Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 33197.

samson

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Quote from: barbs on June 26, 2013, 11:00:37 AM

Do you guys realize that if one of your foreign accounts ever reaches over 10k, you need to report all your foreign accounts irrespective of their balance?

I have foreign account 1: 11,000$, f account 2: 2,000$ f account 3: 500$ f account 4: 0$
I need to report account numbers of all 4 accounts

I have foreign account 1: 100$, F account 2: 200$, f Account 3: 5,000$
don't need to report any account numbers on the 3 accounts

I'm glad I don't live in the land of the free and therefore don't have to do this nonsense.

NewLiberty

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Gresham's Lawyer

Quote from: barbs on June 26, 2013, 11:00:37 AM

Quote from: NewLiberty on June 26, 2013, 10:54:47 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

Yes. That avoids the filing requirement. (If it never reached US$10K in value on foreign land).
There are other ways to avoid it, but that would suffice.
IRS rules are often weird that way. They seem designed to encourage some arbitrary behaviors vs others.

Do you guys realize that if one of your foreign accounts ever reaches over 10k, you need to report all your foreign accounts irrespective of their balance?

I have foreign account 1: 11,000$, f account 2: 2,000$ f account 3: 500$ f account 4: 0$
I need to report account numbers of all 4 accounts

I have foreign account 1: 100$, F account 2: 200$, f Account 3: 5,000$
don't need to report any account numbers on the 3 accounts

True. Well put.

But also if Foreign acct1 =6000 and foreign account 2=6000, the sum is over 10K and its triggered.

barbs

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Quote from: NewLiberty on June 26, 2013, 10:54:47 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

Yes. That avoids the filing requirement. (If it never reached US$10K in value on foreign land).
There are other ways to avoid it, but that would suffice.
IRS rules are often weird that way. They seem designed to encourage some arbitrary behaviors vs others.

Do you guys realize that if one of your foreign accounts ever reaches over 10k, you need to report all your foreign accounts irrespective of their balance?

I have foreign account 1: 11,000$, f account 2: 2,000$ f account 3: 500$ f account 4: 0$
I need to report account numbers of all 4 accounts

I have foreign account 1: 100$, F account 2: 200$, f Account 3: 5,000$
don't need to report any account numbers on the 3 accounts

ChartBuddy

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NewLiberty

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Gresham's Lawyer

Quote from: molecular on June 26, 2013, 09:13:57 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

oh, now I finally understand that weird "account" feature in the satoshi client. It's for dividing up money into multiple accounts for regulatory evasion purposes.

The word you are looking for is "avoid" not "evade". The first is legal, the second can get you a free room with bars, but nothing good to drink.

That feature wouldn't do either though, the requirement is triggered by the sum of foreign held accounts going over US$10 in the previous tax years, so it doesn't matter how many accounts you control, if they add up to 10K, you are on the hook.

Again, don't take any advice from me, I'm just mentioning the dragon sitting over there looking hungry. How you handle it is entirely your business.

smoothie

legendary

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LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper

This market feels like a coiling spring.

The coiling is slow...the release will be epic. Yes we could go more down...but fundamentals say we are going higher in the big picture.

NewLiberty

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Gresham's Lawyer

Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

Yes. That avoids the filing requirement. (If it never reached US$10K in value on foreign land).
There are other ways to avoid it, but that would suffice.
IRS rules are often weird that way. They seem designed to encourage some arbitrary behaviors vs others.

ChartBuddy

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molecular

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

oh, now I finally understand that weird "account" feature in the satoshi client. It's for dividing up money into multiple accounts for regulatory evasion purposes.

ChartBuddy

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Nightowlace

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Quote from: NewLiberty on June 26, 2013, 05:08:53 AM

Quote from: EuroTrash on June 26, 2013, 03:14:49 AM

Quote from: NewLiberty on June 25, 2013, 08:19:43 PM

A word to the wise:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/irswatch/2013/06/25/reminder-fbar-filing-due-by-june-30/

FBAR reporting requirements are due for all folks in the US who have a foreign account that had a value over US$10K in 2012 with the IRS.
Penalty for non-reporting can be as much as 50% of the value of the account per year (not profit) though are much lower for provably innocent mistakes.

To reiterate, it doesn't matter if you cashed out anything or took any profit or just held it all in BTC, it is the value of the account and it being in a foreign nation that triggers the report requirement.
Call your tax attorney to understand your situation, don't take my advice.

I wonder which exchange should be used to determine such value. Like the one where you can't take dollars out or the ones that aren't based in US?

The one that matters will be whichever the IRS wants to use to show that there should have been a filing.

Okay just woke up and spoke with my accountant and his first response- "Bitcoin hahahaha, you're still playin with that thing." "Technically speaking if BTC is considered a currency, which I'm not sure it is yet but ill look, if you didn't have the BTC in the account where you purchased the BTC ie the exchange and it was "gone" you could technically claim it as a loss. If you can move it to a secure private wallet as you say then there would be no way of finding it, and you could say you transferred the money in, bought BTC, traded some for a loss and spent it all on eBay (Bitmit) buying whatever"

So moral of the story buy on the exchange, transfer to private wallet (or buy casascius coins from me, link is in Signature line) if it can't be found it can't be taxed.

afbitcoins

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N . S . A. Notice

Prism system alert. This activity has been logged. The matrix has you.

barbs

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Quote from: TheKoziTwo on June 26, 2013, 08:07:47 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

Don't report it man... just don't....

Seriously wtf is wrong with you guys why are you reporting this you're just asking for trouble

TheKoziTwo

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Oh, just thought of something else.

Regarding my statement above, I would need to file that form...unless

Unless I export the bitcoins (value of $5K) to a wallet after purchasing. Then price doubles to $10K. But, the bitcoins are in my wallet, no longer in the account. So the account value never exceeded $10K. The value of my wallet did though! Grin

Don't report it man... just don't....

ChartBuddy

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gizmoh

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And Bitcoin Foundation receives a Cease and Desist letter from state of California..We will be without Foundation soon.

Rampion

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Quote from: rpietila on June 26, 2013, 07:13:10 AM

Is there any news from the regulation sector? (Or anywhere?)

Yes, supernodes will be prosecuted and locked up at Guantanamo Bay. The keys of their cells will be flushed down the toilet and no more salads and organic food during the rest of their lives. Only jerky beef.

Those who escape from prosecution will be eventually hit by drones, wherever they hide.

rpietila

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Is there any news from the regulation sector? (Or anywhere?)

ChartBuddy

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ChartBuddy

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Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 33197. (Read 26712318 times)