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Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1388. (Read 4671575 times)

legendary
Activity: 1154
Merit: 1001
Bter and Bittrex disabled deposits.
Mintpal opened, but doesn't work.
Only Poloniex and Hitbtc accept coins.

Atrides: Could you perhaps add exchange monitoring to forkguard?  Smiley
Cheers!
hero member
Activity: 658
Merit: 500
Admin of DwarfPool.com
Hi,
I sent 10 XMR to bittrex at 23 09 2014. Now xmr wallet at bitrex is offline (dev requested).I use 3 as mix parameter,,but I still don't  receive any XMR coins. Is 2 days  normal time for transaction?
May be I have to contact bittrex for more information?


Bter and Bittrex disabled deposits.
Mintpal opened, but doesn't work.
Only Poloniex and Hitbtc accept coins.
member
Activity: 90
Merit: 10
Hi,
I sent 10 XMR to bittrex at 23 09 2014. Now xmr wallet at bitrex is offline (dev requested).I use 3 as mix parameter,,but I still don't  receive any XMR coins. Is 2 days  normal time for transaction?
May be I have to contact bittrex for more information?
newbie
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
It is our pleasure to announce that the MEW is officially opened. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/monero-economy-workgroup-the-mew-thread-776479
Please read the OP, we updated it compared the original one.
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1030
Sine secretum non libertas
Quote
who is worried about the prospect of emission being as fast as it is.

If the solution for future adoption is to slow it down though.  The later that conclusion is reached - the more damage has been done.

This is only true if there is a discontinuity in the emission.  If instead, there were a redenomination of the extant emission, the damage to adoption would not be an issue.
Current holders would be sacrificing some small present value in favor of anticipated future gains due to enhanced adoption.

legendary
Activity: 2324
Merit: 1125
However there is another aspect in danger here: fairness between holders across time. Any change would split monero holders forever into the before-change holders and the after-change newcomers. The latters criticizing the formers for the advantage they got over them. Serious drawback for adoption to be carried forever.                  

Definitely a valid point. If it were not addressed adequately could very well spell the undoing of any change, and I'm not sure whether or not it can be.

Likewise about there being a possible silent majority that would be strongly against it. Again I'm not sure how we could know whether there is or not.

I have some ideas to handle this in a way that I believe is absolutely 100% fair to everyone, but hard to implement. Perhaps we consider that at a later time when there are less pressing issues.


I agree 100% to flattening the emission curve to benefit later adopters.  Sadly it also benefits early adopters before the curve by slowing things down early.  So maybe it benefits late & early adopters at the expense of middle adopters?

But more than that on a fundamental discussion like this would be figuring out how to "vote" with real monero supporters.

On idea is to have people spend Monero for a vote that goes into the dev fund.  Since we are massively underfunded I like the idea of pitting two groups against each other in a fundamental vote and throwing the proceeds at the dev fund.

(I do think what money has been spent by the devs needs to be documented - and the dev fund needs to be transparent)

Another is to have a 3 month (or even 1 month) escrow.  This should get rid of a lot of the bytecoin shills.  Instead of proving they just have the coins (buy from market, vote, sell) they have to send to a pre-determined escrow and the coins are released after 1 - 3 months.

I like the idea of funding development, and funding mining too.

But...
Beyond the practicalities, the problem with voting is that the minority loses.  Whichever way it goes some will see what they bought, changed without their consent (and against their wishes) after they got it home.
If a vote were called, I suspect some folks would simply sell, and if it comes out the way they want, buy back.

Not everyone is so generous as we.

Yes, I'd be against any such change.
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1002
Gresham's Lawyer
However there is another aspect in danger here: fairness between holders across time. Any change would split monero holders forever into the before-change holders and the after-change newcomers. The latters criticizing the formers for the advantage they got over them. Serious drawback for adoption to be carried forever.                  

Definitely a valid point. If it were not addressed adequately could very well spell the undoing of any change, and I'm not sure whether or not it can be.

Likewise about there being a possible silent majority that would be strongly against it. Again I'm not sure how we could know whether there is or not.

I have some ideas to handle this in a way that I believe is absolutely 100% fair to everyone, but hard to implement. Perhaps we consider that at a later time when there are less pressing issues.


I agree 100% to flattening the emission curve to benefit later adopters.  Sadly it also benefits early adopters before the curve by slowing things down early.  So maybe it benefits late & early adopters at the expense of middle adopters?

But more than that on a fundamental discussion like this would be figuring out how to "vote" with real monero supporters.

On idea is to have people spend Monero for a vote that goes into the dev fund.  Since we are massively underfunded I like the idea of pitting two groups against each other in a fundamental vote and throwing the proceeds at the dev fund.

(I do think what money has been spent by the devs needs to be documented - and the dev fund needs to be transparent)

Another is to have a 3 month (or even 1 month) escrow.  This should get rid of a lot of the bytecoin shills.  Instead of proving they just have the coins (buy from market, vote, sell) they have to send to a pre-determined escrow and the coins are released after 1 - 3 months.

I like the idea of funding development, and funding mining too.

But...
Beyond the practicalities, the problem with voting is that the minority loses.  Whichever way it goes some will see what they bought, changed without their consent (and against their wishes) after they got it home.
If a vote were called, I suspect some folks would simply sell, and if it comes out the way they want, buy back.

Not everyone is so generous as we.
legendary
Activity: 2268
Merit: 1141
Can anyone tell me what happened?About twenty-four hours ago,I sended 10 XMR to my account on mintpal plartform ,but I still don't  receive any XMR coins,What happen?please help me,thanks




You have to contact Mintpal, they are the worst Monero exchange so good luck.

i see,thanks your quick reply

You better use poloniex, more liquidity there. Also I don't know if mintpal already defroze withdraws and deposits.
donator
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1060
GetMonero.org / MyMonero.com
(I do think what money has been spent by the devs needs to be documented - and the dev fund needs to be transparent)

Every cost is detailed and noted in a document the entire core team has access to. However, there is information in that document that could potentially compromise people who wish to remain pseudonymous / private (eg. the transaction ID of BTC payments reveal their address). Coupled with that is the very real probability of the information being used to criticise us, which means we'll waste more time explaining why we spent X on Y than on getting things done.

We can fix the first problem by not revealing transaction IDs, for instance, but then there's no verification of the information.

We're open to a discussion about how we can solve this without opening the trollgates and without compromising anyone. However, I think that is a discussion we should table for a later stage, as right now we're covering the bulk of the costs out of our pocket so the only people we'd affect is ourselves:-P
newbie
Activity: 19
Merit: 0
Can anyone tell me what happened?About twenty-four hours ago,I sended 10 XMR to my account on mintpal plartform ,but I still don't  receive any XMR coins,What happen?please help me,thanks

http://d.pcs.baidu.com/thumbnail/09d8cba0d685893dcab630f2c6b23ad9?fid=2302147323-250528-352818782664868&time=1411653600&sign=FDTAER-DCb740ccc5511e5e8fedcff06b081203-xfq%2BmRvQKP1NpWPz0HId%2FyVHJe8%3D&rt=sh&expires=2h&r=402572072&sharesign=unknown&size=c710_u500&quality=100


You have to contact Mintpal, they are the worst Monero exchange so good luck.

i see,thanks your quick reply
member
Activity: 99
Merit: 10
XMR is the future.
legendary
Activity: 1256
Merit: 1009
Quote
who is worried about the prospect of emission being as fast as it is.

If the solution for future adoption is to slow it down though.  The later that conclusion is reached - the more damage has been done.
legendary
Activity: 1470
Merit: 1007
Yeah, that's not how it works...

Warning ominously that the mere discussion "hurts the coin", then happily jumping into the discussion explaining why emission change is bad.

(Important note, by the way: I'm sure everyone in this discussion is aware of it, but maybe not every silent reader is: this is about the *speed* of the emission, not the total number of emitted "units") Just to be perfectly clear.

Discussions like this are a necessary part of a community project like this, in my opinion. A bit like the Scottish referendum, I think: it's necessary to have it, and after it's done, every side should accept the result.

It's true that there was already a vote on this matter about half a year ago, but the community was much smaller back then, the proposal unworkable in a way (return mined coins), and it was mainly addressed at miners afaik.

So I think *having* this discussion is fair enough. We're not a religion where "the code" is some unquestionable gift from the gods. On the other hand, I understand the concern that a *never-ending* discussion on this topic will hurt the value.

So, I'm fine with postponing this discussion when a) the current attack (or "attack") is long forgotten, and b) we have secured more funding for the devs. But eventually, this discussion will have to be had, because I know I'm not the only one who is in this project for the long run , who is worried about the prospect of emission being as fast as it is.
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
I agree 100% to flattening the emission curve to benefit later adopters.  Sadly it also benefits early adopters before the curve by slowing things down early.  So maybe it benefits late & early adopters at the expense of middle adopters?

Hope it is not a horizontal line. A slower emission will do for me, such as half every 6-10 years. I reckon the life expectancy of XMR 1.0 will be much longer than 50 years.
legendary
Activity: 1256
Merit: 1009
However there is another aspect in danger here: fairness between holders across time. Any change would split monero holders forever into the before-change holders and the after-change newcomers. The latters criticizing the formers for the advantage they got over them. Serious drawback for adoption to be carried forever.                  

Definitely a valid point. If it were not addressed adequately could very well spell the undoing of any change, and I'm not sure whether or not it can be.

Likewise about there being a possible silent majority that would be strongly against it. Again I'm not sure how we could know whether there is or not.

I have some ideas to handle this in a way that I believe is absolutely 100% fair to everyone, but hard to implement. Perhaps we consider that at a later time when there are less pressing issues.


I agree 100% to flattening the emission curve to benefit later adopters.  Sadly it also benefits early adopters before the curve by slowing things down early.  So maybe it benefits late & early adopters at the expense of middle adopters?

But more than that on a fundamental discussion like this would be figuring out how to "vote" with real monero supporters.

On idea is to have people spend Monero for a vote that goes into the dev fund.  Since we are massively underfunded I like the idea of pitting two groups against each other in a fundamental vote and throwing the proceeds at the dev fund.

(I do think what money has been spent by the devs needs to be documented - and the dev fund needs to be transparent)

Another is to have a 3 month (or even 1 month) escrow.  This should get rid of a lot of the bytecoin shills.  Instead of proving they just have the coins (buy from market, vote, sell) they have to send to a pre-determined escrow and the coins are released after 1 - 3 months.
member
Activity: 94
Merit: 10
Like you, I believe that stability is important to value


Got your point about seeking future stability.

However there is another aspect in danger here: fairness between holders across time. Any change would split monero holders forever into the before-change holders and the after-change newcomers. The latters criticizing the formers for the advantage they got over them. Serious drawback for adoption to be carried forever.                 
                         

Totally agree. It's the real risk for future adoption and possible criticism. But this risk is comparable with the one regarding the lack of funds in the hands of developers for solid progress in development.

But there are definitely other ways to solve it. Not only the abrupt change of rules during the crisis.
full member
Activity: 201
Merit: 100
...

Please make a new clone from github one more time. There was a bad commit that got removed but then got reapplied later. Some people ended up with the wrong one. Everything is fixed now afaik.

I cloned again this morning and everything appears to syncing perfectly.  Thanks again!
sr. member
Activity: 473
Merit: 250






That's the thing, the practicality of verifying that  a change is a majority decision is hard enough. Let alone even fairly defining a majority of what.
There are a multitude of systems that are all arguably fair but could provide drastically different results in a vote.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
However there is another aspect in danger here: fairness between holders across time. Any change would split monero holders forever into the before-change holders and the after-change newcomers. The latters criticizing the formers for the advantage they got over them. Serious drawback for adoption to be carried forever.                  

Definitely a valid point. If it were not addressed adequately could very well spell the undoing of any change, and I'm not sure whether or not it can be.

Likewise about there being a possible silent majority that would be strongly against it. Again I'm not sure how we could know whether there is or not.

I have some ideas to handle this in a way that I believe is absolutely 100% fair to everyone, but hard to implement. Perhaps we consider that at a later time when there are less pressing issues.




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