Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com - page 1742.

plasmoske

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 251

The realist

Quote from: BitCoinzzz on August 31, 2013, 12:24:40 AM

time frame is 6 months you fucking idiot. If hash doubles in September, you will not make any money. Are you a 5 year old? Or just mentally retarded? I forgot in the 3rd world you don't have enough food, slow developing brains.

According to your trusty genesis mining cal, by 6 months I would've already break even and profited. Now you're just making shit up. Please provide calculation. Even a mining genesis cal link would be good. <--- I'd like to see that

And even my device is meant to be shipped on Sept, guess what? I put in October for estimate. It's better to be pessimistic about it rather than optimistic. And I still ROId.

BitCoinzzz

newbie

Activity: 32

Merit: 0

Quote from: plasmoske on August 31, 2013, 12:21:24 AM

Quote from: BitCoinzzz on August 31, 2013, 12:18:50 AM

You do, your arguing about roi. If it doubles this month, there is 0 ROI. You will lose money.

If your timeframe is only 1 month to make ROI then you're in the wrong game.

time frame is 6 months you fucking idiot. If hash doubles in September, you will not make any money. Are you a 5 year old? Or just mentally retarded? I forgot in the 3rd world you don't have enough food, slow developing brains.

Good luck to you morons waiting to get your devices in September, and October you will all make so much monies with negative rate of return. No wonder scams abound in the Bitcoin community because it's filled with dumbasses lol

plasmoske

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 251

The realist

Quote from: BitCoinzzz on August 31, 2013, 12:18:50 AM

You do, your arguing about roi. If it doubles this month, there is 0 ROI. You will lose money.

If your timeframe is only 1 month to make ROI then you're in the wrong game.

By the way, you haven't pointed out where I said it wouldn't double next month or the month after.

BitCoinzzz

newbie

Activity: 32

Merit: 0

Quote from: plasmoske on August 30, 2013, 11:44:19 PM

I never said it won't double in the next month or next. I'm saying after a while, it's bloody hard to keep doubling. Please read before replying or please point to where I said it won't double next month.

3rd world English? Roll Eyes

Let's have a look at your trusty genesis mining cal. http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/59a54f942b

Yeah after 4-5 months, you won't really know what it will be like but the chances of it doubling and doubling and doubling is extremely unlikely.

Who's got 3rd world maths here?

You do, your arguing about roi. If it doubles this month, there is 0 ROI. You will lose money.

ASIC-K

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

Hell?

Quote from: Phoenix1969 on August 30, 2013, 11:56:07 PM

I wonder if upgrade kits will be available again

i sure hope so. i hope they offer early adopters some discounts on upgrades or gen 2 stuff. if so ill be ordering a lot more from them.

Phoenix1969

legendary

Activity: 938

Merit: 1000

LIR DEV

I wonder if upgrade kits will be available again

plasmoske

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 251

The realist

Quote from: vesperwillow on August 30, 2013, 11:47:27 PM

The problem with this is that it's linear thinking, you're not taking into account the efficiency increase over time. Think about how much advancement has occurred with CPU/GPU's over the past decade. Exponential is putting it lightly.

Yes there will be increase in efficiency but there's a technological wall at some point. 28nm will be pretty much the standard in months to come and that's about it. There could be 20nm but I don't see that happening for years to come. Mainly because it's not widely available and way too expensive.

But to have it double > double > double > double > double > double >double > double is impossible. Mathically/technologically wise. People don't seem to understand this.

It's like saying current CPU tech. It becomes double the speed/efficiency next year. and double again next year and double again next year. Going by the logic, by 2020, we should have 60ghz cpu with only 20w usage. lol. That's not exactly the case if you look at the benchmarks for the past few years.

Yeah that was the case back in the old days, pentium 1s but those days are over.

With bitcoin ASICs, you're already almost there at the top. Current bitcoin ASICs are not at Pentium1 levels.

demonmaestro

hero member

Activity: 574

Merit: 500

Mining for the hell of it.

You know it makes me wonder. Why must people argue ROI if we are talking about something that can have no value tomorrow.

People need to stop thinking of bitcoin as a way to get money or get rich and think of it as like a hobby. if make money cool if not well shit happens. Lets just all get along and have some fun and mine them coins! Grin

vesperwillow

hero member

Activity: 616

Merit: 500

Quote from: Ytterbium on August 30, 2013, 09:55:28 PM

The HashFast die is 18x18mm² and does 400Gh/s. (I'm just going with them since they disclosed their die size)

That's 1.2345679 Petahash/s per square meter (yes really). A square kilometer is a million square meters, so if you had a square kilometer of HashFast chips you'd have a 1.2345679 Zetahashes/second.

1.2345679 PH/s equates to a difficulty of 172 million, so to convert a difficulty estimate into square meters of HashFast chips (just the silicon, not the package) you divide by 172 million. So right now you'd need 0.38 square meters worth of HashFast chips to get that difficulty.

Now, you put in a start date of decemeber with the default parameters for the calculator, and it tells you the difficulty in november, 2014 will be 316,655,000,000. That would require 1,841 square meters worth of HashFast chis.

Put in december of 2014, and it'll tell you that by november of 2015, the difficulty will be 279,729,190,000,000. That would require 1.6 square kilometers worth of hashfast chips.

Put in a December, 2015 start and it'll estimate a difficulty generated by 1,453 square kilometers.

At that rate, we would need enough silicon to cover the earth's surface with HashFast chips by sometime in 2017.

The problem with this is that it's linear thinking, you're not taking into account the efficiency increase over time. Think about how much advancement has occurred with CPU/GPU's over the past decade. Exponential is putting it lightly.

plasmoske

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 251

The realist

I never said it won't double in the next month or next. I'm saying after a while, it's bloody hard to keep doubling. Please read before replying or please point to where I said it won't double next month.

3rd world English? Roll Eyes

Let's have a look at your trusty genesis mining cal. http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/59a54f942b

Yeah after 4-5 months, you won't really know what it will be like but the chances of it doubling and doubling and doubling is extremely unlikely.

Who's got 3rd world maths here?

BitCoinzzz

newbie

Activity: 32

Merit: 0

Quote from: plasmoske on August 30, 2013, 10:16:34 PM

You know what? I should've just listened to everyone else and add you to ignore. There's no point in reasoning with idiots. Reasonable assumption? According to what? The genesis mining calculator? lol

Your maths and logic is totally off. I've already given you the scenario/logic behind how hard it is to double and double and double again. Yet you still failed to understand that. Then again, ain't you the idiot who wanted to cancel your order because the case didn't look good? LOL

Added to ignore.

The only idiot here is you, It's up 400% in the last 3 months, which is more than double a month. Are you mentally retarded? What makes you think with all the hashrate coming online that this month now September wont double? Or are you completely retarded lol.

Yes your logical maths, it gets harder to double, yet it did it for the last 3 months and about to do it for the 4th. Idiots, have fun, I will be sure to abuse you morons in a month or two from now. I got a refund on my unit also, just like Johny.

65,750,060
Next difficulty (estimate): 83,520,333

If we go with 18TH increases in about a week, your already at 137TH by end of September you dumb fuck. Even more than the blockchains calculations

30 Day   110 %
60 Day   208 %
90 Day   441 %

Please tell me how it's not going to double, with your magical 3rd world country math.

jspielberg

sr. member

Activity: 490

Merit: 255

Quote from: CMMPro on August 30, 2013, 10:26:04 PM

I digress...almost a million Avalon chips are now basically non-roi meeting garbage IMO.

Well at .078 btc per chip they won't be made into miners... but at their actual cost of .0075btc (guessing that 110nm chips cost 75 cents marginal cost), I am sure the avalon team and their "friends" will find a good use for them.

demonmaestro

hero member

Activity: 574

Merit: 500

Mining for the hell of it.

Quote from: superfluouso on August 30, 2013, 10:16:43 PM

Quote from: dwdoc on August 30, 2013, 09:47:37 PM

Quote from: DPoS on August 30, 2013, 09:24:23 PM

anyone know if any PSUs allow to be on without being controlled by a motherboard? Anything besides using paperclips, etc? Something civil?

A paper clip is cheaper but:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/151106818357

And for those previously clueless about these paperclip shenanigans, here's a decent video:

http://tinyurl.com/lelywgv

I think i am hearing someone being shocked..

Quote from: Phoenix1969 on August 30, 2013, 10:30:30 PM

Quote from: superfluouso on August 30, 2013, 10:16:43 PM

Quote from: dwdoc on August 30, 2013, 09:47:37 PM

Quote from: DPoS on August 30, 2013, 09:24:23 PM

anyone know if any PSUs allow to be on without being controlled by a motherboard? Anything besides using paperclips, etc? Something civil?

A paper clip is cheaper but:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/151106818357

And for those previously clueless about these paperclip shenanigans, here's a decent video:

http://tinyurl.com/lelywgv

also here in corsair psu faq: item #8 https://corsair.secure.force.com/kA1400000008UVw

Dpos... I'm using a simple wire nut on each, for a more permanent solution.... nothing fancy

Error 404.

Phoenix1969

legendary

Activity: 938

Merit: 1000

LIR DEV

Quote from: superfluouso on August 30, 2013, 10:16:43 PM

Quote from: dwdoc on August 30, 2013, 09:47:37 PM

Quote from: DPoS on August 30, 2013, 09:24:23 PM

anyone know if any PSUs allow to be on without being controlled by a motherboard? Anything besides using paperclips, etc? Something civil?

A paper clip is cheaper but:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/151106818357

And for those previously clueless about these paperclip shenanigans, here's a decent video:

http://tinyurl.com/lelywgv

also here in corsair psu faq: item #8 https://corsair.secure.force.com/kA1400000008UVw

Dpos... I'm using a simple wire nut on each, for a more permanent solution.... nothing fancy

CMMPro

hero member

Activity: 588

Merit: 500

These shenanigans with Avalon have to have thrown off the projected growth more than a bit, no?

I don't think we will see very many of those chips ever produced into a device that hashes....most of the DIY builders are facing bankruptcy once their users get litigious. A few small claims court rulings to pay the buyers back and they are bankrupt. I hope they incorporated or some of those people will be losing their homes. I digress...almost a million Avalon chips are now basically non-roi meeting garbage IMO.

Ytterbium

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Quote from: -Redacted- on August 30, 2013, 10:00:32 PM

Why even try to reason with a troll? They're like Democrats - they don't let inconveinient things like facts interfere with their vision of reality...

On the other hand, as we all know Republicans are widely known for their rationality.

plasmoske

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 251

The realist

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_of_two#The_first_96_powers_of_two

SirWizz

full member

Activity: 173

Merit: 100

Quote from: -Redacted- on August 30, 2013, 10:21:01 PM

Quote from: SirWizz on August 30, 2013, 10:20:01 PM

Quote from: -Redacted- on August 30, 2013, 10:00:32 PM

Why even try to reason with a troll? They're like Democrats - they don't let inconveinient things like facts interfere with their vision of reality...

And this statement is reasonable by Republican "standards". See? Grin

Sorry - I'm not a Republican.

Who said you were? Huh

-Redacted-

hero member

Activity: 574

Merit: 501

Quote from: SirWizz on August 30, 2013, 10:20:01 PM

Quote from: -Redacted- on August 30, 2013, 10:00:32 PM

Why even try to reason with a troll? They're like Democrats - they don't let inconveinient things like facts interfere with their vision of reality...

And this statement is reasonable by Republican "standards". See? Grin

Sorry but I'm not a Republican, either.

SirWizz

full member

Activity: 173

Merit: 100

Quote from: -Redacted- on August 30, 2013, 10:00:32 PM

Why even try to reason with a troll? They're like Democrats - they don't let inconveinient things like facts interfere with their vision of reality...

And this statement is reasonable by Republican "standards". See? Grin

Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com - page 1742. (Read 3049501 times)