Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1923. (Read 4671108 times)

When all you've got is Hooke's law, everything looks like a spring

Cryptocurrencies face a number of future problems, including but not limited to:

- transaction witholding attacks
- centralized distribution via lending of promisory notes (back to fiat)
- transaction fee escalations
- network centralization of wealth

These issues can all be solved or greatly mitigated with a reasonable, fixed inflation. There are no other solutions that I know of that are nearly as elegant.

Guys, a fixed subsidy will not work. This was already explained in the MRO economy thread as well as here. If you want MRO to continue to grow after you reach the fixed subsidy, miners will again start relying on tx fees, and then you have fee escalation. A fixed subsidy will only delay the problem. You must have a fixed percentage annual debasement. 1% will not do shit to the value of your coins. Be reasonable.

Money will only lose value if you inflate the circulating money supply. A 1% annual increase to the total supply won't do a damn thing, except solve all kinds of problems. You must have a fixed debasement or the network will eventually be unsustainable.

Gold debases at more than 2%/year and it will not slow down in anyone's lifetime. We will mine from space or make our own gold via super colliders long before Earth's gold supply is tapped. Interestingly, the value of gold keeps going up...

Inflation at 1%
http://pastebin.com/3K0dMnZe

Reminder for pool ops wanting to use the experimental version with fixed block reward/mempool algos, follow these instructions for linux:

All simulations start after the initial 18,000,000 have been minted (I know it's not exactly 18,000,000, but it makes little difference.)

(Matlab code included in case I screwed up the math or something)

1 MRO released every 120 seconds
http://pastebin.com/UWLVZaam

1 MRO released every 60 seconds
http://pastebin.com/dkVYBFj3

0.33333333 MRO released every 60 seconds.
http://pastebin.com/GwQJQzje

Inflation at 1%
http://pastebin.com/3K0dMnZe

Inflation at 0.5%
http://pastebin.com/6tJtdrqP

Also, for fun times, Inflation at 5%
http://pastebin.com/z5vmmW3z

Awesome simulation! You guys make great points. The fixed rate is technically a variable interest as well, just going down all the time ... it took me a minute or ten to make the correlation which your simulation makes incredibly clear .

Having the fixed reward will set this apart in a great way, and does solve a whole lot of issues.

I like the direction we're headed in. Thanks for the discussion!

This is a good point and the reason I brought up Ethereum. They are the only coin doing things right with regards to the emission rate. (In my opinion :p)

Of course the difference between fixed amount and fixed percentage might not be much in our lifetimes, but it does differentiate us from other crypto. Most crypto either have a rate of increase in percent or a fixed limited supply.

I'm not sure of any big name coins that will a fixed absolute amount per year. Ethereum will be a top 10 crypto that will offer it and I wouldn't mind MRO being the other major Crypto to offer it.

Have a think about 1 MRO release for 120 second blocks.

The first year after emission of the initial supply ends you're left with a inflation rate of 1.4%

I wrote a matlab script to calculate inflation rate at 1 MRO blocks per 120 seconds for 1000 years.

Note the calculation starts when all 18,000,000 have already been minted.

http://pastebin.com/sKyXZBzB

The MIP I'm proposing will fix reward when it hits 0.33333333 per block, which, at that time, will result in slightly less than 1% inflation for the first year if I recall correctly, then progressively decreasing inflation each subsequent year.

(0.33333333*60*24*365)

Any news on a more user friendly wallet?

You can follow Bitkoot's progress on a .NET GUI wrapper here (Windows only):
https://github.com/BitKoot/CryptoNoteWallet

You can follow jwinterm's progress on a kivy GUI wrapper here (Windows, and probably Linux as well):
https://github.com/jwinterm/cryptonoteRPCwalletGUI

You can follow Neozaru's progress on a cross-platform Qt GUI wallet here:
https://github.com/Neozaru/bitmonero-qt

We also have another person working on a different Qt GUI implementation, but it's not public yet.

FWIW I endorse drawingthesun's view on fixed emission rates.  It fixes both the inflationary failure scenario and the inadequate fees failure scenario.  Therefore it eliminates a lot of the long-term viability threat.  It helps differentiate MRO from most other crypto, and in the long run it will facilitate the transition from the role of an extreme speculation vehicle to the role of a safe harbor.

Everything in this universe is a spring.

I got into Bitcoin because I don't want a similar release to gold. (Or banks!)

I always thought that Satoshi should have kept the 50 bitcoin reward constant, yeah the first 10 years would have had huge inflation but it would allow more people to get on board during the early years. Then 50 years in bitcoin would have been having a moderate inflation but still enough to entice all peoples to invest in a growing currency. 100 years and you're on 1% and then after you get the super rare phase.

Ethereum is the only coin doing it right I think, it'll be a constant supply and people can mine the same amount of Ethereum in a thousand years, but of course it'll be 0.0001% of the supply by then, causing all the Ethereum to hold great value.

In the meantime Bitcoin will be earning it's security from transaction fees. Good luck with that.

Oh and gold? Well gold is 1% now, but there is a limited amount in the Earth. gold is likely to decrease it's percent too, until space mining is a thing.

MRO under a 1% scheme would be worse, as the supply will increase every year, causing MRO to lose value year after year forever.

I would prefer not to have a compounding 1% devaluation of everyones holdings for all time. :p

I really like the idea of lowest reward being 1 MRO per block. Remember that transaction fees would also add quite a bit by that time (As this assumes MRO is being widely used in 20 - 40 years and hasn't died!)