are worth it. But again, the birth of AI also means that casinos and gambling platforms will use them to avoid leverage from each other and possible exploitations on some of its markets. So I don't think AI is able to exploit much on casino games and sports betting markets.

IA function on the code they are asked to execute so there is no big deal about using AI to make bets. Before now there had been robots and bots that had been in use by many gamblers to make bet and they are giving a good result based on how to are set to function. Using AI can be very interesting to use especially when it is giving a good result and consistent profits. Many casinos if they noticed that a gambler is using robot to make bets and he's winning, they can deactivate the account because that may be against there terms and conditions.

Using AI is not far different on using bot in gambling because they are both relying on human input which is vital to give positive result on gambling. The bad news was there’s no data available on the web which AI can use as an advantage against the casino. I believe AI will just use common strategy like Martingale and so on which doesn’t increase the chance of winning.

The only way to beat the casino is to exploit their software code which an AI can’t do unless they are program exactly for it.

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Quote from: pawanjain on March 15, 2023, 01:46:05 AM

AI bots for gambling shouldn't be fully trusted and should be used only for references.
One thing that we should know is that if everyone starts using these bots then predictions will drastically change over time and eventually people will start losing money.
So in the long run, one can never beat the house.

for reliable gamblers I don't think they will fully trust AI bots and they use AI only as a consideration for their predictions. I mean when predicting sports matches that are so difficult to predict they will use AI as a consideration of the doubts of predictions made by themselves. so, if any gambler puts too much faith in AI bots to beat the house, it will only be hopeless.

Quote from: gunhell16 on March 15, 2023, 02:03:45 AM

In the first place, the AI is not accurate, that's why it is called "Artificial" or "Fake". So I doubt the AI will beat the house edge.

yes, that's right and I've tried it myself. but I tried not for betting predictions just in other words in a ChatGPT related thread and the result is different from the answers of people in the thread. even though the keywords asked in ChatGPT are the same as other members.

so the conclusion that AI bots are only 50% correct.

Quote from: worldofcoins on March 15, 2023, 02:56:57 AM

It's possible that AI could be used to develop more effective gambling strategies, as machine learning algorithms can be trained on large datasets to identify patterns and make predictions. However, it's important to note that casinos already have sophisticated systems to ensure that the odds are always in their favor. On the other hand, casinos could also use AI and other technologies to identify and counteract any potential strategies developed by AI.

and in the end the house can't be beat right?
because no matter how good the AI that is made and how much big data is input into the AI bot, the house is always superior in terms of counteracting all of that and the system used is more sophisticated and better than the others.

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Quote from: inthelongrun on March 15, 2023, 01:19:23 AM

AIs can only provide what is available to them. They cannot change the odds nor capable of rigging certain games and odds. Maybe AI in the future can assess whether odds are fair, overstated, or understated so we can avoid and take advantage of the odds that are worth it. But again, the birth of AI also means that casinos and gambling platforms will use them to avoid leverage from each other and possible exploitations on some of its markets. So I don't think AI is able to exploit much on casino games and sports betting markets.

IA function on the code they are asked to execute so there is no big deal about using AI to make bets. Before now there had been robots and bots that had been in use by many gamblers to make bet and they are giving a good result based on how to are set to function. Using AI can be very interesting to use especially when it is giving a good result and consistent profits. Many casinos if they noticed that a gambler is using robot to make bets and he's winning, they can deactivate the account because that may be against there terms and conditions.

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In a certain time, maybe it will be effective and can beat the house but as we know every day online casino sites will reset, sort of erase the traces of history in betting. Simply put, today you can win in any given game conditions are favorable with any advantage. However, the next day you come and bet in the same room, the betting server will be different again and doesn't guarantee you can win a second time.

An AI role like ChatGPT can't do that in real time because AI needs stored data. If we ask the question on ChatGPT where did they get the data, the answer is that the source is still taken from Google data.

Topic: How succesful will AI projects be to win the house? - page 21. (Read 3187 times)