Would people pour their cash into bitcoin given a stock market crash?

ShakyhandsBTCer

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It's Money 2.0| It’s gold for nerds | It's Bitcoin

Quote from: okthen on July 05, 2014, 09:35:15 PM

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

So it's set. We need that market crash to come after the Winklevoss eft comes to light.
Hurry up guys! Grin

I would argue that public adoption would increase regardless of a market crash once the ETF starts trading.

okthen

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Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

So it's set. We need that market crash to come after the Winklevoss eft comes to light.
Hurry up guys! Grin

ShakyhandsBTCer

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It's Money 2.0| It’s gold for nerds | It's Bitcoin

Quote from: Harley997 on July 04, 2014, 02:21:46 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 03:21:42 AM

Quote from: Harley997 on July 04, 2014, 03:07:33 AM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 02:17:27 AM

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

Probably true, but direct investment will have a much larger effect on bitcoin price than adoption. Additionally, a bitcoin ETF would grant access to a lot more capital as people could then invest with 401ks and other retirement savings.

A ETF would not be available in most workers' 401(k) accounts as the investment choices are limited by the plan administrator of the accounts.

I would be very interested to see how fungible a BTC EFT is compared to bitcoin. That is how easy it would be to go from a share in the ETF to bitcoin.

Really? Plan administrators restrict the ETFs you can buy in a 401(k)? I didn't know that as my retirement plan only allows investment in mutual funds. Maybe I was thinking of IRAs. In any case, thanks for pointing that out.

You can't actually trade ETFs with a 401k the same way that you can trade them in a normal brokerage account, but you can hold some ETfs if the plan allows it.

You are correct to say that you can hold any ETF in an IRA (as long as it trades on a major exchange) but the value of funds in IRAs is much less then what is held in 401(k)s

Maybe once enough people invest in bitcoin in the "mainstream" world then more large, early adopters will sell their holdings, further diversifying the holders of bitcoin in circulation

DannyElfman

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Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 03:21:42 AM

Quote from: Harley997 on July 04, 2014, 03:07:33 AM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 02:17:27 AM

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

Probably true, but direct investment will have a much larger effect on bitcoin price than adoption. Additionally, a bitcoin ETF would grant access to a lot more capital as people could then invest with 401ks and other retirement savings.

A ETF would not be available in most workers' 401(k) accounts as the investment choices are limited by the plan administrator of the accounts.

I would be very interested to see how fungible a BTC EFT is compared to bitcoin. That is how easy it would be to go from a share in the ETF to bitcoin.

Really? Plan administrators restrict the ETFs you can buy in a 401(k)? I didn't know that as my retirement plan only allows investment in mutual funds. Maybe I was thinking of IRAs. In any case, thanks for pointing that out.

I wouldn't worry about people pouring their retirement funds into bitcoin when the ETF comes out, I would be excited about large institutions buying into bitcoin. If consumers wanted to invest in bitcoin they could simply buy it via an exchange.

Harley997

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Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 03:21:42 AM

Quote from: Harley997 on July 04, 2014, 03:07:33 AM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 02:17:27 AM

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

Probably true, but direct investment will have a much larger effect on bitcoin price than adoption. Additionally, a bitcoin ETF would grant access to a lot more capital as people could then invest with 401ks and other retirement savings.

A ETF would not be available in most workers' 401(k) accounts as the investment choices are limited by the plan administrator of the accounts.

I would be very interested to see how fungible a BTC EFT is compared to bitcoin. That is how easy it would be to go from a share in the ETF to bitcoin.

Really? Plan administrators restrict the ETFs you can buy in a 401(k)? I didn't know that as my retirement plan only allows investment in mutual funds. Maybe I was thinking of IRAs. In any case, thanks for pointing that out.

You can't actually trade ETFs with a 401k the same way that you can trade them in a normal brokerage account, but you can hold some ETfs if the plan allows it.

You are correct to say that you can hold any ETF in an IRA (as long as it trades on a major exchange) but the value of funds in IRAs is much less then what is held in 401(k)s

CoinsCoinsEverywhere

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Activity: 532

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Quote from: Harley997 on July 04, 2014, 03:07:33 AM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 02:17:27 AM

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

Probably true, but direct investment will have a much larger effect on bitcoin price than adoption. Additionally, a bitcoin ETF would grant access to a lot more capital as people could then invest with 401ks and other retirement savings.

A ETF would not be available in most workers' 401(k) accounts as the investment choices are limited by the plan administrator of the accounts.

I would be very interested to see how fungible a BTC EFT is compared to bitcoin. That is how easy it would be to go from a share in the ETF to bitcoin.

Really? Plan administrators restrict the ETFs you can buy in a 401(k)? I didn't know that as my retirement plan only allows investment in mutual funds. Maybe I was thinking of IRAs. In any case, thanks for pointing that out.

Harley997

sr. member

Activity: 266

Merit: 250

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 04, 2014, 02:17:27 AM

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

Probably true, but direct investment will have a much larger effect on bitcoin price than adoption. Additionally, a bitcoin ETF would grant access to a lot more capital as people could then invest with 401ks and other retirement savings.

A ETF would not be available in most workers' 401(k) accounts as the investment choices are limited by the plan administrator of the accounts.

I would be very interested to see how fungible a BTC EFT is compared to bitcoin. That is how easy it would be to go from a share in the ETF to bitcoin.

CoinsCoinsEverywhere

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Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Quote from: InwardContour on July 03, 2014, 09:04:49 PM

Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

Probably true, but direct investment will have a much larger effect on bitcoin price than adoption. Additionally, a bitcoin ETF would grant access to a lot more capital as people could then invest with 401ks and other retirement savings.

InwardContour

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Quote from: CoinsCoinsEverywhere on July 02, 2014, 01:38:55 AM

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

The ETF will also likely increase public awareness of bitcoin, causing more people to adopt bitcoin.

DannyElfman

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Activity: 406

Merit: 250

Quote from: SaveForrest on July 02, 2014, 02:04:50 PM

Quote from: aminorex on April 17, 2014, 06:23:55 PM

Either bitcoin itself or an IMF crypto is likely to be used for international settlements and primary reserves 5 to 10 years from now. It would be foolish to create a novel crypto, with an untested codebase and protocol, and place it in such a central role in the global economy. Therefore, I expect bitcoin to fulfill that role.

but what about other promising altcoins? VeriCoin, Monero or DarkCoin or NXT? I put my money proportionally into 9 cryptos, instead of all into BTC. What if BTC plummets to $150??

In general all of the crypto coins trade at a steady rate per BTC. In other words, when priced in fiat when BTC goes up all the other cryptos go up by the same amount.

SaveForrest

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Quote from: aminorex on April 17, 2014, 06:23:55 PM

Either bitcoin itself or an IMF crypto is likely to be used for international settlements and primary reserves 5 to 10 years from now. It would be foolish to create a novel crypto, with an untested codebase and protocol, and place it in such a central role in the global economy. Therefore, I expect bitcoin to fulfill that role.

but what about other promising altcoins? VeriCoin, Monero or DarkCoin or NXT? I put my money proportionally into 9 cryptos, instead of all into BTC. What if BTC plummets to $150??

Swordsoffreedom

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Quote from: twiifm on July 02, 2014, 02:12:09 AM

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on July 02, 2014, 02:02:54 AM

Quote from: twiifm on July 02, 2014, 12:49:50 AM

If there was a crash like 2008. I'd buy stocks hand over fist. Easy money.

You mean short the stocks hand over fist then buy the stocks back at a giant discount and keep the spare profits
Easy money

Yeah that too. Grin

I love shorting. I made a lot shorting TSLA, AMZN, TWTR from feb to april. Now I'm long on those plus DDD. And recently made killing on GPRO

But its really hard to see the trend though and you need balls of steel to be the contrarian

True enough it is quite the thrill and also the one that is a bit crazy to use the shorts ^_^
It might work though but its easier to say buy low sell high than it is to say
Sell high short till it gets low then buy low and Hold till its High or their is a nice stable dividend to rely on instead of a share price appreciation.

Then again short and simple is sweet no need to add the rest

Sell High Buy Low and Short if Overvalued

twiifm

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Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on July 02, 2014, 02:02:54 AM

Quote from: twiifm on July 02, 2014, 12:49:50 AM

If there was a crash like 2008. I'd buy stocks hand over fist. Easy money.

You mean short the stocks hand over fist then buy the stocks back at a giant discount and keep the spare profits
Easy money

Yeah that too. Grin

I love shorting. I made a lot shorting TSLA, AMZN, TWTR from feb to april. Now I'm long on those plus DDD. And recently made killing on GPRO

But its really hard to see the trend though and you need balls of steel to be the contrarian

Swordsoffreedom

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Quote from: twiifm on July 02, 2014, 12:49:50 AM

If there was a crash like 2008. I'd buy stocks hand over fist. Easy money.

You mean short the stocks hand over fist then buy the stocks back at a giant discount and keep the spare profits
Easy money

CoinsCoinsEverywhere

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Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Quote from: okthen on July 01, 2014, 11:48:36 PM

A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

Yes, there needs to be an easy way to sell stocks and buy bitcoin (or a proxy thereof) on the same platform. If/when a bitcoin ETF becomes tradable, it will then be possible for average investors to buy into bitcoin easily.

twiifm

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If there was a crash like 2008. I'd buy stocks hand over fist. Easy money.

okthen

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A stock market crash right now wouldn't affect too much bitcoin. There's still not enough infrastructure/awareness to allow stock traders to quickly move to cryptos.
However, if it happens in a year or so, the scenario might be completely different and cause a major buy in into btc.

STT

legendary

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Dollar index has fallen from 120 in year 2000 to below 80 now. If it keeps falling like it has, that would seem to favour alternatives. Thats a rate of 1.9% deprecation compounded so what is bitcoins annual inflation. I know in theory its capped one day but now

DannyElfman

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Quote from: abercrombie on June 30, 2014, 12:09:38 AM

I believe we'd get some percentage of residual money from a stock market crash.

When the stock market goes down, there is a strengthening of the USD which economists call a "flight to quality."

Bitcoin is an alternative to the dollar.

I would say that bitcoin is more of a competitor to the dollar. If the dollar rallies due to the flight to quality (safety) then competitors would fall

STT

legendary

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Strength of the dollar is a major thing to watch when predicting the prices of commodities. I agree if stocks crash it usually means stronger dollar, that would also mean greater pressure on the price of Bitcoin. If it just stays steady then value has risen, its rising with dollar so thats good but there is pressure on any commodity price when a currency is stronger, oil too usually.

Thats not bad because an economy benefits from lower prices. If oil rises too much it starts to effect business cost and profitability/viability. So at the moment I think bitcoin would act like a commodity in that respect. The bigger deal is will dollars always rise on this sell off or fear type move in markets and its likely not going to always be this way.
When gov was threatening not to pay its debt, the price and value of that debt rose which is stupid but its from the same effect which is most trade is settled in dollars (including bitcoin)

Quote

If the production cost is higher than market price, then the widget will slowly disappear.

Comes back to supply and demand. The widget might have competitive alternatives but its either a needed item or not, if in demand it'll then rise in price till above production cost

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