Unlocking upon a request form a forum member.
Let's continue.
Topic: Investigation and action required. Unusual forum moderation. (Read 933 times)
I don't think there is much more to talk about here. The moderators did not engage in misconduct, and Ratimov was warned in addition to from the forum restoring the deleted threads. If he continues to keep a low profile nothing more is going to happen, although I'll bet we'll still have discussion in the threads, especially about DT inclusions and exclusions. Better keep the discussion on the Reputation section.
You are correct. This topic achieved its goal. It's clear that Ratimov used the holes and tricked forum staffs which caused to create this thread. legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1491
The first decentralized crypto betting platform
I don't think there is much more to talk about here. The moderators did not engage in misconduct, and Ratimov was warned in addition to from the forum restoring the deleted threads. If he continues to keep a low profile nothing more is going to happen, although I'll bet we'll still have discussion in the threads, especially about DT inclusions and exclusions. Better keep the discussion on the Reputation section.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 6524
Fully-fledged Merit Cycler|Spambuster'23|Pie Baker
Yes, a veteran thief. Grand master.
He is a merit source? Do you have any evidence to prove that he has been misusing his source merits?
Who has given him more than 11,000 merits other than other merit sources? Why don't you consider them "tricked", shouldn't sources read a post in full before meriting someone? And why didn't anyone notice his "manipulation" tactics before giving him so much merits?
I will not judge anyone here, but if someone takes advantage of a community by manipulation and deception, deserves no respect and should not be put in a position of authority.
Also note that, back scratchers are every where, it's not limited to this case, almost all merit sources discriminate when it comes to meriting.
I understand you had a long gap in-between you left the forum and rejoined here. Instead of asking questions [beginners level] that makes no sense to us, try to educate yourself with the development of the forum when you were absent. Many things will make sense for you then. Until you do, it's better not to leave any comment in any topics which are related to reputation and forum itself.Who has given him more than 11,000 merits other than other merit sources? Why don't you consider them "tricked", shouldn't sources read a post in full before meriting someone? And why didn't anyone notice his "manipulation" tactics before giving him so much merits?
I will not judge anyone here, but if someone takes advantage of a community by manipulation and deception, deserves no respect and should not be put in a position of authority.
Also note that, back scratchers are every where, it's not limited to this case, almost all merit sources discriminate when it comes to meriting.
As I said, if you want to convince me, it would better to do with showing provable facts with links and explanations. If the facts will be convincing, it could change my mind. And ongoing forcing can't.
I don't know which references you are looking for while all things are already everywhere from the discussions from several of us in last few days, even the forum admin convinced that his staffs were tricked, the forum staff himself feels he did bad job. I have no time to continue the discussion to convince a single person. You think all is good? Good for you.Perhaps there should be a time limit on self mod. I can't think of a good reason to delete posts months later.
I can think of a reason:It's self-moderated to keep the topic as compact as possible (for more efficient scraping).
I don't often delete posts to keep some Q&A, but once there's enough to delete to make the topic a page shorter I do it.Quote
he's laying low
🤫
Yes, he is a veteran forum member after all.
So its possible if he keeps deleting or editing his old topics without writing something in here , that the Account maybe got hacked or sold ?
Unlikely. He's still posting, and he still has the same signature. My guess: he's laying low because at this point the amount of drama he caused is only making things worse for himself.Perhaps there should be a time limit on self mod. I can't think of a good reason to delete posts months later.
I can think of a reason:It's self-moderated to keep the topic as compact as possible (for more efficient scraping).
I don't often delete posts to keep some Q&A, but once there's enough to delete to make the topic a page shorter I do it. legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1491
The first decentralized crypto betting platform
Perhaps there should be a time limit on self mod. I can't think of a good reason to delete posts months later.
Obviously, I can't know what's going on in theymos' head but I don't think one particular case justifies a general change regarding self-moderated threads. But I want to make it clear that I am not against it, especially if implementation is easy.
It's allowed for topic-starters to delete all replies to their self-mod topics. Restoring the posts would only be considered in special cases such as if their account had been hacked.
Also, if a topic has no more replies, moderators will typically delete the topic on request, since then there isn't the issue of deleting other people's replies. That's why the empty topics were not restored.
Also, if a topic has no more replies, moderators will typically delete the topic on request, since then there isn't the issue of deleting other people's replies. That's why the empty topics were not restored.
It's just that he trashed a bunch of threads out of spite or mental breakdown or whatever that was, not because of anything related to the threads themselves. That's why I think it's abuse of a forum feature/privilege.
Perhaps there should be a time limit on self mod. I can't think of a good reason to delete posts months later.
see lots of personal involvement of some users in all that
Are you still going to give special importance in personal involvements or you now can see the other issues are more important than personal?Did you provide any new provable facts since then? As I see from the thread, your accusations towards mods expectedly revealed false and basing on wrong assumptions. Those assumptions are motivated by your personal involvement. Why should my position change?
Unlike you, I did check several deleted topics via ninjastic.space and I didn't see anything of that you are saying about those topics. And I did it even before to come first time in this topic. So, despite it should be on you to prove your words (because it is your accusations), I did my own small research. And I see no new facts. Only new accusations basing on old assumptions.
As I said, if you want to convince me, it would better to do with showing provable facts with links and explanations. If the facts will be convincing, it could change my mind. And ongoing forcing can't.
He is a merit source? Do you have any evidence to prove that he has been misusing his source merits?
Who has given him more than 11,000 merits other than other merit sources? Why don't you consider them "tricked", shouldn't sources read a post in full before meriting someone? And why didn't anyone notice his "manipulation" tactics before giving him so much merits?
I will not judge anyone here, but if someone takes advantage of a community by manipulation and deception, deserves no respect and should not be put in a position of authority.
Also note that, back scratchers are every where, it's not limited to this case, almost all merit sources discriminate when it comes to meriting.
Who has given him more than 11,000 merits other than other merit sources? Why don't you consider them "tricked", shouldn't sources read a post in full before meriting someone? And why didn't anyone notice his "manipulation" tactics before giving him so much merits?
I will not judge anyone here, but if someone takes advantage of a community by manipulation and deception, deserves no respect and should not be put in a position of authority.
Also note that, back scratchers are every where, it's not limited to this case, almost all merit sources discriminate when it comes to meriting.
This is a rule violation, but it's fairly minor. A veteran forum member isn't typically going to be banned without warning for moving their topics incorrectly. (These topics were blanked and then deleted over the course of ~3 days before the issue was noticed. It wasn't part of an ongoing pattern AFAICT.) If he continues to move topics incorrectly, this would warrant a temporary ban.
Yes Retimov is a veteran member[1.] He has long experience in stealing others work [even avoided ban for plagiarism], a thief.
[2.] He has long experience in farming merit in the forum to position himself as 3rd merit earner [we were able to set him as a role model, Ratimov medals Ratimov], a merit farmer.
[3.] He has long experience in manipulating DT system to positing himself with 14 DT strength, a DT abuser.
[4.] He has long experience in conducting deals to grow his feedback page with +22 positive feedback, a trust farmer.
[5.] He has long experience in using trust feedback to hostage the feedback sender to offer peace, a feedback abuser.
We need a custom title for Ratimov: A veteran intellectual thief, merit farmer, DT abuser, trust farmer, feedback abuser. Just like this
Joking apart, what do you feel about his merit source status? You said yourself
see lots of personal involvement of some users in all that
Are you still going to give special importance in personal involvements or you now can see the other issues are more important than personal?He received a warning from me. I wrote to him about his behavior and that in case he continues such actions, he will get a ban. I did not receive a reply, but his trash topics did no longer appear after my warning. I hope for his discretion.
You did what should be done, there are no late in correcting mistake. If you would do the same and used your brain before making everything so messy like it became now then no one would try to point the fingers towards you and the other mod. I really hope you will use this experience to learn a good lesson. All the best. legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 6524
Fully-fledged Merit Cycler|Spambuster'23|Pie Baker
Now I wonder if mr r has had something anger him and it is why he is doing it.
Have you read those 2 threads, which expose Ratimov's Trust abuses done for years in a row and his shenanigans done to cover his abuses and his plagiarism? This is the reason why.
Should Ratimov be in DT1?
Ratimov is deleting self-moderated topics. He now goes onto my Ignore list.
mr r
Oh, he is no "Mr"! You can see here his attempts to act like a gentleman.
At first I thought you are joking when you asked about what happens. Later I realized you actually don't know. Please read the linked materials thoroughlly and you'll understand.
I would argue that even self-mod threads that Ratimov cleaned out should be restored and locked, if that's not done already.
The self-moderated topics were not restored. At least the risk was known when I posted in there (I just didn't expect it).To me it seems that a self-mod OP going on a rampage and emptying multiple threads for no reason should be dealt with in a similar way as a moderator on a rampage would be dealt with. I think in the latter case deleted content would be restored. And the person would likely be stripped of the delete-other-users-posts privilege.
Years ago April fools joke was done by theymos the forum became infected for April fools day.
I got really angry over this really angry and I starting to delete one of my self modded threads.
I wish I had not reacted that way but I did. I got 30 or 40 pms and realized My anger overcame me. I did not delete any more threads.
Now I wonder if mr r has had something anger him and it is why he is doing it.
Yeah my wife had 2x pneumonia from covid and almost died she still suffers to this day from nasal and lung issues. It was not an easy disease for us. So I reacted poorly.
Maybe Mr R is in distress over Ukraine Vs Russia war and has reacted poorly in his behavior.
This is a rule violation, but it's fairly minor. A veteran forum member isn't typically going to be banned without warning for moving their topics incorrectly.
But has he received any warning about it? It seems to many of us too many threads with significant discussion and merit in them to do so without further explanation, which he has not given.
Although I suppose if he hasn't received a warning, your post, which he is sure to read, serves as a warning itself.
He received a warning from me. I wrote to him about his behavior and that in case he continues such actions, he will get a ban. I did not receive a reply, but his trash topics did no longer appear after my warning. I hope for his discretion.
It's allowed for topic-starters to delete all replies to their self-mod topics. Restoring the posts would only be considered in special cases such as if their account had been hacked.
So its possible if he keeps deleting or editing his old topics without writing something in here , that the Account maybe got hacked or sold ?I dont know if the behavior and posting manner has changed the last weeks of him or not , as i not watched him much.
Hopefully he can clear things with an statement soon.
Although I suppose if he hasn't received a warning, your post, which he is sure to read, serves as a warning itself.
I guess it can be seen as a warning or an note for future actions. legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1491
The first decentralized crypto betting platform
This is a rule violation, but it's fairly minor. A veteran forum member isn't typically going to be banned without warning for moving their topics incorrectly.
But has he received any warning about it? It seems to many of us too many threads with significant discussion and merit in them to do so without further explanation, which he has not given.
Although I suppose if he hasn't received a warning, your post, which he is sure to read, serves as a warning itself.
Isn't this statement contradicting itself?
The word "misconduct" implies bad intent. This was a moderator getting tricked.Since Ratimov was turning his old topics into garbage on purpose
He wants to delete his posts, but he can't delete the topics, so he's editing them to be "blank". This is common and allowed.then he moved his trash in the Russian local board
This is a rule violation, but it's fairly minor. A veteran forum member isn't typically going to be banned without warning for moving their topics incorrectly. (These topics were blanked and then deleted over the course of ~3 days before the issue was noticed. It wasn't part of an ongoing pattern AFAICT.) If he continues to move topics incorrectly, this would warrant a temporary ban.I would argue that even self-mod threads that Ratimov cleaned out should be restored and locked, if that's not done already.
It's allowed for topic-starters to delete all replies to their self-mod topics. Restoring the posts would only be considered in special cases such as if their account had been hacked.Also, if a topic has no more replies, moderators will typically delete the topic on request, since then there isn't the issue of deleting other people's replies. That's why the empty topics were not restored.
I would argue that even self-mod threads that Ratimov cleaned out should be restored and locked, if that's not done already.
The self-moderated topics were not restored. At least the risk was known when I posted in there (I just didn't expect it).To me it seems that a self-mod OP going on a rampage and emptying multiple threads for no reason should be dealt with in a similar way as a moderator on a rampage would be dealt with. I think in the latter case deleted content would be restored. And the person would likely be stripped of the delete-other-users-posts privilege.
The question is why he is doing all this and whats going on with his behavior lately for deleting all that things.
But the most thing i dont understand is why he not comes and showing himself here and write about it.
As i remember normaly he was instant replying to things that have to do with him.
But the most thing i dont understand is why he not comes and showing himself here and write about it.
As i remember normaly he was instant replying to things that have to do with him.
I would argue that even self-mod threads that Ratimov cleaned out should be restored and locked, if that's not done already.
The self-moderated topics were not restored. At least the risk was known when I posted in there (I just didn't expect it). That includes some of my own (Merited) posts in topics that weren't self-moderated, and Ratimov indeed should indeed not have any power over those.
[...]
I didn't realize until now that also Mods deleted topics with other users' posts. That's quite a big mistake.
[...]
I didn't realize until now that also Mods deleted topics with other users' posts. That's quite a big mistake.
I would argue that even self-mod threads that Ratimov cleaned out should be restored and locked, if that's not done already.
Not to mention that we've had people banned for less, whereas he's not getting even a slap on the wrist so that's kinda screwed up as far as disincentives to fuck with forum privileges.
Furthermore: how can xandry (which is just a mod, so not an admin) could check Ratimov's messages history?
I'm pretty sure this is a translation issue, and he must have meant his post history.All of the deleted topics with replies have been restored to Archival.
Cool! So Guest R20231030 is Ratimov's new name 
I checked this list, and those topics have been restored:
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34.
That includes some of my own (Merited) posts in topics that weren't self-moderated, and Ratimov indeed should indeed not have any power over those.
All of the deleted topics with replies have been restored to Archival.
I didn't realize until now that also Mods deleted topics with other users' posts. That's quite a big mistake. legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 6524
Fully-fledged Merit Cycler|Spambuster'23|Pie Baker
Thank you for coming to this thread, theymos.
If I am allowed, I would also add a few questions, as it follows:
1. Isn't this statement contradicting itself?
How could it be no misconduct, since it was incorrect to delete those topics? What is a misconduct then, if not taking incorrect decisions?
2. Since Ratimov was turning his old topics into garbage on purpose, then he moved his trash in the Russian local board, thus breaking forum rule no. 1 multiple times in a row, being very aware of what he is doing, why was he not banned for that? This question was addressed also by LV, but no answer has been provided so far:
3. Since even Xal0lex started thinking that what Ratimov does is fishy, why did not he asked other mods for a ban, since he is unable to issue bans? Again, this question was also asked by LV and it was never been answered:
4. Why none of xandry and Xal0lex answered to questions, 3. and 4., although they were asked repeatedly?
Thank you for restoring them.
Small question here (addressed to xandry):
If Halab and LV believe it was easy to find those topics, then why xandry thinks it was very difficult? It doesn't add up.
Furthermore: how can xandry (which is just a mod, so not an admin) could check Ratimov's messages history?
I believed this was something only admins can do.
If I am allowed, I would also add a few questions, as it follows:
1. Isn't this statement contradicting itself?
I see no evidence of misconduct, though it was incorrect to delete topics with substantial replies.
How could it be no misconduct, since it was incorrect to delete those topics? What is a misconduct then, if not taking incorrect decisions?
2. Since Ratimov was turning his old topics into garbage on purpose, then he moved his trash in the Russian local board, thus breaking forum rule no. 1 multiple times in a row, being very aware of what he is doing, why was he not banned for that? This question was addressed also by LV, but no answer has been provided so far:
Isn't that what bans are for? To stop people from posting garbage?
3. Since even Xal0lex started thinking that what Ratimov does is fishy, why did not he asked other mods for a ban, since he is unable to issue bans? Again, this question was also asked by LV and it was never been answered:
But you have a Mod board, in which you could report him to Mods with banning power. It's more than just deleting his own posts, it's moving garbage into your board. And that's a clear violation of the forum rules:
1. No zero or low value, pointless or uninteresting posts or threads.
He could easily have avoided all this by moving the topic to Archival, but he choose to throw his garbage topics on the board you moderate. This sets a precedent for using the board you moderate as a trashcan and by reporting his own posts there turns you into his personal trashman.4. Why none of xandry and Xal0lex answered to questions, 3. and 4., although they were asked repeatedly?
All of the deleted topics with replies have been restored to Archival.
Thank you for restoring them.
~ probably used the "Show the last topics started by this person" function.
Even easier: Search topics. You can quickly find the very short topic titles, nicely kept in Archival.Small question here (addressed to xandry):
I would not like to put the second moderator in a difficult position, but I was honestly surprised by the answer of Xal0lex:
I haven't personally counted how many topics I've deleted. Maybe 10, maybe more. And plus at the moment there are a few more of Ratimov's garbage topics in the section, which will also be deleted in time. You can go to the section yourself and see how many of these topics there are at the moment. You can also go to modlog and do the math yourself.
Once again: I found out about garbage topics only after I was mentioned and I started checking Radimov's message history. How could anyone have found out about this before? That there are many similar garbage topics in the Russian forum? After all, they are old and do not appear in the top of the Russian root. I didn't understand that.If Halab and LV believe it was easy to find those topics, then why xandry thinks it was very difficult? It doesn't add up.
Furthermore: how can xandry (which is just a mod, so not an admin) could check Ratimov's messages history?
I found out about garbage topics only after I was mentioned and I started checking Radimov's message history
I believed this was something only admins can do.
Xal0lex would you help us to understand how you found the topics/posts to clean up if they were not reported?
If you go to the root of the Russian section, you will see a list of topics at the bottom. So I saw two trash topics in this list. Naturally, I deleted them. And then I decided to go through the whole list and found a lot of such topics. Again, I deleted several topics. And then I realized that something was wrong and that it looked very suspicious, so I didn't touch those topics anymore.
I read all the posts and waited for a reply by you. My thoughts were you may have been tricked by mr r.
I just check the post after yours and its from mr t. his conclusion was exactly what I thought may have happened.
Hoping that mr r lets us know why he does what he does. as it put you in a shitty spot for sure.
I see no evidence of misconduct, though it was incorrect to delete topics with substantial replies. All of the deleted topics with replies have been restored to Archival.
This didn't happen. In all of Ratmov's deleted topics, only 3 replies were deleted by moderators in the last 2 years, and none of these deletions were by xandry or Xal0lex.
Quote
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
This didn't happen. In all of Ratmov's deleted topics, only 3 replies were deleted by moderators in the last 2 years, and none of these deletions were by xandry or Xal0lex.
Xal0lex would you help us to understand how you found the topics/posts to clean up if they were not reported?
If you go to the root of the Russian section, you will see a list of topics at the bottom. So I saw two trash topics in this list. Naturally, I deleted them. And then I decided to go through the whole list and found a lot of such topics. Again, I deleted several topics. And then I realized that something was wrong and that it looked very suspicious, so I didn't touch those topics anymore.
~ probably used the "Show the last topics started by this person" function.
Even easier: Search topics. You can quickly find the very short topic titles, nicely kept in Archival. 
Xal0lex would you help us to understand how you found the topics/posts to clean up if they were not reported?
I'm going to dare to answer you and make a wild guess and I hope that I will not get dragged into this tsunami of shit, but Xal0lex probably used the "Show the last topics started by this person" function.
You're falling into conspiracy theories. If you followed a modlog you'd seen that there was no massive deleting of posts in those topics by mods. There was only massive deletion of emptied topics with nonsense subjects. You can check it even without archives because actual log is still containing that data. I'm not a mod in here, but I'm sure that cleaning from nonsense is a mods job. I didn't report any on these topics because I didn't see them before they are being deleted, but if I've seen them, I'd reported them. I do report such nonsense in other cases.
Making an own small research before blaming someone in something could be good.
Have you started your research from this topic from GazetaBitcoin? I will appreciate any input from anyone who have read that topic then read the 2nd topic from LoyceV.Making an own small research before blaming someone in something could be good.
Of course. I follow the situation and see lots of personal involvement of some users in all that. And I didn't want to be involved in those personal vendettas. But those vendettas are tending to grow unfortunately.
I don't know why did Ratimov delete posts in his topics and crashed some other topics and I hardly can support this way of dealing with forum, but a statement that he did it "to cover up his past and current evil activities" was not proved. All those topics are still available in different archives including ninjastic.space and loyce.club, so if there is anything compromising it should not be so hard to show that. But as for now I see only a statement about that based on an old discussion about plagiarism held several years ago which had no consequences then. And then basing on that statement which has no proofs moderators of Russian board are blamed in that they are sock-puppets because they are doing their job on cleaning the forum.
I already showed that at least one your statement is totally wrong, there was no situation when "Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion". You made an assumption and blamed someone, not trying to check if your suspicion is true.
I can say that I saw some cases when dozens of posts of some users were deleted and those users were not banned for incorrect behavior. If it is a personal case for you, it doesn't mean that it should be the same for others. If you'd asked why wasn't a user banned for that, it could be expected, but you preferred to blame moderators for doing a good job.
I see many assumptions in the topic and very few facts. If you want to convince me, I want to see provable facts. Exact links to the topics on ninjastic.space with explanation why are they compromising, with additional links on proofs etc, so everyone could check it and be sure that it is so. And showing that deleting those topics hides some important information to show why are you blaming moderators for their job.
I haven't seen a single report from Ratimov for a long time, and even more so about his own topics. I will even clarify: I have not seen a single report on topics edited by Ratimov.
I haven't personally counted how many topics I've deleted. Maybe 10, maybe more. And plus at the moment there are a few more of Ratimov's garbage topics in the section, which will also be deleted in time. You can go to the section yourself and see how many of these topics there are at the moment. You can also go to modlog and do the math yourself.
You're falling into conspiracy theories. If you followed a modlog you'd seen that there was no massive deleting of posts in those topics by mods. There was only massive deletion of emptied topics with nonsense subjects. You can check it even without archives because actual log is still containing that data. I'm not a mod in here, but I'm sure that cleaning from nonsense is a mods job. I didn't report any on these topics because I didn't see them before they are being deleted, but if I've seen them, I'd reported them. I do report such nonsense in other cases.
Making an own small research before blaming someone in something could be good.
Have you started your research from this topic from GazetaBitcoin? I will appreciate any input from anyone who have read that topic then read the 2nd topic from LoyceV. Making an own small research before blaming someone in something could be good.
I don't like what he did once with a thread I posted on, but I managed to deal with it, after all they are "moderators" all we can do is complaining, but now talking about PMs, merits, being in cahoots etc, is a bit childish because there are several archives available to access, so there is no hiding things.
What bothers me, did you guys discuss about plagiarizing before or not? So if it was already discussed, it makes no sense to delete old posts now, if he had nothing to hide, why trying to hide it now while he knows it can not be erased from archives?
"Anyways, I know it hurts when you get several of your posts deleted in a short amount of time, especially when you are in a campaign, I wish we could throw a couple of hundreds on the table to compensate for the lost posts, nobody would have bothered to complain then."
I'm speaking from psychological viewpoint in the quoted paragraph above, I'm not pointing fingers at anyone.😘
What bothers me, did you guys discuss about plagiarizing before or not? So if it was already discussed, it makes no sense to delete old posts now, if he had nothing to hide, why trying to hide it now while he knows it can not be erased from archives?
"Anyways, I know it hurts when you get several of your posts deleted in a short amount of time, especially when you are in a campaign, I wish we could throw a couple of hundreds on the table to compensate for the lost posts, nobody would have bothered to complain then."
I'm speaking from psychological viewpoint in the quoted paragraph above, I'm not pointing fingers at anyone.😘
At some point it was discovered that Ratimov was following a very simple strategy to cover up his past and current evil activities to achieve whatever goal he has. The steps are following [the order of the steps can be different in case by case but it is believed that the executions were very similar as explained in the following]
[a.] He moves his topics to Archive
[b.] He deletes his own posts
[c.] He moves the topic to the Russian local board. This is where Russian moderators come into our knowledge.
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[f.] He removes everything from the main topic and makes it an empty topic
[g.] He reports the empty topic to the moderator
[h.] Finally the moderator wipes out the entire topic.
A very lengthy but simple and effective strategy to wipe out any unwanted record. Anyone can delete their past posts which is not wrong but the way the whole things were done, it was not usual. It definitely is questionable. So questions were asked, we had our speculations too.
[a.] He moves his topics to Archive
[b.] He deletes his own posts
[c.] He moves the topic to the Russian local board. This is where Russian moderators come into our knowledge.
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[f.] He removes everything from the main topic and makes it an empty topic
[g.] He reports the empty topic to the moderator
[h.] Finally the moderator wipes out the entire topic.
A very lengthy but simple and effective strategy to wipe out any unwanted record. Anyone can delete their past posts which is not wrong but the way the whole things were done, it was not usual. It definitely is questionable. So questions were asked, we had our speculations too.
This raise concern that why he preferred to move an English topic to a non-English board [his local of-course] and expected it to be deleted or already deleted.
Therefore, unless Xal0lex was his "pal" for deleting evidence from Archival board as well, it means that some other mod helped him.
You're falling into conspiracy theories. If you followed a modlog you'd seen that there was no massive deleting of posts in those topics by mods. There was only massive deletion of emptied topics with nonsense subjects. You can check it even without archives because actual log is still containing that data. I'm not a mod in here, but I'm sure that cleaning from nonsense is a mods job. I didn't report any on these topics because I didn't see them before they are being deleted, but if I've seen them, I'd reported them. I do report such nonsense in other cases.
Making an own small research before blaming someone in something could be good.
Yeah but it's one thing when you post in a self moderated thread you know you risk having your post deleted maybe because the author simply doesn't like you or something.
Well, I tend to believe that after I've distrusted him he doesn't like me anymore...
However, I know I'm not the center of the world, so it's most probably more than that. He may be angry now on pretty much the whole forum. But maybe I'm wrong; it's only him who can tell, but, sadly, I am not convinced that he will give a honest answer (if any).
legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1491
The first decentralized crypto betting platform
I would expect Ratimov to give some explanation as to why so many threads moved and deleted, as I said in another thread, but at this stage he doesn't seem to want to give any. Apart from the fact that I don't think he can give any that aren't outlandish on the subject.
Yeah but it's one thing when you post in a self moderated thread you know you risk having your post deleted maybe because the author simply doesn't like you or something. It's quite another for a highly reputable member of the forum who is at the top of several rankings on bpip.org to massively delete self moderated threads where significant issues have been addressed and merit has been given in them. That's not what the self-moderation function was intended for, I believe.
While it's far from nice behavior on the forum, I knew the risk for this when I've posted in self-moderated topics.
It's a bit shame, since although he made a lot of good and informative topics, he acts highly questionable now and then.
It's a bit shame, since although he made a lot of good and informative topics, he acts highly questionable now and then.
Yeah but it's one thing when you post in a self moderated thread you know you risk having your post deleted maybe because the author simply doesn't like you or something. It's quite another for a highly reputable member of the forum who is at the top of several rankings on bpip.org to massively delete self moderated threads where significant issues have been addressed and merit has been given in them. That's not what the self-moderation function was intended for, I believe.
PMs aren't encrypted.
Forum database includes PMs, deleted PMs, is encrypted and only admins, global moderators have access to database.But when both sender and receiver(s) deleted the message, they (Theymos, Gavin, Satoshi, and Sirius) can access the PMs through the database which need to decrypt it.
Yes, I've also seen lately that quite a number of (older) posts got deleted. And all were in Ratimov's self moderated topics. Then I've seen that it's not only my posts that are removed, the whole topics got emptied.
While it's far from nice behavior on the forum, I knew the risk for this when I've posted in self-moderated topics.
It's a bit shame, since although he made a lot of good and informative topics, he acts highly questionable now and then.
But from there to questionable actions of mods... it still one more step, and a pretty big one.
He is not a new member and it's normal that he has friends on the forum. If some of the mods are indeed "covering" him it's not a great thing to hear. It can be also normal mod tasks, as LoyceV said.
Can it be checked only from history (loyce.club, ninjastic.space), logs, bpip... if somebody has the time and willingness? While it can happen for mods to act incorrectly, even willingly, I am also not convinced that theymos should go into PMs (but I am not worried, I am 99% sure he will not), especially as this kind of things can be discussed easily outside of the forum.
While it's far from nice behavior on the forum, I knew the risk for this when I've posted in self-moderated topics.
It's a bit shame, since although he made a lot of good and informative topics, he acts highly questionable now and then.
But from there to questionable actions of mods... it still one more step, and a pretty big one.
I don't know to what extent the moderators of the local Russian board may be in cahoots with him
He is not a new member and it's normal that he has friends on the forum. If some of the mods are indeed "covering" him it's not a great thing to hear. It can be also normal mod tasks, as LoyceV said.
Can it be checked only from history (loyce.club, ninjastic.space), logs, bpip... if somebody has the time and willingness? While it can happen for mods to act incorrectly, even willingly, I am also not convinced that theymos should go into PMs (but I am not worried, I am 99% sure he will not), especially as this kind of things can be discussed easily outside of the forum.
PMs aren't encrypted.
Forum database includes PMs, deleted PMs, is encrypted and only admins, global moderators have access to database.Bitcointalk.org Privacy concern question
Deleted posts are almost never removed from the database. A PM is removed from the database if the sender and all recipients delete it.
Full database backups are created daily, and all global moderators and admins can download the (encrypted) backups and implement their own rotation policies.
Full database backups are created daily, and all global moderators and admins can download the (encrypted) backups and implement their own rotation policies.
they can download the backup to have it at multiple locations, but it's useless for them because they don't have the decryption key
This.
Only me, Gavin, Satoshi, and Sirius can decrypt it.
Ratimov's posts isn't that entirely bad, despite translating using tools, his posts are useful too.
Agreed. But I wasn't talking about those, I was talking about the posts that were edited into this:67л
34e
67ш
Forum admins can decrypt your message
PMs aren't encrypted.Forum database includes PMs, deleted PMs, is encrypted and only admins, global moderators have access to database.
You're talking about backups. This is irrelevant. Quite a long post, but I took a little time to read the OP's post. It seems I don't have the capacity to express an opinion here. But I would like to have a little opinion.
You can keep reading. Reading only.Quote
For advanced identification, it sounds good. But if the moderator has to see the PM and publish it to the forum then I think that's too deep and the PM is someone's secret. Everyone has secrets and I don't think it's ethical to share anything in PM with the public
PMs here are Personal Messages but they are not Private Messages. Forum admins can decrypt your message and if you don't trust them, don't send any PM.Quote
Note: PM privacy is not guaranteed. Encrypt sensitive messages.
Discussion about it
PM privacy is not guaranteed. Encrypt sensitive messages.
Quite a long post, but I took a little time to read the OP's post. It seems I don't have the capacity to express an opinion here. But I would like to have a little opinion.
For advanced identification, it sounds good. But if the moderator has to see the PM and publish it to the forum then I think that's too deep and the PM is someone's secret. Everyone has secrets and I don't think it's ethical to share anything in PM with the public
For advanced identification, it sounds good. But if the moderator has to see the PM and publish it to the forum then I think that's too deep and the PM is someone's secret. Everyone has secrets and I don't think it's ethical to share anything in PM with the public
shouldn't have gone unpunished is moving trash-topics into another board:
Then again, users often get away with many bad posts without getting banned.
I recall back where nutildah got banned because he was moving his thread and ignored warning from a moderator. The difference is moderator who handle Ratimov's post agree with that, while this one he was not agree. Then again, users often get away with many bad posts without getting banned.
How you can expect many bad posts will be banned when people who commit clear plagiarized posts aren't get banned?
Ratimov's posts isn't that entirely bad, despite translating using tools, his posts are useful too.
[a.] He moves his topics to Archive
[b.] He deletes his own posts
[c.] He moves the topic to the Russian local board. This is where Russian moderators come into our knowledge.
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[f.] He removes everything from the main topic and makes it an empty topic
[g.] He reports the empty topic to the moderator
[h.] Finally the moderator wipes out the entire topic.
I haven't seen a single report from Ratimov for a long time, and even more so about his own topics. I will even clarify: I have not seen a single report on topics edited by Ratimov. By the way, I found out that he edits his topics and for some reason moves them to the Russian board only when I was mentioned in the topic Ratimov is deleting posts in a self-moderated topic[b.] He deletes his own posts
[c.] He moves the topic to the Russian local board. This is where Russian moderators come into our knowledge.
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[f.] He removes everything from the main topic and makes it an empty topic
[g.] He reports the empty topic to the moderator
[h.] Finally the moderator wipes out the entire topic.
A little later I checked the history of his topics (Ratimov) and really found a lot of edited topics in the Russian forum. They can be divided into two types:
1. Topics where he edited only his own messages, and the posts of other users remained untouched
2. Topics where everything is deleted, and the first post is edited.
I sent the first type to the archive (probably this was not part of his plans), since I believe that other users should not lose messages because of these strange actions. And often you can understand the meaning there even without the first post
I made notes for myself to know that these topics are in the archive, just in case he moves them to the Russian forum again.
The second type of topics in which there is no sense at all, I sent to Trashcan.
I sincerely do not understand why Ratimov did all this, since many topics have been useful and relevant so far. To be honest, I was hoping that he would answer this question himself.
I would not like to put the second moderator in a difficult position, but I was honestly surprised by the answer of Xal0lex:
I haven't personally counted how many topics I've deleted. Maybe 10, maybe more. And plus at the moment there are a few more of Ratimov's garbage topics in the section, which will also be deleted in time. You can go to the section yourself and see how many of these topics there are at the moment. You can also go to modlog and do the math yourself.
Once again: I found out about garbage topics only after I was mentioned and I started checking Radimov's message history. How could anyone have found out about this before? That there are many similar garbage topics in the Russian forum? After all, they are old and do not appear in the top of the Russian root. I didn't understand that.In any case, only administrators can check the actions of moderators, and we (moderators) do not know who is doing what
What matter is, are we going to allow moderators who do not have a sense of responsibility, the liability and loyalty to preserve the reputation of bitcointalk?
One way or another, deleting trash is exactly what Mods are hired for. The only thing that - in my opinion - shouldn't have gone unpunished is moving trash-topics into another board:What do you think a moderator should do if he sees such garbage topics in the root of the section under his control?
Isn't that what bans are for? To stop people from posting garbage?An investigation is required first to find if the moderators are guilty of mutual agreement or it was an innocent irresponsibility.
I assume and hope theymos will not use his "access of the forum PM" for this. 
A very lengthy but simple and effective strategy to wipe out any unwanted record. Anyone can delete their past posts which is not wrong but the way the whole things were done, it was not usual. It definitely is questionable. So questions were asked, we had our speculations too.
I don't know to what extent the moderators of the local Russian board may be in cahoots with him, as you and Gazeta suggest, what is clear is that Ratimov's behavior is quite suspicious and so far has resulted in a few DT1 distrusting him. Those are many, too many deleted threads, and Mr. Switzerland putting him on ignore for it, opening the quoted thread, gives a lot to think about.
The main man needs to look into the matter, he has the supreme access of everything including access of the forum PM [the communication can be done using a none forum media too] and the database. No, this is not a reputation matter, this is a forum issue hence the topic is on the meta board.
The moderators in question: Russian local board moderators Xal0lex and xandry.
There are not enough public links for unusual moderation from xandry yet however since the activities concentrated in the Russian local board we can not ignore his involvement too. Again as I said the main man [Theymos] have ultimate access of everything for investigation. Let's bring everything that questions the unusual moderation.
Everything had started a few days ago when LoyceV created a topic about deleting his post in a self-moderated topic and later it found out that the same user was deleting several other's posts too from his self-moderated topic and the fact had established that he was deleting the posts to cover the trace of his past plagiarism, current feedback abuse, DT manipulation and his tactics of offering peace to negotiate any feedback left to him. Everything about the user has outlined very well in the topic "Should Ratimov be in DT?". It requires almost half an hour read to understand and realize the motive of the user. I highly suggest to read the topic, if you have not yet.
At some point it was discovered that Ratimov was following a very simple strategy to cover up his past and current evil activities to achieve whatever goal he has. The steps are following [the order of the steps can be different in case by case but it is believed that the executions were very similar as explained in the following]
[a.] He moves his topics to Archive
[b.] He deletes his own posts
[c.] He moves the topic to the Russian local board. This is where Russian moderators come into our knowledge.
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[f.] He removes everything from the main topic and makes it an empty topic
[g.] He reports the empty topic to the moderator
[h.] Finally the moderator wipes out the entire topic.
A very lengthy but simple and effective strategy to wipe out any unwanted record. Anyone can delete their past posts which is not wrong but the way the whole things were done, it was not usual. It definitely is questionable. So questions were asked, we had our speculations too.
Response were given but more like a few excuses with a few return questions. Sounds like a preplanned dialog in defense in case there are questions.
Unpleasant merit transactions found by GazetaBitcoin but I would like to accept speculation from LoyceV, "It's quite normal for a Merit source to Merit someone when they use the same local board. I don't expect the posts to be bad, so it's not wrong."
How can a moderator or moderators do not see a single user is following a pattern and using him [them] to remove many other's posts including his entire topics. Not 1 or 5 or 10. Let's read what he said.
A database query will surely show the numbers and also it will show how many topics and posts were deleted by the same moderator but he never thought something is not normal.
At some point the same moderator became unusually aggressive in his defense too.
What matter is, are we going to allow moderators who do not have a sense of responsibility, the liability and loyalty to preserve the reputation of bitcointalk? An investigation is required first to find if the moderators are guilty of mutual agreement or it was an innocent irresponsibility. Second, based on the result of the investigation, an action is required.
The moderators in question: Russian local board moderators Xal0lex and xandry.
There are not enough public links for unusual moderation from xandry yet however since the activities concentrated in the Russian local board we can not ignore his involvement too. Again as I said the main man [Theymos] have ultimate access of everything for investigation. Let's bring everything that questions the unusual moderation.
Everything had started a few days ago when LoyceV created a topic about deleting his post in a self-moderated topic and later it found out that the same user was deleting several other's posts too from his self-moderated topic and the fact had established that he was deleting the posts to cover the trace of his past plagiarism, current feedback abuse, DT manipulation and his tactics of offering peace to negotiate any feedback left to him. Everything about the user has outlined very well in the topic "Should Ratimov be in DT?". It requires almost half an hour read to understand and realize the motive of the user. I highly suggest to read the topic, if you have not yet.
At some point it was discovered that Ratimov was following a very simple strategy to cover up his past and current evil activities to achieve whatever goal he has. The steps are following [the order of the steps can be different in case by case but it is believed that the executions were very similar as explained in the following]
[a.] He moves his topics to Archive
[b.] He deletes his own posts
[c.] He moves the topic to the Russian local board. This is where Russian moderators come into our knowledge.
[d.] He reports other's posts from the topics.
[e.] Moderators delete the reported posts because now these posts are irrelevant in the discussion
[f.] He removes everything from the main topic and makes it an empty topic
[g.] He reports the empty topic to the moderator
[h.] Finally the moderator wipes out the entire topic.
A very lengthy but simple and effective strategy to wipe out any unwanted record. Anyone can delete their past posts which is not wrong but the way the whole things were done, it was not usual. It definitely is questionable. So questions were asked, we had our speculations too.
This raise concern that why he preferred to move an English topic to a non-English board [his local of-course] and expected it to be deleted or already deleted.
Therefore, unless Xal0lex was his "pal" for deleting evidence from Archival board as well, it means that some other mod helped him.
Maybe this is the reason:
I personally process reports regardless of the date of the post or topic.
Response were given but more like a few excuses with a few return questions. Sounds like a preplanned dialog in defense in case there are questions.
[....]
Why should moderators be ashamed of doing their job? What do you think a moderator should do if he sees such garbage topics in the root of the section under his control?
[...]
Do these trash topics have to stay in the section, or what? Go to the root of the Russian section and browse the pages, there are plenty of such topics. So what, let them lie around? What kind of moderator would allow such a mess? So naturally, the moderators delete them.
Anticipating a question about the content that was there, so that's not interesting to me. I see what's in those threads now. We don't need such trash topics in the section.
Why should moderators be ashamed of doing their job? What do you think a moderator should do if he sees such garbage topics in the root of the section under his control?
[...]
Do these trash topics have to stay in the section, or what? Go to the root of the Russian section and browse the pages, there are plenty of such topics. So what, let them lie around? What kind of moderator would allow such a mess? So naturally, the moderators delete them.
Anticipating a question about the content that was there, so that's not interesting to me. I see what's in those threads now. We don't need such trash topics in the section.
Unpleasant merit transactions found by GazetaBitcoin but I would like to accept speculation from LoyceV, "It's quite normal for a Merit source to Merit someone when they use the same local board. I don't expect the posts to be bad, so it's not wrong."
[...]
Ratimov is mod's no. 1 fan!
[...]
The appreciation is mutual! The mod also also chose Ratimov as his first destination of merits, sending him an amount more than double compared to his second most merited user.
[...]
Ratimov is mod's no. 1 fan!
[...]
The appreciation is mutual! The mod also also chose Ratimov as his first destination of merits, sending him an amount more than double compared to his second most merited user.
[...]
How can a moderator or moderators do not see a single user is following a pattern and using him [them] to remove many other's posts including his entire topics. Not 1 or 5 or 10. Let's read what he said.
Since the appearance of your topic, I personally have deleted no more than 30 topics. Don't forget that the Russian section has two moderators. So no need to attribute to me what is not there (nepotism, etc).
30 Topic! Out of 78 and yet nothing looked unusual to him. That's only 30 topics, how many posts these 78 topics had those were reported and deleted? A database query will surely show the numbers and also it will show how many topics and posts were deleted by the same moderator but he never thought something is not normal.
I would like to think you were fooled on the other hand I don't know if you had any personal reason to favor a local member.
No more speculations. At some point the same moderator became unusually aggressive in his defense too.
Is my English so bad that you don't understand? Or are you trying to troll? What is not clear in what I wrote above? [...]
When you are not guilty, there are no need to lose your control. The moderation is questionable either it was a mutual agreement or an innocent irresponsibility.What matter is, are we going to allow moderators who do not have a sense of responsibility, the liability and loyalty to preserve the reputation of bitcointalk? An investigation is required first to find if the moderators are guilty of mutual agreement or it was an innocent irresponsibility. Second, based on the result of the investigation, an action is required.
Jump to: