Tennis League All Thread - page 352.

Kemarit

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Quote from: babygun on November 02, 2021, 08:30:29 AM

Quote from: aoluain on November 02, 2021, 07:54:41 AM

^
Does anyone know what his immediate goals are as a player? I mean what does
he think he can achieve currently? does he expect to win at least an ATP250 title?

Maybe he would be better off on the challenger circuit if he is after tournament wins.

I would also say he is massively frustrated but there has to be a time when he has
to simply realise that its time to quit.

I feel sorry for him and he has done brilliantly to get back to where he is now but this
looks like his limit.

I don't know if he is really frustated; I think he loves the game too much to retire. He has nothing more to prove, he won multiple grandslams and became olympic champion 2 times also. If he keeps losing, there will come a moment that he starts to realise that it is best for him to retire as an active player but until then he will probably keep on playing tournament after tournament.

I agree, he just probably enjoy the game itself, and not targeting of anything, he knows that it is difficult to win a tournament right now, with his form and the players in the current circuit.

He might as well just play it the way he wanted and that's it.

Bublik vs Ruud currently, Ruud won the first set 6-4 already. His probably gonna take this in two sets. Last game for today, hopefully we can get some win in Paris.

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Quote from: babygun on November 02, 2021, 08:30:29 AM

Quote from: aoluain on November 02, 2021, 07:54:41 AM

^
Does anyone know what his immediate goals are as a player? I mean what does
he think he can achieve currently? does he expect to win at least an ATP250 title?

Maybe he would be better off on the challenger circuit if he is after tournament wins.

I would also say he is massively frustrated but there has to be a time when he has
to simply realise that its time to quit.

I feel sorry for him and he has done brilliantly to get back to where he is now but this
looks like his limit.

I don't know if he is really frustated; I think he loves the game too much to retire. He has nothing more to prove, he won multiple grandslams and became olympic champion 2 times also. If he keeps losing, there will come a moment that he starts to realise that it is best for him to retire as an active player but until then he will probably keep on playing tournament after tournament.

@aoluain You are right. Personally, I don't think that he might be able to win any more titles after his return to tennis again. He has aged and ages his getting the better of him and adding the surgery to that and we can see that he has left his peak time way behind and to be honest, I think his retirement is very coming very soon.

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Quote from: aoluain on November 02, 2021, 07:54:41 AM

Does anyone know what his immediate goals are as a player? I mean what does
he think he can achieve currently? does he expect to win at least an ATP250 title?

I think his only aim is to get back to the very top and challenge for slams again. I can't see that aiming for anything else would make sense. How could a player with Murray's history and pedigree possibly get motivated if he knows he'll never break back into say the top 50, let alone the top 4, where he used to belong?

It may be that once he accepts he won't regain his previous level, he'll consider retiring.

The only other alternative really is that he simply loves tennis, and loves playing, and the result is a secondary concern - but I can't see that this is the case.

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Quote from: Cnut237 on November 02, 2021, 05:00:25 AM

Quote from: Yaunfitda on November 02, 2021, 02:49:50 AM

Yeah, and as the match goes longer, the more Murray will be put to the disadvantage because of his age and his body. So I would say that the surface of the tournament didn't go on his way here.

It's very difficult to bet successfully on Murray matches. Of course he has the talent to beat almost anyone out there, but his physical side is not the same after his injury and surgery, and as you say, the longer a match goes on, the more of an effect it has. And even if he wins a long match, there's a good chance he'll lose the next one regardless of opponent, just because he can't play a lot of matches in quick succession any more. It must be really frustrating for him, he just can't return to his previous level of winning slams and even (briefly) being world number one.

You are right. He does have the capability to defeat almost everyone in there but his age and the surgery has been a drawback for him. If he's not able to finish matches faster that will make him lose most of his matches. Another thing is that he has left his golden times way behind in the past so it will be unwise to expect so much from him.

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Quote from: aoluain on November 02, 2021, 07:54:41 AM

^
Does anyone know what his immediate goals are as a player? I mean what does
he think he can achieve currently? does he expect to win at least an ATP250 title?

Maybe he would be better off on the challenger circuit if he is after tournament wins.

I would also say he is massively frustrated but there has to be a time when he has
to simply realise that its time to quit.

I feel sorry for him and he has done brilliantly to get back to where he is now but this
looks like his limit.

I don't know if he is really frustated; I think he loves the game too much to retire. He has nothing more to prove, he won multiple grandslams and became olympic champion 2 times also. If he keeps losing, there will come a moment that he starts to realise that it is best for him to retire as an active player but until then he will probably keep on playing tournament after tournament.

aoluain

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^
Does anyone know what his immediate goals are as a player? I mean what does
he think he can achieve currently? does he expect to win at least an ATP250 title?

Maybe he would be better off on the challenger circuit if he is after tournament wins.

I would also say he is massively frustrated but there has to be a time when he has
to simply realise that its time to quit.

I feel sorry for him and he has done brilliantly to get back to where he is now but this
looks like his limit.

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Quote from: Yaunfitda on November 02, 2021, 02:49:50 AM

Yeah, and as the match goes longer, the more Murray will be put to the disadvantage because of his age and his body. So I would say that the surface of the tournament didn't go on his way here.

It's very difficult to bet successfully on Murray matches. Of course he has the talent to beat almost anyone out there, but his physical side is not the same after his injury and surgery, and as you say, the longer a match goes on, the more of an effect it has. And even if he wins a long match, there's a good chance he'll lose the next one regardless of opponent, just because he can't play a lot of matches in quick succession any more. It must be really frustrating for him, he just can't return to his previous level of winning slams and even (briefly) being world number one.

Quote from: Juggy777 on November 02, 2021, 04:59:58 AM

Also wouldn’t it be better for him if he called it quits

I think so, yes.

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Quote from: Yaunfitda on November 02, 2021, 02:49:50 AM

Quote from: Joca97 on November 01, 2021, 07:41:45 PM

Quote from: aoluain on November 01, 2021, 06:12:02 PM

Quote from: Rabi3 on November 01, 2021, 05:51:20 PM

What a disappointing loss for Murray today on Paris, he had 7 match points and couldn't convert a single one of them to claim the victory, I thought he can win it easily and even the odds favored him against Koepfer with @1.25, it sucks to see such a talented player in this situation, his hip surgery really affected him, playing with metal in your hip is not the same, and being that long away from tennis courts also made it harder to comeback to the same form, it really sucks Sad

Yea I watched the last two sets, I didnt know which way to bet so I didnt on this match.
Murray was broken a few times and was playing defensively for a lot of the match. There
is also some discussion regarding the speed of the courts, they are slow which seems
to result in a lot of longer rally's.

I had 2 bets on today in Paris,
Ivashka v Ramos Vinolas
Norrie v Delbonis

and tomorrow only 1 bet so far, Felix AA to beat Mager.

The race is on for points.

Murray keeps playing tournaments trying to get back somehow but he just cant.He continues to struggle in every single match it dosent matter who he is playing and his matches are really long. I also had a bet on Ivashka to win and had a bet on Norrie to win in straight sets so happy with my wins today

Good win for you both.

Yeah, and as the match goes longer, the more Murray will be put to the disadvantage because of his age and his body. So I would say that the surface of the tournament didn't go on his way here.

Besides the FAA vs Mager, I think another match that can be a giveaway is Agut vs Duckworth. I think Bautista Agut can also win this in 2 sets and cover the totals as well.

I personally feel Murray needs some time off to work on his body, because right now he’s struggling and it’s evident he can’t win if he just continues to play.

Also wouldn’t it be better for him if he called it quits, he has nothing to prove and has a good record so he can take up coaching, and be part of the game as that’s what he said he wishes to do once he retires from the game.

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Quote from: Joca97 on November 01, 2021, 07:41:45 PM

Quote from: aoluain on November 01, 2021, 06:12:02 PM

Quote from: Rabi3 on November 01, 2021, 05:51:20 PM

What a disappointing loss for Murray today on Paris, he had 7 match points and couldn't convert a single one of them to claim the victory, I thought he can win it easily and even the odds favored him against Koepfer with @1.25, it sucks to see such a talented player in this situation, his hip surgery really affected him, playing with metal in your hip is not the same, and being that long away from tennis courts also made it harder to comeback to the same form, it really sucks Sad

Yea I watched the last two sets, I didnt know which way to bet so I didnt on this match.
Murray was broken a few times and was playing defensively for a lot of the match. There
is also some discussion regarding the speed of the courts, they are slow which seems
to result in a lot of longer rally's.

I had 2 bets on today in Paris,
Ivashka v Ramos Vinolas
Norrie v Delbonis

and tomorrow only 1 bet so far, Felix AA to beat Mager.

The race is on for points.

Murray keeps playing tournaments trying to get back somehow but he just cant.He continues to struggle in every single match it dosent matter who he is playing and his matches are really long. I also had a bet on Ivashka to win and had a bet on Norrie to win in straight sets so happy with my wins today

Good win for you both.

Yeah, and as the match goes longer, the more Murray will be put to the disadvantage because of his age and his body. So I would say that the surface of the tournament didn't go on his way here.

Besides the FAA vs Mager, I think another match that can be a giveaway is Agut vs Duckworth. I think Bautista Agut can also win this in 2 sets and cover the totals as well.

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Quote from: babygun on November 01, 2021, 09:34:52 AM

Quote from: Jating on October 31, 2021, 09:40:39 PM

No surprised that Zverev can win the Vienna Open, but I has hoping that the game will be extended to at least 3 sets to make it more exciting. Just 1 needed break for him in the first set is what he needed as Tiafoe wasn't able to come back.

And also congrats to Marin Cilic, although I didn't follow the St. Petersburg tournament, good to see winning his first hard court title in the last 5 years against Fritz.

It is good to see Cilic winning again a tournament, but as the others have said he is already past his prime. He will always be able to claim that he won 1 grand slam (US Open 2014) but that's about it. His serve and overall play is good, but also not so special compared to a lot of other players.

Yes, sometimes you feel nostalgic when you hear a former grand slam winner still grinding it hard to win another tournament after 7 years.

Haven't check the Paris Open, but as per members comment, it's going to be a difficult lost for Murray against Koepfer.

FAA vs Mager - Maybe this one is the easiest to predict, I think FAA will win and can cover the handicap.

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Quote from: aoluain on November 01, 2021, 06:12:02 PM

Quote from: Rabi3 on November 01, 2021, 05:51:20 PM

What a disappointing loss for Murray today on Paris, he had 7 match points and couldn't convert a single one of them to claim the victory, I thought he can win it easily and even the odds favored him against Koepfer with @1.25, it sucks to see such a talented player in this situation, his hip surgery really affected him, playing with metal in your hip is not the same, and being that long away from tennis courts also made it harder to comeback to the same form, it really sucks Sad

Yea I watched the last two sets, I didnt know which way to bet so I didnt on this match.
Murray was broken a few times and was playing defensively for a lot of the match. There
is also some discussion regarding the speed of the courts, they are slow which seems
to result in a lot of longer rally's.

I had 2 bets on today in Paris,
Ivashka v Ramos Vinolas
Norrie v Delbonis

and tomorrow only 1 bet so far, Felix AA to beat Mager.

The race is on for points.

Murray keeps playing tournaments trying to get back somehow but he just cant.He continues to struggle in every single match it dosent matter who he is playing and his matches are really long. I also had a bet on Ivashka to win and had a bet on Norrie to win in straight sets so happy with my wins today

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Quote from: Rabi3 on November 01, 2021, 05:51:20 PM

What a disappointing loss for Murray today on Paris, he had 7 match points and couldn't convert a single one of them to claim the victory, I thought he can win it easily and even the odds favored him against Koepfer with @1.25, it sucks to see such a talented player in this situation, his hip surgery really affected him, playing with metal in your hip is not the same, and being that long away from tennis courts also made it harder to comeback to the same form, it really sucks Sad

Yea I watched the last two sets, I didnt know which way to bet so I didnt on this match.
Murray was broken a few times and was playing defensively for a lot of the match. There
is also some discussion regarding the speed of the courts, they are slow which seems
to result in a lot of longer rally's.

I had 2 bets on today in Paris,
Ivashka v Ramos Vinolas
Norrie v Delbonis

and tomorrow only 1 bet so far, Felix AA to beat Mager.

The race is on for points.

Rabi3

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What a disappointing loss for Murray today on Paris, he had 7 match points and couldn't convert a single one of them to claim the victory, I thought he can win it easily and even the odds favored him against Koepfer with @1.25, it sucks to see such a talented player in this situation, his hip surgery really affected him, playing with metal in your hip is not the same, and being that long away from tennis courts also made it harder to comeback to the same form, it really sucks Sad

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Quote from: Rabi3 on October 31, 2021, 06:19:58 PM

Quote from: herurist on October 31, 2021, 11:13:01 AM

Quote from: Trofo on October 30, 2021, 03:40:39 PM

I see all the conversation is about Vienna tournament, understandably since it was stronger than St. Petersburg one, but I had been betting on this one much more. Mainly backing Cilic since he found his form for the first time in last couple of years and connected some nice victories in the past weeks. Wins against Khachanov and Agut were enough for me to force him until the tournament end. Backed him today and will do so again tomorrow in the final and then in Paris masters when it starts.

Cilic is a pretty good player in my opinion especially in his strong serve. I can even say that Cilic's points contributed through his serve can be more than 60% in one game.
but Cilic sometimes loses concentration in the middle of the game which makes him sometimes make unnecessary mistakes.
with the speed and strength of his serv, I think Cili will continue to grow even though he is at his age, he can be considered a veteran in the tennis world.

Nah I don't think he can grow to be honest, first of all serve alone is not enough as we can see players with massive serves are low in the leader board, also Cilic for me is done, and by done I mean he can't compete with big players, I think St Petersburg title is as big as he can win now, I Don expect to see anything crazy from him, very few players can do that at that age and i think he is not one of them.

as you said, because even though the small service is very good, there are some things that can't be done by just serving, and besides that the age factor also has an effect.
Little boy is not young anymore and it is certain that this will affect his performance because his physique is definitely not as good as when he was muf.
but on the other hand I still believe that he can still do something in St. Petersburg.

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Quote from: Jating on October 31, 2021, 09:40:39 PM

No surprised that Zverev can win the Vienna Open, but I has hoping that the game will be extended to at least 3 sets to make it more exciting. Just 1 needed break for him in the first set is what he needed as Tiafoe wasn't able to come back.

And also congrats to Marin Cilic, although I didn't follow the St. Petersburg tournament, good to see winning his first hard court title in the last 5 years against Fritz.

It is good to see Cilic winning again a tournament, but as the others have said he is already past his prime. He will always be able to claim that he won 1 grand slam (US Open 2014) but that's about it. His serve and overall play is good, but also not so special compared to a lot of other players.

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Quote from: Trofo on November 01, 2021, 01:00:59 AM

Quote from: mv1986 on October 31, 2021, 06:29:07 PM

Quote from: Rabi3 on October 31, 2021, 06:19:58 PM

Quote from: herurist on October 31, 2021, 11:13:01 AM

Quote from: Trofo on October 30, 2021, 03:40:39 PM

I see all the conversation is about Vienna tournament, understandably since it was stronger than St. Petersburg one, but I had been betting on this one much more. Mainly backing Cilic since he found his form for the first time in last couple of years and connected some nice victories in the past weeks. Wins against Khachanov and Agut were enough for me to force him until the tournament end. Backed him today and will do so again tomorrow in the final and then in Paris masters when it starts.

Cilic is a pretty good player in my opinion especially in his strong serve. I can even say that Cilic's points contributed through his serve can be more than 60% in one game.
but Cilic sometimes loses concentration in the middle of the game which makes him sometimes make unnecessary mistakes.
with the speed and strength of his serv, I think Cili will continue to grow even though he is at his age, he can be considered a veteran in the tennis world.

Nah I don't think he can grow to be honest, first of all serve alone is not enough as we can see players with massive serves are low in the leader board, also Cilic for me is done, and by done I mean he can't compete with big players, I think St Petersburg title is as big as he can win now, I Don expect to see anything crazy from him, very few players can do that at that age and i think he is not one of them.

I also severely doubt that Cilic will grow anywhere from here. The guy is 33 years old, his whole game is pretty much based on strong serves and if he faces a player with good tools to defend those serves, it is almost an automatic loss for Cilic. Players like the top 3 GOATs almost always found ways to defend his serves.

He is my fellow country man so I am following his career closely. No room to grow there, he finished his growth long ago. That being said he is much more than big serve. He has great ground strokes as well. His problem is in his head, now when he found his form he will be dangerous.

Without checking stats I am quite sure he has solid H2H with most top players, except Djokovic. He was never able to play against him.

Cilic has already passed the peak of his career, and that is a fact.
When he was completely psychologically ready and focused on tennis, he achieved great success, such as winning the GS, and 2 more GS finals, and winning the Davis Cup.
Unfortunately, those days of his great tennis glory are long gone and Čilić has been struggling in tennis tournaments for years and rarely wins.
This year’s Olympics seem to have helped him a lot to regain his confidence and raise the level of his game.
He is playing with confidence again and will probably win a few more tennis tournaments, but the end of his tennis career is near.

aoluain

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^
Yes he looks like "the finished article" but I doubt any player would say they are
finished growing, I expect they are constantly growing their game, making tweaks,
improving shots and improving mental ability and positivity.

They have to in order to try and stay ahead of opponents, in the case of Cilic he could
have an eye towards retirement but this win could spur him on to continue and
potentially "grow" his game.

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Quote from: mv1986 on October 31, 2021, 06:29:07 PM

Quote from: Rabi3 on October 31, 2021, 06:19:58 PM

Quote from: herurist on October 31, 2021, 11:13:01 AM

Quote from: Trofo on October 30, 2021, 03:40:39 PM

I see all the conversation is about Vienna tournament, understandably since it was stronger than St. Petersburg one, but I had been betting on this one much more. Mainly backing Cilic since he found his form for the first time in last couple of years and connected some nice victories in the past weeks. Wins against Khachanov and Agut were enough for me to force him until the tournament end. Backed him today and will do so again tomorrow in the final and then in Paris masters when it starts.

Cilic is a pretty good player in my opinion especially in his strong serve. I can even say that Cilic's points contributed through his serve can be more than 60% in one game.
but Cilic sometimes loses concentration in the middle of the game which makes him sometimes make unnecessary mistakes.
with the speed and strength of his serv, I think Cili will continue to grow even though he is at his age, he can be considered a veteran in the tennis world.

Nah I don't think he can grow to be honest, first of all serve alone is not enough as we can see players with massive serves are low in the leader board, also Cilic for me is done, and by done I mean he can't compete with big players, I think St Petersburg title is as big as he can win now, I Don expect to see anything crazy from him, very few players can do that at that age and i think he is not one of them.

I also severely doubt that Cilic will grow anywhere from here. The guy is 33 years old, his whole game is pretty much based on strong serves and if he faces a player with good tools to defend those serves, it is almost an automatic loss for Cilic. Players like the top 3 GOATs almost always found ways to defend his serves.

He is my fellow country man so I am following his career closely. No room to grow there, he finished his growth long ago. That being said he is much more than big serve. He has great ground strokes as well. His problem is in his head, now when he found his form he will be dangerous.

Without checking stats I am quite sure he has solid H2H with most top players, except Djokovic. He was never able to play against him.

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Quote from: Jating on October 31, 2021, 09:40:39 PM

No surprised that Zverev can win the Vienna Open, but I has hoping that the game will be extended to at least 3 sets to make it more exciting. Just 1 needed break for him in the first set is what he needed as Tiafoe wasn't able to come back.

Unfortunately, what he did in the previous few matches didn't happen, lost the first set and able to turn things around win two sets, beating Tsitsipas and Sinner, but I think it was more to Zverev who played well, and not giving Tiafoe to comeback.

Today the ATP Paris Master 1000 starts there will be many matches to choose to bet on.

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No surprised that Zverev can win the Vienna Open, but I has hoping that the game will be extended to at least 3 sets to make it more exciting. Just 1 needed break for him in the first set is what he needed as Tiafoe wasn't able to come back.

And also congrats to Marin Cilic, although I didn't follow the St. Petersburg tournament, good to see winning his first hard court title in the last 5 years against Fritz.

Topic: Tennis League All Thread - page 352. (Read 203687 times)