Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com - page 2098.

pheaonix

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Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 10:16:16 AM

Quote from: FlappySocks on April 26, 2013, 09:57:32 AM

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 09:43:09 AM

They are approx 0.086 BTC per Avalon chip and €80 to assemble ten to an open source board, and €100 to assemble 20.

Chips are rated at 282 Mh/s each. Not too sure where you've got 2.0-2.5 BTC for 10 from?!

So thats €280 for 5.64 Ghash

About 700,000 chips on order?? 5.64 Ghash x 35,000 in a few months. Is that right?

No, man your addition sucks, that's just the chips as it states clearly above. Then you have 100 Euros if they decide to do the double sided boards or 160 if just the 10 chips per board, plus housing and psu. On top of which you're sending anonymous currency to people you don't know on a bulletin board to buy the chips and then have them send that to another anonymous person in another country to assemble the unit.

But then by August/September who knows what offers will be available.

One things for sure, the BFL crowd won't be making anything like they envisaged.

there won't be a housing and psu will be simple.

seleme

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well, ppc is currently more profitable to mine than bitcoin (if you can find buyer to sell it). trc is often much more profitable (again if you can find buyer for it).

organofcorti

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Poor impulse control.

Quote from: Cablez on April 26, 2013, 10:44:16 AM

Quote from: organofcorti on April 26, 2013, 10:41:29 AM

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 10:33:29 AM

Ah, understood, extending the life cycle then!

Point is, I don't think FPGAs can do that.

Depends on the alt coin. TRC, PPC, bytecoin are all I think double sha256. Still not very useful in my opinion.

That's what I thought.

Cablez

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Quote from: organofcorti on April 26, 2013, 10:41:29 AM

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 10:33:29 AM

Ah, understood, extending the life cycle then!

Point is, I don't think FPGAs can do that.

Depends on the alt coin. TRC, PPC, bytecoin are all I think double sha256. Still not very useful in my opinion.

Bitcoinorama

hero member

Activity: 532

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Doesn't one of the pools offer your hardware for non crypto currency coin related purposes and reward you with cash? I'm sureI read that somewhere to offset the lack of profit when difficulty increases for bitcoin...?

organofcorti

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Poor impulse control.

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 10:33:29 AM

Ah, understood, extending the life cycle then!

Point is, I don't think FPGAs can do that.

Bitcoinorama

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Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Ah, understood, extending the life cycle then!

organofcorti

donator

Activity: 2058

Merit: 1007

Poor impulse control.

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 10:29:50 AM

You put down 3k now but your return is when you get the ASIC at a later date...hopefully!

I was referring to:

Quote from: seleme on April 26, 2013, 10:09:52 AM

Mars could still mine alternative coins even when bitcoin mining would become unprofitable. That's it's main advantage to me.

Bitcoinorama

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Activity: 532

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Quote from: organofcorti on April 26, 2013, 10:18:02 AM

Quote from: seleme on April 26, 2013, 10:09:52 AM

Quote from: Anvi on April 26, 2013, 09:24:34 AM

Dear kncminer. Can I pay by "cash on delivery" or once the product is ready for shipping? I'm located in Helsinki, Finland
I'm scared to pay before the products are finished, demonstrated, and packaged for shipping.

Also the Mars miner price point seems high to me. BFL's non-existing BitForce 5 GH/s SC miner is advertised at $274.00, which might actually make ROI, if they ship during this year.

6GH+/s miner at $ 2,795.00 is likely to never meet ROI.. 6500Mhash @dif 8974296.01489/ profit per Month $1,524.78, but fact is that difficulty will take 2 huge leaps for every following month. In couple months the profit figure is probably near $100 per month.

Quote

Upgrade protection built in to any Mars purchase with vouchers for up to $2000 off of any Jupiter purchase.

Does this mean, that I get $2000 off Jupiter price with a single Mars purchase?

Mars could still mine alternative coins even when bitcoin mining would become unprofitable. That's it's main advantage to me.

What's so special about this FPGA that it can mine anything other than a sha256(sha256()) coin?

The entire point of the FPGA is to tie you into purchasing the ASIC for 7k when it arrives. The issue is whether there will be better avenues for your cash or whether mining will still be reasonable profitable at that point at least for return on investment. The earliest you will see the ASIC is September and that's being optimistic.

You put down 3k now but your return is when you get the ASIC at a later date...hopefully!

seleme

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Quote from: organofcorti on April 26, 2013, 10:18:02 AM

Quote from: seleme on April 26, 2013, 10:09:52 AM

Quote from: Anvi on April 26, 2013, 09:24:34 AM

Dear kncminer. Can I pay by "cash on delivery" or once the product is ready for shipping? I'm located in Helsinki, Finland
I'm scared to pay before the products are finished, demonstrated, and packaged for shipping.

Also the Mars miner price point seems high to me. BFL's non-existing BitForce 5 GH/s SC miner is advertised at $274.00, which might actually make ROI, if they ship during this year.

6GH+/s miner at $ 2,795.00 is likely to never meet ROI.. 6500Mhash @dif 8974296.01489/ profit per Month $1,524.78, but fact is that difficulty will take 2 huge leaps for every following month. In couple months the profit figure is probably near $100 per month.

Quote

Upgrade protection built in to any Mars purchase with vouchers for up to $2000 off of any Jupiter purchase.

Does this mean, that I get $2000 off Jupiter price with a single Mars purchase?

Mars could still mine alternative coins even when bitcoin mining would become unprofitable. That's it's main advantage to me.

What's so special about this FPGA that it can mine anything other than a sha256(sha256()) coin?

So it can't mine scrypt ones? I'm not really knowledgeable in that... in that case it's not as attractive product as I thought it might be unless one is optimistic about getting discount for Jupiter delivered in promised timeline. Not so sure about it.

organofcorti

donator

Activity: 2058

Merit: 1007

Poor impulse control.

Quote from: seleme on April 26, 2013, 10:09:52 AM

Quote from: Anvi on April 26, 2013, 09:24:34 AM

Dear kncminer. Can I pay by "cash on delivery" or once the product is ready for shipping? I'm located in Helsinki, Finland
I'm scared to pay before the products are finished, demonstrated, and packaged for shipping.

Also the Mars miner price point seems high to me. BFL's non-existing BitForce 5 GH/s SC miner is advertised at $274.00, which might actually make ROI, if they ship during this year.

6GH+/s miner at $ 2,795.00 is likely to never meet ROI.. 6500Mhash @dif 8974296.01489/ profit per Month $1,524.78, but fact is that difficulty will take 2 huge leaps for every following month. In couple months the profit figure is probably near $100 per month.

Quote

Upgrade protection built in to any Mars purchase with vouchers for up to $2000 off of any Jupiter purchase.

Does this mean, that I get $2000 off Jupiter price with a single Mars purchase?

Mars could still mine alternative coins even when bitcoin mining would become unprofitable. That's it's main advantage to me.

What's so special about this FPGA that it can mine anything other than a sha256(sha256()) coin?

Bitcoinorama

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Quote from: FlappySocks on April 26, 2013, 09:57:32 AM

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 09:43:09 AM

They are approx 0.086 BTC per Avalon chip and €80 to assemble ten to an open source board, and €100 to assemble 20.

Chips are rated at 282 Mh/s each. Not too sure where you've got 2.0-2.5 BTC for 10 from?!

So thats €280 for 5.64 Ghash

About 700,000 chips on order?? 5.64 Ghash x 35,000 in a few months. Is that right?

No, man your addition sucks, that's just the chips as it states clearly above. Then you have 100 Euros if they decide to do the double sided boards or 160 if just the 10 chips per board, plus housing and psu. On top of which you're sending anonymous currency to people you don't know on a bulletin board to buy the chips and then have them send that to another anonymous person in another country to assemble the unit.

But then by August/September who knows what offers will be available.

One things for sure, the BFL crowd won't be making anything like they envisaged.

Timzim103

member

Activity: 91

Merit: 17

Quote from: seleme on April 26, 2013, 04:52:23 AM

Their price for fpga is not that big if you compare it to other fpga offers. Someone opened a thread yesterday selling 400mh/s for 350, that would count as 5200 for this hashing power and that thread attracted lot of interest.

Yeah, I saw that too and came to the same conclusion. Plus, with the discussion around getting products with PSUs and fans from China, I'd rather purchase from elsewhere.

seleme

legendary

Activity: 2772

Merit: 1028

Duelbits.com

Quote from: Anvi on April 26, 2013, 09:24:34 AM

Dear kncminer. Can I pay by "cash on delivery" or once the product is ready for shipping? I'm located in Helsinki, Finland
I'm scared to pay before the products are finished, demonstrated, and packaged for shipping.

Also the Mars miner price point seems high to me. BFL's non-existing BitForce 5 GH/s SC miner is advertised at $274.00, which might actually make ROI, if they ship during this year.

6GH+/s miner at $ 2,795.00 is likely to never meet ROI.. 6500Mhash @dif 8974296.01489/ profit per Month $1,524.78, but fact is that difficulty will take 2 huge leaps for every following month. In couple months the profit figure is probably near $100 per month.

Quote

Upgrade protection built in to any Mars purchase with vouchers for up to $2000 off of any Jupiter purchase.

Does this mean, that I get $2000 off Jupiter price with a single Mars purchase?

Mars could still mine alternative coins even when bitcoin mining would become unprofitable. That's it's main advantage to me.

FlappySocks

hero member

Activity: 546

Merit: 500

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 09:43:09 AM

They are approx 0.086 BTC per Avalon chip and €80 to assemble ten to an open source board, and €100 to assemble 20.

Chips are rated at 282 Mh/s each. Not too sure where you've got 2.0-2.5 BTC for 10 from?!

So thats €280 for 5.64 Ghash

About 700,000 chips on order?? 5.64 Ghash x 35,000 in a few months. Is that right?

Bitcoinorama

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Quote from: FlappySocks on April 26, 2013, 09:33:52 AM

Quote from: Luckybit on April 26, 2013, 09:28:17 AM

How many Ghash are the DIY crowd talking about offering and at what price?

2.82Ghas for around 2.0 - 2.5 BTC

Needless to say, the ordering has gone crazy.

They are approx 0.086 BTC per Avalon chip and €80 to assemble ten to an open source board, and €100 to assemble 20.

Chips are rated at 282 Mh/s each. Not too sure where you've got 2.0-2.5 BTC for 10 from?!

FlappySocks

hero member

Activity: 546

Merit: 500

Quote from: Luckybit on April 26, 2013, 09:28:17 AM

How many Ghash are the DIY crowd talking about offering and at what price?

2.82Ghas for around 2.0 - 2.5 BTC

Needless to say, the ordering has gone crazy.

Luckybit

hero member

Activity: 714

Merit: 510

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on April 26, 2013, 07:43:22 AM

In summary; You buy a Mars 6Gh/s FPGA for $2.7k (plus shipping??) and you are stuck committing yourself to order the 250Gh/s Jupiter for $7k now irrespective of when it launches and whether the DIY crowd beat them to market with a better and cheaper product using Avalon's bulk chips (shipping in a month) and open source pcb and case design (available in two weeks) or swallow a $2.7k loss to switch to the DIY option if KNCMiner and ORSoC are caught dragging their feet! (Or risk waiting and waiting until they are ready to ship a product that performs to expectations without costing them or the customer more in the long run - such as BFL are doing right and you can see how that's working out for them). This is not a healthy position to be in.

Both options will be competing to refine their product offerings in the same timescale with KNCMiner asking for a premium over the DIY hobbyist set.

I'm not knocking on KNCminers ability to deliver, but they have no prior history or experience and time is such a huge factor, that this Mars deal and question mark over Jupiter is not the best solution for them or their customers.

It wouldn't necessarily be a loss because 6Ghash is still enough to mine with but it depends on what the DIY crowd can offer and at what price? If they can offer 20Ghash at $3000 then we will all be stuck with 6Ghash and that would completely suck. How many Ghash are the DIY crowd talking about offering and at what price?

Anvi

newbie

Activity: 40

Merit: 0

Dear kncminer. Can I pay by "cash on delivery" or once the product is ready for shipping? I'm located in Helsinki, Finland
I'm scared to pay before the products are finished, demonstrated, and packaged for shipping.

Also the Mars miner price point seems high to me. BFL's non-existing BitForce 5 GH/s SC miner is advertised at $274.00, which might actually make ROI, if they ship during this year.

6GH+/s miner at $ 2,795.00 is likely to never meet ROI.. 6500Mhash @dif 8974296.01489/ profit per Month $1,524.78, but fact is that difficulty will take 2 huge leaps for every following month. In couple months the profit figure is probably near $100 per month.

Quote

Upgrade protection built in to any Mars purchase with vouchers for up to $2000 off of any Jupiter purchase.

Does this mean, that I get $2000 off Jupiter price with a single Mars purchase?

Luckybit

hero member

Activity: 714

Merit: 510

Quote from: seleme on April 26, 2013, 07:45:41 AM

Nobody should buy with preorders, I guess people have learn that already.

If you have product in stock then ask money for it - it's simple as that.

I'm definitely considering to buy Mars, it's much better deal than some of asics sold recently as it's cheaper and can be used for other stuff and not thrown away after becoming non-profitable for mining bitcoins but only if I can get it in a week after I pay for it.

Otherwise, sorry, I'm not financing anyone just like that.

I'm with you. I reached the exact same conclusion. I think Mars can last us through July and honestly that is good enough. By July difficulty will be through the roof but at the same time we will have made somewhat of a profit and will be in line for the 250Ghash product. Provided the product really is only $5000 that is a steal of a price if we were to get it in the fall.

The problem is I doubt we will get it by the fall but that is another matter.

Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com - page 2098. (Read 3050071 times)