Why KYC is extremely dangerous – and useless - page 11.

1miau

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Quote from: zasad@ on February 02, 2020, 04:55:07 PM

Russian translation
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/kyc-5222690

Quote from: Perkjeff on February 03, 2020, 09:46:24 AM

French Translation
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/pourquoi-le-kyc-est-extremement-dangereux-et-inutile-par-1miau-5222860

Thanks both of you for the translations!

Quote from: Saint-loup on February 03, 2020, 11:22:20 AM

You should write a shorter version if you want your text to be shared and translated (and read) IMO. I'm sorry but I found it very long for this kind of subject, some arguments are repeated several times in the text.

The original version (from 2019) was a little bit shorter but also containing less information which was important for me to include. If you think you can create a (significant) shorter version while not missing important parts, feel free to do so, I would be looking forward to read it.

Quote from: Saint-loup on February 03, 2020, 11:22:20 AM

BTW Why not launching a petition on change.org?

I can't see how a petition could help, while bringing awareness to the risks of KYC helps much more in my opinion. If people know about the risks, they will think twice if they do KYC where it's needless and risky.
Petitions are a good thing but unfortunately not really effective for our problem here in my opinion.

Shimmiry

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Quote from: Saint-loup on February 03, 2020, 11:22:20 AM

You should write a shorter version if you want your text to be shared and translated (and read) IMO. I'm sorry but I found it very long for this kind of subject, some arguments are repeated several times in the text.

BTW Why not launching a petition on change.org?

There is no problem having a long post explaining everything about KYC, from its history onto how to a conclusion and prevention to it. Everyone must be patient and this posts was indeed long, yet reading it doesn't made me bored as some arguments did lift the other statements.

Launching a petition on change.org would also be useless. KYC and the risks of Identity theft can be prevented as long as the users are knowledgeable with its harm. Therefore, giving your information in KYC-required platforms is your choice. And signing a petition were far to be successful.

Harlot

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At the end of the day KYC is something we can't escape so really the only way of protecting our personal information is to whom we are handing out with. 1miau did a really good point on saying you just don't give your KYC to any kind of service and project out there since you can't really trust all of them especially the ones who have a shady background. At least with the reputable ones the only concern you can have when it comes to KYC is from leaks and hacks from happening in their exchange which I think is the best option you have when it comes to the crypto industry. Not unless we have some new and enhanced level of regulation when it comes to KYC safeguards from these services we cannot expect our data from leaking somehow.

Saint-loup

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You should write a shorter version if you want your text to be shared and translated (and read) IMO. I'm sorry but I found it very long for this kind of subject, some arguments are repeated several times in the text.

BTW Why not launching a petition on change.org?

Perkjeff

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French Translation

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/pourquoi-le-kyc-est-extremement-dangereux-et-inutile-par-1miau-5222860

joniboini

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Quote from: BITCOIN4X on February 03, 2020, 05:21:37 AM

However, I also do not know for sure whether my personal data is also used for other things or not because so far I have not had a problem related to the use of personal data.

You don't know because they won't tell you. Have you ever wonder why the ads on your browser show products that you're interested in the recent weeks? That's one of the results of this data collection thing.

Because there is no way you can verify whether they use it for good or bad purposes, you should never do it unless it is extremely necessary. Don't do KYC on a fairly new exchange with ambiguous privacy policy and registered on an off-shore address for example.

BITCOIN4X

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I agree with what you have explained about KYC from the perspective of sensitive data. There is no guarantee that data will be forever safe for third parties and users may not be able to control the data they have submitted whether or not it has been used by others.
So far I have never used my sensitive data for ICO, Bounty and exchanges that have a bad reputation. I only send KYC on the local exchange and it is needed because this exchange helps the government to prevent illegal actions such as money laundering.

However, I also do not know for sure whether my personal data is also used for other things or not because so far I have not had a problem related to the use of personal data.

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: LbtalkL on February 01, 2020, 01:33:19 PM

I suggest not to try KYC with websites that do not have a third party KYC Service, having a third party service will make your mind at ease but of course, a reputable service just like Binance is using "Refinitiv" is decent one.

Why is a company using a third party service safer? I'd argue the exact opposite. Companies often tender this out to the lowest bidder, who invariably have very poor security. It also means your KYC documents are being shared around with more people and with third party companies, so there are more opportunities for a malicious employee to access them or a hacker to steal them. Your Binance example is a poor one considering they were hacked for thousands of users' documents and information just a few months ago.

Prince Edu17

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I agree too, that's why I never do a KYC. Scammers use all kinds of sneaky approaches to steal your personal details. Once obtained, they can use your identity to commit fraudulent activities such as opening a bank account, etc.

akirasendo17

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Kyc have some good side, but mostly if its turns out to be in the hands of bad people things are going from good to worse
why? informations are there which can be use for fraud acts, also can be use to steal money, because of this information, I dont agree that its useless because as I said there are good use , example are for bank, this will be use for securing you account, yes its also a kyc, also its a protection example if your account been hack, you can use it to protect or open your account

Febo

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Man, if regulations in country you live in demands KYC you simply have to do it. What you can do is to do it where you trust that company to keep your data secured as much as possible. And to avoid service you need doing KYC for, unless you really need to use it.

zasad@

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Russian translation
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/kyc-5222690

LbtalkL

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Thanks for the information, I just wanna share my inputs to this thread. I suggest not to try KYC with websites that do not have a third party KYC Service, having a third party service will make your mind at ease but of course, a reputable service just like Binance is using "Refinitiv" is decent one. A website that does not have this service or similar is suspicious and our data is in danger. Some bounties here on Bitcointalk only using a google form for KYC details that is very dangerous for us so don't you ever try it.

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: MufasaR on January 31, 2020, 06:59:12 AM

Are you saying exchanges are the biggest crypto service providers that have most of the influence on whether KYC should be done or not ?

Exchanges are certainly the biggest service providers in terms of volume handled in the crypto-space, but I wouldn't say they have much influence. Most of them are just complying with laws which are being enforced by various governments or organizations around the world. There are certainly ways that exchanges can function without having to ask for KYC - look at some of the good DEXs, for example. But centralized exchanges don't want to transition to that model because it would affect their profits. So instead they sell out their principles and sell out their customers to keep their own bottom line intact.

MufasaR

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on January 31, 2020, 05:29:56 AM

Quote from: MufasaR on January 31, 2020, 02:58:22 AM

crypto had to bend down to the rules of FIAT

Don't conflate all of crypto with these centralized scammy exchanges. Bitcoin hasn't bowed down to anyone - it is still just as decentralized and censorship resistant as it ever was. It is only the centralized exchanges which have sold out the principles of bitcoin and sold out their customers, enforcing these ridiculous KYC demands and deciding what their customers can and cannot spend their bitcoin on.

Are you saying exchanges are the biggest crypto service providers that have most of the influence on whether KYC should be done or not ?
Thought gambling is one industry that has adopted this KYC culture which imo is hurting their own businesses in the long run

Ukraina

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This article is long and detailed analysis and evaluation of KYC. Since 2017, when trading platforms and platforms in blockchain fields appeared, it has led to a lot of bounty programs for bounty hunters.

KYC is required and it limits many virtual users, bots, etc.However, KYC information issues of users are not strictly managed and there is no commitment to the records. KYC. The leakage of user information occurs regularly, users when KYC is not guaranteed damage to privacy, ...

Quote

Avoid KYC for everything else:

No KYC for altcoin / shitcoin bounties or altcoin / shitcoin airdrops where the owners are likely scammers or incompetent.
No KYC for shitty exchanges where the owners are likely scammers or incompetent.
No KYC for low amounts of money where it’s just not worth the risk (this probably includes everything that doesn’t make you rich)

I agree with this opinion, there are many cases of unnecessary KYC, in some cases, the developer only wants to collect the user's information through KYC and sell it out.

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: MufasaR on January 31, 2020, 02:58:22 AM

crypto had to bend down to the rules of FIAT

Don't conflate all of crypto with these centralized scammy exchanges. Bitcoin hasn't bowed down to anyone - it is still just as decentralized and censorship resistant as it ever was. It is only the centralized exchanges which have sold out the principles of bitcoin and sold out their customers, enforcing these ridiculous KYC demands and deciding what their customers can and cannot spend their bitcoin on.

If you don't like these rules and regulations (and you absolutely shouldn't), then stop using the exchanges which enforce them. If everybody stopped giving their business to these scammy exchanges, then this kind of behavior would rapidly cease. It is entirely possible to buy, sell, trade, spend, and use bitcoin without touching a single on of these centralized exchanges or giving away your KYC documents to a single service.

MufasaR

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Quote from: 1miau on January 29, 2020, 07:31:04 PM

But seriously, why should KYC help to prevent terrorism? ~~Or even precious metals or cash?~~ That "argument" is circulating since a very long time,

The argument has indeed gone on forever and no one will come out with an answer because there is no wrong or correct answer to this question, unless some bias is applied. Though i would like to think KYC was mearnt to vent out some people from either preventing the abuse of a campaign or try and have people that will relate to a product/service(though a questionnaire before kyc process would be helpful )..... cant rule out the fact that some few individuals will data harvest other users information for their own selfishness, whats even mind boggling is BIG cooperations pay handsomely for this data Roll Eyes

Quote from: Upgrade00 on January 30, 2020, 05:39:12 AM

This argument does not hold much water when you critically analyze it. Anyone who really wants to circumvent the KYC process using dubious means can so do.

true, which is scary if you asked me

Honestly I thought crypto was suppose to kick out KYC with its so called "anonymous" character but no, crypto had to bend down to the rules of FIAT so as to allow more people adopt it, back in the early days of crypto most services were accessible with a simple sign up now because regulators have infiltrated the crypto system to have society accept it. Good thread OP

Upgrade00

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Quote from: 1miau on January 29, 2020, 07:31:04 PM

But seriously, why should KYC help to prevent terrorism? Or even precious metals or cash? That "argument" is circulating since a very long time,

This argument does not hold much water when you critically analyze it. Anyone who really wants to circumvent the KYC process using dubious means can so do. It is the careless individuals who only wanted to claim a few airdrops or bounty coins end up putting up sensitive documents on the web making them vulnerable to the dark web.
The rationale behind it should be the desire of the government to have control over all the financial affairs of its citizenry, hence why KYC is required by all exchanges and other financial websites. Having an entire community transfer funds anonymously with no means of reaching it led to the idea of identity verification.

Perkjeff

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I read your post and some minutes later, I found this topic on Bitcointalk.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/claim-free-60-cytc-tokens-in-the-first-month-after-registering-in-the-app-5216868

First Post + 3 replies (all from OP) with:

From first post :

Quote from: criptoflex on January 12, 2020, 01:12:57 AM

Earn Mining Reward 20% to 30% from CYTT Mining Packages

NOTE: KYC needed to start earning free coins or dividends

and he is insisting for that, from first reply :

Quote from: criptoflex on January 19, 2020, 10:52:43 PM

Many people registered in the App, but are not receiving the free tokens because they haven't go through the Authentication process (KYC) yet.
Every user has to Authenticate in the App to start receiving the rewards. This applies as well to the users who decide to purchase the mines to get rewards from 20% per month in CYTC tokens.
The Authentication process is straightforward and normally will be activated within 1 hour from the submission.
You just need to fill name and ID, send a copy of the ID and a picture of yourself holding it.
The Authentication tab is under your profile section.
Happy earnings!

And the guy received negative feedback before.

I'm not saying the guy is trying to scam people, but at least I'm more aware than before on the subject and I will be more careful - seems like I am already actually - thanks to you. Thank you for that.

Topic: Why KYC is extremely dangerous – and useless - page 11. (Read 5983 times)