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Topic: Why KYC is extremely dangerous – and useless - page 10. (Read 6007 times)

legendary
Activity: 4326
Merit: 8950
'The right to privacy matters'
Very well thought out.  Basically true only flaw missing is the reason governments are doing kyc is make work for new law enforcement government branches. (paranoid or what)    Same thing as full synching of ipad iphone imac itv  or android tablet pc.

Millennials and gen-x get vitimized via digital fraud a lot as they tend to trust the tech and don't realize  what a weasly scammer can do with it.  Older people  don't wantt the full connivence of being fully synched up as they fear  getting ripped off by it.

KYC  is needed for large money movers not little numbers.  But most of the world governments are still trying to make  the world into 2 groups the have and the have nots.  KYC  for any amount under 1000 usd is truly wrong

I would argue it is wrong for any amount under 100,000 usd value.  At certain wealth numbers it can be argued for since it would not create the demand for stolen info that 1000 or 500 limit does.

Some where I posted a list of btc addresses by value.  I will look for it.  Found it  and you can see setting the kyc at 100,000 usd means under 170,000  people need give kyc for all of bitcoin but setting kyc at 1,000  means over  3,300,000 would need kyc



So having that low level kyc threshold creates a lot of kyc info in a lot of places  only making more victims and more demand and more law enforcement.

I thought about it before but you would rather use a coinmixer because;
1. You will end up spending a lot in fees when doing an atomic swap. So carrying out 2 atomic swaps means losing more coins in fees not forgetting the exchange rates that are always set so that the DEXes can make some profit out of your trades.

2. Not convenient; Most atomic swaps have maximum limits for coins you want to exchange so imagine if someone wants to convert 20 BTC and the atomic swap has a limit of only 2 BTC per trade. Some even start asking for KYC (read changelly)  Grin

Verdict: Coin mixers are a cheaper option, much more convenient to use

Coin mining works pretty well to stay anonymous.

In Fact you can turn  a profit  doing it.

BTW  being anonymous paints a target  on the anonymous address.

https://bitcoinist.com/bitcoin-addresses-732000-1-btc/


don't you think  this info above is looked into by governments

certainly the info below in the 10 btc and above category is listed


Quote
https://bitinfocharts.com/top-100-richest-bitcoin-addresses.html

Bitcoin Rich List
 Search
Share:         1
Bitcoin distribution
Balance, BTC   Addresses   % Addresses (Total)   Coins   $USD   % Coins (Total)
(0 - 0.001)   14109754   48.72% (100%)   2,894 BTC   28,479,632 USD   0.02% (100%)
[0.001 - 0.01)   7032245   24.28% (51.28%)   28,110 BTC   276,636,215 USD   0.15% (99.98%)
[0.01 - 0.1)   4978235   17.19% (26.99%)   160,258 BTC   1,577,131,784 USD   0.88% (99.83%)
[0.1 - 1)   2052612   7.09% (9.8%)   655,373 BTC   6,449,645,276 USD   3.6% (98.95%)
[1 - 10)   631693   2.18% (2.71%)   1,671,480 BTC   16,449,348,079 USD   9.18% (95.35%)
[10 - 100)   137934   0.48% (0.53%)   4,447,159 BTC   43,765,335,409 USD   24.43% (86.17%)
[100 - 1,000)   14091   0.05% (0.06%)   3,575,309 BTC   35,185,296,894 USD   19.64% (61.74%)
[1,000 - 10,000)   2056   0.01% (0.01%)   4,863,288 BTC   47,860,544,488 USD   26.72% (42.1%)
[10,000 - 100,000)   103   0% (0%)   2,249,811 BTC   22,140,820,546 USD   12.36% (15.38%)
[100,000 - 1,000,000)   3   0% (0%)   549,861 BTC   5,411,290,435 USD   3.02% (3.02%)



Addresses richer than
1 USD..............100 USD.......   1,000 USD..............10,000 USD..............100,000 USD...........1,000,000 USD........10,000,000 USD
21,248,660   7,237,023......   2,710,158...............673,101...................140,753..................13,916...................1,632


by dollar value there are 155,000 addresses over 100,000usd  about the same as over 10btc since a coin is now around 9800  don't you think that list is given to irs etc  especially if they find ones they don't know the owner to.

So the whole idea of anonymous is kind of dead here.  What do you want to do the op idea or  coinmixer  if they result in a newly minted unidentifiable  address most governments will say cost basis is zero and the day the new address is made  is your profit.

Ie a make a 10 coin address today with any method  USA will say it is worth 98000  and since it can't be identified as of today I should report it as 98000 profit for 2020 taxes.

If I don't and I hodl it to 2025 finally cashing it in  lets pretend it is worth 200,000

I will have tax penalties since I did not report the 98,000 in 2020.  So if I want to hide coins I need to have a country to live in that does not tax coins.

But if I have a country to live in that does not tax my coins  why hide them. Since they are not subject to tax  I can show them in an unhidden address.


So effectively you have hidden money with a target painted on it.
legendary
Activity: 2226
Merit: 6947
Currently not much available - see my websitelink
Much appreciated, I've added it:

Languagetranslated by
________________________________________
Turkishyslyv


For ICO's yes, for exchange like Binance just needed.

But we have to trust some sites if we want to use them and sites like binance, coinbase etc are one of them.
Cheesy Cheesy

https://www.coindesk.com/binance-kyc-issue

https://cointelegraph.com/news/coinbase-former-provider-sold-user-data-to-third-parties-prompting-neutrino-acquisition

ICO also make KYC compulsory so if you will not submit your KYC, you will not be able to participate in ICOs. We really don't have much options in this regard.  Sad
Really depends on the country where your ICO is based. If you are based in US, you are most likely screwed currently but in Europe we had a large number of ICOs where it's totally legal to launch a new project and you don't need KYC up to a certain limit. I don't know how it's for other countries but I can't imagine SE Asia / Africa for example is stricter than EU.
full member
Activity: 1134
Merit: 105
For ICO's yes, for exchange like Binance just needed.

Even though it is still risky to submit our kyc to trusted sites like binance, because those sites can be hacked and the information can be leaked. But we have to trust some sites if we want to use them and sites like binance, coinbase etc are one of them. ICO also make KYC compulsory so if you will not submit your KYC, you will not be able to participate in ICOs. We really don't have much options in this regard.  Sad
newbie
Activity: 5
Merit: 0
dangerous in sense , i think it take our data like passport photo copy , photos, documents copy everything. they can be used it in any way where they want. if any web site is fake then its really dangerous , but if it is trust able . it give benefit to us .
useless :it take lot of time and limit of files to be loaded, if file got wrong or large size the we have to load it again. after all this many websites are useless and fake al the time which we use to upload and etc work was waste..
sr. member
Activity: 896
Merit: 272
OWNR - Store all crypto in one app.
KYC is scam. Anonymity and data privacy are the most important things nowadays.

KYC is not scam but most people use KYC to scam others.

1- Some websites demands KYC for withdrawals only and use KYC an excuse for not to release the funds/withdrawals.
2- Some websites collect the KYC data and sell it to the dark market or misuse it for advertisements and other stuff.
Its the tool that a scammer uses to gather information from the user in order to exploit their funds and assets. Its the reason why people nowadays are in doubt when a website is asking for their personal information because they are aware that its an approach that was commonly used by scammers. Some people had been victimized and lose their funds because of KYC that's why we should always be aware before giving an information about ourselves that can used against us because we can't easily identify if their intention was good and its better to be careful than ending up regretting.
hero member
Activity: 1078
Merit: 537
member
Activity: 92
Merit: 10
A great article! Most current crypto websites require KYC to gain some verification steps using account. We already know KYC is useless, so why are they still asking for it. Without KYC, how do we use such services, such as exchanges  Huh
sr. member
Activity: 1622
Merit: 270
Undeads.com - P2E Runner Game
I agree with every word. KYC is dangerous and useless.
And completely violates the right to privacy.
Especially surprising is the requirement of KYC on some kinds of ICO and presales, as here
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/anndavid-chaums-xx-coin-join-the-referral-sale-earn-bonus-tokens-5222060
It looks like - 'We are pre-selling the very private coin in the world, but please give us all your personal data ...' Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 3136
Merit: 1172
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
KYC is scam. Anonymity and data privacy are the most important things nowadays.

KYC is not scam but most people use KYC to scam others.

1- Some websites demands KYC for withdrawals only and use KYC an excuse for not to release the funds/withdrawals.
2- Some websites collect the KYC data and sell it to the dark market or misuse it for advertisements and other stuff.
newbie
Activity: 64
Merit: 0
That so amazing post, when people transaction altcoin or bitcoin they must to KYC for transferring but in the near future that isn't safe for them because There're people will know you, they have ID number, Passport, Face,... That is a reason why that is so dangerous for people and workers on Bounty,too! When they working on bounty campaign but that is scam bounty, they are losting time, KYC,.... After that, That scam project will sell that data for third-party,....
copper member
Activity: 2940
Merit: 1280
https://linktr.ee/crwthopia
Nice to have your translations to Filipino and Portuguese local board!
I've included them in my OP.
However, I'm low on Merit and will send you when my sMerit is refilled again.  Smiley
It's definitely a great opportunity to have translated it. I have internalized the topic more when I translated it to my local language. It made me realize that it's definitely important to protect what you can and do some due diligence about what you are going to do, in terms of KYC if you are going to do it or not. I kept on reading and realized some of my mistakes on my end (my personal experience) related to KYC. It deserves more exposure, especially to the beginners coming into the cryptocurrency space.
legendary
Activity: 2226
Merit: 6947
Currently not much available - see my websitelink

Well done op, great article! And it did deserve a translation to Portuguese speakers:

Portuguese translation
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/traducao-por-que-o-kyc-e-extremamente-perigoso-e-inutil-5223742
Nice to have your translations to Filipino and Portuguese local board!
I've included them in my OP.
However, I'm low on Merit and will send you when my sMerit is refilled again.  Smiley



I will post here a few lines, which I believe everyone should know:

Quote
Privacy is the power to selectively reveal oneself to the world.

Quote
Since we desire privacy, we must ensure that each party to a transaction have knowledge only of that which is directly necessary for that transaction. Since any information can be spoken of, we must ensure that we reveal as little as possible. In most cases personal identity is not salient. When I purchase a magazine at a store and hand cash to the clerk, there is no need to know who I am. ..... I cannot here selectively reveal myself; I must always reveal myself.

Great topic, could need a bump.  Wink
Especially with cash removed, we need crypto as a pseudonymous medium of payment.
legendary
Activity: 2352
Merit: 6089
bitcoindata.science
Good topic

I fee months ago I wrote a post about the cypherpunk manifesto , which I will post a few lines here:

Cypherpunk Manifesto.
Cypherpunk Manifesto was written in 1993 by Eric Hughes. It is amazing to see something that was written almost 30 years ago to be so relevant today.

I will post here a few lines, which I believe everyone should know:

Quote
Privacy is the power to selectively reveal oneself to the world.

Quote
Since we desire privacy, we must ensure that each party to a transaction have knowledge only of that which is directly necessary for that transaction. Since any information can be spoken of, we must ensure that we reveal as little as possible. In most cases personal identity is not salient. When I purchase a magazine at a store and hand cash to the clerk, there is no need to know who I am. ..... I cannot here selectively reveal myself; I must always reveal myself.


This example of buying a magazine is amazing. If my identification is not relevant for the transaction,  there is absolutely no sense in revealing it.

If we must always reveal ourselves we have no privacy .

I don't want people to know that I deal with crypto,  because that's is something which I do as a hobby in my personal life.
hero member
Activity: 1498
Merit: 557
Well done op, great article! And it did deserve a translation to Portuguese speakers:

Portuguese translation
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/traducao-por-que-o-kyc-e-extremamente-perigoso-e-inutil-5223742
copper member
Activity: 2940
Merit: 1280
https://linktr.ee/crwthopia
jr. member
Activity: 45
Merit: 1
KYC is scam. Anonymity and data privacy are the most important things nowadays.
full member
Activity: 1190
Merit: 123
★Bitvest.io★ Play Plinko or Invest!
Finally, a thread that said everything that's on my mind about KYC. I have never been a fan of KYC. although exchanges/platform try to sugarcoat it, it doesn't take away the fact that people got into the crypto space just to get away from KYC/AML – people were tire of handing out their data to these entities. So bitcoin promised us privacy and we got on board to be in charge of our own data. Demanding for KYC completely go against the purpose of cryptocurrencies /blockchain.  I'm aware that some of these exchanges are bending the knee to regulations in jurisdictions where they operate but then, it's wrong to make KYC compulsory. No KYC should be a standard for crypto related businesses and platforms like Exchanges.
sr. member
Activity: 1204
Merit: 270
Hire Bitcointalk Camp. Manager @ r7promotions.com
Most reason why people give out KYC details is as a result of poverty and lack of knowledge. people can do anything possible to get money no matter what. even if it involves selling out their bank information. in other to quench hunger. hunger and poverty are the two most misery thing that can make a man release everything in his possession.

Yes, you are right and the newcomers suffer more. Many of these national scandals face disappointment when it comes to getting money to alleviate their own poverty. Now KYC is very dangerous and our person is not up to date.
member
Activity: 154
Merit: 10
Most reason why people give out KYC details is as a result of poverty and lack of knowledge. people can do anything possible to get money no matter what. even if it involves selling out their bank information. in other to quench hunger. hunger and poverty are the two most misery thing that can make a man release everything in his possession.
legendary
Activity: 2912
Merit: 6403
Blackjack.fun
BTW Why not launching a petition on change.org?

Oh yeah, let's use a website that is known for selling its own user's personal data and uses tracking once you signed one to feed you more money earning "petitions" to complain about KYC.

Yeah, I can see some fine irony in it.
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