Topic: What has really been behind china's economy - page 4. (Read 1055 times)

What has really been behind China's economy:
1.Real estate bubbles(Evergrande and other construction giants). Lots of apartments that were built in the past, but nobody wants to buy them.
2.Lots of debt. The Chinese provinces have several trillion USD worth of debt.
3.China is still underdeveloped and it's easier for the underdeveloped economies to growth with 5-10% nominal GDP per year. The developed economies can grow with maximum 2.5% nominal GDP per year.
4.Lots of underpaid labor. Around 1 billion people in China live with approximately 140 USD per month.
5.Lots of manipulated statistics and hidden data. The communists like to lie and deceive.

You're on to something. Undoubtedly, it is difficult to ignore China's economic growth since its economy was opened up. It is obvious that there has been a considerable improvement in living conditions, technological developments, and major infrastructure construction. However, you correctly highlighted the other side of the coin. Huge sacrifices are made in the name of individual liberties. Similar to a scale, it has civil liberties on one side and economic progress on the other. You have excellent understanding into the demographic crisis. It's a ticking time bomb that makes maintaining the economic development they've attained even more difficult. There are many economic and social puzzles in this scenario, each of which is crucial to the broader picture of sustainable growth and progress.

As far as I understand, china's economy is boosted by export tech products and the loan service they provide. China's loan interest is higher than that of other international institutes. Still, most countries take loans from China because of their friendly terms and conditions. China extend loan duration multiple times. China offers loans, and they work at the same time. For example, What is the purpose of your loan? If it's because you want to build something, china will give you a loan with the condition that they will work on that project. By doing these tactics, they are getting profit from two sides. One is from lending, and the other one is from the construction work. Here are the countries that are mostly in debt to China

Recently, China's economy has collapsed due to the series of calamities that have passed through their country, one of which is a new series that has damaged a lot of affected private sector businesses. Because of your concern, many people in this country are really trying to get up.

But despite all the events, they continue to export to different countries for their recovery from the calamities. Even the inflation they are facing is not good, as far as I know. In addition, the population of China, which is a very large population, has also been affected in the past short period of time.

Without a doubt what China has achieved since the government decided to be more lenient and open the economy is a great feat, however it was achieved by massively restricting the freedoms of their citizens, so it should not really be a model we should look up to, besides the greatest challenge for China right now is to keep what they have gained so far, and with a population crisis way worse than what we are seeing in the western countries this is going to be very difficult to achieve.

China capitalizes its source of economy booster on investments with the visions of creativities and essential consumable produces that is globally in demand for consumptions without relying on just its natural resources of coal and rare earth metals

The most important thing that is fundamental to China's economic growth is the very consistent legal force in the country which is strictly obeyed by its people. This was formed from the authoritarian communist government under the leadership of Mao Tse Tung.

China is now a superpower, even America's "big enemy", but remember it took them ±40 years to become what they are now. Yes, of course this happens because the vision and mission of the government may be in line between one leader and another, yes of course it is followed by the will of the people as well. Now China is very independent, just look at the quality of human resources, education and health, which they export a lot.

My point exactly, they've created an economy that has sustained a population of over a billion people. That achievement is not cheap in any form.
They've greatly used their population to their own advantage.
They don't only have industries in China that are highly productive, they also have them outside the shores of china, even here in my home country, the Chinese companies have a strong stake in my country's economy.
So the prediction of Chinese economy going to be strong in the next decade is likely possible, because what you see is what you get(GIGO).

I think they had to study more on their economic policies and where able to come up different formulations to that best suits there society, by investing more on science and technology and also giving grand's to small scale medium enterprises to help them have a capital base.

In China there surely is a lot of control for the outside world.
There is still crime though and the countryside is different from city live.
As for now they have a disappointed youth having studied a lot and not getting (well paid) jobs.  
In the end the Chinese people are as human as anyone else. They like to have kids and a quite live, mostly.

Read several of his posts and the guy looks biased to me for some reason. Can't take his posts seriously.


Here I must agree, the US and EU are trying to protect their markets from cheap Chinese goods. They would prefer big international brands ordering goods in China and then selling in the US/EU. Most of the profit goes to the corporations, Chinese economy doesn't benefit from such a scenario much. China used to sell directly using eBay, Aliexpress, Alibaba etc but taxes were introduced and existing tax exemptions were cancelled making such business not very profitable. 

Foreign investments, manufacturing capacity and exports, and IP theft is what the Chinese economy has bred over the last 30 years. They used their large population to prop up their economy and it doesn't actually lead to sustainable growth -- expect an eventual crash. Their GDP is not sustainable and the one party state hasn't led to much new innovation over the last few decades.

And keep in mind the real estate sector in China is abysmal as of late: https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/19/economy/china-sunac-ny-bankruptcy-protection-intl-hnk/index.html

I see how strict the education system is in China, they really seem to create people who are very disciplined and prepared for China's important goals, so don't be surprised, even though China has a lot of population, their education level is very good and also quite evenly distributed.

Good knowledge creates good human resources, and automatically this also boosts China's economy. In the next few decades, it is predicted that China's economy will continue to strengthen.

As far as I know, there are many disasters facing China this year of 2023, the kind that seem like their country is cursed if I just observe them in my opinion. The calamities faced by the nation of China are severe, and recently they have faced another disaster.

Therefore, the state of their economy has fallen greatly due to the calamities they have experienced because, to be honest, many establishments have been affected by these things. So they have a bit of a problem with the inflation rate at the moment because they have had declining exports, and the percentage of their unemployment rate has increased even more due to the market crisis.

* https://edition.cnn.com/2023/08/21/economy/china-economy-troubles-intl-hnk/index.html
* https://www.albawaba.net/news/china-faces-9th-calamity-year-resulting-casualties-1532685
* https://www.reuters.com/world/china/water-logged-northern-china-faces-threat-more-disasters-2023-08-23/

China's main strength is its confucian system of administration through which it effectively operates its state apparatus and implements sound policies. China's economy is also full of potential but despite some damage from the global economy China has achieved the world's first manufacturing recovery and the first economic growth despite the pandemic. It has an important role to play in deeply implementing innovation driven development strategies the role of digitization and intellectualization is also immense. China's economic structure is able to maintain consistent order China's capabilities continue to advance by leveraging the advantages of talent and human resources to continuously strengthen the training of creative talent.

First of all China is not a democracy, it's really hard to compare them to other countries that free markets and open election. In China everything is controlled, over the last 2 years several economic indicators turned bad and the communist party decided to stop publishing them. I expect the Chinese economic picture to be highly skewed, only positive data is bringw broadcasted and everything else is pushed under the carpet. The second issue is that China is starting from a very different level to the developed countries in the world, average wages are lower, safety standards and environmental regulations are very different. That is why it's much easier for Chinese firms to compete globally during times of crisis. Also the Chinese government has a lot of money at hand to step in and boost certain sectors to survive the covid pandemic. China even managed to profit from the pandemic, I remember that almost all the masked in my country where produced in China. In my opinion the biggest threat for China is the trade wars with USA and if it intensifies it could spilt over to Europe as well. If most of the western countries would boycott China their economy is doomed, because the rest of the world can't take over all these exports. China is trying hard to expand into Africa and Asia to create more consumers, but they don't have enough money and China has to help out with loans.

Well in a country with 1,400,000,000 people all under very strict rules of behavior a successful worker always knows he is easy to replace.

So workers are underpaid in general and abused by the upper class via low wages hard long hours etc.

Foxconn had suicide nets in place due to excessive worker suicide attempts.

Here in the Wonderfull USA we get great freedoms anther are actually about 750,000,000 guns available to  about 330,000,000 million people includes little kid as they watch where Daddy puts the gun.


https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/29/health/us-children-gun-deaths-dg/index.html


be shot to death is the most common way for a kid to die in the USA.

So the gun freedom slows crazy nut job government rules to turn the workers in to semi slaves. But the workers shoot way too many people.  You would think there was a happy in-between .  But I do not think so.

China exports in the majority, maybe its comparable to somewhere like Germany or Japan some country led by global demand.   The determining factor is efficiency and China has alot to gain still from moving away from its quite retro agrarian style economy that didn't employ machinery till fairly recently.  They have moved a great distance in just twenty years so far.  Other things like the large building programs seem quite a failure in comparison, corrupt and badly done in many cases so theres alot to learn still.    Just the industrialization of their farming despite many challenges has been massive, its visible on sat images just how massive the alterations are.  

just look at how big the Chinese population is, and you will understand where they are coming from in terms of workforce. they have their own world when it comes to service of its people. but i believe some are suffering with the strict protocols of their government. it is good that they already phased out their one-child policy. i guess, a lot of families are mentally tortured on this policy.

The nations has only recently come to the spotlight in just a few years, it was a quick raising to the top unexpectedly, that is why it kinda remind me of japan renaissance, back in 2000, it was nothing but famine land with high crime rate, and many of them are farmers just after the revolution, where they completely distrusted paper cash by focus their life to farm their own food insteads of work for money, they are absolutely and perfectly fine to just afford beans and rice for every lunch, no fancy internet or gadget or English lesson, can they sustain themselves? I can safely say nearly everyone of them could just cut down their expense greatly by quickly adopting to beans and rices again, while there might be some exceptions, there is minority megarich who got rich doing their shady biz during the booming period, would have troubles to frugal bean and rice lifestyle, that they are gonna leave the wasteland with their massive cash heists too, they are all greedy bastard and they would never leave any money behind to the communist scum too. I wouldn't dare say to the younger gen btw, they seem to be highly internet addicts, it is very tedious to estimate, a 50/50 chance that is also why the ccp are now trying to damage control and introducing all sort of nationalizing measures, think of pointless social credit scores etc, they can't have good rest until they can finally get all of their unrest rebels in full control all over again.

If you reverse the order of factors, the picture is quite correct! First came the technology, so mass production began. If you read the history of China before this "acceleration" of the economy - you will learn that in 60-80 years in China there was more population than in any other country. But they produced primitive and, to put it mildly, not very high quality goods.  It was Western investments, equipment, technology, and knowledge that made China a modern China from an agrarian country in the third world.