Topic: IOTA Crowdsale - page 17. (Read 182701 times)

I didn't mean it as an insult, just that I would love better communicated schedules. Now that we have graphics artists etc. Can we have a deadline for Beta client with GUI? Even if it's one week, or two weeks I personally would just like a date when it will be released.

I kind of hope the GUI is not too awesome, like iotatoken.com overdid all the canvas background stuff.... cant even scroll fluidly on an quad-core Atom 1,44 GHz

"go ahead" sounds good. Would be great if it would be possible to make a Beta-Release in February.
Looking forward for it.

Of course we did, it's a highly reputable design firm from San Francisco. And due to this we actually had an unexpected delay due to international wiretransfer being stuck for days before work could even commence. But timeframes is flexible when you work on GUI due to the nature of iterations. You provide a rough idea, wireframes are put together, you review them and give pointers, new wireframes are drawn, eventually you greenlight them, then the next stage is design draft, then redraft after input, then another draft, then another input etc. Then animation, same process, then coding, similar issues there and then finally connecting back-end to front-end.  We're now at the stage where I've given a clean 'go ahead'.

Seems like you didn't talk about any timeframes with them and it's a bit strange... If they do the job for a money, and if they're professionals, there's got to be some timeframes.

It is indeed how it works. The features of IOTA has been known since day 1, we've already presented the vision of IOTA successfully in front of 200+ people, we're already bringing on board people who want to use it. They don't need a GUI to understand the concept and usage of IOTA, just like people did not need Ethereum to start working on projects for it.

The beta + GUI will be a really nice way for people to use IOTA in terms of sending transactions etc. but it wont magically make people think up use cases they can't already think up and start work on.

As for ETA annoying, welcome to the world of development. As we stated we outsourced the GUI and so we can't really do anything to boost it up other than provide them with input.
So yes, I am genuinely suggesting that more people start approaching companies (personally I'm in touch with over 15) that may have use of IOTA instead of just waiting around for GUI.

I am sorry but that's not how it works. We have had the information that beta is 'soon' and GUI 'in days' and it's getting frankly a little annoying. Without a functioning client and launch do you really want us to go to meetups with a whitepaper and smile? We need at least a Beta with GUI client to be able to show something to people. When we have a client and a testnet I will happily drag people by the hair to check it out!

Agreed. I think every aspect of this project has been professional and well run except for the occasional lapse in calm temperament and tone, which is very important for the image of the project.

well just some feedback here,
i remember reading David spitting the f word a few posts back and saying the word "bs" just a few posts up. my opinion is that the main represetative (for now at least until iota catches on and has better participation) of a project should stay neutral with his tone. don't be emotional and don't be rude (not even to trolls).

Thank you for the already improved tone. I (honestly) appreciate that.
Let's move on, agreed. I continue to support the project.
Good luck.

I respect everyone that bought IOTA or JINN in good faith without a hidden agenda of just pump and dumping it. Like I just said earlier I consider over 90% of people to be in this group. But there are still countless people that try to profit from false rumours and speculation (many of which don't even hold IOTA), to which I can only be extremely blunt in reply. You should not take it personally, there are several hundred holders (and speculator non-holders), I cannot keep track of each and every one of you and your intention, but when you ad hominemly attack me on false grounds I will respond back, and it won't be in the most polite tone. But I have never ever shown a lack of respect for anyone who is helping us and our vision and I am sorry if you have misinterpreted it this way.


I never said I expected you to test the product you purchased, but you claimed you were eagerly awaiting it so I don't think it's unreasonable to then  bring up that you could indeed already have begun testing your software purchase if you were very eager.

For (hopefully) the last time: I have only addressed the people who are speculating without doing anything, because this goes beyond what we, the creators and sellers of IOTA, has as responsibility. I have seen this sort of speculation ruin other great projects including Nxt and increasingly Bitcoin itself. Just go over to /r/bitcoin and see how far the project has fallen due to it being comprised of mainly speculation and very little progress or activism anymore. I don't want IOTA to fall into this category ever if I can prevent it, this is why I take the approach I take, but I'm not omnipotent. Ethereum has a great community in this regard they focus 95% on adoption and use-cases and tend to look down on speculation, because the value will come automatically as long as the rest is in place.

I also reject the claim that I don't take any responsibility as leader, again if you were in Ryver/kept a closer eye on what I've actually done you would know that most of the things that have happened in IOTA thus far is due to my initiation. But I don't want IOTA to become dependent on me for IOTA's sake. I want IOTA to prosper as a self-sustaining community, which I am quite confident it will.

And if you missed it in my last cointelegraph interview couple weeks back: I personally thank every single one who bought IOTA, including you.



Now enough drama for today, I'd like to again encourage everyone to check out http://www.iotevents.org and www.meetup.com/topics/internet-of-things/ to see if there's an event in your vicinity which we can enlighten about IOTA.

The kind of response I expected.

As my last replies to you:

1) I will keep my IOTA. Thank you very much.

2) You mean "OWN" not OWE... and no, this has nothing to do with control of anything. Just a lack of respect you show to people who are helping "your vision" (as you put it). I've been happy to wait on both JINN and IOTA (delays are not my problem with these projects) - neither is control.  

3) I'm sorry I have not participated in the testing (RYVER) - I am part of many projects and real life responsibilities which require time. As I helped fund the project, I imagined it would not be too much to ask that you actually tested the product without my help. I'm glad others are helping where they can, but find this disconnect and tone you take on this very issue part of your problem as a leader for this project. That you can't accept that we are not in the same position regarding this matter (and that you can't acknowledge that us having funded you is part of this dynamic) is troubling.

Like I said, enough is enough. I will stay quite now. I've said what I think and I've exposed my concerns - you are not interested, that's ok. I will keep my token/software. Maybe you really are great at what you do behind the scenes - I surely hope you are.  

Best of luck,

*from the "PUMP AND DUMPER" who never sold a single share of JINN or IOTA.

rtrtcrypto,

At first I don't like the tone too, but after reading all the explanations I have calmed down - they just do things very differently then the most other "Coins and ICO-s": registered company, VAT-tax, sale of software, lawyers.

I mean change the focus/view on it.

Interesting, because I have not seen you participate in the initial testing in Ryver, even though I invited you quite some time ago.


First of all you are vacuously postulating that either of us is 'getting paid' X, Y, Z. The funds we got from the software sale goes toward 3 things: paying VAT tax on the sale itself (this is how the real world works), toward IOTA development and R&D for our hardware start-up. This is something we disclosed on day 1.

You are 100% entitled to ask about my role in IOTA, I thought by this point it was self-evident, but I have no problem answering: I am the architect of the project. IOTA came about as a result of my vision for Fog and Mist computation requiring a compensation layer, which is why we started our hardware start-up too. Given that I was so fortunate to be in a position of working with CfB and Serguei in our hardware start-up it was a no-brainer that these would be the ones who flesh out the tech itself. This is also why CfB repeatedly state that his role is developer. In addition to this I am the manager that takes care of everything else from setting up the website, orchestrating the entire crowdsale, doing all the branding, PR and marketing, getting big companies involved, getting academics involved, setting up events, getting other crypto projects involved, to more mundane things like talking to lawyers, registering company and paying the bills. So now you know my role in IOTA and maybe have a better understanding of why I refuse to take orders from you as if you owe me somehow, soon you'll see just how much extra free work I have done to make your software a lot more useful while you only sat here complaining about not being allowed to be a slave master.


Have I said the market is not important? No. I have said that in order for IOTA to succeed the focus of the community has to be on technological adoption and NOT random speculator fluctuations in the first weeks. What drama that is to be avoided? This sort of drama that you instigate, which we sadly have to waste time on. This time that I have to respond to you and other trolls like you would be 100x better spent on virtually anything else, but since you purchased IOTA I feel compelled to respond to your paranoid ideas, no matter how delusional. Again this is the pleasure of leading a project. /s


So far you are the only person that somehow managed to miss my role in IOTA, so you are also the first person to ask why you should take me seriously. My answer: if you don't feel like it, don't. Whether you take me serious or not does not impact my life in any measurable way, so do whatever makes you feel better.


This is just getting beyond nonsensical at this point. The use of IOTA is not dependent on the value of it, you can use it as software however you like regardless of 'value' on exchanges. So your entire argument is flawed from start. Hell, even at 0 value you can still use it, so you get exactly what you paid for. This has been the point we have been emphasizing constantly: if you want it to increase in value DO SOMETHING USEFUL, stop just sitting on a random crypto forum talking.

And for the final time again: I, as well as CfB have emphasized that we do not want the project to be dependent on one person or a handful of people. IOTA is decentralized, people are allowed to do with it as they wish, so stop trying to put me in some "You are the ruler of IOTA" position and try to make it entirely reliant on me. With that said I can guarantee you that there is no single person that has done more to increase the value of IOTA than the person you are vacuously attacking just now.

This will be my last reply to you as it is beyond obvious that you are either really just a troll or delusional and think that you somehow owe me and CfB because you bought some product we developed. And just to prove my point again: I am willing to reimburse you for the IOTAs you purchased so that I can have them in my possession instead if you truly believe the drivel that you spew.

I've been following this tone of his for over 2 years now. It was the same in JINN. I love these projects and really think they are amazing - I've put a good deal of money and have helped pay for his salary on both projects.

I accept the idea that I am overly sensitive on this issue. But, it gets really depressing to witness the same tone over and over for multiple years towards many of the people who fund the projects he is involved in.

I just think it's unacceptable. I defended him and the delays many times here and in JINN - I don't even mind the delays, I think they are legitimate. I am a loyal holder of the tokens (both JINN and IOTA), have never sold ANY and want what is best for the project(s). But, now I am a "pump and dumper" (who never sold even one coin over multiple years, mind you). 

I will leave it at that, I've said what I have to say. Disgusted.

rtrtcrypto, I think you're bit exaggerating, really.

+1

This is a must IMO

I appreciate you're working hard and improving the codebase etc
but these delays are causing stress and confusion.

I hope the UI guys have some kinda deadline and we launch sooner rather than later
The sooner we do the sooner we can leave this trash-talk behind us.

Until a successful Genesis the IOTA brand will continue draw this kinda negative energy.

My god man, you are just horrible at what you do. I'm really amazed by how rude and tone-deaf you are.
I can't even find the right emotions. I and others are helping to pay your salary and your reaction is just so nasty.

You are the most ungrateful team member for any project I have backed. FIAT, crypto, etc.

My respect for CFB will keep me onboard with JINN and IOTA - but just barely.

"Welcome to the real world. IOTA is real world tech, not crypto-speculation-pump-and-dump"

Great. Where is the software I paid for then? I paid for a product, ok... I'm waiting to take possession of it.

"But the point stands: there are some people who bought IOTA tokens for speculation: we do not owe them anything beyond the software and everyone needs to understand this."

I'm curious, you are not one of the technical developers, correct? You don't work on the math, nor the protocol itself, nor are you a cryptographer, etc. Is this correct? Because if you guys (IOTA TEAM) are just responsible for developing software (technical work) and you are not one of the developers or programmers or cryptographers. Then why exactly are you being paid? As you said yourself, the responsibility of the team is just to develop the technology and nothing else.  

There is also another contradiction, you say that you don't care about speculators and the market doesn't matter and that only the technology is important. Then what drama is caused by any speculator? If the market around your product is not important to you - as you say, the software sale is OVER and you are just responsible for the tech. So, what exactly is the drama that is to be avoided?

Lastly, I'm not interested in having you take me seriously or not seriously - you miss the point again. People are (rightfully) questioning why they should take YOU seriously.

I bought "software" that I intend to use... having said that, my use of the network will be dependent on its value which is dependent on its use - your actions and words make me believe that you are hurting the future use of MY software which I paid to have and use. As such, I take issue with you and your tone in so far as it hurts my future use of what I paid to have.

We'll keep it open until the beta release at least. But yes we'll be moving over to a dedicated IOTA forum shortly. Personally I don't care about rtrtcrypto's toxicity, we know full well that this kind of mentality permeates BTT, which we also knew when we hosted the crowdsale here, so it's no problem for us to deal with. And again it just put emphasis once again on what really matters: the tech, everyone should focus on the tech.