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Topic: Save Gox - page 2. (Read 11364 times)

sr. member
Activity: 352
Merit: 250
https://www.realitykeys.com
April 23, 2014, 08:47:37 PM
#93
http://www.coindesk.com/investor-group-optimistic-fight-mt-gox-liquidation/
This was in the media again today with more details of the proposed takeover.

It seems clear that the only way creditors will receive more than the 200k BTC is if the company is generating revenue again or if the assets are sold.  Their considerably large customer database of already AML verified users is worth something to another company if they have the banking licenses to use it effectively.

However the way this investor group proposes to restart Gox seems like a terrible deal for the creditors.

Quote
The document suggests that roughly $8m will be needed to fund the rehabilitation, drawing from cash held by Mt. Gox.

Seriously?  The new investors are taking ownership stake and risking none of their own skin entirely at the expense of the creditors?  That is quite absurd.  Do people know what they are signing up for?

This might make sense if the new investors are putting in new money to the tune of $10's of millions.  The currently proposed deal is only upside, which is hardly appropriate.

The other mysterious thing about this is that when they're talking to the community to drum up support for their plan, they talk like all the customer deposits are customer assets, not Gox assets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqaCNScwpGw&feature=youtu.be

But then if you look at the leaked court filing, it calls for spending JPY 816 million of "cash owned by Mt Gox" building a new exchange:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/219613733/sunlot-holdings-proposed-rehabilitation-plan-ENGLISH

It sounds like they'll now submit a new plan, since the court's reply to their original one was "lol", but looking at their original intentions, it seems like either:
a) They were going to intentionally misappropriate customer assets to fund their new exchange.
b) They're lying to the community about how they see the status of their deposits.
legendary
Activity: 4522
Merit: 3426
April 23, 2014, 08:20:17 PM
#92
It seems clear that the only way creditors will receive more than the 200k BTC is if the company is generating revenue again or if the assets are sold.  Their considerably large customer database of already AML verified users is worth something to another company if they have the banking licenses to use it effectively.
However the way this investor group proposes to restart Gox seems like a terrible deal for the creditors.
Quote
The document suggests that roughly $8m will be needed to fund the rehabilitation, drawing from cash held by Mt. Gox.
Seriously?  The new investors are taking ownership stake and risking none of their own skin entirely at the expense of the creditors?  That is quite absurd.  Do people know what they are signing up for?
This might make sense if the new investors are putting in new money to the tune of $10's of millions.  The currently proposed deal is only upside, which is hardly appropriate.

I agree. Essentially, creditors are asked to fund a new startup with an uncertain future. There are probably better places to invest your money than a resurrected Mt. Gox.
sr. member
Activity: 263
Merit: 250
April 23, 2014, 08:16:24 PM
#91
http://www.coindesk.com/investor-group-optimistic-fight-mt-gox-liquidation/
This was in the media again today with more details of the proposed takeover.

It seems clear that the only way creditors will receive more than the 200k BTC is if the company is generating revenue again or if the assets are sold.  Their considerably large customer database of already AML verified users is worth something to another company if they have the banking licenses to use it effectively.

However the way this investor group proposes to restart Gox seems like a terrible deal for the creditors.

Quote
The document suggests that roughly $8m will be needed to fund the rehabilitation, drawing from cash held by Mt. Gox.

Seriously?  The new investors are taking ownership stake and risking none of their own skin entirely at the expense of the creditors?  That is quite absurd.  Do people know what they are signing up for?

This might make sense if the new investors are putting in new money to the tune of $10's of millions.  The currently proposed deal is only upside, which is hardly appropriate.
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1014
April 23, 2014, 03:20:11 PM
#90

"Karpeles wanted to be liked, three former employees say. He bought lunch for the entire staff and spent thousands of dollars on gadgets and equipment to make the office more "fun" - exercise balls for chairs, beer steins and robots. Late last year, in the middle of increasingly strained times for Mt. Gox, he spent an afternoon putting up a hammock in the recreation room.

But staff found it galling that the boss was buying these goodies even while he refused to give pay raises. They also became frustrated as they waited for Karpeles to authorise decisions or make progress on simple tasks. Developers, stuck without direct access to the Mt. Gox source code, resorted to playing video games, people inside the company at the time say.

Employees were also concerned that Karpeles' tight grip on all company affairs was causing a bottleneck: he was the only person who could access the exchange's bank accounts and bitcoin holdings and resolve requests by traders to cash out."


Criminal or wasteful stupidity?
Looks like both at the same time.



No absolutely not

Massive mental illness. Personality disorder, schizophrenia etc.

MK, the Joker of Bitcoinland

vip
Activity: 840
Merit: 1000
April 23, 2014, 09:41:24 AM
#89
Since Gox couldn't be trusted, which exchange can?


Bitsimple.com has never had a complaint.
newbie
Activity: 47
Merit: 0
April 23, 2014, 06:51:24 AM
#88
hope btc venture capitalist save Mt. Gox .
 Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 500
April 23, 2014, 01:30:23 AM
#87
To bad they can't just proportionally give the 200,000 BTC back to all the Mt. Gox users. This would be like a 25% payout of your balance. Even better some accounts are criminal accounts with no aml information and some users may never redeem there coins so ideally it is possible to get more then 25% of your accounts funds back.

Of course this will never happen they will just use customer funds for their own expense. And the CEO will pay him self over and over again. Any additional funds left over will be wasted on legal fees. It's bad they only give us 5% back but its taking so long it looks like you'll only get 0% back.
legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1040
A Great Time to Start Something!
April 22, 2014, 06:33:31 PM
#86

"Karpeles wanted to be liked, three former employees say. He bought lunch for the entire staff and spent thousands of dollars on gadgets and equipment to make the office more "fun" - exercise balls for chairs, beer steins and robots. Late last year, in the middle of increasingly strained times for Mt. Gox, he spent an afternoon putting up a hammock in the recreation room.

But staff found it galling that the boss was buying these goodies even while he refused to give pay raises. They also became frustrated as they waited for Karpeles to authorise decisions or make progress on simple tasks. Developers, stuck without direct access to the Mt. Gox source code, resorted to playing video games, people inside the company at the time say.

Employees were also concerned that Karpeles' tight grip on all company affairs was causing a bottleneck: he was the only person who could access the exchange's bank accounts and bitcoin holdings and resolve requests by traders to cash out."


Criminal or wasteful stupidity?
Looks like both at the same time.

hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 500
April 22, 2014, 04:54:26 PM
#85
Any news from these guys (directly from them or indirectly from other surces affecting their possibilities)?
newbie
Activity: 5
Merit: 0
April 22, 2014, 12:43:07 AM
#84
The only way to save gox is to return the money that was 'lost' back to its rightful owners. 
Thats pretty much it.  Theres nothing else to trust about the brand.
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1002
April 21, 2014, 09:14:11 PM
#83
This whole thing seems very sketchy. There's still no sourcing or substance to their claims about what would happen under liquidation, and they throw in some more unsubstantiated FUD as well, like talking as if the fact that Japan doesn't recognize bitcoins as currency means they'll mysteriously decide they don't have any value.

If somebody really was going to take this thing on their big problem would be trust, and the only way to get it is to be absolutely honest and straightforward. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not seeing that here.
Yes, that whole "buy Mt. Gox for 1BTC" thing seems sketchy.

With their scheme, they pay off some customers with some of the known assets, pay off other customers with future earnings if any, and get to keep any assets recovered once they're in charge. That's suspicious. Almost as if they know where some of the missing assets are.

It's better to let the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police go to work. With full access to all Mt. Gox records, the block chain, and outside experts, they should be able to find out where the missing assets went. With a little more data, they'll probably have enough to arrest and interrogate Karepeles.

This just had to be an inside job.
sr. member
Activity: 274
Merit: 250
April 21, 2014, 08:56:34 PM
#82
Since Gox couldn't be trusted, which exchange can?

If Bitcoin does what it claims, then more than one person knows where the Bitcoin is.
sr. member
Activity: 352
Merit: 250
https://www.realitykeys.com
April 21, 2014, 08:45:06 PM
#81
Save Gox people on Lets Talk Bitcoin.

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/ltb102-savegox-and-the-show-floor/

This whole thing seems very sketchy. There's still no sourcing or substance to their claims about what would happen under liquidation, and they throw in some more unsubstantiated FUD as well, like talking as if the fact that Japan doesn't recognize bitcoins as currency means they'll mysteriously decide they don't have any value.

If somebody really was going to take this thing on their big problem would be trust, and the only way to get it is to be absolutely honest and straightforward. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not seeing that here.
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1002
April 21, 2014, 05:55:37 PM
#80
I had only vague suspicions about Gox until the "hiatus in withdrawals" last June. That was a huge red flag. When a real brokerage does that, like Lehman did, they're out of business within hours. I've been posting that Gox was probably broke since July 4, 2013, when their two-week "hiatus" ended and full withdrawals didn't resume. 
vip
Activity: 840
Merit: 1000
April 21, 2014, 05:38:42 PM
#79
lol, fair enough Smiley
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
April 21, 2014, 05:27:12 PM
#78

Nice read, thanks. That's the problem with trusting a company. How do you know the owner isn't completely nuts?

You should have know he was in 2011 when he went around this forum claiming his customers were terrorist and money launders for following the instructions Mark gave himself.

Yeah, guess that's true. We all should have seen it coming but hindsight is 20-20.

i was trying to warn people.

I remember Goat. You tried to warn people as early as the end of 2011 about Gox at the same time I was warning people about pirate. We should have listened to each other.  Wink
vip
Activity: 840
Merit: 1000
April 21, 2014, 05:20:25 PM
#77

Nice read, thanks. That's the problem with trusting a company. How do you know the owner isn't completely nuts?

You should have know he was in 2011 when he went around this forum claiming his customers were terrorist and money launders for following the instructions Mark gave himself.

Yeah, guess that's true. We all should have seen it coming but hindsight is 20-20.

i was trying to warn people.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
April 21, 2014, 02:48:16 PM
#76

Nice read, thanks. That's the problem with trusting a company. How do you know the owner isn't completely nuts?

You should have know he was in 2011 when he went around this forum claiming his customers were terrorist and money launders for following the instructions Mark gave himself.

Yeah, guess that's true. We all should have seen it coming but hindsight is 20-20.
vip
Activity: 840
Merit: 1000
April 21, 2014, 02:33:29 PM
#75

Nice read, thanks. That's the problem with trusting a company. How do you know the owner isn't completely nuts?

You should have know he was in 2011 when he went around this forum claiming his customers were terrorist and money launders for following the instructions Mark gave himself.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
April 21, 2014, 02:07:30 PM
#74

Nice read, thanks. That's the problem with trusting a company. How do you know the owner isn't completely nuts?
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