Topic: The situation with Ukraine and the accounts that supported the war. - page 4. (Read 2671 times)

The Pharmacist, I just don't think it's fair to boil this down to a disagreement/free speech/politics issue when OP;

1) Demands I remove users from my campaigns
2) Calls me a fascist, genocide supporter and other disgusting things
3) Tries to get me fired from running a campaign

I feel it is disingenuous to characterize it as something like that. But ofcourse, you are entitled to your opinion and interpretations.

Long story short, I tried to listen to OP's case and asked him for any proof and any corroboration but he just resorted to insults and disgusting accusations.

I'm here for the same reason I've always been, and I'm sorry you felt that offended by my post to say that.  That actually hurts coming from you.

All of that is understood, and I am still saying that tagging someone because of something they said, whether they're trolling you to death or have different political opinions, isn't using the trust system correctly.  I'm not going to counter anything, and I meant no insult or disrespect to you--I would have said the same thing to any other member, and I'm not even making a big thing out of this, just stating my opinion.

Somehow I knew I probably should have just kept silent in a thread like this, where emotions are running high.  Peace, Hhampuz.  I'm bowing out of this one as gracefully as I can.

My brother, The Pharmacist. I don't know if you just hang around on bitcointalk these days for the paycheck but I remember a time where I enjoyed reading your posts and what you had to say but these days.. I don't know what's up.

This user messaged me and DEMANDED that I removed members from my campaign because they were "nazi sympathizers" "Putin puppets" and "war apologists/genocide apologists". As I invested myself quite heavily in the Ukrainian situation, not the least by having plenty members in my campaigns who are in/from Ukraine it hit closer to home than other, more foreign, tragedies so obviously I took this seriously and I asked him if he could show me some proof about this and if he could get any other members to corroborate his story about this user as I'd gladly remove anyone from my campaign if they were to engage in such activities.

This user refused to do either and went on to follow me around the forum now calling me a putin puppet, war supporter, nazi sympathizer etc.  He refused to be helpful and did not seem to care particularly much about the entire situation other than trying to cause issues here on bitcointalk. If anything I would have imagined that he was actually on the side he so thoroughly tried to defame.

I gave this user an appropriate tag of being a troll that I would not trust, which I'll gladly stand by, and then I put him on ignore. Have you even read this thread, the demands this user has been making, the posts he's been making?

Speaking of thinking someone would have known better.. I remember when you knew better and actually looked into the context of situations before passing judgement but like I said before, I don't know what's up with you these days. That's all, feel free to counter the neg - it is a democratic system!

And just a sidenote, I even got a message from the campaign in particular where the member he demans I remove message me, saying that they had someone send multiple emails to them saying that I, their campaign manager, is a fascist and putin supporter who should not be running their campaign here on bitcointalk if they want to have a fair reputation. My negative trust is more than justified.

I just noticed this thread for some reason, though it's a couple months old.  I took a look at OP's feedback, and I have to say I agree with you there.  Negative/positive trust shouldn't be used for disagreements about politics, and I'd say not even a neutral is appropriate.  Hhampuz left a neg for OP, and I find that disheartening as I have a lot of respect for him.  Still do, but I would have thought he would have known better than to give OP a neg because of politics.

All of those things would be the consequence of free speech, whether you agree with them or not.  Free speech (in the purist sense of the term) means the freedom to tell lies.  It doesn't guarantee those lies will be free from consequences, because the propaganda you mentioned would--and should--be met with opposition, which also depends on a lack of censorship.

I know this is a sensitive topic in the context of the Russia/Ukraine situation, but remember that it's the speech you don't like or want to hear that needs to be protected.  If that wasn't the case, who would be the gatekeeper of "truth" and would you trust that person or entity?

How old are you, my friends? What countries do you live in? Are you so illiterate that you do not understand the difference between freedom of speech and propaganda? In that case, before you talk about freedom of speech, first learn to define the difference between "freedom of speech" and "propaganda.

What if I told you that the people of your countries are not human and they can and should be exterminated? What if I told you that your countries are havens of fascism and should be wiped off the face of the earth? And I will spread all of these sayings around the world, including on this forum, supporting my words with lies, fakes, etc. How's that for "freedom of speech"?

No, my friends, this is not freedom of speech. It is the real propaganda, which is spread on our forum in the person of some users (especially in the Russian-speaking part of the forum). The whole civilized world fights against propaganda and Russian propaganda including. So why shouldn't our forum, which is under the jurisdiction of a country that is actively engaged in this fight, join its country and the whole world to help fight popaganda?

P.S. Here is a link to the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights for you to study (read carefully articles 19 and 20 of PART III).

I also recommend reading the articles on the official U.S. government website

GEC Special Report: Russia’s Pillars of Disinformation and Propaganda
Disarming Disinformation: Our Shared Responsibility

because you didn't properly deliver it. also, why it is so important for you that the forum take a side in this war? why can't it just be a neutral forum where all people from both sides can express their support from both sides or their disdain from both sides? if there is misinformation being spread around in the forum, then counter it with facts.

It is sad that many people in this forum, and throughout the world, have lost the ability to think, to think logically.
It was sarcasm about Teimos, but no one understood this, you can complain to him, let him ban me, I don’t give a fuck!
The number of pro-Russian users is growing like a snowball.
Imagine the situation if you can - your house was robbed and you were attacked and maimed, you filed a complaint with the police, but the police, instead of punishing those responsible for the attack, punish you, because you demand punishment for the guilty attacker.
Funny dialectic, isn't it?
Crime without punishment breeds more crime.
It is a fact.

I find it ironic that when it comes to freedom of speech you are very much alike the person you hate the most (I guess), as both you and Putin don't like freedom of speech and simply can't handle it. And if you don't like it here, there are plenty of other platforms where only one narrative is allowed. Freedom simply ain't for everyone.

LOL, Buddy!, i cant believe am asking this but just to be sure, Are you being serious right now?.
I know that every user on this forum is as free as a bird to say all sort of shit but i believe that does not include accusing a reputable leader of this honorable forum wrongly, even without a source or reference, how did you know that the forum administrators are pro-Russian? where did you find the information that theymos is a big fan of putin?

Incase this your accusation against the forum administrators and theymos are a joke, i must let you know that in as much as the forum allows freedom of speech 100%, there are things one shouldn't joke with, i know you cant be harmed but your account can be greatly harmed if you go about accusing the forum administrators without evidence or prove.

Did I say you were a fascist? I'm just saying don't accuse a person without grounds. I meant don't spread fakes and thus become like the ruᛋᛋian propagandists who post fakes and spread brazen lies about Ukraine on the forum. I completely agree with you that ruᛋᛋian propaganda is taking over the forum. But spreading fakes about theymos is not going to get you anywhere. You can only make it worse, because you will turn against yourself (and others like you) all the sensible members of the forum community who more or less support Ukraine.

In the beginning, there were several war-supporting accounts that spread deliberately false information, all this Kremlin dirt and narratives about fascism in Ukraine.
I sent complaints about such messages, the messages were not deleted, after almost 4 months there are already about 20 accounts spreading such information. And they have nothing for it.
And more than that, these accounts are useless, except for lies, they do not write about anything.
But some call it democracy
But this is not democracy at all, it is fascism in its purest form.
And it turns out I'm a fascist that I demand to ban such accounts?

What the hell are you talking about? What the hell information do you have? Provide proof. I fully support Ukraine, but the kind of bullshit you're talking about I don't intend to support. Don't go overboard. Don't spread bullshit, don't be like the rashists.

P.S. I know for a fact that theymos is against the war and against putler.

I'm not sure what you two are being resentful at but moderators and admins do not censor Ukraine War posts or users.

This information is very scary because I want to be in a democratic forum that is guided by democratic principles where I would not be forced to behave contrary to my conscience and ideology. Authoritarianism would kill the forum because it would not give members the avenue to contribute positively to the forum. I assume you are referring to Theymos the Chief Administartor as a diehard supporter of Putin. But I am committed to remain in this forum because you have not provided any proof to authenticate you allegations. I am sure this forum has experienced and intelligent administrators that understands that political neutrality is foundational to effectively and efficiently organize and control an international organization like this forum.      

The forum and its administration are very pro-russian.
There is information that teimos is a big fan of putin and soon wants to introduce an authorization system on the forum, for this you will need to siegheill in front of the webcam and shout out loud three times - glory to the putler!
But Interpol will get to this infernal office, everyone will be punished for terrorism!
Update of the first post, the fascist regiment has arrived.

Your point of view is also valid.
But in this case, people write lies, a stream of nonsense, propaganda, and they are given merit for this.

Ah, okay. I understand what you were saying now.

When I give someone merit, I am not necessarily agreeing with the post. I am saying that it may be beneficial for others to read the post. Often times the two go hand in hand, but this is not always the case. Although there are few regulations as to the merit system, I understand the above is the intended use for merits.

This means if I were to merit a "pro-Russia" post, I am saying that others should read the post. This could mean that the post says something important about the author, it could mean that the author put a lot of effort into the post, it could mean the post is insightful, or it could mean that for some other reason, I believe that others should read the post.

Merit - in the upper right corner above the message.
People give merit to the one who wrote the message and they want to support and approve what is written.

I am not sure what you mean by "merites". It appears that word may be French, and the translation into English does not make sense in the context of what I wrote.

Nobody didn't asked to remove them because probably they don't care about it.
As you already said, nobody aren't going to ban them. Probably use of trust system is more apropriate here. I see that you sent negative trust ratings to some people, but I suggest you to add refernce links to it with proofs that your feedback would look more seriously.
About last part of your post, @Pmalek already explained it.