Topic: Please stop with mBTC, microBTC, ...! - page 10. (Read 15214 times)

Quote from: Harley997 on July 11, 2014, 06:53:44 PM

I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

Using lots of zeros isn't standard. While you can do it in general it is too error prone and inconvenient. World wide any teenager+ knows what mBTC or uBTC means, even if they don't know what BTC is. That is probably even true in the USA, so maybe it is time to learn the prefixes.

How would anyone at all know what mBTC or uBTC means if they don't know what BTC is? That is a baseless assumption and simply untrue.

If you were to use decimals then it would be very clear as to exactly how much BTC would be in question.

mBTC - 1/1000th of a BTC
uBTC - 1/1,000,000 of a BTC

Even my 10 year old knows that. She doesn't have any clue or even care what a BTC is right now. She is only interested in money that she can cram in her pocket.

Okay you have successfully explained what mBTC and uBTC is, but you have not explained how some random person would know what these measurements mean.

dyask

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Quote from: dyask on July 11, 2014, 05:55:26 PM

Quote from: dyask on July 11, 2014, 05:55:26 PM

I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

Using lots of zeros isn't standard. While you can do it in general it is too error prone and inconvenient. World wide any teenager+ knows what mBTC or uBTC means, even if they don't know what BTC is. That is probably even true in the USA, so maybe it is time to learn the prefixes.

How would anyone at all know what mBTC or uBTC means if they don't know what BTC is? That is a baseless assumption and simply untrue.

If you were to use decimals then it would be very clear as to exactly how much BTC would be in question.

mBTC - 1/1000th of a BTC
uBTC - 1/1,000,000 of a BTC

Even my 10 year old knows that. She doesn't have any clue or even care what a BTC is right now. She is only interested in money that she can cram in her pocket.

Harley997

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Activity: 266

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I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

Using lots of zeros isn't standard. While you can do it in general it is too error prone and inconvenient. World wide any teenager+ knows what mBTC or uBTC means, even if they don't know what BTC is. That is probably even true in the USA, so maybe it is time to learn the prefixes.

How would anyone at all know what mBTC or uBTC means if they don't know what BTC is? That is a baseless assumption and simply untrue.

If you were to use decimals then it would be very clear as to exactly how much BTC would be in question.

dyask

hero member

Activity: 854

Merit: 510

I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

Using lots of zeros isn't standard. While you can do it in general it is too error prone and inconvenient. World wide any teenager+ knows what mBTC or uBTC means, even if they don't know what BTC is. That is probably even true in the USA, so maybe it is time to learn the prefixes.

dyask

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Quote from: Dallas5 on July 02, 2014, 08:23:36 AM

I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

Well using mBTC and uBTC is following the SI standard. In fact that is probably the widely followed standard in the world. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SI

Gianluca95

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Reputation first.

Just use BTC or satoshi (0.00000001) like in:

I just bought a car for 10 BTC!
The new Final Fantasy game will cost only 15000 satoshi!

Using mBTC, uBTC, μBTC is just unnecessary, sounds like a different coin and it will confuse a lot of people.

Coinedup and a few other sites are guilty of using mBTC.

1 satoshi is the smallest unit of BTC that's all people should have to learn. If you want massive user adoption you have to simplify things.

Yes, I appreciate your purpose, but satoshi is too much low, maybe uBTC is good Wink

HarmonLi

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Honest 80s business!

I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

totally -- we already have standards that have been decided by the market!

CryptInvest

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Yes, with the number of zeros after the decimal point is really a mess. Why all journalists repeated the false truth that Bitcoin can be divided to six decimal places. Satoshi is the same 7 characters.

zhinkk

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Quote from: Sheldor333 on July 11, 2014, 02:57:50 PM

I agree with OP, Bitcoin and Satoshi are the only reasonable units.

Both units naturally emerged from usage. There is no advantage in propagating other units, they only add confusion.

In addition there is absolutely no problem in expressing amounts below 0.01 BTC efficiently in Satoshi: You can just use the common abbreviation for thousands: 'k'.
So for example 100k Satoshi are 0.001 BTC. Simple and intuitive.

I agree with this. In a way, I feel like you can use mBTC/ bits/whatever if you want. Just stop trying to make it a standard. I want to say 0.00001 BTC. Why is that a problem? We aren't dealing with 5 year olds, any teenager+ knows what a decimal is.

BowieMan

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Is there life on Mars?

yeah, let's change the standard denomination every couple years!!! Roll Eyes

flagel8

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Until there is something better to use instead of mBTC, uBTC and so on we are stuck with those, that is my opinion at least. Even thought it would be better now to come up with something since it would be easier to implement.

'bits'... ...what?

Sheldor333

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Until there is something better to use instead of mBTC, uBTC and so on we are stuck with those, that is my opinion at least. Even thought it would be better now to come up with something since it would be easier to implement.

counter

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Time is on our side, yes it is!

Quote from: zimmah on July 02, 2014, 08:49:40 PM

Quote from: counter on July 02, 2014, 07:00:07 PM

For the record I did not realize a bit was not the same as 1 Satoshi...

Because of this I think it would not be the best idea to use if there is a chance it will confuse people. I however think we should just call 1 Satoshi 1 Bit because it would makes sense for a single unit to be a bit IMO.

The language does need to be tweaked but I don't think it is something worth fighting over is all.

The word bit should be avoided altogether, as when someone hears it for the first time he would never know whether it means 1 satoshi, 100 satoshi, 1 bitcoin, 0.125 bitcoin or something else entirely.

It has been discussed to death many times, but a handful of people spreads bits like a meme and it tends to stick around for that reason only. Some people just don't know when to quit.

You are correct. I've just forgotten all of this reasons why certain terms are best not to be used. Kind of surprised this issue still being debated but I also can see why at the same time. Leaning towards just calling any amount under a bitcoin "x" amount of Satoshis and being done with it simply because the issue is annoying me(just joking), even though I feel the discussion is warranted at this point. I think the more the discussion the more there is confusion for those looking in trying to understand.

dyask

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Quote from: Lethn on July 10, 2014, 07:09:22 AM

Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 06:57:13 AM

Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 05:57:27 PM

There is nothing difficult about writing 0.0005BTC for example, granted, it's difficult to say it but that's really the only time when I'd say it's a good idea to do use those units.

Easy to make mistakes with lots of zeros too. Grin

Learn fucking mathematics like I am and stop being lazy lol :p that's basically all this is, it pisses me off that I'm re-learning everything so I understand it correctly and then these fuckers just come along and make shit up.

So using mBTC or uBTC would be using math skills. Or you could use 1.3x10^-7 instead of 13 satoshi, that would be using math skills, not writing out 0.00000013 BTC which is fine for computers but not for humans.

tmobileguy

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Quote from: kutaka on July 10, 2014, 07:11:46 AM

Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 06:42:17 AM

Well the US Dollar is 4 syllables and even the brief form USD is three. So much for that theory. In Japan the "yen" is pretty unique and only one syllable. I asked my 10 year old and she knew what milli and micro meant. Japanese education includes that at least.

For trading you can just use Bitcoin. The other forms are for shopping.

Oh and Japan is amongst the world leaders in money and innovations. In fact Europe is too. Although the US might be the undisputed king of McJobs that don't pay enough to live on. Maybe "Mc" should be a unit?

Wow butthurt much? Silicon valley is the world center of IT innovations, whether you agree with that or not.

Also, Dollar is 2 syllables. I've never been to USA, but I do not think that in shop you can often hear: "This will be 2 US Dollars" unless you live at the Canada border.

No butthurt (whatever that means.) But there is a vast amount of innovation outside of Silicon valley. I never said US innovation isn't important, it is just by far from the whole story. For the record the Silicon valley accounts only for a small part of US innovation. It is far from being the center of innovation in the US.

As for "Dollar", that by itself doesn't mean USD, or US Dollar unless you happen to be in the US, then the term dollars is used by itself. Dollar is used for many world currencies. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollar The confusion isn't just for those living at the Canadian border. I have traveled a lot, and term dollar is ambiguous. Bitcoin is clear though, unless you are taking about both the network and BTC.

For the record I actually happen to be a US citizen and I work in the high tech world. I currently live in Japan. In many ways the US is very backwards and even primitive. For example broadband in the states is overpriced, slow and often hard to get.

We should just call them dollars then! Just don't call them virtual dollars...because then people will be bragging about how many VD's they have...

tmobileguy

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Quote from: Lethn on July 10, 2014, 07:09:22 AM

Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 06:57:13 AM

Quote from: kutaka on July 10, 2014, 07:11:46 AM

There is nothing difficult about writing 0.0005BTC for example, granted, it's difficult to say it but that's really the only time when I'd say it's a good idea to do use those units.

Easy to make mistakes with lots of zeros too. Grin

Learn fucking mathematics like I am and stop being lazy lol :p that's basically all this is, it pisses me off that I'm re-learning everything so I understand it correctly and then these fuckers just come along and make shit up.

Tom Smykowski: Well... well look. I already told you: I deal with the god damn customers so the engineers don't have to. I have people skills; I am good at dealing with people! Can't you understand that? What the hell is wrong with you people?

- Lethn's BFF

dyask

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Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 06:42:17 AM

Well the US Dollar is 4 syllables and even the brief form USD is three. So much for that theory. In Japan the "yen" is pretty unique and only one syllable. I asked my 10 year old and she knew what milli and micro meant. Japanese education includes that at least.

For trading you can just use Bitcoin. The other forms are for shopping.

Oh and Japan is amongst the world leaders in money and innovations. In fact Europe is too. Although the US might be the undisputed king of McJobs that don't pay enough to live on. Maybe "Mc" should be a unit?

Wow butthurt much? Silicon valley is the world center of IT innovations, whether you agree with that or not.

Also, Dollar is 2 syllables. I've never been to USA, but I do not think that in shop you can often hear: "This will be 2 US Dollars" unless you live at the Canada border.

No butthurt (whatever that means.) But there is a vast amount of innovation outside of Silicon valley. I never said US innovation isn't important, it is just by far from the whole story. For the record the Silicon valley accounts only for a small part of US innovation. It is far from being the center of innovation in the US.

As for "Dollar", that by itself doesn't mean USD, or US Dollar unless you happen to be in the US, then the term dollars is used by itself. Dollar is used for many world currencies. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollar The confusion isn't just for those living at the Canadian border. I have traveled a lot, and term dollar is ambiguous. Bitcoin is clear though, unless you are taking about both the network and BTC.

For the record I actually happen to be a US citizen and I work in the high tech world. I currently live in Japan. In many ways the US is very backwards and even primitive. For example broadband in the states is overpriced, slow and often hard to get.

kutaka

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Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 06:42:17 AM

Well the US Dollar is 4 syllables and even the brief form USD is three. So much for that theory. In Japan the "yen" is pretty unique and only one syllable. I asked my 10 year old and she knew what milli and micro meant. Japanese education includes that at least.

For trading you can just use Bitcoin. The other forms are for shopping.

Oh and Japan is amongst the world leaders in money and innovations. In fact Europe is too. Although the US might be the undisputed king of McJobs that don't pay enough to live on. Maybe "Mc" should be a unit?

Wow butthurt much? Silicon valley is the world center of IT innovations, whether you agree with that or not.

Also, Dollar is 2 syllables. I've never been to USA, but I do not think that in shop you can often hear: "This will be 2 US Dollars" unless you live at the Canada border.

Lethn

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Quote from: dyask on July 10, 2014, 06:57:13 AM

There is nothing difficult about writing 0.0005BTC for example, granted, it's difficult to say it but that's really the only time when I'd say it's a good idea to do use those units.

Easy to make mistakes with lots of zeros too. Grin

Learn fucking mathematics like I am and stop being lazy lol :p that's basically all this is, it pisses me off that I'm re-learning everything so I understand it correctly and then these fuckers just come along and make shit up.

dyask

hero member

Activity: 854

Merit: 510