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Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1386. (Read 4670630 times)

legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
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this opens up Monero to a huge "pre-mine" debate that could get ugly fast.

oh blah blah blah says the coin that sets aside 1% premine for the dev with no accountability.   Cheesy

There is accountability to the miners who can turn it off if they don't like what is happening. Miners don't represent the whole community certainly but that is not no accountability.

legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
Is it seriously being considered to change emission rates? I am shocked if smooth or other devs agreed to this

Nobody agreed to anything it is merely a discussion.

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I see changing the emission rate as just short term thinking by greedy coin holders who are tired of the price not going to da moon. Short sightedness kills things. Including coins.

I will never agree to any change that is supported on that basis. Obviously hidden motives are impossible identify with certainly, but if anything is to be done there will need to be a strong justification for it that does not include price manipulation.

legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
A post mine is completely out of the question in my book.

Jesus. This isn't the USD where the government just tries to solve it's problems by printing more money. I mean wtf.

The only option is to change the emission schedule.

What is the problem with price going down for now until more adoption? If the coin is legit it will succeed. As i said if someone believes that the price will fall then sell now buy back later.

It almost feels like this is a panic decision driven buy Risto and his "whale" collective that are watching their BTC wealth dwindle and have been unable to prop up the XMR price. So they seem desperate to do anything to increase the price. No patience.

And before you dismiss my motives for saying this, consider this point. One of the biggest marketing points for BBR to new investors we are constantly meeting with is the value of XMR. The better XMR performs short term the better for us.

But if you guys keep doing controversial things it hurts us all.
legendary
Activity: 1750
Merit: 1036
Facts are more efficient than fud
A post mine is completely out of the question in my book.

Jesus. This isn't the USD where the government just tries to solve it's problems by printing more money. I mean wtf.

The only option is to change the emission schedule.

What is the problem with price going down for now until more adoption? If the coin is legit it will succeed. As i said if someone believes that the price will fall then sell now buy back later.

Adoption should increase with the GUI, so if a post-mine is the road, we should go down it prior to the GUI. Not siding here, just pointing out the time frame.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
I will bow out now, as I am sure I am not welcomed in this discussion. My apologies.

Not true, windjc. We don't chase people away from our thread because we disagree on their views on things nor because they happen to involved with another coin.

Your views are as valid as anyone else's.

Obnoxious signatures are an obvious turn off, and may result in your views being taken less seriously. But that is your call.

legendary
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1001
getmonero.org
A post mine is completely out of the question in my book.

Jesus. This isn't the USD where the government just tries to solve it's problems by printing more money. I mean wtf.

The only option is to change the emission schedule.

What is the problem with price going down for now until more adoption? If the coin is legit it will succeed. As i said if someone believes that the price will fall then sell now buy back later.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
if Monero changes the emission I'm out.

The main body of XMR emission is set in stone and not going to change.

The tail-end emission has yet to be determined.

Is it seriously being considered to change emission rates?

You can't "change" something that hasn't been decided yet...

Once again:

The main body of XMR emission is set in stone and not going to change.

The tail-end emission has yet to be determined.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
Quote
Hey, I'm just pointing out the obvious blow back that will occur, imo.
   Roll Eyes

*looks at wj sig*

suuuure u just have xmr's best interest at heart.  this is the dude that started the "official" boolberry name vote without boolberry as an option.  he's a clown

Ok. Look. We can agree to disagree. You like changing the emission. I don't think its a good idea. I actually think it will hurt XMR and probably, if anything, help BBR. But we don't have to make it personal. I was just generally surprised thats all. I will bow out now, as I am sure I am not welcomed in this discussion. My apologies.
legendary
Activity: 1750
Merit: 1036
Facts are more efficient than fud
Debate timeout:  Smiley

legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
if Monero changes the emission I'm out.

The main body of XMR emission is set in stone and not going to change.

The tail-end emission has yet to be determined.

Is it seriously being considered to change emission rates? I am shocked if smooth or other devs agreed to this, as (although it wouldn't necessarily be my opinion) this opens up Monero to a huge "pre-mine" debate that could get ugly fast. My opinion would be to stick to the current emission rates and not give devs blocks. Fund raise from within. You guys have enough whales where dev funds should never be an issue.

Emissions aren't ideal with XMR, but changing the emission rate opens up a huge can of worms, imo.  

I see changing the emission rate as just short term thinking by greedy coin holders who are tired of the price not going to da moon. Short sightedness kills things. Including coins.

Something like this could be a compromise solution, if it is made sure the devs will not dump those coins immediately (for instance by putting the coins in escrow and pay as a reward based on some guidelines of proven performance).

What I don't understand is the Risto and other whales are creating the "MEW" and all these other "whale" things, yet the developers are going hungry. How the hell does this happen?
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
Quote
Hey, I'm just pointing out the obvious blow back that will occur, imo.
   Roll Eyes

*looks at wj sig*

suuuure u just have xmr's best interest at heart.  this is the dude that started the "official" boolberry name vote without boolberry as an option.  he's a clown
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
Quote
this opens up Monero to a huge "pre-mine" debate that could get ugly fast.

oh blah blah blah says the coin that sets aside 1% premine for the dev with no accountability.   Cheesy

Hey, I'm just pointing out the obvious blow back that will occur, imo.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
if Monero changes the emission I'm out.

The main body of XMR emission is set in stone and not going to change.

The tail-end emission has yet to be determined.

Is it seriously being considered to change emission rates? I am shocked if smooth or other devs agreed to this, as (although it wouldn't necessarily be my opinion) this opens up Monero to a huge "pre-mine" debate that could get ugly fast. My opinion would be to stick to the current emission rates and not give devs blocks. Fund raise from within. You guys have enough whales where dev funds should never be an issue.

Emissions aren't ideal with XMR, but changing the emission rate opens up a huge can of worms, imo.  

I see changing the emission rate as just short term thinking by greedy coin holders who are tired of the price not going to da moon. Short sightedness kills things. Including coins.

Something like this could be a compromise solution, if it is made sure the devs will not dump those coins immediately (for instance by putting the coins in escrow and pay as a reward based on some guidelines of proven performance).
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
Quote
this opens up Monero to a huge "pre-mine" debate that could get ugly fast.

oh blah blah blah says the coin that sets aside 1% premine for the dev with no accountability.   Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
if Monero changes the emission I'm out.

The main body of XMR emission is set in stone and not going to change.

The tail-end emission has yet to be determined.

Is it seriously being considered to change emission rates? I am shocked if smooth or other devs agreed to this, as (although it wouldn't necessarily be my opinion) this opens up Monero to a huge "pre-mine" debate that could get ugly fast. My opinion would be to stick to the current emission rates and not give devs blocks. Fund raise from within. You guys have enough whales where dev funds should never be an issue.

Emissions aren't ideal with XMR, but changing the emission rate opens up a huge can of worms, imo.  

I see changing the emission rate as just short term thinking by greedy coin holders who are tired of the price not going to da moon. Short sightedness kills things. Including coins.
legendary
Activity: 1344
Merit: 1001
A post mine is completely out of the question in my book.

Jesus. This isn't the USD where the government just tries to solve it's problems by printing more money. I mean wtf.

The only option is to change the emission schedule.
legendary
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1001
getmonero.org

What we see now is the lack of capability of absorbing the coins (the price is declining slowly).


If it is declining sell now and buy back later. In order for the price to go up we need bigger community and more places to actually spend the coins. We dont need forced slower emission.

And price isnt really declining because of the emission.
We need better optimized miners and without the 5% fee. This will reduce dumps and bring more miners.
Price felt because bitcoin also felt and we know that we are far from being independent from btc price.
Price took a hit because of the alleged attack. There was a shitstorm of FUD. People still arent sure if a bug existed or not, if there is an ongoing attack or not, if BCX can do what he claimed or not.

We need more adoption. And adoption wont come because someone on trollbox said that monero is best coin ever. Actually these days coins must start thinking about adoption outside of bitcointalk forums.


The fact that it is cheap for more time  because of high emission is good. And it is not too cheap either. There is time for more people to get involved. We should be probably asking people to mine the coin. And keep what they get for some months.
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1012
Still wild and free
I have no patience for reading the complete thread of 775 pages (and also my time is limited).
However, when it comes to emission curve, ideally it should go along with adoption.
When adoption is 5 times, also the emission should be 5 times.

What we see now is the lack of capability of absorbing the coins (the price is declining slowly).
Price is the best indicator wether the emission is ideal or not - and it is retarded to maintain something that is not ideal just because it is "holy and unquestionable like the Pope". When they decided the emission rate earlier in the voting, the decision was made on based on the best knowledge of that time - however now we are in September and over 20 % of coins mined, now it is the moment of truth: is the current emission rate ideal for status quo?
Do we have adoption enough to maintain the price (or prefertably even increasing it slowly so that the investors will continue being interested in buying the coins - personally I am not buyer at this moment - I am not dumper neither but I have a stack that I am satisfied and I do not see any reason to increase it especially if there is no incentive for such).

Agreed on emission ideally following adoption, but not agreed that it should be changed to match it.
The fact that your exact argument could be made in 6 months again if a changed was applied now, strongly undermines its relevance.

And no, saying "we sear it will only happen once" is not going to give holders back the confidence they'd be losing.

Saying "retarded" does not help anything.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
when it comes to emission curve, ideally it should go along with adoption.
When adoption is 5 times, also the emission should be 5 times.

What we see now is the lack of capability of absorbing the coins (the price is declining slowly).
Price is the best indicator wether the emission is ideal or not - and it is retarded to maintain something that is not ideal just because it is "holy and unquestionable like the Pope". When they decided the emission rate earlier in the voting, the decision was made on based on the best knowledge of that time - however now we are in September and over 20 % of coins mined, now it is the moment of truth: is the current emission rate ideal for status quo?
Do we have adoption enough to maintain the price (or prefertably even increasing it slowly so that the investors will continue being interested in buying the coins - personally I am not buyer at this moment - I am not dumper neither but I have a stack that I am satisfied and I do not see any reason to increase it especially if there is no incentive for such).
I am dumper if the price starts drastically decline from the current and when I dump, I most likely will never touch the coin anymore.

Ideally the coin should serve all the stakeholders: miners, developers, investors.
The "ever increasing price trend" serves all these stakeholder groups, miners get more money from their mined coins, developers get more donations/their stack grows in value and investors get their annual rate of return.

The blockreward should be dimished or make a stash from each block, for example 25 % of each block rewards goes to the escrowed fund that finances the development and pays after something has achieved according to the burden.
The other way is simply to lengthen the emission curve, it can be done wether making a block to appear every 3 minutes instead of every 1 minute or it can be adjusted by decreasing the block reward for example 33 % the latter will give more time for development and is more gracious towards adoption, it means the later adopters get also relatively long not too expensive coins.

The lowering of blockreward is not bad for later adopters IMO as long as the total coin supply stays constant, it just gives more time for people to join in to the party.

Tail-end aside, the emission curve is what it is.  The market has already priced XMR accordingly and it's not going to change.

You have to accept the volatility and occasional pumps/dumps.  It's economically impossible for something to only go up and never down.

Two steps forward one step back Fibonacci retrenchment/fortification is the healthiest way to grow with true strength.

A 25% devtax on mining is politically impossible and guaranteed to result in a fork.

The devs will never agree to change Monero as a result of, or in attempt to manipulate, transient market conditions.  That's why we love it!
legendary
Activity: 2268
Merit: 1141
Is moneropool.com down?

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[21:38] dEBRUYNE: the pool is still working, only the webservers broken
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