Topic: Trust abuse and some "strange" theories. - page 2. (Read 932 times)

I don't know a whole lot about the background of either user here or their activities, but upon summary review of left trust ratings, it seems to me both parties are being frivolous and or abusive of the trust system. Without condemning KTChampions here, not knowing much about their activities, it seems they are using the trust system to leave ratings related to forum rules, which really should be reported and handled by staff and not be dealt with using the trust system.

johhnyUA, while I agree with his general consensus that there are cliques of users controlling the trust system here and purposefully keeping certain individuals and groups out, his use of the trust system here is not what it is intended for and is largely counterproductive to his stated goals. At the end of the day you are just abusing the trust system in the polar opposite way.

All of this said, you are each technically free to leave these ratings for whatever reason you decide, but the uses I see here are antithetical to the purpose of the trust system and the cohesion of this community in general. The trust system is supposed to be a way to help warn users of and prevent theft and fraud. These uses are counterproductive to those goals on both sides.

I would advise johhnyUA to remove these ratings and make his grievances via public discussion. While I disagree with KTChampion's use of the trust system, I find the types who take it upon themselves to be forum police most often are unwilling to change their behavior. The only effective method of combating this is public discussion of the damages it causes, not by using the trust system to fight out these battles.

Have most of you guys forgot the lessening of the guidelines post the introduction of the flag system? Yes, you can now leave negatives for many more things (and no, it isn't abuse/misuse like it was before - to a lesser extent now). It is the flag system that's for scams nowadays, and the trust system for more "opinionated-things".

Completely agreed.

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These walls of text aren't helping.

I have no idea in hell what you're talking about here, but it looks like just another anti-DT rant on your part, so I'll let it waft through each eye and out my nose as usual.

OP, based on what JohhnyUA wrote in your feedback it doesn't really appear to be justified.  It looks like he just doesn't agree with your assessments on a few matters, which sort of comes down to a matter of opinion--and leaving somebody a neg based on that isn't what Theymos wants the trust system used for.  I don't know if anyone was falsely accused, because I haven't looked into the matter and haven't even read the entire OP here but you ought to be free to express your opinions and that includes calling out scams as you see them.  If something isn't actually a scam, the accused should make their case and let the community decide on it.

When it comes to making false accusations, people should really have more of a spine about that sort of thing.  I don't know how many times I've been slandered, and if you look at my trust page members have accused me of a lot of things I didn't do.  And you'll note that I haven't retaliated with red trust or even made a big deal out of it. 

This is a forum where free speech is allowed, isn’t it? I have openly expressed my accusations and am ready to discuss any of them. But I did not leave red tags only on the basis of my opinion. Leaving red tags not related to trust cases is an abuse if you are in DT.


Thank you for your responsiveness. The translation is good.
There is one inaccuracy:


In the second sentence there is no "Я" - "I". There, this word is missing because it is assumed that theymos wants to steal the money from the forum, but not Joni.

I don't like to take part in such disputes because they don't concern me. I'm neutral with both johhnyUA and KTChampions.
johhnyUA for his knowledge of Bitcoin and KTChampions for his investigations.

I always thought that johhnyUA had a negative attitude towards detectives who are investigating the Abuzers and the negative feedback left to them. That day I decided to ask him why he has such an attitude to such work, because in my opinion it is as useful for the forum as writing useful content.

He told me that the cleanups were not going well. Intelligent users are being cleaned up now for obvious and sometimes fictional reasons.

In his opinion, it makes no sense to clean a room in which, as he says, no one will live. I understand he believes that users who share useful information should have leniency in reputation issues.

I'll try to translate a part of our conversation. I apologize to native English speakers if I make any mistakes.



I'll try to translate a part of our conversation. I apologize to native English speakers if I make any mistakes.


johhnyUA, KTChampions, Please correct me if I have made any mistakes.

Yep, it is correct, take a look:

It is allowed, but please don't just blindly use my words to justify your actions whenever it suits you. Anyway, apology accepted.
He did mention that he tried to send me PM and IIRC I ignored him immediately after PM so he might be telling the truth. You still have to say why do you think this is trust abuse, you indeed accused some members without any proof, while I personally wouldn't send (in most cases) feedback for this, other users might and will do it.

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Side note, your signature, personal text and avatar are contradicting each other.

Johnny will lie to the last. Perhaps I will ask madnessteat as a participant in that conversation to verify or correct the translation.

Looks like we need a notary to make signed & apostilled translation. Though I doubt that even this would be helpful. He won't recognize it anyway.

An amazing lie - amazing with its dullness. You left me your first feedback on July 29th.
The investigation about markiz73 was completed on July 26th.

Once again you are caught in a lie 


Old lie, proofs here.


Everyone can see how the topic began and how it ended (spoiler: adequate users changed their minds in the process).
As for the "serial scammer" - how should I call the user who confessed to:

1.) Mass account trading.
2.) Merit abuse.
3.) Bumping /shilling.
4.) Offering bumping service.
5.) Plagiarism (many accounts from his farms are banned for plagiarism).
6.) Participation in the obvious scam projects.
7.) Account farming.

and was tagged and banned?
Yes, Smart man is a serial scammer and was caught by me.



Another exaggeration from johhnyUA and in any way not a trust case.


Great tactic - justify your actions "I was in a bad mood and drunk" 
And of course, the hypocritical Joni decided to apologize when the sum of the facts showed his abuses and inappropriate behavior.
He does this only because he is trying to get out of an unpleasant situation for him.


Hahaha 
Do not try to escape from this topic, liar. Give us your version of the translation and everyone will see what you mean.

And I ask everyone to note that Johnny did not comment on his mental problems with nationalities - this is his sore subject and he can not object to anything here.


Oh, it seems the caught abuser and the liar wants to get pity from someone who saw his abuse, how cute 
Note: when he talks about "a carrier through bodies" he means those big scammers that I caught.
Broken logic. I catch them for violations, and the accusation of a career on this is complete nonsense (what kind of career can be here? I just make the forum cleaner).


I only show the fact of trust abuse. And I am calm. But how calm you are, everyone can check by reading your feedback about me or other users 


Another lie and an attempt to evade discussion.
Even with respect to bounty cheating, you indirectly admitted that you have alts, I'm not talking about other nonsense "I lived honestly all my life." 

"Yes, you are pretty much allowed to tag anyone you like, for every reason you like  Roll Eyes"
                                                                                               (c) marlboroza, 2019 AD (from here)



My first feedback was left to this "person" before any of his "investigations", for his very bad attitude for trolling people.
Example:
This person like to troll other people, for example he created topic which called Craig Wrigth Satoshi and didn't delete it after my explanation post

But after a few question why i tagged person for supporting of Craig, i changed my feedback. And it's highly accurate in everything in it.
This person, for example, accuses chimk (one of the most honests and trusted members of russian local board) to many times. Here is proof in English, you can read it by yourself:

1. First topic
It's called "Total corruption in Russian local [DT involved!]"

Where he tries to accuse many trusted russian local members in protecting serial scammer (it is his catchphrase   )
After that topic, xtraelv distrasted him for some time.
Here is quotes from this topic:





And of course, chimk (not me, as you see) make a really good posts where he showed all rotten nature of this person, everyone should read this - https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.52783096

I ll give here a little shot piece of this:

So, as you see, this person is lying

Here is proof from this topic:

My first feedback was earlier than his "investigation" in some hours. Here is proof:
(https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.52014120)

And what he responded to that:

But now he lying (again and again) that my first trust post was after his investigations.

2. Second topic
Whis is called Supporting of shitposting by merit source is it trustworthy?
It's funny topic, because maggot KTC used "broken phone" technique: he translated many quotes out of context with wrong translation.
Here is quotes from it (not from me, from a trusted members of english local):




And again, here is highly merited answer of chimk, where he made two important statements:

First, about trolls in russian local:

And second, which is more important. because this was the same with me - at first i was very polite to KTChampion in disscussions of Bitcoin, but one moment (after tons of trolling and speculating from him) i realized that this is rotten person, bad person with bad intents. And now i'm like me now.


So, as you see, this person is manipulating facts and loves dirty tactics

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About this:

And this his quote was explanation why i think so. ( i don't checked it, maybe it's poorly translated as with quotes in topic Supporting of shitposting by merit source is it trustworthy?, so, here in link for my message in russian, check it by yourself - https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53274734)

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Conclusion and few words after:

So, i don't know what to add to all this. If you think, that this behavior is trustworthy (to lie, to accuse trusted and honest members, to try to make a carrier through bodies (meaning "идти чepeз гoлoвы/идти пo тpyпaм" famous catchphrase in russian) then distrast me and be happy of your life. I'm not afraid of that. I know here some good persons, i communicate with them and trying to get knowledge about cryptocurrencies.

And you can see, how difference our way of acting: this maggot is reaally full of butthurt about my feedback, and can't stay calm. Just creating more drama.
While i don't fucking care about mine red feedback from bob123 (after two-four days of butthurt of course. But now i'm like a japanesse lake with flowers, calm and unshakable). Because i'm here not for trust wars and i'm not interested in getting "power to rule them all"


All my life i living as honest person, and i hate three thing in people: lying, manipulating, hypocrizy. All this three things is in KTChampion. So, it's obvious that i don't like him. And will never change. I will keep tagging liars, cryptohaters and trolls. This is my view of life, tho.

This was respond, i will not feed a troll so think all this by yours brain. I'm out (maybe i will answer to some questions of normal users, but i'm not sure

whatever you say! Someone does not want us to be seen in this forum, especially in the global section, to be effective.
I don't see them as ordinary coincidences.
There is a gang that is effective globally. they want all the interests for themselves. there is a mass of supporters who support them but cannot develop yet.
so
- principal ringleaders (these are trying to look like good people)
- shooter
- fans

the forum is under the control of these 3 audiences

What happened: user johhnyUA gave me red tag for no trust case.
Information about the inadequacy and deceit of this reference I will write below. To begin with, the story of its appearance.


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=1097370;dt

The main problems with Johnny began because of my investigations.
There were several cases when I accused users with high ranks in abuse, but he defended them.
Example: Smart man - serial scammer, eventually tagged and banned.
"Last straw" in his turning to madness was the topic (started by johhnyUA) about markiz73 [BAN APPEAL] markiz73 in whose defense he involved a lot of people.
After my investigation, this topic was closed forever.
After that, johhnyUA once again began to insult me. I openly announced that his behavior pattern is similar to another user's behavior pattern proof.
johhnyUA realized that I would investigate him. What could he do in this situation, given that he had nothing against me?
He did not find anything smarter than leaving me a red tag for my disputes with other people and for his fantasies (lies).
A few hours later, I published a topic that johhnyUA is a bounty cheater.

Separately, I want to note that that initial reference from johhnyUA was even funnier than the one that is left now. Additionally, he accused me of supporting Craig Wright, on the grounds that I translated his article. In December of this year, johhnyUA got into DT2 (thanks to the lottery and trolling by some members of the forum, but I do not want to point to them now, as this is a separate topic for discussion). Some users began to make fun of johhnyUA for his inadequate reference and he deleted it. Then he edited it and left again. It is still not relevant. Considering that johhnyUA was DT2 at that moment and he was warned about the unacceptability of his actions, this is a trust abuse.

Once again, the order of events:

By July 27th, questions on Smart Man and markiz73 were closed by me.
On July 29th, I accuse him of botofarming.
In response, he leaves me feedback on the events of May 29th (for some reason, this did not bother him before).
I publish the topic that he is a bounty cheater, it is still July 29th.
In January, he gets into DT2.
The situation becomes dangerous for him and he removes his feedback. Edits and leaves it again.

Given that nothing has fundamentally changed, I leave my tag to johhnyUA for trust abuse.

If anyone is interested in my disputes about bitcoin, shitposting, scammer Crage Wright, scammers in community, etc. then they can read them here here and anywhere on the links. I am ready to answer for every word I say.

I would love to complete this topic now, but since I started I have to write the rest of the "anomalies" with johhnyUA. So:

Maybe he (someday, somehow) will be able to prove that he is not a bounty cheater and maybe he will stop abusing the trust system, but there is another problem: he has mental health problems.. I am not a doctor, but I draw conclusions on his behavior and the opinions of other people.
His "amazing" stories concern not only me, but also many other users:


And finally: theymos want to steal forums money - another story by johhnyUA.

http://archive.md/u6rtd#selection-7201.0-7201.228

http://archive.md/5iRM8#selection-2849.0-2863.291

Once again, the Russians are mentioned in a negative sense (johhnyUA himself is Ukrainian) and it is alleged that theymos wants to steal forum money. And these are "not just assumptions, but conclusions from some suspicious facts".

Conclusion: I tag johhnyUA for trust abuse.
This topic will be my reference about his mental problems. Considering that he will not stop in his "amazing" theories, I may need this reference many more times.