Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 253. (Read 78223 times)

"where were you when Ukraine bombed Donbas for 8 years" at it's finest.

Not a week goes by where some high ranking UA official SBU, ministers etc...doesn't get arrested, charged with treason, or accused of collaboration with RU. They have so many holes there that even planning something like this seems unreasonable.


Right, your position is represented under "Because that's just what orcs do"

Which civilized World? This one or this one or perhaps this one etc etc etc ...

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On 4 April, 2022 from UA embassy in Egypt
https://web.archive.org/web/20220714023412/https://twitter.com/UKRinEGY/status/1511047591533985817


Now on 29, July 2022
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ukraine-detains-russian-owned-ship-loaded-with-grain-at-black-sea-port/ar-AA106tVo

If I'm having a hard time tracking all of this, can't imagine a typical person trying to make sense of all of this.
Is there at least a consensus that time is on RU side? Or rather, RU stands to loose less dragging this into winter?

The recurrent threat from the RF to anything that is not just letting them kill people at their will is to go one step further in brutality and destruction. The problem with that "strategy" is that the degree of brutality and destruction is already extreme. Filtration, deportation and mistreatment of captives is already happening. Forced nationalization is ongoing.

I am right now watching the film "Mr Jones", it is about the Holodomor in Stalin times. I do not think that Moscow is doing anything better now nor intends to do anything different in the future. Moscow will use any captured part of Ukraine to spoil and buy the kleptocrat's a few more acres of land for the Dachas, as a burnable land in case of conflict and as population to be massacred and kept in check - so that they do not get politically influential ever.  

For now the destruction of schools, medical centres, shopping centres, this is a deliberate attempt to destroy everything that makes a country live and thrive is pointing in that direction (pure wanton destruction, of no use for the war objectives).

I am saying all this because I believe that Ukraine may need to endure, because unless they keep being an independent country, the lives of the people will simply by a tool for Moscow -  a dispensable tool that can be deported, killed by hunger, used as forced labour and politically cancelled. I can only imagine the sacrifices and courage of the people fighting and helping the fight in Ukraine, but without it, there is no future for the people and the future generations in Ukraine.

Unfortunately, and since this is already an armed conflict, they only route IMHO is to use all tools to the maximum efficacy to win the war. If you take a look at the RF army, the weaknesses that are evident come from:

- Corruption.
- Poor logistics
- Poor leadership
- Non-professional / disaffected / undisciplined / unseasoned soldiers.
- Population reluctance to join the army or support the war.

Russia will not run out of soviet era tanks and artillery, but HIMARS seem to certainly be making a difference on the ability to disrupt logistics. I do not give full credit to the British intelligence reports, but there seems to be a good chance on Ukraine actually being able to re-take the offensive, while the RF assaults seem quite stalled in the east.

This touches several of the weak points of RF and can make the war take a different perspective.

 

Come on... Navalny is in prison on fake charges, and many people related to him are under various degrees of repressions. Kiselev Ukrainian propagandist LOL, do you really think everyone's an idiot here.


Right. Bring up Strelkov while you're at it. Some people not being in jail doesn't negate the fact that an ordinary person can be beaten, jailed, fined, and possibly have criminal charges filed for a solitary "protest", which is technically legal but denied by all this "discreditation" bullshit.

Simple question: is there war in Ukraine, or "special operation"?


I was talking about the first month. Which also included a hasty retreat from Kyiv. And the latest news around Kherson aren't good for Putin. Apparently taking territory is easier than actually holding it, who could have known. Damn Ukrainian nazis not greeting Russian soldiers with flowers, is that what this is?


I don't need "Ukrainian propaganda", I've seen the consequences of pyccкий миp first hand. The bullshit about not prohibiting second languages etc is laughable to non-Russians in the former USSR. Ethnic cleansing has been part of Russian imperialism for centuries and still is. There is a reason why most of Eastern Europe wants to get as far from Russian influence as possible. Not something you could possibly understand even if your belief in the benevolence of Putin and other Russian tzars is genuine, and not pasted from a 15 ruble мeтoдичкa.

About the fascist Kremlin regime is from the same opera as about corruption in Ukraine.
When a Dutch journalist asked President Zelensky about corruption in Ukraine, he reacted sharply that only those who lived in Ukraine could talk about corruption in Ukraine.
One of the hallmarks of fascism is the rigid dictatorship of society. The devil is in the details. It is unlikely that you know that applicants for journalism at the Moscow State University, quite recently, could be denied admission due to the fact that they support Putin's policies - this is according to Russian political scientist Sergei Chernyakhovsky. In the Russian Federation there is such a university, the Higher School of Economics, and so there, the post of scientific director is occupied by Konstantin Sonin, who called for the hanging of President Putin, as well as Russian ministers Shoigu and Lavrov, and instead of prison or a fine, he was awarded a scientific award.
In Russia, the property of Ukrainian propagandists, such as Dmitry Gordon and Evgeny Kiselev, is not seized, and the property of Navalny's FBK employees is not touched, at least for now.
Evgeny Roizman, the Russian ex-Mayor of Yekaterinburg, who is constantly branding the Russian army on social networks, is not being jailed. They do not open criminal cases against many famous people (Sobchak, Shevchuk, Makarevich, Galkin, Khamatova, Bi2) who condemn the Russian army. There are many such examples. If this is totalitarianism, then some kind of ridiculous. This cannot be compared with Ukraine, especially after SBU agents admitted in March that they had killed Denis Kireev, a member of the negotiating delegation, for treason.


Read the latest news. Russian troops took Kherson, Melitopol, Lisichansk, Severodonetsk, the entire Luhansk region, a significant part of the Donetsk region, as well as part of the Zaporozhye and Kharkov regions.

Why is this comparison between Putin and Hitler, have you re-read the Ukrainian propaganda again? So know that Russia is a multicultural country, which, unlike Ukraine, does not prohibit second languages ​​in national areas. You're looking in the wrong direction. Modern Hitlers sit in Washington, I'm not talking about Biden, but about the American leadership as a whole, which spits on the independence and interests of other states, putting their own interests above all else. "Defenders of democracy" who have already killed 20-30 million people since WW II, that's who the real terrorists are. And hypocrites are all those who say that NATO is only for protection.

The video of torture and further killing on camera over the captive is obviously a Ukrainian fake, but for some reason one of the main persons there was interviewed by the russian state media. This looks rather strange. Need to figure out how it happened.
Very strange.

Any thinking person will by this time assume that anything coming from Ukraine is almost certainly fake.  They are compulsive liars and fabricators and do it even when there is no compelling reason to.  And the Western mainstream media has a similar compulsion to pick up the garbage and run with it.

The Russians are not strangers to 'playing with reality' and could easily leverage the 'automatic fakery' perception of the Ukrainians to frame them in a slightly-above-par psy-op if they wished.  e.g., deliberately putting in a lot of the evidence that you called out.  Likewise, the Ukrainians probably could do a decent job inventing fake shit if they wished (albeit on a more limited scale using higher-skilled personnel) but for some reason they just don't wish to.

Something still stinks in all of this, and I just have a gut feeling that there is a level of cooperation at certain levels, or in certain veins, between elements within the Ukrainian side and the Russian side.  I'd bet money that some deal or wink/nod handshake understanding has been struck, but I'd also bet that it is not known at almost any level.

If it was withdrawn before they had chance to vote, thats dictatorship...someone above their parliament, or maybe even some foreign PR company
or secret service decided that "it caused "an inadequate public outcry""

It looks like the video with the castration of the prisoner turned out to be a Ukrainian fake. The video contains: a tactical polo shirt of the Ukrainian company M-TAC, a balaclava of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, a Ukrainian pixel uniform (all of the above is on the regular list of equipment for SBU and GUR employees). Cherry on the cake - blue nitrile gloves from the first aid kit of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, and rare Nike sneakers released for the Ukrainian team in 2008.

source

I'm projecting that a lot of people who are currently Ukrainian POWs of the Russians will ultimately be re-armed and re-trained by Russia and will ultimately be fighting Poland when the Ziocons fuse the two countries.

I'm expecting that some of the 'Nazis' are so because of some intensive and invasive psychological techniques that can probably to some degree be reversed.  As they said, rightly enough, the Ziocons and everyone else loves them because they are highly effective at causing up trouble.  Like it or not, the 'force multiplication' effects of terrorism are significant.  The problem for 'Nazis' is that when their usefulness to the Ziocons is done they are far far more likeable and less dangerous as dead Nazis.  My guess is that that is the main reason behind the POW camp attack.

An alternate hypothesis is that the Russians wanted to test out one of the American HIMARS systems they bought from the Ukrainians and did a 'false flag' on the POW camp to kill several birds with one stone.  I personally would find that quite amusing, and very fitting, but I doubt that it is the case.

Propaganda coming from the fascist Kremlin regime is hardly "facts". By the way:


Sounds familiar, doesn't it? Except Hitler was a bit more successful at it than Putin, he was able to take Warsaw in a month... Putin managed only to destroy Mariupol in a month. The end will hopefully be the same, suicide in a bunker.

It didn't pass, because the initiators themselves removed it. If the Zelensky government really wanted to, then this law would be approved at the snap of a finger. This law was lifted so as not to spoil the image of Ukraine in front of Western arms suppliers. And for your information, Zelensky has banned almost all opposition parties, and he said it's cool that the Nazi terrorist Stepan Bandera is the national hero of Ukraine for a certain part of Ukrainians, therefore, when you talk about the Nazis, look towards Ukraine first.



Here's a photo from western Ukraine in 1941.



Translation of the inscription

This is the hero of modern Ukraine Stepan Banders - Hitler's henchman, whose punishers killed tens of thousands of people in Volhynia in 1943 on a national basis.
But you, apparently because of your stubbornness, are still trying not to notice the obvious facts that Ukraine is infected with Nazism.

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Did Mikhailo Saakashvili, the lover of ties, tell you this tale?
What "tough rebuff" from the civilized world are you talking about if Georgia was the first to start that conflict?
Read at least the BBC, Reuters or the report of the International Commission in the end, to keep abreast of past events.

So... that's a good thing actually. A very small minority introduced a law that didn't pass. Are you even aware how democracy works? A hint: it's a bit different from Soviet/Putin style single-party "sieg heil" type of system.

Let me be clear, even considering that you, as a biased user, wont accept this.
You can talk about logic and motives when it comes to any other country except Russia. They are capable of any crazy stuff because they can and they get away with it. If in 2008 the civilized World gave a tough rebuff in response to the invasion of Georgia, you didn't even know what Crimea is.

Now here, the pro-Kremlin telegram channel with a huge number of subscribers reflects in early June what MI6 would do with British-supplied MLRS in Ukraine. It's sick already but quite fine for russians. So one of their targets as per this channel should be Olenivka. Since you're an expert in russia I hope you know that the translation from "they may" to russian is "we will". Why? No one knows, because they can.



NOw lemme ask how you end up spreading your bullshit here for literally 8 people? Your no good at least for Reddit or Alexa stats with impressive digits of this forum is enough to master russian budgets?

It's even more ridiculous to say it was accidental attack.
The captured Azovites are still highly valued for exchange, because at large in Ukraine they are apparently still considered the elite and there are many more of their fighters and supporters at large who are pressing the Zelensky government to exchange them in the very first place.
For the Zelensky government, for which victories on the information front are much more important than real ones, it would be better if the Azov people did not surrender, but died the death of the brave as martyrs. Therefore, on the one hand, Kyiv exchanges part of the soldiers, and on the other hand, instead of Russia, it may well seek to complete its plan to glorify the prisoners from Azovstal by completely destroying it. Moreover, as mentioned above, such attacks may be designed not only to intimidate witnesses, but to reduce the desire of Ukrainian soldiers to surrender into Russian captivity.

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This means that either Ukrainian soldiers, with the help of Western weapons and foreign mercenaries, do not know how to fight at all against the antediluvian Russian army, or you are not able to impartially process information. To understand this topic, it is still better to read what correspondents from the fronts transmit.





According to the Minister of Defense of Ukraine in June 2022, the Ukrainian army would have enough strength to confront such armies as France or the UK (which are among the five strongest armies in the world), but at the same time Ukraine *for some reason* is not able to cope with the "backward", "unorganized", "demoralized" army of the Russian Federation in the amount of 150 thousand soldiers, which is only 15% of the entire army of the Russian Federation.

The Russian army for five months taken about 126.610 thousand square kilometers of territories that previously belonged to Ukraine. The Russian government is already ready to accept these lands into the Russian Federation after referendums.

In general, if the Russian army is so backward, as you say, then it turns out that NATO troops are not capable of anything at all. It turns out that they can only fight against civilians in Yugoslavia and Afghan nomads armed with machine guns, but they lack the courage to fight against the Russian army, otherwise the "brave" NATO military would not hide behind the backs of Ukrainian soldiers and would have started a third world war long ago, which in the blink of an eye, it would turn into a nuclear one and destroy all life. After all, this is precisely what all those who escalate this conflict between NATO and the largest nuclear power are striving for.



PS. At first, I thought that it was beneficial for Russia when the West significantly underestimated its military potential. But this is wrong, because Ukrainians, deceived by local and European propaganda, are sent to the front, and then tens of thousands die there.

Pretty much this. Nevertheless we can make educational guesses.

What we know, in support of RU side:
-Russian side went to great length to capture those PoW
-Azov "evacuation" had the most global attention and was overseen by Red Cross
-They have great PR value. Parading PoWs on cameras is a great moral booster
-PoWs have direct values when doing PoW exchanges. And we know that some were already used in a PoW exchange  
-Azov PoWs are especially prized, they're so valuable internally that Russia wanted to pass resolution banning their exchange
-Dead PoWs have no value to RU. It would be counter productive for RU. It can be used as moral booster and incentivize UA fighters to fight to the end instead of surrendering
-8 RU prison guards were also wounded in the shelling

In support of UA side:
-It's their most (?) prized military unit
-Azov PoWs had priority over other regular military PoWs

Summary of RU side claims as i see it:
-Azov PoWs started to talk with investigators and UA attacked to shut them up.

Summary of UA side claims as i see it:
-RU kills PoWs to pressures UA to stop using HIMARS
-RU kills PoWs so UA stops fighting  
-Because that's just what orcs do

Considering the value of Azov being alive to UA and RU sides, both claims sound ridiculous to the point of being laughable. So most likely this was an accidental attack. As these things go, like with MH17, one side will try to do everything to investigate and drum up as much attention as possible, and the other side has no option but to just blatantly deny everything and try to make it go away ASAP.

Challenge at least one point, and it may turn out that you know nothing but bingo. Although about bingo, maybe you also greatly overestimate yourself.

brainwashed for 30 years, Anglo-Saxons, Bandera, de-Russification of Ukraine, aggressive NATO, Yugoslavia, anti-constitutional coup, clown Zelensky

My god are we playing bingo? I think I won and we don't even have to wait for a Croatian to show up.

By what criteria did you attribute me to the Kremlin bots? Bots get paid for multiple posts, right?
But it’s okay that you are now writing the Freebitcoin refcode in your signature here, not me. Thus, I have evidence that you can be called a Freebitcoin casino site bot.
If my statements with references to sources violate your subtle mental organization, then these are not problems of the Kremlin propaganda, but your personal ones.
And now, be so kind as to present your evidence that the Kremlin pays me for my posts in this thread, otherwise you are an empty talker.



The project card indicates that the initiators of this bill № 7351 were 9 Ukrainian deputies: Bezuglaya, Aliksychuk, Bakumov, Grivko, Tretyakova, Voitsekhovsky, Mysyagin, Mazurashu, Fedienko. The bill was withdrawn without a voting, because, according to deputy Bakumov, it caused "an inadequate public outcry".
Can't you see how the Ukrainian government does not spare its inhabitants and sends them on suicidal attacks on the eastern front against Russian artillery, tanks and aviation? In Russia, there was not a single mobilization, while in Ukraine women from 18 to 60 years old are already being called up. Your government does not put you in anything, it uses you like cannon fodder to get new financial injections and weapons from Western countries, some of which will then be sold on the black market in exchange for your lives.



Please post a link proving that the Russian military did it. I'll check what sources you trust completely.

Also, if possible, please comment on this post.





Russian troops were destroying them before the Azov fighters surrendered in May, two more Azov fighters were sentenced to death, and 144 AFU soldiers (including Azov) were exchanged in June for 144 Russian prisoners of war. First of all, the Ukrainian side wanted the Azov people back, so they are valued much more for exchange than for intimidation.



By this logic, it turns out that Russian soldiers in captivity can also incriminate themselves in order to save their lives.



Well, based on your smile, only those who consume Ukrainian Zelensky noodles from morning to evening know the truth.
If you know the truth, please tell me, how many looters of Ukrainian origin were tied to poles with tape and beaten in the Ukrainian cities, and how many looters from Russia have already been prosecuted by the Ukrainian Ministry of Internal Affairs?

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Judging by how the Ukrainians have been thoroughly brainwashed for 30 years, that now they point-blank do not see how they are used in a fratricidal massacre to the applause of the Anglo-Saxons, they see nothing wrong with the glorification of Bandera, they approve of the complete de-Russification of Ukraine and membership in the aggressive NATO military bloc that destroyed Yugoslavia; and after the anti-constitutional coup, the Ukrainians elected the clown Zelensky as president, who had not an ounce of political weight and experience, - then it is time to treat the head of the Ukrainian nation.

So sweet.
We will never know the truth but we always know what time it is. Just like our grandfathers!