Test Cricket Prediction and Discussion Thread [self - mod] - page 1037.

eaLiTy

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Quote from: mersal on February 13, 2020, 12:50:52 PM

AFAIK,every born child should be registered withing the time frame from being born is mandatory to get birth certificate but here we have more corrupted government officials so we can pay some money as bribe and can register at any time when we want.Note: we can also take birth certificate for a person who doesn't even born in India. Cheesy

I am not deputing your claims as corruption is prevalent in India but from my experience dealing with people all around India what i found is that majority of the people from North of India does not go to hospitals when they are pregnant instead they deliver the child at home with the help of local nurse who does not have a degree from a medical school but who have the skills passed on through generation and hence they do not have a clear idea about the exact date of birth but having a different year of birth is fraudulent but it is happening because the authorities is also not having any idea about their real birth and they will accept what the parents claim.

Even i was shocked to hear this in the beginning but it is what it is and that is the fact.

mersal

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 13, 2020, 12:34:10 PM

Quote from: ene1980 on February 13, 2020, 11:38:12 AM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 13, 2020, 09:48:38 AM

Being an Indian citizen, I have to say that it is very easy to forge the date of birth column in the high school mark sheet. At the time of joining, the parents usually lower the age of their child by 6 months or an year and this new date of birth is then continued with every document such as Aadhar Card, Voter ID.etc. Most of the time, it goes on without any suspicion. However, in some cases, as a result of the physical appearance of the individual he gets caught and if he is unlucky, then he'll be sent for the bone-density test.

It is really strange as there is no mandatory to register when the child is born and that is usually done through hospital and on seeing these situation it is really strange someone to reduce their age as it is not fair for the other kids who are competing against them and these sort of malpractices should be given strict punishment so that someone's opportunity is robbed by these actions. What is the accuracy level when you test bone density to determine age Undecided

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As per the law, mandatory birth registration is there. But even now, the coverage is low in the rural areas. And you can imagine the situation we had 15 or 20 years back, when the data was not stored digitally. A lot many times, the compiled data would be lost (either due to natural disasters such as flood, or due to accidents such as fire). And the penalty given to the offenders is not very serious and it actually encourages such crime. For example, Delhi player Prince Ram Niwas Yadav was found to have faked his age in a domestic U-19 tournament two months back. He was only given a two-year suspension (BCCI could have banned him for life). In his case, he was 24 year old but claimed that he was 19 so that he could participate in the U19 tournament.

AFAIK,every born child should be registered withing the time frame from being born is mandatory to get birth certificate but here we have more corrupted government officials so we can pay some money as bribe and can register at any time when we want.Note: we can also take birth certificate for a person who doesn't even born in India. Cheesy

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: ene1980 on February 13, 2020, 11:38:12 AM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 13, 2020, 09:48:38 AM

Being an Indian citizen, I have to say that it is very easy to forge the date of birth column in the high school mark sheet. At the time of joining, the parents usually lower the age of their child by 6 months or an year and this new date of birth is then continued with every document such as Aadhar Card, Voter ID.etc. Most of the time, it goes on without any suspicion. However, in some cases, as a result of the physical appearance of the individual he gets caught and if he is unlucky, then he'll be sent for the bone-density test.

It is really strange as there is no mandatory to register when the child is born and that is usually done through hospital and on seeing these situation it is really strange someone to reduce their age as it is not fair for the other kids who are competing against them and these sort of malpractices should be given strict punishment so that someone's opportunity is robbed by these actions. What is the accuracy level when you test bone density to determine age Undecided

.

As per the law, mandatory birth registration is there. But even now, the coverage is low in the rural areas. And you can imagine the situation we had 15 or 20 years back, when the data was not stored digitally. A lot many times, the compiled data would be lost (either due to natural disasters such as flood, or due to accidents such as fire). And the penalty given to the offenders is not very serious and it actually encourages such crime. For example, Delhi player Prince Ram Niwas Yadav was found to have faked his age in a domestic U-19 tournament two months back. He was only given a two-year suspension (BCCI could have banned him for life). In his case, he was 24 year old but claimed that he was 19 so that he could participate in the U19 tournament.

ene1980

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 13, 2020, 09:48:38 AM

Being an Indian citizen, I have to say that it is very easy to forge the date of birth column in the high school mark sheet. At the time of joining, the parents usually lower the age of their child by 6 months or an year and this new date of birth is then continued with every document such as Aadhar Card, Voter ID.etc. Most of the time, it goes on without any suspicion. However, in some cases, as a result of the physical appearance of the individual he gets caught and if he is unlucky, then he'll be sent for the bone-density test.

It is really strange as there is no mandatory to register when the child is born and that is usually done through hospital and on seeing these situation it is really strange someone to reduce their age as it is not fair for the other kids who are competing against them and these sort of malpractices should be given strict punishment so that someone's opportunity is robbed by these actions. What is the accuracy level when you test bone density to determine age Undecided

.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: JSRAW on February 13, 2020, 06:12:21 AM

Yeah serious issue for u-15 and u-19 category that's why boards especially Asian boards taking this seriously. BCCI doing their thingy such as vetting younger players in Domestic cricket, It has fair amount of challenge but as far as i know x-ray (Bone-density test) comes when every other options fails such as Birth certificates, High school marksheet etc. Not full proof plan though but at-least they are serious and trying to crack down the age fraud.

Being an Indian citizen, I have to say that it is very easy to forge the date of birth column in the high school mark sheet. At the time of joining, the parents usually lower the age of their child by 6 months or an year and this new date of birth is then continued with every document such as Aadhar Card, Voter ID.etc. Most of the time, it goes on without any suspicion. However, in some cases, as a result of the physical appearance of the individual he gets caught and if he is unlucky, then he'll be sent for the bone-density test.

JSRAW

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Quote from: RamBahadur.Gurung on February 13, 2020, 05:48:05 AM

Quote from: JSRAW on February 13, 2020, 05:14:55 AM

Age-fudging is common problem in any sport and cricket is no exception but i doubt if any board support this idea. in fact in recent time boards are taking necessary precaution. Recently BCCI banned few players (Manjot Kalra,Rasikh Salam) because of this and investigating many cases in domestic cricket. Players now can play only 1 u-19 WC, initiative taken by Rahul Dravid. He and Gangully doing their job as far as BCCI is concern.

This can be a serious issue in age group tournaments (especially those for U-15 and U-19 groups). Players who fudge their age do have an unfair advantage. It is like allowing men to take part in tournaments which are meant only for women. But there is no ready made solution for this. It is not practical to conduct x-ray examination for all the players.

Yeah serious issue for u-15 and u-19 category that's why boards especially Asian boards taking this seriously. BCCI doing their thingy such as vetting younger players in Domestic cricket, It has fair amount of challenge but as far as i know x-ray (Bone-density test) comes when every other options fails such as Birth certificates, High school marksheet etc. Not full proof plan though but at-least they are serious and trying to crack down the age fraud.

Quote from: erikalui on February 13, 2020, 06:05:24 AM

especially since many players come from villages where they just know their birth month and may be year so for them, it's easy to get fake documents as there is no proof. Even in my college I had one student whose birth month and year were forged but nobody ever bothered to take a look at it.

Yeah, Shivam Mavi was similiar case i suppose but they caught him eventually, Not Guilty as of now but investigation are in progress.

erikalui

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Looks like you all are discussing forging documents but sadly it is not just forging but many don't have their birth even recorded, especially since many players come from villages where they just know their birth month and may be year so for them, it's easy to get fake documents as there is no proof. Even in my college I had one student whose birth month and year were forged but nobody ever bothered to take a look at it.

Tomorrow's test match have the same openers probably. Don't know whether to watch or not to watch as this would hamper India's rank in the WC tournament. Sharma may be back in one of the matches so we have a good bowler atleast. More than the batsmen, we need the best bowlers.

RamBahadur.Gurung

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Quote from: JSRAW on February 13, 2020, 05:14:55 AM

Age-fudging is common problem in any sport and cricket is no exception but i doubt if any board support this idea. in fact in recent time boards are taking necessary precaution. Recently BCCI banned few players (Manjot Kalra,Rasikh Salam) because of this and investigating many cases in domestic cricket. Players now can play only 1 u-19 WC, initiative taken by Rahul Dravid. He and Gangully doing their job as far as BCCI is concern.

This can be a serious issue in age group tournaments (especially those for U-15 and U-19 groups). Players who fudge their age do have an unfair advantage. It is like allowing men to take part in tournaments which are meant only for women. But there is no ready made solution for this. It is not practical to conduct x-ray examination for all the players.

JSRAW

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Quote from: ene1980 on February 12, 2020, 04:05:29 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 11, 2020, 10:29:05 PM

It is easier to forge the age certificates in Asian nations, since data is not stored in servers (mostly it is in hard copy format). On the other hand, in the Western nations all the details are stored digitally and it is almost impossible to forge the DOB or other details of an individual.

So are you telling that it is sponsored by the respective cricket boards, if not it is impossible to forget these documents even if it is not stored in servers and if you are able to do these kind of manipulations then you can even edit the digital entries, it is a serious accusation and i am not sure about the authenticity of these accusations as i have not seen any major newspaper picking this news and if they are caught then it will have a serious implication in the future.

Age-fudging is common problem in any sport and cricket is no exception but i doubt if any board support this idea. in fact in recent time boards are taking necessary precaution. Recently BCCI banned few players (Manjot Kalra,Rasikh Salam) because of this and investigating many cases in domestic cricket. Players now can play only 1 u-19 WC, initiative taken by Rahul Dravid. He and Gangully doing their job as far as BCCI is concern.

BitSat19

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Quote from: ene1980 on February 12, 2020, 04:05:29 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 11, 2020, 10:29:05 PM

It is easier to forge the age certificates in Asian nations, since data is not stored in servers (mostly it is in hard copy format). On the other hand, in the Western nations all the details are stored digitally and it is almost impossible to forge the DOB or other details of an individual.

So are you telling that it is sponsored by the respective cricket boards, if not it is impossible to forget these documents even if it is not stored in servers and if you are able to do these kind of manipulations then you can even edit the digital entries, it is a serious accusation and i am not sure about the authenticity of these accusations as i have not seen any major newspaper picking this news and if they are caught then it will have a serious implication in the future.

Even in Sub-Continent big cities have facility of computer based certificates which are good but most of rural areas still have this advantage of doing tricks which will end soon but this was really works for many in past because they give wrong certificates and I am sure boards members also involved in this all as they take gift boxes for this which is now going to end in near future.

ene1980

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 11, 2020, 10:29:05 PM

It is easier to forge the age certificates in Asian nations, since data is not stored in servers (mostly it is in hard copy format). On the other hand, in the Western nations all the details are stored digitally and it is almost impossible to forge the DOB or other details of an individual.

So are you telling that it is sponsored by the respective cricket boards, if not it is impossible to forget these documents even if it is not stored in servers and if you are able to do these kind of manipulations then you can even edit the digital entries, it is a serious accusation and i am not sure about the authenticity of these accusations as i have not seen any major newspaper picking this news and if they are caught then it will have a serious implication in the future.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: JSRAW on February 11, 2020, 01:05:08 PM

For some weird reason i see this as a age-scam whenever any young fella from Sub-continent pops in the international team. In sub-continent hiding age is big scam. few examples comes into my mind such as Sehwag ( he accepted this on record) and Shahid Afridi ( Prime example)

I have to agree on this part. Even during the recently concluded U19 World Cup, many of the players looked as if they were comfortably above 19 years (sadly most of them playing for the four Asian teams). It is easier to forge the age certificates in Asian nations, since data is not stored in servers (mostly it is in hard copy format). On the other hand, in the Western nations all the details are stored digitally and it is almost impossible to forge the DOB or other details of an individual.

Indymoney

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on February 11, 2020, 05:30:54 PM

Quote from: BitSat19 on February 11, 2020, 03:33:01 PM

~snip
These two accepted but we have some many others also in this community those hide age because in sub-continent its very common thing as just few days back I was in my kids school principal is my friend and he was celebrating his 55th birthday and twin sister was just 45 years old so you can imagine whats going here Naseem is good youngster but I feel he is above but now its no matter because he is already in record books.

I was not aware of this strange situation where people will be able to lie about their age. I have read about Afridi in his biography that he claimed that he was not that young when he scored the fastest century and i thought it was just a publicity stunt to sell more books but i like the ten year difference between twins Cheesy

. I am not sure how that is even possible to lie about a ten year gap as these are well above my comprehension Grin

.

Here in our society its nothing serious business because I am working in a company where we need to add personal stuff for many things once I have very interesting problem as daughter give me data she is 30 years old and second day mother was saying she is just 42 so I was very confuse as she was not giving any identity or proof but I have to manage because this was nothing serious just formalty so as @JSRAW already pointed we have thousands cases like this.

7788bitcoin

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Quote from: BitSat19 on February 11, 2020, 03:33:01 PM

~snip
These two accepted but we have some many others also in this community those hide age because in sub-continent its very common thing as just few days back I was in my kids school principal is my friend and he was celebrating his 55th birthday and twin sister was just 45 years old so you can imagine whats going here Naseem is good youngster but I feel he is above but now its no matter because he is already in record books.

I was not aware of this strange situation where people will be able to lie about their age. I have read about Afridi in his biography that he claimed that he was not that young when he scored the fastest century and i thought it was just a publicity stunt to sell more books but i like the ten year difference between twins Cheesy

. I am not sure how that is even possible to lie about a ten year gap as these are well above my comprehension Grin

.

BitSat19

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Quote from: JSRAW on February 11, 2020, 01:05:08 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 11, 2020, 08:58:34 AM

Quote from: ene1980 on February 10, 2020, 01:41:05 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 10, 2020, 09:31:29 AM

Both Naseem Shah and Yasir Shah bowled well. But these guys need to be consistent while facing tougher opposition. I still remember what happened to Naseem, when he played his first test match (against Australia at Brisbane). He couldn't handle the pressure then. Anyway, it is encouraging to see some young players in the starting XI for Pakistan after a long time.

If they are able to develop young talents when the sernior players are still in the team, then they will be able to groom them and become a better player than they started and all the teams should follow that pattern to have a good team even after their past super stars retire, the problem with Pakistan is that they usually replace the senior players at once if they fail a series and push the young players and that will not help them develop.

Personally I am against the idea of allowing 16-year olds to play in the national team. But Pakistan has done it very frequently. Hasan Raza was just 14-years old, when he played his first match for Pakistan. Some of the other teams don't allow this. For example, the last time Australia had a teenager in theri national side was in 2011, when Pat Cummins made his debut.

For some weird reason i see this as a age-scam whenever any young fella from Sub-continent pops in the international team. In sub-continent hiding age is big scam. few examples comes into my mind such as Sehwag ( he accepted this on record) and Shahid Afridi ( Prime example)

These two accepted but we have some many others also in this community those hide age because in sub-continent its very common thing as just few days back I was in my kids school principal is my friend and he was celebrating his 55th birthday and twin sister was just 45 years old so you can imagine whats going here Naseem is good youngster but I feel he is above but now its no matter because he is already in record books.

JSRAW

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 11, 2020, 08:58:34 AM

Quote from: ene1980 on February 10, 2020, 01:41:05 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 10, 2020, 09:31:29 AM

Both Naseem Shah and Yasir Shah bowled well. But these guys need to be consistent while facing tougher opposition. I still remember what happened to Naseem, when he played his first test match (against Australia at Brisbane). He couldn't handle the pressure then. Anyway, it is encouraging to see some young players in the starting XI for Pakistan after a long time.

If they are able to develop young talents when the sernior players are still in the team, then they will be able to groom them and become a better player than they started and all the teams should follow that pattern to have a good team even after their past super stars retire, the problem with Pakistan is that they usually replace the senior players at once if they fail a series and push the young players and that will not help them develop.

Personally I am against the idea of allowing 16-year olds to play in the national team. But Pakistan has done it very frequently. Hasan Raza was just 14-years old, when he played his first match for Pakistan. Some of the other teams don't allow this. For example, the last time Australia had a teenager in theri national side was in 2011, when Pat Cummins made his debut.

For some weird reason i see this as a age-scam whenever any young fella from Sub-continent pops in the international team. In sub-continent hiding age is big scam. few examples comes into my mind such as Sehwag ( he accepted this on record) and Shahid Afridi ( Prime example)

7788bitcoin

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 11, 2020, 08:58:34 AM

Personally I am against the idea of allowing 16-year olds to play in the national team. But Pakistan has done it very frequently. Hasan Raza was just 14-years old, when he played his first match for Pakistan. Some of the other teams don't allow this. For example, the last time Australia had a teenager in theri national side was in 2011, when Pat Cummins made his debut.

It depends upon the skill level of the player, Sachin, Afridi all came during their younger days in the team and it is a rare occurrence and they were in the team because of their immense talent and they fulfilled their career. There is a lot more competition now and rather than pushing an younger player they need to help them developer and mature themselves.

UmerIdrees

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Quote from: ene1980 on February 10, 2020, 01:41:05 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 10, 2020, 09:31:29 AM

Both Naseem Shah and Yasir Shah bowled well. But these guys need to be consistent while facing tougher opposition. I still remember what happened to Naseem, when he played his first test match (against Australia at Brisbane). He couldn't handle the pressure then. Anyway, it is encouraging to see some young players in the starting XI for Pakistan after a long time.

If they are able to develop young talents when the sernior players are still in the team, then they will be able to groom them and become a better player than they started and all the teams should follow that pattern to have a good team even after their past super stars retire, the problem with Pakistan is that they usually replace the senior players at once if they fail a series and push the young players and that will not help them develop.

Things have changed a lot these days in cricket. You will not find many seniors players teaching or coaching to Jr. Players as then these Jr Players become threat for the Seniors ones. Due to a lot of competition among the players, no one will want that others players take the place of one self. Players thinks of their career more than what is more beneficial for their country or team.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: ene1980 on February 10, 2020, 01:41:05 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 10, 2020, 09:31:29 AM

Both Naseem Shah and Yasir Shah bowled well. But these guys need to be consistent while facing tougher opposition. I still remember what happened to Naseem, when he played his first test match (against Australia at Brisbane). He couldn't handle the pressure then. Anyway, it is encouraging to see some young players in the starting XI for Pakistan after a long time.

If they are able to develop young talents when the sernior players are still in the team, then they will be able to groom them and become a better player than they started and all the teams should follow that pattern to have a good team even after their past super stars retire, the problem with Pakistan is that they usually replace the senior players at once if they fail a series and push the young players and that will not help them develop.

Personally I am against the idea of allowing 16-year olds to play in the national team. But Pakistan has done it very frequently. Hasan Raza was just 14-years old, when he played his first match for Pakistan. Some of the other teams don't allow this. For example, the last time Australia had a teenager in theri national side was in 2011, when Pat Cummins made his debut.

BitSat19

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Quote from: ene1980 on February 10, 2020, 01:41:05 PM

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on February 10, 2020, 09:31:29 AM

Both Naseem Shah and Yasir Shah bowled well. But these guys need to be consistent while facing tougher opposition. I still remember what happened to Naseem, when he played his first test match (against Australia at Brisbane). He couldn't handle the pressure then. Anyway, it is encouraging to see some young players in the starting XI for Pakistan after a long time.

If they are able to develop young talents when the sernior players are still in the team, then they will be able to groom them and become a better player than they started and all the teams should follow that pattern to have a good team even after their past super stars retire, the problem with Pakistan is that they usually replace the senior players at once if they fail a series and push the young players and that will not help them develop.

Pakistan's biggest issue is not development of youngsters we have history of many exciting new and talented youngsters they came give very few performance and then suddenly disappear because here biggest issue is personal like and dislike we have no 100% Merit system which give young's confidence which is very important in cricket we have very poor system and sick mind peoples in management which are not able to handle things as they need to be for good quality and performance.

Topic: Test Cricket Prediction and Discussion Thread [self - mod] - page 1037. (Read 167748 times)