✨ Shuffle.com | The next generation of crypto casinos | Sports, Casino + token - page 18.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: o48o on October 14, 2024, 07:20:12 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 13, 2024, 09:26:24 PM

-cut-

Perhaps it wasn't clear for o48o.

Shuffle has two kinds of buybacks. - The 15% non-net-gaming revenue buyback which the SHFL Foundation has a weekly budget, AND the 30% buyback which comes from actual net-gaming-revenue. The 15% buyback will stop, BUT the 30% buy back from net-gaming-revenue will continue.

I believe that The SHFL Foundation will have better use for the budget, than using it to buy SHFL then burn them.

Thanks for trying to explain it, and i really hope i am wrong about this, but it's still not clear for me. What exactly they mean by non-SHFL net-gaming revenue?

Because i thought that was revenue from everything but $shfl gambling.

And that SHFL NGR (30%) revenue would come from gambling with $SHFL. Meaning that all revenue would be in shfl anyway. So how can you use that for buying SHFL back from the market?

You couldn't, you would just burn 30% of the lost tokens, which wouldn't be anything compared to buyback from NON shfl NGR when incentive to gamble with shfl stops after the 3rd airdrop.

Or maybe i am confused because of the naming of that system. But if i am correct assuming this, i disagree that "actual demand" would be in any way better or that actual demand would be less because of NON SHFL NGR buyback.

I'm honestly not that sure where the money for the buybacks of the "non-net-gaming-revenue" comes from. But their post says that the SHFL Foundation will stop non-net-gaming-revenue buybacks, which probably means the money to buyback comes from the SHFL Foundation's wallets to buy SHFL and HODL them. The 15% non-net-gaming-revenue buybacks were for the SHFL Foundation's wallets to HODL, not burn.

The 30% buyback and burn from net-gaming-revenue will continue, and from your point of view nothing actually changed in their buyback and burn design/strategy.

Fivestar4everMVP

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Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: hd49728 on October 14, 2024, 02:54:08 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 14, 2024, 12:07:28 AM

Shuffle has two kinds of buybacks. - The 15% non-net-gaming revenue buyback which the SHFL Foundation has a weekly budget, AND the 30% buyback which comes from actual net-gaming-revenue. The 15% buyback will stop, BUT the 30% buy back from net-gaming-revenue will continue.

I believe that The SHFL Foundation will have better use for the budget, than using it to buy SHFL then burn them.

It is very sensible to continue only with their net-gaming-revenue for SHFL Buy back and burn. Their own pocket money needs to be redirected to their platform developments like building new products, enhancing platform security and expanding their marketing programs and collaborating with new partners.

These developmental things with non-net-gaming revenue allocation will help Shuffle platform becoming better with time in products, security, partnership and more. Then it will bring mutual positive effects to SHFL token because the token is one of Shuffle business products. Having more customers will help increasing demand on SHFL token as well.

Yeah, the price or value of a token lies in its utilities or use case, burning tokens only gives such a token a short term price boost, depending on the community that is around project, else, most of the time, it still won't have any positive effect on the price of the token, this is to say that, gone are the days when burning of part of supply of a tokens usually lead to a massive price boost, crypto has so much outgrown that stage.

If the shuffle team will be needing to increase the demand for their casino token, they will not only need to have more customers, because many customers may not actually in interested in buying the token since the casino already supports deposit, play-with, and withdrawal with and through other popular cryptocurrencies. So, to make the users interested in buying and holding the token, the team have to put in place a good usercase, utility for the token, something users of shuffle casino can't do without, and to do it's, they need to own shuffle token.

o48o

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Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 13, 2024, 09:26:24 PM

-cut-
Perhaps it wasn't clear for o48o.

Shuffle has two kinds of buybacks. - The 15% non-net-gaming revenue buyback which the SHFL Foundation has a weekly budget, AND the 30% buyback which comes from actual net-gaming-revenue. The 15% buyback will stop, BUT the 30% buy back from net-gaming-revenue will continue.

I believe that The SHFL Foundation will have better use for the budget, than using it to buy SHFL then burn them.

Thanks for trying to explain it, and i really hope i am wrong about this, but it's still not clear for me. What exactly they mean by non-SHFL net-gaming revenue?
Because i thought that was revenue from everything but $shfl gambling.

And that SHFL NGR (30%) revenue would come from gambling with $SHFL. Meaning that all revenue would be in shfl anyway. So how can you use that for buying SHFL back from the market?

You couldn't, you would just burn 30% of the lost tokens, which wouldn't be anything compared to buyback from NON shfl NGR when incentive to gamble with shfl stops after the 3rd airdrop.

Or maybe i am confused because of the naming of that system. But if i am correct assuming this, i disagree that "actual demand" would be in any way better or that actual demand would be less because of NON SHFL NGR buyback.

hd49728

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Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 14, 2024, 12:07:28 AM

Shuffle has two kinds of buybacks. - The 15% non-net-gaming revenue buyback which the SHFL Foundation has a weekly budget, AND the 30% buyback which comes from actual net-gaming-revenue. The 15% buyback will stop, BUT the 30% buy back from net-gaming-revenue will continue.

I believe that The SHFL Foundation will have better use for the budget, than using it to buy SHFL then burn them.

It is very sensible to continue only with their net-gaming-revenue for SHFL Buy back and burn. Their own pocket money needs to be redirected to their platform developments like building new products, enhancing platform security and expanding their marketing programs and collaborating with new partners.

These developmental things with non-net-gaming revenue allocation will help Shuffle platform becoming better with time in products, security, partnership and more. Then it will bring mutual positive effects to SHFL token because the token is one of Shuffle business products. Having more customers will help increasing demand on SHFL token as well.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: hd49728 on October 13, 2024, 10:00:22 PM

Quote from: o48o on October 12, 2024, 12:40:37 PM

Can someone help me to understand if their tokenomics just changed radically? Because if i am reading this correctly, the main thing why i was interested about $shfl just ended, like it wouldn't matter. Just because they want bigger prizes in lottery? Is this for real? Only thing that made sure this would have intrinsic value is removed?

I agree with Wind_FURY that having actual demand on the token is better than money spent by the Shuffle team from part of their business income to buy back the token on the market, and burn it.

I am only unclear about the sentence, no more buy back, but burn will continue. I am confused that how burn in future will be done if the team will no longer make any token buy back.

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 13, 2024, 09:26:24 PM

The team probably thought that the budget for the buyback could be utilized better for the business itself to truly define real value for its token, SHFL. The token might indeed lose some "demand", but that isn't actually real "demand". It's merely Shuffle buying its own token, which probably was OK to boot-strap its market.

To do buy back and burn in a long term program, budget for it must be big and it can not only come from the company pocket. Budget for it must come from something passively earn by the company, and they only sacrifice it for the program, to show off their team dedication to the token development. If the source of passive income and budget is not big enough, the program will not be able to last long.

Perhaps it wasn't clear for o48o.

Shuffle has two kinds of buybacks. - The 15% non-net-gaming revenue buyback which the SHFL Foundation has a weekly budget, AND the 30% buyback which comes from actual net-gaming-revenue. The 15% buyback will stop, BUT the 30% buy back from net-gaming-revenue will continue.

I believe that The SHFL Foundation will have better use for the budget, than using it to buy SHFL then burn them.

hd49728

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Quote from: o48o on October 12, 2024, 12:40:37 PM

Can someone help me to understand if their tokenomics just changed radically? Because if i am reading this correctly, the main thing why i was interested about $shfl just ended, like it wouldn't matter. Just because they want bigger prizes in lottery? Is this for real? Only thing that made sure this would have intrinsic value is removed?

I agree with Wind_FURY that having actual demand on the token is better than money spent by the Shuffle team from part of their business income to buy back the token on the market, and burn it.

I am only unclear about the sentence, no more buy back, but burn will continue. I am confused that how burn in future will be done if the team will no longer make any token buy back.

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 13, 2024, 09:26:24 PM

The team probably thought that the budget for the buyback could be utilized better for the business itself to truly define real value for its token, SHFL. The token might indeed lose some "demand", but that isn't actually real "demand". It's merely Shuffle buying its own token, which probably was OK to boot-strap its market.

To do buy back and burn in a long term program, budget for it must be big and it can not only come from the company pocket. Budget for it must come from something passively earn by the company, and they only sacrifice it for the program, to show off their team dedication to the token development. If the source of passive income and budget is not big enough, the program will not be able to last long.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: tranthidung on October 11, 2024, 09:27:02 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 10, 2024, 06:32:43 AM

Quote

September update - steady on

https://x.com/noahdummett/status/1841693517258559701

He made a good argument about variance, because every month can't be a month of another ATH in wagered volume, there will be months of lower data on those numbers. Plus if Noah posts lower data, then that could possibly be used to spread FUD about the service.

There is nothing can go up steadily without any fall and there are necessary ups and downs in any business growth or any market too. If things go up steadily, no pull back, it will be only from complete manipulation.

To have sustainable growth in adoption of SHFL token and wager volume, we don't need to see a smoothly steady chart. The wager volume chart shared by Noah, looks to be good enough as indicator of Shuffle user activities on the platform in general and with the SHFL token usage in particular.

Companies use quarterly data to show improvement or decline in the performance of their business. Shuffle should probably do that if they will share such information in the future. I believe that quarterly, and annual data, would be the best time frames.

Quote from: o48o on October 12, 2024, 12:40:37 PM

Can someone help me to understand if their tokenomics just changed radically? Because if i am reading this correctly, the main thing why i was interested about $shfl just ended, like it wouldn't matter. Just because they want bigger prizes in lottery? Is this for real? Only thing that made sure this would have intrinsic value is removed?

I wouldn't be so sure that people just kept on staking it for lottery after they keep losing on it and realize that changes to win in a lottery in a lifetime are very small. I hope i am wrong about that. Now that value might as well go up instantly, because fundamentals that i rooted this token for seem to be discontinued.

The team probably thought that the budget for the buyback could be utilized better for the business itself to truly define real value for its token, SHFL. The token might indeed lose some "demand", but that isn't actually real "demand". It's merely Shuffle buying its own token, which probably was OK to boot-strap its market.

o48o

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Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Can someone help me to understand if their tokenomics just changed radically? Because if i am reading this correctly, the main thing why i was interested about $shfl just ended, like it wouldn't matter. Just because they want bigger prizes in lottery? Is this for real? Only thing that made sure this would have intrinsic value is removed?

I wouldn't be so sure that people just kept on staking it for lottery after they keep losing on it and realize that changes to win in a lottery in a lifetime are very small. I hope i am wrong about that. Now that value might as well go up instantly, because fundamentals that i rooted this token for seem to be discontinued.

panjul07

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Quote from: Wapfika on October 10, 2024, 07:58:01 AM

-snip-

The current leader for the contest:

Already more than 1000x for the highest odds contest on each game

I'll give a clue for the maximum possible multiplier for the above selected games as follow:
- Rip City, Evil Eyes, Octo Attack: all these games has 12,500x as the max multiplier
- Mental 66,666x
So basically the multiplier on the current leaders are not that big compared to the max possible multiplier on each game.
Of course all the games are extreme volatility slot that can give huge multiplier but they are also hungry games that can eat our balance quickly

tranthidung

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Farewell o_e_l_e_o

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 10, 2024, 06:32:43 AM

Quote

September update - steady on

https://x.com/noahdummett/status/1841693517258559701

He made a good argument about variance, because every month can't be a month of another ATH in wagered volume, there will be months of lower data on those numbers. Plus if Noah posts lower data, then that could possibly be used to spread FUD about the service.

There is nothing can go up steadily without any fall and there are necessary ups and downs in any business growth or any market too. If things go up steadily, no pull back, it will be only from complete manipulation.

To have sustainable growth in adoption of SHFL token and wager volume, we don't need to see a smoothly steady chart. The wager volume chart shared by Noah, looks to be good enough as indicator of Shuffle user activities on the platform in general and with the SHFL token usage in particular.

Quote

Another point made, is about unnecessary pressure. But it's also about the purpose of their job. Are they running the service because they actually love doing it, or are they doing it because they merely want positive numbers. Because loving the job will bring more long term success than merely doing it for positive monthly data.

Because it is not too old, monthly data is good enough for summary but after several years, we can use a bigger summarizing data, like wager volume in quarters. When time goes more, we will be able to use wager volume yearly like Bitcoin yearly candles that can help us to see price pattern in previous cycles.

Wager volume and activities of gamblers on casinos, in my opinion, are affected by market too, like bullish and bearish market will affect gamblers in different ways like more or less active gambling.

o48o

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Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

So apparently their lottery is live now:

It looks fairly decent, i was afraid that i would need to participate every week,

Changes to win are low and so might be nr of participants as there are around 83,7 millions of shfl even in circulation yet.

But at least it's not real world lottery impossibility for someone to win it. And there's a change that this would affect to price in positive way like thought. I already pointed out that we could be mooning before this and after this takes an effect, we are most likely going to new ath at least. Not that i think it's relevant for the future, or even good for shfl yet.

You need to chose 5 balls and one power ball. There are 55 balls total and 18 power balls, and you get 40% of the bet by guessing everything right.

If my calculations are correct, changes to win main prize by staking 50 shfl is 1 in 62,617,698. Someone please correct me if i am wrong because that seems low.

And you get some, even if you don't get everything right, which i think is the best thing in this

Wapfika

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@Panjul07 the reward structure of their bonus is so good. There’s a separate reward for the highest multiplier and highest payout to give chance for small bankroll player to still compete even with the minimum bet.

I probably can play the hacksaw games eligible on this promotion but a big no for RIP city and Mental since both slot games is hard to win a huge multiplier which is too risky for my shrimp bankroll.

I will focus on Evil eyes since it has a decent volatility based on my recent experience when I try this game during the early release.

panjul07

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Halloween is coming so Shuffle started a new contest for it, the contest started earlier today and will last till Halloween but this contest is running weekly so I guess there will be at least 3 rounds for this Spooky Spins promo.
The first week Spooky Spins promo can be seen by clicking below image:

In short, there are 2 categories to win in this contest. They are biggest win and biggest multiplier on each selected slot game.
The prizes are $500 for the biggest odds/multiplier and $2000 for the biggest payout/win.
Remember that it apply for each game so there are 8 prizes to grab, 4*$500 and 4*2000.
Minimum bet is friendly enough because it is $0.1 only, so dont miss this opportunity especially those who like halloween or spooky themed slot.

ryzaadit

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Quote from: wiivita on October 08, 2024, 11:57:16 PM

Hey, do you offer any bonuses for new user?

Have you ever to check on https://shuffle.com/promotions

In my opinion, "SHUFFLE" taking some mostly reference like (Stake). In stake they are not quite much offering promotion like (Deposit bonus), more focused sharing the bonus with Bonus Claim like (Weekly, Pre, Post or Monthly).

Typical casino like these, are more suitable for waggering user.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 06, 2024, 11:16:23 PM

Quote from: panjul07 on October 05, 2024, 06:30:34 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 05, 2024, 01:19:11 AM

That actually could be a mathematical problem. Hahaha. How much is your current capital, how much could you lose, how much are the rewards, and will you break even after rewards?

Reward should always be taken as a side bonus from our gambling activity, not a thing which should be chased unless we are billionaire who want to take it as a challenge then take a risk of decent amount of money while it wont bring any issue if we lose the whole amount.

If we should force ourselves to chase the reward (not only as what mentioned by above users), I'm pretty sure it wont be something profitable unless we are making profit while wagering $250M

This kind of promotion is good, no doubt about it because it may attract players to keep gambling as long as possible and as much as they can in a hope to get the rewards but of course small-medium gamblers will never think about it.

Although that's true, BUT for those people who would seriously chase that expensive reward and be the FIRST Red Diamond VIP holder, then they probably should have the capital and make a plan. THAT makes it a mathematical problem. I didn't say anything that rewards shouldn't be a side-bonus.

Furthermore, Noah posted the total volume wagered for September. It's higher 👀

Quote

September update - steady on

https://x.com/noahdummett/status/1841693517258559701

Noah posted under the post showing Shuffle's September data,

Quote

This will likely be the last scheduled wager data update we do. I still plan on sharing data from time to time, especially where it's interesting or paints an accurate picture of the business, but these monthly updates are not optimal for a few reasons:

- wagered volume is a good stat to track but it's not everything; it sets a bad industry precedent that this is the key metric when considering growth in a casino, when in reality you could completely blow out your net revenue margins to juice those numbers inorganically (we don't do this, but not ruling out that no one else would).

- variance is something that is a consideration for all casinos, but even more for us as a newer entrant; unfortunately, it's also out of our control. When users run hot, wagered volume looks a lot better than when the house runs hot, which in turn causes conflict between the perception of the business and what's actually going on behind the scenes. As an example, we ran colder than expected in August, and around expected in September, yet our wagered volume would have you think that the two months performed roughly the same.

- it puts a lot of unnecessary pressure on the team, and I've noticed that we do consistently better work when we're just focused on improving the player experience.

Again, I plan on sharing a lot of our data as and when it makes sense to do so. But it'll likely be data that gives a clearer indication of what's going on - the wagered volume is fun and interesting from time to time but having it be a scheduled update doesn't have a lot of upside for anyone.

https://x.com/noahdummett/status/1841693522124210264

He made a good argument about variance, because every month can't be a month of another ATH in wagered volume, there will be months of lower data on those numbers. Plus if Noah posts lower data, then that could possibly be used to spread FUD about the service.

Another point made, is about unnecessary pressure. But it's also about the purpose of their job. Are they running the service because they actually love doing it, or are they doing it because they merely want positive numbers. Because loving the job will bring more long term success than merely doing it for positive monthly data.

BABY SHOES

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HODL - BTC

Quote from: wiivita on October 08, 2024, 11:57:16 PM

Hey, do you offer any bonuses for new user?

You mean the welcome bonus for new users?

Actually Shuffle has no bonus for new users on display that I know of... After asking live support that they offer bonuses for new users as follows:

Quote

For your first deposit, we can offer you a 100% deposit bonus, matched up to $1000 with 35x rollover on deposit & bonus.

You may be able to contact live support before placing a bet.

wiivita

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Hey, do you offer any bonuses for new user?

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: o48o on October 07, 2024, 08:19:17 AM

Quote from: Synchronice on October 06, 2024, 04:26:47 PM

Quote from: o48o on October 04, 2024, 06:51:03 AM

CEX doesn't necessary bring adoption or traffic. Even with huge exchanges with real trading it mainly brings just speculators. And in worst cases you need to pay ton of shuffle tokens to CEXes for listing, which CEXes can use for price manipulation. And huge portion of these "large" cexes have just fake volume without decent liquidity.

Get listed on CEX means that millions of people will be able to see your coin, buy and sell it. Compare the userbase of DEXs to CEXs, there will be a significant difference because an average person prefers to register on CEX, get KYC verified and trade easily with his smartphone while trading on DEX is a little more complicated and when you own a crypto wallet, you need to take some responsibility on your shoulders.
Compare CEX and DEX to eBay/Amazon and other crypto marketplaces. List your item on eBay, you'll sell it easily but list your item on any crypto marketplace, you'll struggle. CEXs are like eBay/Amazon, they are popular and have traffic, that is a significant moment. Listing your coin on CEX is a good marketing strategy for any coin, let alone the possibility of easy trading for millions of people.

By the way, I can't talk about price manipulation and how often that happens with tokens like Shuffle has. The company has to outweigh pros and cons of each of their step but I still think that everyone wants to get listed on major CEXs.

What happened here was probably that Shuffle had promised a CEX listing, and since they didn't want to break their promise, they chose the one that lists anything for money.

I would imagine that they know what they are doing, unless this was some newbie from marketing doing the listing.

Before making such claims, you probably should research if Shuffle indeed make that "promise", no?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Quote

Cexes have their upsides, and binance was an extreme suggestion. Any legitimate CEX would do, XT just isn't one of them. All i am asking is that we shouldn't fall for them being what they are advertising to be.

For example, let's take a look that XT again shall we, as i pointed out it has major faked volume without decent liquidity, so maybe we get millions more eyes watching for SHFL when we are listed in there like you said.

The reason why Shuffle chose XT.com is probably because of the cheap listing fee. Plus it's laughable that Binance was used as an example of "legitimacy" when that exchange is also known for wash-trading, and the founder is a known entity for money laundering.

Pardon me, but I'm not trying to offend you. They're merely the facts.

o48o

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Quote from: Synchronice on October 06, 2024, 04:26:47 PM

Quote from: o48o on October 04, 2024, 06:51:03 AM

CEX doesn't necessary bring adoption or traffic. Even with huge exchanges with real trading it mainly brings just speculators. And in worst cases you need to pay ton of shuffle tokens to CEXes for listing, which CEXes can use for price manipulation. And huge portion of these "large" cexes have just fake volume without decent liquidity.

Get listed on CEX means that millions of people will be able to see your coin, buy and sell it. Compare the userbase of DEXs to CEXs, there will be a significant difference because an average person prefers to register on CEX, get KYC verified and trade easily with his smartphone while trading on DEX is a little more complicated and when you own a crypto wallet, you need to take some responsibility on your shoulders.
Compare CEX and DEX to eBay/Amazon and other crypto marketplaces. List your item on eBay, you'll sell it easily but list your item on any crypto marketplace, you'll struggle. CEXs are like eBay/Amazon, they are popular and have traffic, that is a significant moment. Listing your coin on CEX is a good marketing strategy for any coin, let alone the possibility of easy trading for millions of people.

By the way, I can't talk about price manipulation and how often that happens with tokens like Shuffle has. The company has to outweigh pros and cons of each of their step but I still think that everyone wants to get listed on major CEXs.

What happened here was probably that Shuffle had promised a CEX listing, and since they didn't want to break their promise, they chose the one that lists anything for money.
I would imagine that they know what they are doing, unless this was some newbie from marketing doing the listing.

Cexes have their upsides, and binance was an extreme suggestion. Any legitimate CEX would do, XT just isn't one of them. All i am asking is that we shouldn't fall for them being what they are advertising to be.

For example, let's take a look that XT again shall we, as i pointed out it has major faked volume without decent liquidity, so maybe we get millions more eyes watching for SHFL when we are listed in there like you said.

Here are quick stats from ahrefs.com:

CEX:

DEX:

For some reason people are underestimating the traffic on DEXes. CEXes used to make more sense when every coin had their own blockchain.

When those tokens can be traded in DEXes, there's no real reason for CEXes (except maybe in some cases cheaper fees). Especially when those CEXes are something like XT is.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: panjul07 on October 05, 2024, 06:30:34 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on October 05, 2024, 01:19:11 AM

That actually could be a mathematical problem. Hahaha. How much is your current capital, how much could you lose, how much are the rewards, and will you break even after rewards?

Reward should always be taken as a side bonus from our gambling activity, not a thing which should be chased unless we are billionaire who want to take it as a challenge then take a risk of decent amount of money while it wont bring any issue if we lose the whole amount.

If we should force ourselves to chase the reward (not only as what mentioned by above users), I'm pretty sure it wont be something profitable unless we are making profit while wagering $250M

This kind of promotion is good, no doubt about it because it may attract players to keep gambling as long as possible and as much as they can in a hope to get the rewards but of course small-medium gamblers will never think about it.

Although that's true, BUT for those people who would seriously chase that expensive reward and be the FIRST Red Diamond VIP holder, then they probably should have the capital and make a plan. THAT makes it a mathematical problem. I didn't say anything that rewards shouldn't be a side-bonus.

Furthermore, Noah posted the total volume wagered for September. It's higher 👀

Quote

September update - steady on

https://x.com/noahdummett/status/1841693517258559701

Topic: ✨ Shuffle.com | The next generation of crypto casinos | Sports, Casino + token - page 18. (Read 22341 times)