Topic: Removal of BestChange ANN from local sections - page 2. (Read 1097 times)
The OP has not posted since creating this thread, maybe they are working behind the scenes using PMs to get a better understanding of what happened in relation to the deleted threads. Even though reasons have been alluded to what happened, nothing was explained and maybe this is an opportunity to have a debate about whether a moderator should always advise a member why their threads were removed at the time they took action.
If the agency you hired used shitty machine translation on Dutch, chances are they did the same for other languages.
I said the same thing earlier, it was an obvious redflag from the Dutch assessment. Same agency can't produce different results. Little penalty they ( bestchange) has to pay for not trusting anyone from the forum to do the job.
If the one in Dutch was translated by the same agency and reported as bad, there's a significant possibility that the others are also bad.
Can you give us an idea what the issue is with all the above-mentioned threads?
There are some line which your translated content might have gone against the rules or we say they are badly translated. But I believe only local mods can have such action to delete post as they are only person who can decide whether a post is bad or not when following the forum ethics.
]Whoops, you are correct. I somehow missed up my quotes. Has been updated!
This has happened to me as well, but most times when with mobile and it's too tiny to quote the right person. So for that I reduced my interest of quoting while on mobile. 
If you bothered to read the whole thread instead just the last post that you replied to, you would see that on at least one local board thread was deleted even though translation was good (confirmed by 2 native speakers of that board), meaning there's more factors to it.
Well, only one translation was verified by 2 native speakers who confirmed that it was written in a well manner but still rest of the local boards translation might be deleted only because they were not written by native speakers or the agency who translated the announcement thread might have used machine translation. The exact reason behind deleting of those local board threads is still unknown.And when that thread appeared, I thought that it was better to be opened by BestChange than by some local user, due to possible later updates.
Hello sir Mitchell!
Please I can't remember saying the above statement you quoted me there. I wouldn't have responded to this but I know how strict is forum about whatever they do. Please I would like you to re-edit your post and quote the right person for future purposes.
Sorry to draw back your attention and I mean no insults. At least I am with my clear eyes 👀.
Whoops, you are correct. I somehow missed up my quotes. Has been updated! Please I can't remember saying the above statement you quoted me there. I wouldn't have responded to this but I know how strict is forum about whatever they do. Please I would like you to re-edit your post and quote the right person for future purposes.
Sorry to draw back your attention and I mean no insults. At least I am with my clear eyes 👀.
Snip
Correct, as a patroller I can only deal with newbies.Please I can't remember saying the above statement you quoted me there. I wouldn't have responded to this but I know how strict is forum about whatever they do. Please I would like you to re-edit your post and quote the right person for future purposes.
Sorry to draw back your attention and I mean no insults. At least I am with my clear eyes 👀.
If you bothered to read the whole thread instead just the last post that you replied to, you would see that on at least one local board thread was deleted even though translation was good (confirmed by 2 native speakers of that board), meaning there's more factors to it.
Well, only one translation was verified by 2 native speakers who confirmed that it was written in a well manner but still rest of the local boards translation might be deleted only because they were not written by native speakers or the agency who translated the announcement thread might have used machine translation. The exact reason behind deleting of those local board threads is still unknown. 
Ideally, these boards should have a moderator speaking the local language.
I've offered to volunteer since the Greek board is ultra low traffic.
But it seems there's not much interest. Which I kind of understand also. If s board is low traffic having its own moderator becomes an administrative burden. On the other hand the Bitcoin community should do its best to remain open to all kinds of people.
I don't know in the end. It lies with Theymos' decisions. But if a community can't have traffic and had lost its moderator bringing another one won't necessarily bring traffic also. So it's understandable.
I've offered to volunteer since the Greek board is ultra low traffic.
But it seems there's not much interest. Which I kind of understand also. If s board is low traffic having its own moderator becomes an administrative burden. On the other hand the Bitcoin community should do its best to remain open to all kinds of people.
I don't know in the end. It lies with Theymos' decisions. But if a community can't have traffic and had lost its moderator bringing another one won't necessarily bring traffic also. So it's understandable.
As far as I know, patrollers can only act on posts written by Newbies, so we can discard that theory.
Correct, as a patroller I can only deal with newbies.What do you mean by patrollers? Are these human positions, or are they bots which have an API to read and report newbie posts (like Mitchell's spambot)? And when did they start getting used?
This has been a position for as long as I've been on the forum. Think I got it somewhere in 2015 (whilst being a Moderator for the Dutch section) and kept it when I stopped being its moderator. I would look it up, but don't feel like going through that many DM pages.Patrollers deal with newbies, my bot used to run on my own account, but that isn't very secure, so I made a new one and it got the same patroller rights I have.
But as far as I know, every Mod is also patroller.
You are wrong, simple moderators do not have patrol powers. Patrol powers are given by theymos at his discretion, but initially simple moderators do not have such powers.
I don't think there is an API, just patrol.
Correct. All my bot does is scrape, parse, act. 
But as far as I know, every Mod is also patroller.
You are wrong, simple moderators do not have patrol powers. Patrol powers are given by theymos at his discretion, but initially simple moderators do not have such powers.
I also think that the local board threads were removed only due to poor translation and nothing else. I also suggest Best Change to hire someone reputable who could rewrite those threads once again but in human tone not by using any AI or machine translation tools.
If you bothered to read the whole thread instead just the last post that you replied to, you would see that on at least one local board thread was deleted even though translation was good (confirmed by 2 native speakers of that board), meaning there's more factors to it. So the deletion depends on a subjective criterion more like a lottery
Afaik, that's how post deletion always worked around here. 
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When your thread was removed for poor quality translation, you went back to the same agency that make the translation for you and they did fucking analysis
The bold part point us to where the problem is, agency did an analysis, did they tell you they changed anything or work on the translation to make it meet the standard acceptable here in the forum?
No right! So now you want to force your way through?
The bold part point us to where the problem is, agency did an analysis, did they tell you they changed anything or work on the translation to make it meet the standard acceptable here in the forum?
No right! So now you want to force your way through?
Have you read what the thread is about? I'll answer you: no. We are talking about the fact that Best Change has 16 translations of its service thread made and just 5 of them were deleted. Moreover, they can be deleted not just because they were supposedly translated by an automatic translator but:
... because this sort of translation activity is simply more noise than signal in that local section.
Otherwise it would not be understandable that the Croatian translation, which is well done, has been deleted.
In short, such translations can be deleted if they are done by an seemingly by an automatic translator or if they are ‘noise’, or not, because for example the one in the Spanish section was not deleted and I would bet that it was not the only one that was reported and not deleted.
So the deletion depends on a subjective criterion more like a lottery whereby 5 translations have been deleted and 11 remain. The company's poor translation in some cases is not crucial here.
When your thread was removed for poor quality translation, you went back to the same agency that make the translation for you and they did fucking analysis
The bold part point us to where the problem is, agency did an analysis, did they tell you they changed anything or work on the translation to make it meet the standard acceptable here in the forum?
No right! So now you want to force your way through?
The bold part point us to where the problem is, agency did an analysis, did they tell you they changed anything or work on the translation to make it meet the standard acceptable here in the forum?
No right! So now you want to force your way through?
What do you mean by patrollers? Are these human positions, or are they bots which have an API to read and report newbie posts (like Mitchell's spambot)? And when did they start getting used?
Mods are attached to a certain board, patrollers aren't. But as far as I know, every Mod is also patroller. So a Mod can moderate anyone on "their own" board, but only Newbies anywhere else. And there are a few patrollers who aren't Mods. I don't think there is an API, just patrol. 
Talking about Theymos, that dude is fucking busy out there man! I don't think he would have that time responding to them knowing too well that he has people under him who can fixed up this minor issues. As I believe any deleted post can be restored by mod/admin without mentioning theymos himself. I will go with your suggestions at least to contact those local moderators, it's a nice idea.
Less I forget.. refer that I meant is to post on those locals through someone over there, but your suggestion counters all as it's the best.
Less I forget.. refer that I meant is to post on those locals through someone over there, but your suggestion counters all as it's the best.
Posts are usually deleted by moderators and not by admins. In the case of the local boards it is usually by the local board moderator if any, or a global mod.
it was simply an action taken by one of those global mods or patrollers without anyone's assistance.
As far as I know, patrollers can only act on posts written by Newbies, so we can discard that theory. What do you mean by patrollers? Are these human positions, or are they bots which have an API to read and report newbie posts (like Mitchell's spambot)? And when did they start getting used?
What we're talking about here is taking the same announcement and translating it into 16 different languages/topics. Local moderators need to decide on a case-by-case basis whether this kind of pure translation is actually worthwhile in their own local sections. It'd be totally reasonable for a local moderator to delete any of these topics due to being a poor translation, or even just because this sort of translation activity is simply more noise than signal in that local section.
The 4 topics deleted in this case were in low-volume language sections that don't have their own moderators, so Global Moderators who can't actually speak the language have jurisdiction. Given that, it's reasonable to assume that they're poor translations and/or non-additive. I'm not inclined to restore them.
The 4 topics deleted in this case were in low-volume language sections that don't have their own moderators, so Global Moderators who can't actually speak the language have jurisdiction. Given that, it's reasonable to assume that they're poor translations and/or non-additive. I'm not inclined to restore them.
If the agency you hired used shitty machine translation on Dutch, chances are they did the same for other languages.
I fully agree with LoyceV, and I also think that the local board threads were removed only due to poor translation and nothing else. I also suggest Best Change to hire someone reputable who could rewrite those threads once again but in human tone not by using any AI or machine translation tools. If the Dutch translation was really bad then I'd assume the deletion there could've been caused by obvious breaking of above rule #27.
It was really bad:it is not clear to us was the suspicious in using machine translation was the reason for our Dutch topic to be taken off. Could anyone please advise?
It's the reason I reported it. I assume the Mod agreed with me. If you paid for these translations, it doesn't sound like natural Dutch.Quote
"Als u uw tijd belangrijk vindt, moet u weten hoelang het duurt om een geldwisselaar met acceptabele wisselkoersen te kiezen. Wij bieden u aan dat te vergeten en uw tijd aan iets leuks te besteden"
Can you give some insight as to why our threads were removed from Japanese. Hebrew, Croatian, Greek and Swedish section?
If the agency you hired used shitty machine translation on Dutch, chances are they did the same for other languages. it was simply an action taken by one of those global mods or patrollers without anyone's assistance.
As far as I know, patrollers can only act on posts written by Newbies, so we can discard that theory. Fair. I had no idea they only acted on newbie posts; I always assumed they had the same power as the global mod except to ban and unban users.
The translation I saw on our local board wasn't bad. It wasn't perfect but the agency that took care of it obviously did more than just Google translate or DeepL.
Tells alot about the source of those translations, the mod who took care of it could be right after all.
The translation I saw on our local board wasn't bad. It wasn't perfect but the agency that took care of it obviously did more than just Google translate or DeepL.
It was still deleted, even though I didn't report it. Someone else probably did. The Greek board is kinda dead. I follow it for every post and get a notification for everything, there aren't that many posts at all. So I'd say someone probably doing the same also reported it and because there's no local moderator they took the report too seriously and they didn't know Greek at all do they just followed it blindly.
A solution maybe could be to have a local reputable member make your posts so they don't get deleted.
It was still deleted, even though I didn't report it. Someone else probably did. The Greek board is kinda dead. I follow it for every post and get a notification for everything, there aren't that many posts at all. So I'd say someone probably doing the same also reported it and because there's no local moderator they took the report too seriously and they didn't know Greek at all do they just followed it blindly.
A solution maybe could be to have a local reputable member make your posts so they don't get deleted.
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