Topic: What has really been behind china's economy - page 2. (Read 1088 times)

Cheap labor = Cheap Manufacturing = High exports. I am not sure why nobody talks about it. China is known to manage their automation and labor usage at very high throughput rate. No other country can beat it except couple of newly originating ones.

They are able to manage their economy (until now) through their population itself. Most of the peeps are working in the mega factories where they mass produce almost everything. If you checkout alibaba then you will see whether it is medicinal equipment’s or some engineering jobs or clothes, hell they got it for you at cheapest level no one can beat.

For me that’s biggest factor China maintaining their charisma.

Let me start by saying that I didn't call for loving the US
I simply explained that the "success of Chinese business" is based on Western technologies, concepts, ideas, businesses. The West is not only the USA, at least in my understanding.

I already wrote above about China's investment - it is a real evil, as well as yuanization of the economies of some countries that succumbed to Chinese influence.

The topic here is about Chinese economy, and political problems of China, USA, Germany, Spain, Iran, Egypt, and others who have "skeletons in the closet" - I think we should discuss it in another thread .

PS. Could you please tell me, I didn't quite understand your phrase "I understand your red blooded 'murica! approach" - English is not my native language, is it some slang turn of phrase ?

I understand your red blooded 'murica! approach, and I dislike China as much as the next person, but I do dislike USA too. China enslaves nations by giving them debt, USA enslaves them by invading and stealing their resources, neither are good nations. You can't be from USA and expect anyone in a poor nation like from Latin America or middle east and expect people to like the USA, you guys have invaded and ruined dozens of nations just to get richer yourself.

However, you are right that China has ruined plenty of nations themselves, they are famous for giving "free" money for a while until the whole nation is swallowed whole as a debt ridden country that needs to work forever just to appeal to China, that is a less vicious and less murderous way of business, so I would prefer that to be honest. I mean on one hand a nation will invade and murder everyone you love and control your resources, on the other they will give you money to grow you and feed you and then enslave you, I rather not die to be fair.

China leads the world's Eastward shift, no doubt. Their export diversification strategy beyond Asia? Genius. The Asian market is theirs to rule, and that's just the start. Their goods? Highly skilled, diversified, and innovative. They're altering the game, not simply playing. The West is finally paying attention. Chinese technological expand? It's here and changing the global economy

How about crisis management? China's economic downturn management? Amazing. They've faced hardships, but who hasn't? With a huge population, they've handled these situations admirably. Like constructing a financial empire with style and smarts. They can recover and keep going? That distinguishes them. Folks, things are changing. China is speeding toward becoming the world's largest economy. They're playing their cards right. The Eastern wind is blowing, and it's bringing change

If China can maintain comprehensive exports to markets other than Asia as a new plan they are developing, then I believe China will become one of the strongest countries financially. Of the many products they make, they are generally marketed to Asia because that region is the source of their strength to dominate the market. China is a country that is strong in trade relations and especially its influence on the Asian market which has controlled many sectors and China is also a country that is developing innovation in the field of technology which is now starting to be taken into account by Western countries

The crisis that has occurred in recent years has not only hit China and other countries have also been affected. But their economic strength is much better compared to several countries which are starting to face much bigger problems and their ability to solve the recession problem should be appreciated in the midst of a large population, they are able to provide solutions.

The only thing I would add to your answer is the fact that virtually all Chinese services are based on Western models, reworked and rethought with the mistakes of the original Western services - marketplaces, payment services, social networks..... This is also, in a sense, borrowing, and taking into account the mistakes experienced by Western companies....

China's economy has grown very quickly because its government can quickly put policies into place, without having to go through the complicated voting process that happens in democracies. Even though this method is controversial, it does make things more efficient, especially when it comes to big infrastructure projects. But it's not all good; this system can miss local needs or make it hard to divide up resources. It's great for going places quickly, but it comes with some risk

Now, if you want to really "get" China, you need to enter into their online world. If you switch from Instagram to TikTok (Douyin if you will), you'll see a creative and lively side of Chinese society that the media doesn't usually show. Trade Amazon or eBay for Taobao, and you're not just shopping; you're experiencing China's dynamic e-commerce ecosystem, where speed and innovation are the names of the game. What about Alipay vs. PayPal? It's like stepping into the future of digital payments. It's interesting to see how these platforms reflect the different aspects of Chinese culture, often being ahead of the curve when it comes to new ideas and how they fit into everyday life.

You're describing a situation that happened recently.
The key points - the income level of the Chinese, working in factories producing quality goods - has increased markedly. This has made them less competitive, which used to be the main "thing" of the Chinese industry.

Yes, Chinese people are very hard-working, persistent, and forward-looking. It's silly to argue here, I completely agree ! But there is a nuance - until recently, they invested in study, work, development - they understood what they can achieve in a fairly free country. I will not touch on politics and nuances, but economic freedom in China was ! Now the trends are changing. and not for the better - free economy is starting to be squeezed by the state. And this will be a negative factor that will negatively affect at least the desire to work for the future, which may not be....

I may not know the big picture of what China or China is doing to keep their economy on a pretty good trend. But I tried to understand it from individual residents there who I happen to have many acquaintances with who are also Chinese. And what I see from them is that they are tenacious, hardworking and disciplined people. They are not greedy to get big profits at once. But they carry out a series of very systematic plans starting from small things which in the long term can change big things.

And if I remember the word China then what comes to my mind is cheap products whose quality is not so bad. Sometimes even very good. There, workers' wages may be low, but this is also what makes the prices of goods from that country always cheap and makes them very popular and sell well on the market. Even in the market in my country, products from China always fill the market. And many consumers like it. Because the price is really cheap. Especially in the current economic crisis, there will be more people looking for cheap products but with standard quality. it's about quantity vs quality.

And globally, China is now even starting to have its own stage. And the name of this country is now starting to become a strong name when talking about the international economy, especially in Asia. They build their image slowly and then develop it patiently. Sometimes I personally have my own worries when our country has business relations with that country.

This is the exact situation and the truth is that Chinese government has a strong interest in projecting a positive image to the world and it has been successful in doing so through its economic development and its hosting of major events. The Chinese government also has a strong influence on the media and there are limits on freedom of expression. As a result, it can be difficult to get an accurate data of life in China from within the country. However, one thing that sets China's economic apart from other countries in the Op post is due to her top-down and centralized decision making. The government has been able to enact sweeping economic reforms because it doesn't have to go through the same kind of legislative process that exists in democratic countries. China has been able to ramp up infrastructure investment quickly because the government can simply decide to build new roads or whatever policies without having to seek approval from a legislature.

If China, is maintaining a great image it itself in front of the world but have a different reality inside, then they're doing a great job in concealing what really happens in their country. I say this because, the impact of China, to the whole world in terms of manufacturing can not be overemphasized. I believe that there is hardly a home in the whole world where you will not see a Chinese product inside. China, is among the world power and has a robust economy as far as I can see, although I've not been to the country before, but I feel the impact of their economy because of there massive exports to other countries.

I must applaud China, because it's not easy for a country of over one billion people to sustain it's economy and still have surplus to export  to other countries. So with that kind of population explosion, it's to be expected that it won't be easy to switch jobs, in fact if not for their industrialization, they're supposed to have the highest number of unemployed and restitutes in the world, because of their explosive population.

the growth of China's economy IS. An export-oriented economy cannot actively develop and grow with shrinking markets. And China's economy basically lives by exporting EVERYTHING and EVERYTHING. And the key role is played by Western consumers, who bring revenue in liquid currency. And it is them that China is losing today. Plus the internal crisis, which will lead to lower incomes and taxes, and therefore lower purchasing power inside China, which will also prevent the economy from not only growing, but will force it to reduce turnover, which will worsen the situation. The government cannot subsidize business long and massively to create a pretty picture....

I saw from some Chinese Business explainer vid way back then that China's economy is on the shoulders of their elites. Money is literally pooled within their circle only and that's where China's getting their flourishing economy from. As for the industries, I don't think there's a particular industry that China is specializing in since they tend to dip their toes on everything that would make them money. Going back to the source of their GDP, it's quite possibl that this is truly the case since China's not allowing anyone that's rich enough to just cash their money out and transfer it into an international bank account willy-nilly. They are requiring Chinese Rich people to actually hold some yuan on their end every year or else their assets will be seized by the country. If this is the case, then that just means that the country is in a massive bubble economy and anytime it could pop.

It's actually pretty straight forward and simple, there's no need to overthink it. For many years they had the biggest population on the planet. After Mao's disastrous policies were overturned and the current government (although a much more progressive form) positioned the country on a path away from basic subsistence into manufacturing. Before "Made in China" there was "Made in Taiwan" and probably other countries before that. They dragged hundreds of millions up by improving education, housing, production standards and enforcing laws to a certain degree. They could build on a much bigger scale than was ever imagined because the government helped drive it forward. It's just a shame Xi Jinping is choosing to drag it back down again now.

We need to know that China is a country that has people who really appreciate and love domestic products. And this allows local companies in China to continue operating even though the products they produce are less popular with the global market. They have quite a lot of people who will always support their country's economy by always using and buying products that are available domestically. This is one of the factors why China's economy is so strong.

Never mind products such as food, personal items and furniture for daily life. Even for vehicles, electronics and even applications on smartphones, they prefer domestically produced products, compared to foreign products. And this is something that cannot be implemented in other countries, especially my country. Because in my country, people prefer foreign products compared to domestic products. So local companies and factories in my country cannot survive for long, because the products produced cannot compete with products produced from abroad.

China's economic growth is increasing so rapidly and what I know is that they are currently very strong in terms of the economy. China controls the Asian market which is much wider than the European market or the American continent. Their products are marketed to Asia at prices that are much cheaper and more affordable than other products, even though the quality of their products is not much better than products made in America or other countries. The Chinese state is much more secretive in any case and as some people have previously commented they try to manipulate to appear strong in the eyes of other countries.

But apart from that I want to highlight the marketing techniques carried out by their government to control the largest market on the Asian continent and if I'm not mistaken most of their products sell very quickly on the Asian continent. I also like the way they approach both exports and imports and that's why their economy is much better than before. This country is truly extraordinary in terms of population and they always have ways to make their economy better.

It is really difficult to know the real secret of China. They can usually handle all situations easily. Even after coming out of the strict restrictions of the pandemic, there is also talk of the government taking effective steps to boost the economy. In various developed countries, the government has provided financial benefits to the people during the pandemic, but China has taken care of everything by itself. The benefits allocated by the country's government were mainly for the manufacturing sector. Temporarily price compression has positive effect of lowering prices for people but it was good in long term.

Lately, I love how African countries have started to dissociate their natural resources from China and other slavery countries because they have more funds to give. In the past years, China are free givers, as what people use to think but they don't know that any time they give free interest loan, there is a bilateral agreement between the country that borrowed money and China thag lend the funds. They don't give without taking from you, if you ask for road for loan for infrastructures and they agreed to give you, th country will b selling mineral resources to them at affordable price, more like discount, these are the things they are good at in other to help developed their own country.

However, I love them. Yes, the world is all about survival, even US, France, UK and many more are guilty of this. That was how France was milking Niger of her mineral resources but when a coup happened, all were stop and all effort to force them in continuity of the exploiting wasn't successful. Other African countries have all wake up from there slumber to eradicate this madness of loan and other benefits from these developed countries.


Is this even possible, I think colonization might not allow this to happen. Check half of the world and people that English speaking countries helped in the late 80s, they were English speaking countries, even China was colonized to some extent. Language barrier is one the reason why I think this might not allow China to dominate the world.

I will assume that you do not quite understand what China is doing and how it is supposedly “investing” in other countries. About the port - thanks for reminding me, and this will be the best example. Let me now tell you how this “project” happened in reality? And then you take this scheme and compare it with other “investment projects in China.” You will be surprised - “everything is like a tracing paper”...
So, what does the scheme of Chinese “friendship” and “investment” look like, using the example of a port:

China is offering Sri Lanka a major international project: a large cargo port, similar to the Singapore maritime cargo hub. Everything looks logical - a good geographical location - located at the intersection of sea routes between Africa, the Middle East, Asia, Oceania... Yes, the project is complex and expensive and requires attracting investments. Now let's watch our fingers!
1. China says - dear friend Sri Lanka, we are ready to help you and make such a project and invest in it. When the port starts operating, we will all get rich, both you and us! OK ? Let's sign the contract!
2. And this is where the nuances begin. Yes, we will give cheap loans, but there are some conditions. For example: development of project documentation will be done by Chinese companies. OK ? OK ! Oh, and one more small request - will the main contractors, construction and engineering companies, also be Chinese? Well, what's the difference? Well, stop it, we have experience, everything will be fine! Oh, and one more thing, just a trifle - will Chinese companies also supply construction materials and equipment? No, why are you going to strain yourself? We will bring everything, everything will be fine, just sew bags for the money that we will soon earn!
3. Very soon all documents are signed. Let's pay attention to what:
- economic feasibility study/business plan, from a Chinese company
- technical documentation, from a Chinese design company
- contracts for work and supplies with Chinese companies
- an investment agreement with specified obligations. Of course, a separate section is the obligations of the country receiving the investment, financial obligations, as well as the creation of all conditions for launching the project,
4. And the “great construction” begins. where Sri Lanka finds itself in the role of an “auxiliary worker”, i.e. provides only land and labor. At the same time, the volume of Sri Lanka's financial obligations amounts to, for example, $10 billion. This is a loan that China gives them. Let's remember this.
And then it turns out that a significant part of the CREDIT goes to pay for the services of... yes, Chinese contractors.
And then events develop like this:
- suddenly some nuances emerge that increase the cost of the work and require urgent decisions, because “Sri Lanka did not provide some information” or something similar.... And if you decide quickly, then this can only be done... Yes, yes, yes! Only Chinese contractors!
And another part of the CREDIT goes... back to China.
- but the project is nearing completion, everything is fine, if you do not pay attention to the nuances mentioned above. But this is not the end yet...

Final: the project is finished, the port is built, the “red ribbon has been cut”, and everyone is standing on the shore and trying to hear the “clink of coins”... But, as you begin to guess, it is NOT HEARD!

And then the country that received such assistance begins to ask questions - where is the income? Where is the implementation of the business plan? Why doesn't anyone come to the port??? What's happening

And the Chinese representatives, hiding a smile, say - “oh... well, you understand... there are probably some external factors, or YOUR MISTAKES, that do not allow you to reach the calculated indicators.” At the same time, they are silent that service contracts are deliberately delayed, and “recommendations” like “do not interact with the facility at the moment” are sent (this is where corruption and whatever you like).
After 6-12 months, China turns to Sri Lanka with the words “friends! We have fulfilled our obligations, but you have not. The project looks like you are to blame for everything that is happening. And by the way - when will you repay the loans, and most importantly HOW, if the project only brings losses for maintenance!?".

Do you feel where the dialogue is going? No ? Then let's listen to what happens next:
China says “guys, we need you OUR money” (most of which didn’t even leave China), let’s either pay, or read the contract - there are fines, and you pay them too! For some time, Sri Lanka has been frantically searching for a solution. But no one will help someone who is “stuck” in Chinese investments. NO ONE WILL HELP, because... They understand perfectly well what kind of project this is!

And when the “hour of reckoning” comes with money that does NOT exist, China says, “we are friends! Why are we going to bankrupt you? Let’s do it this way - we don’t charge interest. The body of the loan remains, and you ... sell the port to us for 10% of the its cost? If not, then tomorrow you will pay with interest, and we will block the port through international courts until everything is paid in full, and you will bear huge costs for its maintenance, by the way, this is spelled out in the contract."

Total:
Sri Lanka has $10 billion in debt.
From China:
- 10 billion in income over 3-5-10 years.
- 5 billion went to Chinese companies (salaries/taxes/business development/...)
- “Investor-friendly” status.

This is what the real picture of “Chinese investment” looks like

I agree. But as I said in my previous post, they are not giving loans just because they want to help other countries and take a small part of interest from it. They gain additional benefits, too, which I have already mentioned in my previous post. You have to sign an agreement that they will build your structure with their money, and you will have to pay the loan with interest.

Did you get how they benefited by building your structure? They use their workforce and technology to repay most of the loan. Rest remained as an investment. This is not illegal at all. They are doing the same thing as others but in a more innovative way.