I guess no one yet had cloned steem ever since?
Did you forget Ark.io?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.17016728
Topic: Someone please make a steem clone - page 2. (Read 14356 times)
Did you forget Ark.io?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.17016728
I guess no one yet had cloned steem ever since? I thought newbium was just one. Maybe you guys are requesting a clone to a wrong crowd, there are hardcore programmers can do this in less than a week. its the money talk that can make it work, how much would someone pay for steem.it clone by the way?
...if something else similar to steem comes along we can be early investors and maybe whales ^^
Every scammer knows and will try to take advantage of this. ^^^
Because steem doesn't allow them to make quick copy paste scamcoins they will have to find a workaround to this I guess.
I dont think we need a clone , just something with a similar idea would be good enough. I k ow steem works well and as a bonus it pays according to steem power which you can invest into. So you can invest directly into your own articles. Best of all if something else similar to steem comes along we can be early investors and maybe whales ^^
Steem.it would be a great platform if you host blogs. What I would do is use their code for more niche blogs. I would make one for "recipes". Then make a coin and use that coin to hire content writers. Once you cloned it and had the payments going you could start pumping out new blog sites for every popular niche.
I have bigger ideas and I don't think steem.it technology is very good. I'm more into fully decentralized platforms and mobile dapps. It's definitely a good idea to use it if you're starting a blog.
I have bigger ideas and I don't think steem.it technology is very good. I'm more into fully decentralized platforms and mobile dapps. It's definitely a good idea to use it if you're starting a blog.
@iamnotback
Good eye.. they count on us not reading the fine print.
This comment of yours is deserving of a bump to raise awareness of this sketchy situation.
Watch out guys it's gettin' pretty damn scammy out there.
Good eye.. they count on us not reading the fine print.
This comment of yours is deserving of a bump to raise awareness of this sketchy situation.
Watch out guys it's gettin' pretty damn scammy out there.
Ark.io is running an ICO now and already raised $1 million with another ~3 weeks to go, but they are not even promising how much of the premine the ICO participants will get:
https://ark.io/ARK-TEC-Agreement.pdf
Nor are they limiting the amount of funds raised, thus the initial value of the market cap required in order for those ICO investors to even exit break even.
Why would anyone invest under such horrible terms? What are these speculators thinking?
(I hope somebody is going to put an end to this nonsense soon! and all those who bought these scamcoins are going to observe their tokens become worthless! That is my hope.)
https://ark.io/ARK-TEC-Agreement.pdf
Nor are they limiting the amount of funds raised, thus the initial value of the market cap required in order for those ICO investors to even exit break even.
Why would anyone invest under such horrible terms? What are these speculators thinking?
(I hope somebody is going to put an end to this nonsense soon! and all those who bought these scamcoins are going to observe their tokens become worthless! That is my hope.)
Masknetwork looked good until they shut down earlier. However their UI was about as bad as it gets and really had no future if they didn't have more nodes that looked more professional, instead of using calibri font all the time 
Steem clones such as Ark based on DPOS and the same failed concepts as Steem (such as voting) will IMO also fail:
@laonie wrote that he invested 400 BTC in Steem Power.
https://steemit.com/steem/@steemitblog/proposed-changes-to-steem-economy#@anonymint/re-laonie-re-anonymint-re-laonie-re-lukestokes-re-steemitblog-proposed-changes-to-steem-economy-20161107t025849431z
You are correct that users won't stay just for money and the site must be enjoyable/meaningful even without remuneration, because it is mathematically impossible to pay users enough for blogging from debasement of investors.
However if users stayed because they are investors, then they could have both their heart and mind vested in it. That was one of my key insights when I realized how to make a better Steem "clone".
Voting is the problem (because as one of my blogs pointed out, it is impossible to avoid Sybil attacks without handing that voting power to the whales which thus centralizes the ranking and reward system).
Btw, remember I responded to one of your blogs in August and warned you that you were throwing your BTC down a rat hole. Maybe next time you listen more carefully to what I have to say.
Yes, you did warn me, thanks for the warning, i wasn't thinking clearly at that time, and i learned the lesson.
I am developing a social network blockchain project somewhat similar to Steem, but different in very important ways which address all of your points and even points you have not yet thought of. It is also intended to fix all the centralization problems of Bitcoin, so it is to be a major announcement in the Bitcoin ecosystem when I get close to launch. Also the name I have is superior (the domain is already registered), on the caliber of "Twitter".
The DPOS which Steem is based on is less than ideal. I wrote down the issues at least one of which afaik no one else had enumerated. I have also been creating a new programming language to replace JavaScript and Java, and this ties into my plans for the social network. I must keep some of the details secret until I get closer to launch, otherwise other projects would possibly attempt to copy them.
I will be in Singapore in second and third week of January (for a medical trip to deal with my liver & digestive health problem) if anyone wants to meet to talk with me face-to-face. It would probably be best if there was some angel investment now to help hire another top programmer to accelerate my progress. I am a top programmer and only want to work with the very best due to the Mythical Man Month loses of productivity due ridiculous amounts of communication load (or miscommunication outcomes) incurred when working with junior programmers.
I can be contacted at my LinkedIn, which is linked in my first blog post.
I don't think it is in my best interests to apply my design and ideas to changing Steem, because I am not one of the whales who mined the stealth mining. The prior concentration of ownership disincentivizes me from being a full partner in the ecosystem. I had thought about contacting @ned, but then changed my mind when I became aware of how most of the tokens had been minded for Steemit, Inc.
I have appreciated that they did this experiment and demonstrated the potential value of a Steem-like concept and I participated sincerely to see what would come of it (which is a concept I was working on before they launched and before I had heard of Steem). I presume they have profited commensurately. And they can make changes now and see how much they can salvage from the existing design and inertia. I am not claiming they can't make some design improvements. I will be watching intently to see what they do.
https://steemit.com/steem/@steemitblog/proposed-changes-to-steem-economy#@anonymint/re-laonie-re-anonymint-re-laonie-re-lukestokes-re-steemitblog-proposed-changes-to-steem-economy-20161107t025849431z
Quote from: myself
Quote from: @laonie
Quote from: myself
Quote from: @laonie
If you want to win a user's heart, money just won't work.
You are correct that users won't stay just for money and the site must be enjoyable/meaningful even without remuneration, because it is mathematically impossible to pay users enough for blogging from debasement of investors.
However if users stayed because they are investors, then they could have both their heart and mind vested in it. That was one of my key insights when I realized how to make a better Steem "clone".
Voting is the problem (because as one of my blogs pointed out, it is impossible to avoid Sybil attacks without handing that voting power to the whales which thus centralizes the ranking and reward system).
Btw, remember I responded to one of your blogs in August and warned you that you were throwing your BTC down a rat hole. Maybe next time you listen more carefully to what I have to say.
Yes, you did warn me, thanks for the warning, i wasn't thinking clearly at that time, and i learned the lesson.
Quote from: @knozaki2015
I invested 40btc... so I totally agree with your position!
I am developing a social network blockchain project somewhat similar to Steem, but different in very important ways which address all of your points and even points you have not yet thought of. It is also intended to fix all the centralization problems of Bitcoin, so it is to be a major announcement in the Bitcoin ecosystem when I get close to launch. Also the name I have is superior (the domain is already registered), on the caliber of "Twitter".
The DPOS which Steem is based on is less than ideal. I wrote down the issues at least one of which afaik no one else had enumerated. I have also been creating a new programming language to replace JavaScript and Java, and this ties into my plans for the social network. I must keep some of the details secret until I get closer to launch, otherwise other projects would possibly attempt to copy them.
I will be in Singapore in second and third week of January (for a medical trip to deal with my liver & digestive health problem) if anyone wants to meet to talk with me face-to-face. It would probably be best if there was some angel investment now to help hire another top programmer to accelerate my progress. I am a top programmer and only want to work with the very best due to the Mythical Man Month loses of productivity due ridiculous amounts of communication load (or miscommunication outcomes) incurred when working with junior programmers.
I can be contacted at my LinkedIn, which is linked in my first blog post.
I don't think it is in my best interests to apply my design and ideas to changing Steem, because I am not one of the whales who mined the stealth mining. The prior concentration of ownership disincentivizes me from being a full partner in the ecosystem. I had thought about contacting @ned, but then changed my mind when I became aware of how most of the tokens had been minded for Steemit, Inc.
I have appreciated that they did this experiment and demonstrated the potential value of a Steem-like concept and I participated sincerely to see what would come of it (which is a concept I was working on before they launched and before I had heard of Steem). I presume they have profited commensurately. And they can make changes now and see how much they can salvage from the existing design and inertia. I am not claiming they can't make some design improvements. I will be watching intently to see what they do.
The idea of forcing "Jane and Joe" into the crypto world is inherently flawed. Any system that thrives off of the non-savvy community is destined to fail. Adoption will come to the commoners after everyone else, it's the only viable way.
With that being said, fuck steem and fuck anyone who tries to make a clone.
With that being said, fuck steem and fuck anyone who tries to make a clone.
Good luck trying to fuck me. I doubt that will work out for you. Ask the gays in the Philippines who violating my respect for them by trying to flirt with me when I was giving clear body language that I was not interested.
I agree about "force".
But I disagree if that is providing what people want and need...
To my BCT friends who are goldbugs, the reason I speak frankly is because I want you to look at the situation objectively. I know from my own infatuation in the past with precious metals, that the drug of fighting back against the system is very intoxicating.
But the fact is that absent our existing governance and monetary system, a power vacuum forms, which sucks in roaming armed gangs which then gives rise to warlords. The warlords are the market makers. Feudalism. Power is a fact of physics and nature.
The only way your fantasy of a silver dime monetary barter system would take form is if you have an organized community with governance, security, and enshrining silver dimes as the monetary system to give it the confidence it needs. And then some market makers to provided the liquidity between debt, silver dimes, and production. And you have to then provide for defense against more powerful invaders, so your community can't be too small.
If you don't understand how governance, market makers (i.e. power-brokers), and the economy are all dependent on each other, then you of course will make silly fantasies about people trading silver dimes as a fall back option.
Understanding power vacuums, the power-law distribution of wealth in nature, etc.. are critical to forming a rational assessment of the future.
Money has always been what people trust and have confidence in. This doesn't mean the metal itself, but as Armstrong has explained many times it was the stamp on the metal. Even when the invaders took over the Roman Empire, they used the stamps on the coins from the former Empire because it was more trusted.
Bitcoin (crypto-currency on a blockchain) enable trustless money, where we don't have to trust any authority. We trust the decentralized protocol. Now that was the ideal. Unfortunately Satoshi's proof-of-work centralizes and thus we end up trusting Gregory Maxwell and the Chinese mining cartel.
So crypto-currency is not quite ready for being independent of the powers-that-be yet.
Someone may invent a solution. I happen to know someone who claims he may have such a solution. We'll see...
But the fact is that absent our existing governance and monetary system, a power vacuum forms, which sucks in roaming armed gangs which then gives rise to warlords. The warlords are the market makers. Feudalism. Power is a fact of physics and nature.
The only way your fantasy of a silver dime monetary barter system would take form is if you have an organized community with governance, security, and enshrining silver dimes as the monetary system to give it the confidence it needs. And then some market makers to provided the liquidity between debt, silver dimes, and production. And you have to then provide for defense against more powerful invaders, so your community can't be too small.
If you don't understand how governance, market makers (i.e. power-brokers), and the economy are all dependent on each other, then you of course will make silly fantasies about people trading silver dimes as a fall back option.
Understanding power vacuums, the power-law distribution of wealth in nature, etc.. are critical to forming a rational assessment of the future.
Money has always been what people trust and have confidence in. This doesn't mean the metal itself, but as Armstrong has explained many times it was the stamp on the metal. Even when the invaders took over the Roman Empire, they used the stamps on the coins from the former Empire because it was more trusted.
Bitcoin (crypto-currency on a blockchain) enable trustless money, where we don't have to trust any authority. We trust the decentralized protocol. Now that was the ideal. Unfortunately Satoshi's proof-of-work centralizes and thus we end up trusting Gregory Maxwell and the Chinese mining cartel.
So crypto-currency is not quite ready for being independent of the powers-that-be yet.
Someone may invent a solution. I happen to know someone who claims he may have such a solution. We'll see...
Question for you.
What is the most ideal money system?
In the now Id suppose this would be the system with the most liquidity and fungibility.
However if one was to theorize what the most ideal money system was, what would it
There is no perfect static one. Nothing static will ever be perfect, because static means we can't exist. Our existence is predicated on friction and thus change via irreversibility of space-time. I wrote about this recently in several places (see Economic Devastation, see one of my blogs on Steemit, and see some recent comment posts and also wrote about this on Github, don't have time to dig this up, ... google my name and "light cones").
The ideal money system is always changing. It is the one that enables society to move forward, as the needs of society changed.
As I have explained several years ago in my seminal articles which CoinCube cited, during the Industrial Age we needed to store capital in a way that maximized the economies-of-scale of constructing factories, i.e. maximizing efficiency of labor and technical capital. Whereas, now in the Knowledge Age we need to maximize decentralization and thus diversity of maximization-of-the-division-of-labor.
This is why now physical money can't move us forward. Gold and silver could only take us back to a Dark Age. We must move forward, because the degrees-of-freedom in society had shifted due to technological advancement. I would need to write another essay to explain this in more detail and don't have the time nor cognitive energy to do it now.
Quote
As Dmitry Orlov points out, everyone's priority is on food, security, and transportation. Direct trade of these is more valued than some metal which can't be traded for these needs, because these metals are not liquid.
Thinking towards your better then steemit line of thought. The next generation social network would do well to focus on these things. Allow the economy(trade of goods and services) to flourish freely. Decentralize food preparation and distribution. (Ie: uber/air bnb like: you cook some extra food and use a local service to sell and deliver it, build a rep, etc). Decentralize security, neighborhood militia, cop liasons, neighborhood watch, etc. Decentralize transportation, uber.
(Decentralization in this case, still uses a network as the centralizer, however it allows regular people to participate. Ie: gives the purpose..a job, when no ones hiring)
Disagree. IMO, the better Steemit I am working on can't focus on physical world things, because that doesn't appear to me be the low hanging fruit. The virtual world moves at much greater degrees-of-freedom (a form of efficiency in the sense of potential energy). Once you've onboarded the virtual ecosystem, it can then also take over the physical realm as an after effect of already conquering the world.
The idea of forcing "Jane and Joe" into the crypto world is inherently flawed. Any system that thrives off of the non-savvy community is destined to fail. Adoption will come to the commoners after everyone else, it's the only viable way.
With that being said, fuck steem and fuck anyone who tries to make a clone.
With that being said, fuck steem and fuck anyone who tries to make a clone.
Potential significance of a totally different kind of Steem "clone":
Re: China putting capital controls on BTC! (lol)
Afaics, the only practical technical way this can be accomplished is to ensure that the users never hold the private keys and thus ensuring that the exchanges do not allow any transfers to any Bitcoin address which is not controlled by the exchange (or another compliant exchange). To ensure that no exchange user can reside outside of China and that no such user can withdraw in fiat outside of the Chinese banking system. If they were to allow users to control private keys, then they would have to enforce such tracking on each user which is impractical to enforce.
Thus this proposal means that the Chinese could no longer participate in for example a social network (such as the project I am working on) where the crypto-currency moves from user-to-user regardless of their financial jurisdiction and in which the users control their private keys.
In other words, China would effectively be removing their citizens from the Bitcoin (and crypto-currency) ecosystem.
I don't see any way they can do this and not render China a 2nd class citizen on the future of the Internet economics. They will stunt the development of their own Internet software technology sector.
If China was going to do this, I think they would have done it a long time ago. I would tend to think this is some rumor put out there by those who wanted to make a lot of money shorting. Another sign that the corruption in governance also exists in the government of China's finance bureaucrats (and who would be surprised). Nevertheless before this could actually become a regulation, I think very astute people would have to sign off on it, and I just don't see China shooting themselves in the foot. They are too cunning for that. That Bloomberg has pulled the news off their website is another indication that this was probably malfeasance.
I see this as very likely a buying opportunity and a bear trap due to some errant malfeasance within the Chinese bureaucracy.
And also that the China's oligarchy control over Bitcoin mining and price is growing. If true, this corrupt influence over Bitcoin is what Bitcoin was supposed to eliminate. But the problem is Satoshi's proof-of-work design naturally centralizes due to economies-of-scale. I have a video which explains this in some detail. And also we can see the control over the exchanges by governments is another choke point of control leading to such malfeasance.
We need to do something about this technically. I am working on it. I have a design for unprofitable proof-of-work to address this problem. TPTB_need_war (who some think is me since I am reputed to be AnonyMint) has also done conceptual technical design work on decentralized exchange (and there is some new research on that I haven't yet published). But decentralized exchange probably isn't really the solution because speculators don't want to trade where volume is low and trades aren't instantaneous. Instead the solution is probably about how we onboard millions of users and thus create an ecosystem where fiat is irrelevant for the users, i.e. the crypto-unit becomes the unit-of-account. In that case, the speculators become orthogonal to the users to a great extent (not entirely of course). If China were to wall off their population from this sort of Internet ecosystem, they would I think fall to 2nd class citizens on the Internet. Building their own walled gardens for such would again mean centralized control over private keys, which would mean massive failure due to hackers.
China will lose this gambit (of control over crypto-currency) eventually.
Afaics, the only practical technical way this can be accomplished is to ensure that the users never hold the private keys and thus ensuring that the exchanges do not allow any transfers to any Bitcoin address which is not controlled by the exchange (or another compliant exchange). To ensure that no exchange user can reside outside of China and that no such user can withdraw in fiat outside of the Chinese banking system. If they were to allow users to control private keys, then they would have to enforce such tracking on each user which is impractical to enforce.
Thus this proposal means that the Chinese could no longer participate in for example a social network (such as the project I am working on) where the crypto-currency moves from user-to-user regardless of their financial jurisdiction and in which the users control their private keys.
In other words, China would effectively be removing their citizens from the Bitcoin (and crypto-currency) ecosystem.
I don't see any way they can do this and not render China a 2nd class citizen on the future of the Internet economics. They will stunt the development of their own Internet software technology sector.
If China was going to do this, I think they would have done it a long time ago. I would tend to think this is some rumor put out there by those who wanted to make a lot of money shorting. Another sign that the corruption in governance also exists in the government of China's finance bureaucrats (and who would be surprised). Nevertheless before this could actually become a regulation, I think very astute people would have to sign off on it, and I just don't see China shooting themselves in the foot. They are too cunning for that. That Bloomberg has pulled the news off their website is another indication that this was probably malfeasance.
I see this as very likely a buying opportunity and a bear trap due to some errant malfeasance within the Chinese bureaucracy.
And also that the China's oligarchy control over Bitcoin mining and price is growing. If true, this corrupt influence over Bitcoin is what Bitcoin was supposed to eliminate. But the problem is Satoshi's proof-of-work design naturally centralizes due to economies-of-scale. I have a video which explains this in some detail. And also we can see the control over the exchanges by governments is another choke point of control leading to such malfeasance.
We need to do something about this technically. I am working on it. I have a design for unprofitable proof-of-work to address this problem. TPTB_need_war (who some think is me since I am reputed to be AnonyMint) has also done conceptual technical design work on decentralized exchange (and there is some new research on that I haven't yet published). But decentralized exchange probably isn't really the solution because speculators don't want to trade where volume is low and trades aren't instantaneous. Instead the solution is probably about how we onboard millions of users and thus create an ecosystem where fiat is irrelevant for the users, i.e. the crypto-unit becomes the unit-of-account. In that case, the speculators become orthogonal to the users to a great extent (not entirely of course). If China were to wall off their population from this sort of Internet ecosystem, they would I think fall to 2nd class citizens on the Internet. Building their own walled gardens for such would again mean centralized control over private keys, which would mean massive failure due to hackers.
China will lose this gambit (of control over crypto-currency) eventually.
About the proposed Boost language tangent that I got dragged into in early September and extracting myself from that blackhole:
https://github.com/keean/zenscript/issues/11#issuecomment-257667869 (read only the linked comment post)
https://github.com/keean/zenscript/issues/13#issuecomment-257757157 (read the linked plus following two comment posts)
https://github.com/keean/zenscript/issues/11#issuecomment-257667869 (read only the linked comment post)
https://github.com/keean/zenscript/issues/13#issuecomment-257757157 (read the linked plus following two comment posts)
back on topic. ARK, it's going to be the best project of 2017.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/ark-dpos-ark-protokol-marketsquare-ipfs-staking-on-binance-1649695
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/ark-dpos-ark-protokol-marketsquare-ipfs-staking-on-binance-1649695
Okay this is the first serious Steem clone. And this is a serious competitor to the project I am working on.
But I see they've already made the critical error of choosing voting as the reward and onboarding paradigm. Thus I am not worried. I will defeat this project.
Thanks for the competition. This lights a fire under my butt.
They have a significantly diverse team. But if you study carefully, they don't have many top 1000 programmers, maybe not any of those guys. That doesn't mean they can't produce something good. Looks like they have some technical progress.
But there aren't so many Satoshis in this world.
This is good competition for me. Thanks.
If you guys are looking for a competitor to STEEM you should take a look at NEWBIUM. It's crypto content focused, but similar ideas of paying content providers with tokens based on attention, votes, etc
I checked Newbium - it is not very liquid - only 6$ was traded yesterday. See
https://coinmarketcap.com/assets/newbium/#markets
I'm still coding...
Re: FATCA will drive the world to crypto-currency
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/world-news/taxes/when-the-back-office-becomes-bigger-than-the-front-office-it-is-time-to-die/
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/products_services/launching-socrates-new-payment-system/
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/world-news/taxes/when-the-back-office-becomes-bigger-than-the-front-office-it-is-time-to-die/
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/products_services/launching-socrates-new-payment-system/
Perhaps readers need a summary to perk their interest.
The point is that if you want to sell internationally, then the payment providers are not going to be able to handle your business. You will need to accept something else. But what else?
We need a crypto-currency that is in the hands of millions and easily accessible for international commerce.
The point is that if you want to sell internationally, then the payment providers are not going to be able to handle your business. You will need to accept something else. But what else?
We need a crypto-currency that is in the hands of millions and easily accessible for international commerce.
This is better than a Steemit clone. Monetizing podcasting!
COVAL based on a loyalty network is going to release an app called VOCAL in about a month that essentially monetizes podcasting. Podcasting has struggled even more than blogging to produce a revenue stream as people don't want to listen to audio adverts which are a pain to produce anyway unlike google ads revenue. I see it as having even more potential than Steemit it they pull it off well. What do you think?
https://mobile.twitter.com/circuitsofvalue/status/768994220153659393
It seems really have some good potential if properly developed.
This is better than a Steemit clone. Monetizing podcasting!
COVAL based on a loyalty network is going to release an app called VOCAL in about a month that essentially monetizes podcasting. Podcasting has struggled even more than blogging to produce a revenue stream as people don't want to listen to audio adverts which are a pain to produce anyway unlike google ads revenue. I see it as having even more potential than Steemit it they pull it off well. What do you think?
https://mobile.twitter.com/circuitsofvalue/status/768994220153659393
Another reason I have reduced my posting activity.
Medium's stats support my belief that vast majority of readers do not want to write blogs. And the vast majority of social networking users don't even want to read blogs!
I don't think the censorship issue is even in the consciousness of most readers and even bloggers.
Thus I conclude Steem has not found any low-hanging viral fruit.
I would not prefer to be blogging on Steem (as compared to a replacement for Steem that wasn't reliant on whales and note I am coding such now), because I am totally dependent on the whales, both for my reward, visibility and also for the security of the blockchain.
This pretty much sums it up nicely. Even cheap lotto tickets are not viral, but boring.
But at least Steemit continues to expand their very detailed stats...
And has stabilized at 4-5K daily users (of which about 1K are multiple or bot accounts)...
So we are talking 3,500 daily users... almost certainly more than use Ethereum daily.
Dan can kill off God and spout all the faux "revolutionary" rhetoric he wants...
But unless he deprecates the offensive, elitist Whale Culture by HF some form of redistribution...
Steemit's fatal flaw will dead-end the platform (and decimate the value of whale accounts).
Are you sure the numbers are correct?
Steemit went down like 85% so the rewards should have went down too no?
And rewards were the only thing getting people on board.
Jump to: