Topic: Will energy consumption be Bitcoins downfall ? - page 5. (Read 1698 times)
will energy consumption be the crash of bitcoin`` bitcoin has been operating for a long time, actually it's been almost 13 years, why is it only now that people say bitcoin has fallen because of energy, why from the past, after elon musk negative tweets about bitcoin, now it has spread to other things other things, I think this is all made by greedy rich people, who want to take advantage of adversity...
CZ tweeted https://twitter.com/cz_binance/status/1399195759140954112
Just as people moved from gasoline powered cars to electric will investors also move from bitcoin to ecofriendly alts?
I don't think energy consumption will result in Bitcoin's downfall. Bitcoin miners will always move towards any means that will be better in the coming future for Bitcoin mining. This is natural since the general energy consumption is moving towards that direction anyways and I see Bitcoin miners going that route. it's not a bitcoin downfall but will just adjust the price for a bit because they can make it happen. miners will play along if the law will make it illegal for not using green source.
Just as people moved from gasoline powered cars to electric will investors also move from bitcoin to ecofriendly alts?
I don't think energy consumption will result in Bitcoin's downfall. Bitcoin miners will always move towards any means that will be better in the coming future for Bitcoin mining. This is natural since the general energy consumption is moving towards that direction anyways and I see Bitcoin miners going that route.
The problem of energy consumption when mining bitcoin has already been raised and it must be addressed, otherwise many large investors will stop investing in bitcoin. This will lead to a drop in demand for it and, of course, a drop in its price. It seems to me that there was a fairly large vulnerability in bitcoin. The problem of energy consumption, and not from renewable sources, is now very urgent in connection with the sharp changes in climate. It seems that bitcoin will have a very difficult time in the near future.
From the recent policies introduced by some countries, it can be seen that energy shortages do affect the development and mining of Bitcoin, but this will not cause the collapse of Bitcoin, because countries like Iran have only temporarily banned them. In fact, they Still have to continue mining, and according to research shows that mining consumes very little energy, and they are mining in some areas with more hydropower energy, not only does not cause excessive energy consumption, but also makes energy distribution more reasonable.
There are already miners who make it as their business so even there are increased in energy consumption they can still sustain it provided they already have many apparatus uses in their business. Some might use solar to continuous their business. this is good to big miners but for individuals who just use their own electricity it can be a lose in their profit but not in bitcoin.
From the recent policies introduced by some countries, it can be seen that energy shortages do affect the development and mining of Bitcoin, but this will not cause the collapse of Bitcoin, because countries like Iran have only temporarily banned them. In fact, they Still have to continue mining, and according to research shows that mining consumes very little energy, and they are mining in some areas with more hydropower energy, not only does not cause excessive energy consumption, but also makes energy distribution more reasonable.
There are already miners who make it as their business so even there are increased in energy consumption they can still sustain it provided they already have many apparatus uses in their business. Some might use solar to continuous their business. this is good to big miners but for individuals who just use their own electricity it can be a lose in their profit but not in bitcoin.
Bitcoin's energy consumption is just one of the minor issues. Many countries prohibit Bitcoin mining and other activities, which also reflects from the side that these countries want to regulate these mining activities, whether it will affect their country's legal currency, so Some countries will take measures against Bitcoin.
Energy consumption is much into discussion these days, and the big controversy is now once again getting shattered by Elon Musk. It is also stated that, banks now consume more power than the bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies. With time, efficiency is getting achieved on bitcoin mining equipments. Based on this I don't think energy consumption will set to be a big issue in the future.
From the recent policies introduced by some countries, it can be seen that energy shortages do affect the development and mining of Bitcoin, but this will not cause the collapse of Bitcoin, because countries like Iran have only temporarily banned them. In fact, they Still have to continue mining, and according to research shows that mining consumes very little energy, and they are mining in some areas with more hydropower energy, not only does not cause excessive energy consumption, but also makes energy distribution more reasonable.
The most important thing is the performance or the advantage of the money. Many companies destroy our planet little by little, although some of them said that they just "we safe the earth by creating this and that products" but I think they just don't realize it yet. If all companies do their job in the right way then maybe we will not hear about global warming, polution and etc. Even I don't think that electric car company really don't make any polution. Steel, ruber, glass and etc are needed in order to make a car, and I am not sure that in the process of making of that there is no negative impact for earth. I think if bitcoin spread evenly and the price become more stable it can safe many people life. People will be safe from inflation that make them poor. In my opinion fiat makes us poor, holding fiat for years is not an investment, it is just make us poorer evertime because of inflation. So bitcoin will not fall only because of that.
you need to go back and read the conversation so you know what we are talking about.
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
Every trader wants profits and their best bet is btc because they know how hard it has become for miners to mine it. They are keeping its price high because of the resources being used to mine it, making a direct correlation between consumption of resources to mine a btc and its present value.
Now, when talking about security, none of the PoS coins in my views can beat the security of btc, please draw me to one which can and I will think of changing my portfolio from btc to that xyz coin. If such a thing would exist, it would have taken over btc already. Every node validates a transaction making it more difficult for a hacker to break the chain and move that transaction his way. I agree that the speed of btc may be less if compared to so many altcoins there, but we still use it because we know the value it has given to crypto and is still adding it with its mining. And when all the alts (your PoS coins included) are created to provide the nearly same functions that btc gives, I would twist and turn your question and ask you: why not to use btc over them when they are only copying what btc did years ago? In the end, it is all about choosing the right coin and if btc is my right coin, I will go for it and you may go for your PoS coin.
In Bitcoin Security ,
Is it the High PoW Hash rate that keep it secure
or
is it the Fact that the top 4 mining pool operators have so far agreed not to collude their over 51%
and double spend or other shenanigans.
And yes, we all know miners can point their miners at different pools,
but the point is , those 4 pool operators only need 3 to 6 confirmations to double-spend, where it can't be undone
so ~1 hour for them to totally destroy bitcoin security as you know it.
Odds are the miners would not even find out for 4 to 6 hours after it happened.
https://medium.com/mit-media-lab-digital-currency-initiative/who-is-monitoring-mining-pools-65de79b90710
If that is secure to you, good for you.
However a PoS coin such as Cardano has 2,523 Active Pools.
So for me , I'll sleep better with Cardano security ,not to mention it's energy efficiency means no government has to ban it.
Bitcoin only offers ~7 transactions per second, Cardano offers 256 transactions per second.
Bitcoin Blockspeed 10 minutes
Cardano Blockspeed 20 seconds
To me Cardano wins hands down, but I also am not following bitcoin like a religion.
The actual tech specs are all that matter to me.
FYI:
Cost for the Bitcoin Pool operators to 51% attack the BTC network is $Zero .
Cost for an outside entity to 51% attack BTC is $612,664, for an hour-long 51% attack.
source: https://www.jumpstartmag.com/understanding-51-attacks-on-blockchains/
Cost for an entity to 51% attack Cardano, is ~$24 Billion US Dollars, for even a short 1 hour attack.
And that is only if buying up the Cardano does not raise the price per coin. Which it would.
Plus spending ~$24 billion just to destroy the value of that money , is not a wise choice.
I feel safer with Proof of Stake coin Cardano, but that is just me.
Just as people moved from gasoline powered cars to electric will investors also move from bitcoin to ecofriendly alts?
no electric cars are expensive. will probably wait for 10 years to own one. will just use my bike if EV isnt worth $1K. $1k is even way high.
the people who certainly wanted to control BTC decentralization doesnt have the energy source to keep mining BTC so they ban the use of fossil sources. this is controling BTC and what they want miners to use is the tesla batteries.
you need to go back and read the conversation so you know what we are talking about.
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
Every trader wants profits and their best bet is btc because they know how hard it has become for miners to mine it. They are keeping its price high because of the resources being used to mine it, making a direct correlation between consumption of resources to mine a btc and its present value.
Now, when talking about security, none of the PoS coins in my views can beat the security of btc, please draw me to one which can and I will think of changing my portfolio from btc to that xyz coin. If such a thing would exist, it would have taken over btc already. Every node validates a transaction making it more difficult for a hacker to break the chain and move that transaction his way. I agree that the speed of btc may be less if compared to so many altcoins there, but we still use it because we know the value it has given to crypto and is still adding it with its mining. And when all the alts (your PoS coins included) are created to provide the nearly same functions that btc gives, I would twist and turn your question and ask you: why not to use btc over them when they are only copying what btc did years ago? In the end, it is all about choosing the right coin and if btc is my right coin, I will go for it and you may go for your PoS coin.
great points exactly what I was looking for in these conversations. What had me worried about BTC was what price does it have to hold to be profitable currently and after the next halving. At what point would a miner say my electric cost are to high to sustain a profit. If you supplement with solar you have increased your cost.
right now it looks like 40% of revenue goes toward electricity cost. https://www.coinwarz.com/mining/bitcoin/calculator?h=110.00&p=3250.00&pc=0.17&pf=0.00&d=21434395961349.00000000&r=6.25000000&er=1&btcer=47197.18580000&ha=TH&hc=2407.00&hs=0&hq=1
Monero seems to be pretty secure also with a $625k reward to break its code but I don't see it as a better option than BTC either.
https://currency.com/the-most-secure-cryptocurrency
so strictly as an investment I think Harmony, Nano, Helium and ALGO will have a higher percentage gain than BTC in the next six months, BTC defiantly has proven endurance on its side.
you need to go back and read the conversation so you know what we are talking about.
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
Every trader wants profits and their best bet is btc because they know how hard it has become for miners to mine it. They are keeping its price high because of the resources being used to mine it, making a direct correlation between consumption of resources to mine a btc and its present value.
Now, when talking about security, none of the PoS coins in my views can beat the security of btc, please draw me to one which can and I will think of changing my portfolio from btc to that xyz coin. If such a thing would exist, it would have taken over btc already. Every node validates a transaction making it more difficult for a hacker to break the chain and move that transaction his way. I agree that the speed of btc may be less if compared to so many altcoins there, but we still use it because we know the value it has given to crypto and is still adding it with its mining. And when all the alts (your PoS coins included) are created to provide the nearly same functions that btc gives, I would twist and turn your question and ask you: why not to use btc over them when they are only copying what btc did years ago? In the end, it is all about choosing the right coin and if btc is my right coin, I will go for it and you may go for your PoS coin.
Energy? usage? Billions are spent on useless energy projects every month in the world. Think about the local automobile dealership, they run lights all night long, parking lot lights, lights inside, they have computers that stay on 24 hours a day. No one every worries about how much energy they use. Consider this, Large companies that melt aluminum and other large industries expend huge amounts of energy to produce something as novel as aluminum foil. Anyone worried about that? No this is not about energy at all. Musk is an idiot, if you want to know what this is all about, just think about the bigger picture. Why are they suddenly so concerned with energy? No its about banking and finance, they do not like the idea that anyone can access banking and finance with sophisticated crypto financial products. It is a power they have controlled for centuries. No one is really concerned with energy use, because Visa and Mastercard, process billions of transactions which are no different than the transactions processed by mining bitcoin. In fact visa and mastercard consume 30 times more energy than bitcoin and other crypto currency combined. Just understand that the idea that bitcoin is causing global warming is BULL... These are the same people that want to save the whales, but never really do save them, they want to they just can't do it because it was never under their control in the first place. This is emotion over intellect, which is why I say that if Musk really believes that global warming is caused by bitcoin then he is truly stupid.
you agree with me then, the masses are going to do what they want to do regardless of the engineering and endless debates. An Electrical Engineer argued with me for 10 years as to why Tesla would never make it. He had all the numbers and figures and never invested a dime at $24 a share. He is still eating crow today because no matter what he thought, the masses started a movement into electric vehicles verses Gasoline. So if the consumer wants to use NANO for example instead of BTC because it uses very little power there is nothing to stop them.
Energy? usage? Billions are spent on useless energy projects every month in the world. Think about the local automobile dealership, they run lights all night long, parking lot lights, lights inside, they have computers that stay on 24 hours a day. No one every worries about how much energy they use. Consider this, Large companies that melt aluminum and other large industries expend huge amounts of energy to produce something as novel as aluminum foil. Anyone worried about that? No this is not about energy at all. Musk is an idiot, if you want to know what this is all about, just think about the bigger picture. Why are they suddenly so concerned with energy? No its about banking and finance, they do not like the idea that anyone can access banking and finance with sophisticated crypto financial products. It is a power they have controlled for centuries. No one is really concerned with energy use, because Visa and Mastercard, process billions of transactions which are no different than the transactions processed by mining bitcoin. In fact visa and mastercard consume 30 times more energy than bitcoin and other crypto currency combined. Just understand that the idea that bitcoin is causing global warming is BULL... These are the same people that want to save the whales, but never really do save them, they want to they just can't do it because it was never under their control in the first place. This is emotion over intellect, which is why I say that if Musk really believes that global warming is caused by bitcoin then he is truly stupid.
I don't think that it will cause such thing for Bitcoin. Besides, I'm pretty sure that renewable energy will start being used fully on Bitcoin mining in the near future. Especially Elon Musk's statements can have a big impact on it.
Just as people moved from gasoline powered cars to electric will investors also move from bitcoin to ecofriendly alts?
Not really. If the crypto market has to exist, BTC has to stay tight and upright all the time. Talking about the energy consumption patterns, we already have solutions in the form of renewable sources of energy. I think the market would more or less rectify itself, if there is a lot of buzz around dirty energy being used by miners. Miners would shift themselves to countries providing subsidies for using renewable sources of energy. Most of the countries around the world are already providing subsidy for renewable sources and new miners would base themselves in these countries. I think this is more like a self rectifying equilibrium, it will rectify itself. But yes greeners alts would prosper alot, basically the one's working of Proof of Stake Model. Just as people moved from gasoline powered cars to electric will investors also move from bitcoin to ecofriendly alts?
Who makes you believe that Bitcoin is consuming too much energy? Musk? You should not listen to him, but to the miners who are mining it. If they commit that btc is really becoming dangerous globally because of its energy consumption, then they can come to a solution and make btc more eco friendly on their own. I like Musk's initiative of reaching out to and approaching miners to turn to more green mining. But will you accept it if some day, that same guy starts reaching out to people and ask them to stop using electricity completely and go solar forcefully? Aren't we consuming too much electricity even without mining already?
you need to go back and read the conversation so you know what we are talking about.
In a nut shell, I could care less about what an individual says but more in how people react. If the consumer can use XYZ coin ( a very low power consuming POS) and achieve the same function, security and even better speed than High energy consuming POW BTC, then why not use XYZ
Just as people moved from gasoline powered cars to electric will investors also move from bitcoin to ecofriendly alts?
Who makes you believe that Bitcoin is consuming too much energy? Musk? You should not listen to him, but to the miners who are mining it. If they commit that btc is really becoming dangerous globally because of its energy consumption, then they can come to a solution and make btc more eco friendly on their own. I like Musk's initiative of reaching out to and approaching miners to turn to more green mining. But will you accept it if some day, that same guy starts reaching out to people and ask them to stop using electricity completely and go solar forcefully? Aren't we consuming too much electricity even without mining already?
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