LargeCoin Pricing Announced; Taking Pre-Orders - page 3.

dropt

legendary

Activity: 1512

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Quote from: bulanula on May 31, 2012, 09:33:34 AM

Any updates ?

Hoping they did not run off with all the moneys Huh

IIRC, all deposits were to be held in escrow, so there will be no "running off with all the moneys."

I think I found a listed address at one point, next time I'm in Vancouver maybe I should swing by.

bulanula

hero member

Activity: 518

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Any updates ?

Hoping they did not run off with all the moneys Huh

ElectricBrain

newbie

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Quote from: nmat on March 06, 2012, 05:32:55 PM

Quote from: DavinciJ15 on March 06, 2012, 03:06:28 PM

I agree I was excited until I looked at the numbers and thought about the agreement.

1. $4500 is enough to build a fake and run off with the pre-orders.
2. No one knows for sure you can accomplish this.
3. You have no reputation, or testimonials of your past accomplishments.
4. I want to see your face, and more of web presence with an address and phone number
5. You can't start small by selling low cost systems as part of building your rep between now and July?

Well, I hope you are not a fraud as I would love to buy a system.

I know that it doesn't prove anything, but during the past year ttul mentioned several times that they were working on an ASIC.

The "Long Con" is an art only the best scammers can pull off. I don't think this is a SCAM, but if it is, it's a good one.

Dalkore

legendary

Activity: 1330

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Mining since 2010 & Hosting since 2012

Quote from: deepceleron on April 29, 2012, 09:36:39 AM

You would have to hope that many miners will quit when the reward goes down.

Interesting question posed here. What are the thoughts on this? I have been doing calculations and have some interesting scenarios worked out.

Dalkore

bitpop

legendary

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odd indeed, i want PHOTOS

DeathAndTaxes

donator

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: deepceleron on April 29, 2012, 09:58:27 AM

At $15,000, that puts the miners in the "definitely more reasonable" zone. The offer has expired though (and they apparently took more than 25 preorders at that price too).

My guess is they will never sell a single unit @ $30K. As you point out the math doesn't make any sense. By the time they are beyond pre-orders; BFL should be caught up on back orders, possibly have rigbox out, the new FPGA upstart releasing products, new Lancelot board out, possibly a price cut on the quad ztek, and all FPGA makers looking towards 28nm Artix based miners at end of the year.

If it doesn't make sense now @ $30K in makes even less sense in a more competitive environment near the end of the year.

deepceleron

legendary

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Quote from: JWU42 on April 29, 2012, 09:48:49 AM

LC rigs were at $15K - just FYI

aha, just found: "Okay, everyone. We've read the forums, and have carefully considered the ROI calculations that have been submitted by various of you. We have also talked to many of you by telephone. After much research and contemplation, we have decided to offer the first 25 customers who order a C200 unit by April 15 a 50% discount on our initial price of $30,000 per unit to ensure that we can establish trust with an initial group of customers." (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.797876). I'm sure the responses they got to revise pricing were similar to my post.

At $15,000, that puts the miners in the "definitely more reasonable" zone. The offer has expired though (and they apparently took more than 25 preorders at that price too).

JWU42

legendary

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Quote from: deepceleron on April 29, 2012, 09:36:39 AM

The impact of all 25 20Ghash/s ASIC rigs would be both significant but still small. In addition, the cost is too high for all but the very-long term risk-takers.

The current difficulty indicates a network hashrate of 10799 GHash/s.
You would be adding 500 GHash/s to that when all these rigs turn on.

Each 20GHash rig will increase the difficulty by 2793.
The current difficulty is 1508590. Each rig is still a drop in the bucket...

It would take $1,800,000 worth of LargeCoin rigs (60 of them) to mine 10% of the Bitcoins (5040 BTC a week, currently valued at $25200), while consuming 50A @ 120V doing it. The difficulty going up just 11.1% from such a purchase won't completely destroy the existing mining economy... You would have to hope that many miners will quit when the reward goes down.

It would take 143 weeks (2.7 years) of 25BTC/block mining to break even on your investment with free electricity, if the hashrate of the rest of the network and the exchange rate stayed the same (you could also get rich, or the Bitcoin economy could completely collapse). This is a risky investment unless you think value is going up up up. If you do, $30,000 will buy you 6125 BTC off MtGox right now; your Largecoin miner would only make that much after 145+ weeks of mining if nobody else turns on a mining rig.

LC rigs were at $15K - just FYI

deepceleron

legendary

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The impact of all 25 20Ghash/s ASIC rigs would be both significant but still small. In addition, the cost is too high for all but the very-long term risk-takers.

The current difficulty indicates a network hashrate of 10799 GHash/s.
You would be adding 500 GHash/s to that when all these rigs turn on.

Each 20GHash rig will increase the difficulty by 2793.
The current difficulty is 1508590. Each rig is still a drop in the bucket...

It would take $1,800,000 worth of LargeCoin rigs (60 of them) to mine 10% of the Bitcoins (5040 BTC a week, currently valued at $25200), while consuming 50A @ 120V doing it. The difficulty going up just 11.1% from such a purchase won't completely destroy the existing mining economy... You would have to hope that many miners will quit when the reward goes down.

It would take 143 weeks (2.7 years) of 25BTC/block mining to break even on your investment with free electricity, if the hashrate of the rest of the network and the exchange rate stayed the same (you could also get rich, or the Bitcoin economy could completely collapse). This is a risky investment unless you think value is going up up up. If you do, $30,000 will buy you 6125 BTC off MtGox right now; your Largecoin miner would only make that much after 145+ weeks of mining if nobody else turns on a mining rig.

ice_chill

sr. member

Activity: 336

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Quote from: antirack on March 26, 2012, 06:19:01 PM

And with more people making big cash ($) investments for larger FPGA and ASIC mining equipment, I believe there will be more downwards pressure on the Bitcoin.

My thinking is that a lot of relative small scale miners that only spent a few hundreds or a thousand dollars for their equipment are perfectly happy to keep their income in Bitcoin. While the ones that spent up to $15k or even more, have an urgent need to put those Bitcoin back on an exchange in order to sell them for $$$ to pay the bills.

In other words, while more large scale miners won't mean more Bitcoin on the market, we will have more people that put their Bitcoin up for sale for $$$.

I don't think there is a difference between small investor and large investor cashing out to pay bills, mainly because a small investor will have GPUs which actually cost more to run, while mine less bitcoins, a larger investor has better power efficiency so he has less bills to pay and mines more bitcoins.

And TBH I don't think miners make up the major economy of Bitcoin.

organofcorti

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Poor impulse control.

Quote from: antirack on March 26, 2012, 06:19:01 PM

And with more people making big cash ($) investments for larger FPGA and ASIC mining equipment, I believe there will be more downwards pressure on the Bitcoin.

My thinking is that a lot of relative small scale miners that only spent a few hundreds or a thousand dollars for their equipment are perfectly happy to keep their income in Bitcoin. While the ones that spent up to $15k or even more, have an urgent need to put those Bitcoin back on an exchange in order to sell them for $$$ to pay the bills.

In other words, while more large scale miners won't mean more Bitcoin on the market, we will have more people that put their Bitcoin up for sale for $$$.

It might also increase the profitability of services that pay bills for bitcoin. I can pay my electricity bill in bitcoin, for example. If LargeCoin creates a large number of new farmboys out there they'll be keen to spend coin paying for things *without* using an exchange.

JWU42

legendary

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And back on topic -- sent an e-mail yesterday and no response as of yet Cry

EDIT - Got an e-mail early this morning (29 March) that they are finalizing details on the escrow details and engineering work continues...

JWU42

legendary

Activity: 1666

Merit: 1000

Yeah - agreed with that you can get down to some very good numbers but it doesn't make sense yet...

Seasonic PSU X-Gold PSUs - Check
Underclocked Sempron - Check
Bios - Will review further
Memclock - 180-300 (some cards aren't happy with 180)
USB Key - Check (BAMT)

DeathAndTaxes

donator

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: JWU42 on March 26, 2012, 08:51:58 PM

D&T - 3 Mh/J - seriously?

It isn't easy but it is doable.

Every little watt helps especially that last few tenths of a MH/J.
* 80Plus-Gold PSU
* 240V circuit (about 3% lower W than 120V)
* 4x5970s rig (high MH/S relative to host overhead)
* Underclocked and undervolted sempron
* Turn off what is not needed in BIOS
* Memclock down to 150
* Linux on USB key (no 100% CPU bug)
* Supplemental fans but not going to crazy (I dropped it back to 2x UltraKaze pulling instead of pushing)

Undervolting and underclocking the GPU you can get up to 4 MH/J but currently it is more profitable to run it at full voltage. Still as those FPGA start to drive down price/difficulty it is nice to have the option to crank up the efficiency to squeeze that last little bit out of old old GPUs.

Still 2.5+ MH/J is solid. I remember a thread some time back after the price crash when I got into arguments because some people thought getting >2.0 MH/J was just unrealistic. Today 2.0 MH/J is just downright bad.

JWU42

legendary

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Ours is 200A...

D&T - 3 Mh/J - seriously? Mine are all above 2.5 and one at 2.7 - but barely. That said, they all have 20-30W worth of 120x38mm Delta screamers on them...

DeathAndTaxes

donator

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Gerald Davis

You can check your breaker panel. If you have a "mains" breaker (some panels don't) it should be rated below the current limit for wiring from your panel to power grid. In US most homes have at least 100A, sometimes 200A, even older homes that haven't been upgraded should be good for 60A or so.

julz

legendary

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Quote from: antirack on March 26, 2012, 06:32:23 PM

Assuming 12kWh, is this even possible on a domestic electricity circuit under normal circumstances? (100 Amps @ 110V)

If not, then those 30 GH/s GPU farms are only fictional or very rare.

According to my household power monitor... our instantaneous water heater alone uses around 15kW.
That thing is on a 3-phase 240V supply (Australia).

I've seen household usage spike up to near 20kW - so I guess an electrician could put in circuits to supply a nice big GPU farm.

Not sure how well that would go *on top of* the already heavy usage of some households like this one though!

DeathAndTaxes

donator

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: antirack on March 26, 2012, 06:32:23 PM

Assuming 12kWh, is this even possible on a domestic electricity circuit under normal circumstances? (is 100 Amps @ 110V about right??)

If not, then those 30 GH/s GPU farms are only fictional or very rare.

US mains are 240V (120V split phase). Dropping in 240V outlets isn't that tough. I made a DIY article a while back. Also 2.5 MH/J is pretty crappy. Optimized rigs can get closer to 3MH/J. Still 12 KW on 240V mains is 50A but you would want to derate that 20% so you need about 60A of capacity. A pair of NEMA L6-30R outlets will do the trick.

Still I would say non-botnet 30GH/s farms are pretty rare. Antecdotally (and looking at pool stats) I would say even >10GH/s farms are relatively rare.

antirack

hero member

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Immersionist

Assuming 12kWh, is this even possible on a domestic electricity circuit under normal circumstances? (is 100 Amps @ 110V about right??)

If not, then those 30 GH/s GPU farms are only fictional or very rare.

JWU42

legendary

Activity: 1666

Merit: 1000

Or another way to look at it...

The 30 Gh/s farm that was GPU powered was paying almost $900 a month on electric.

Assuming 2.5 Mh/J (hard to get much better) = 12,000 Watts @ $.10/Kwh = $876/month

Now same miner can achieve similar for 1/10th (using BFL) or 1/20th (using other FPGA) the power. Now, the question of paying off the hardware ASAP is another issue and varies by individual.

Topic: LargeCoin Pricing Announced; Taking Pre-Orders - page 3. (Read 30323 times)