[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1969.

Pale Phoenix

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Quote from: fluffypony on May 21, 2014, 06:12:52 PM

Quote from: aminorex on May 21, 2014, 06:08:07 PM

Quote from: fluffypony on May 21, 2014, 06:05:38 PM

Darkcoin will have the largest market share (measured by market cap excluding any premined or instamined coins) among all the cryptocurrencies focused on anonymity (including Monero, Bytecoin, and Anoncoin) in 12 months time. Let me know when it's setup and I'll throw my 5 BTC down.

I would take that bet as well, but not on bitbet. Via escrow. 5 BTC. Let me know.

BitBet.us opens it up, though, to larger bets in the pool instead of it being a person-to-person deal...let's see what our dear friend "darkota" says and we can figure out if this is going to play out or go nowhere:)

I like it. Put it up on Bitbet. You'll have to specify exact parameters for mkt cap (number of coins disqualified, etc.) to get the bet approved.

sorryforthat

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Quote from: Jarod1231 on May 21, 2014, 06:13:28 PM

Somebody want to tell me the command line to get a receiving address?

do help to get it all

getaddress

Jarod1231

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Somebody want to tell me the command line to get a receiving address?

fluffypony

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GetMonero.org / MyMonero.com

Quote from: aminorex on May 21, 2014, 06:08:07 PM

Quote from: fluffypony on May 21, 2014, 06:05:38 PM

Darkcoin will have the largest market share (measured by market cap excluding any premined or instamined coins) among all the cryptocurrencies focused on anonymity (including Monero, Bytecoin, and Anoncoin) in 12 months time. Let me know when it's setup and I'll throw my 5 BTC down.

I would take that bet as well, but not on bitbet. Via escrow. 5 BTC. Let me know.

BitBet.us opens it up, though, to larger bets in the pool instead of it being a person-to-person deal...let's see what our dear friend "darkota" says and we can figure out if this is going to play out or go nowhere:)

aminorex

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Sine secretum non libertas

Quote from: fluffypony on May 21, 2014, 06:05:38 PM

Darkcoin will have the largest market share (measured by market cap excluding any premined or instamined coins) among all the cryptocurrencies focused on anonymity (including Monero, Bytecoin, and Anoncoin) in 12 months time. Let me know when it's setup and I'll throw my 5 BTC down.

I would take that bet as well, but not on bitbet. Via escrow. 5 BTC. Let me know.

fluffypony

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GetMonero.org / MyMonero.com

Quote from: darkota on May 21, 2014, 05:39:42 PM

I'm sure Darkcoin won't depend on the Masternodes for anonymity as much once Ring Signatures and I2P are implemented. The nodes might just serve as an incentive to help maintain the network...unlike Bitcoin where hosting nodes does nothing to help you personally.

I2P, while java may introduce additional inconveniences at first, I don't see much of a threat, especially when it can be improved upon over and over with Dev's like Evan...

So overall, masternodes might be an incentive, while the I2P and Ring Signatures are the real anonymity...still leaving Darkcoin ahead of the competition.

I can see that trying to have a debate with you will be fruitless. How about you put your money where your mouth is - set a bet up on BitBet.us for 5 BTC and I'll match it with 5 BTC on the other side. We can make it simple and based on your post: Darkcoin will have the largest market share (measured by market cap excluding any premined or instamined coins) among all the cryptocurrencies focused on anonymity (including Monero, Bytecoin, and Anoncoin) in 12 months time. Let me know when it's setup and I'll throw my 5 BTC down.

aminorex

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Sine secretum non libertas

If you really want to eliminate botnets, mine coins in a way that only a human can do. We can call it proof-of-work-by-human, or "a job" for short.

Alternatively, I advocate whitelisting peers. Choke them off at the network.

aminorex

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Sine secretum non libertas

Quote from: phzi on May 21, 2014, 05:53:25 PM

Ya, let the GUIs come with time. I see this as a non-issue so far.

I rather like the lack of a GUI. It allows me to easily discriminate which trolls I should put on ignore, and which I should proselytize.

othe

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Quote from: phzi on May 21, 2014, 05:53:25 PM

Quote from: mr_random on May 21, 2014, 05:47:22 PM

Quote from: xibeijan on May 21, 2014, 05:45:35 PM

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind. DarkCoin has also Masternode mining which opens a new dimension for mining.... more incentive.

Bytecoin devs are elusive and have been mining their own coin since 2012 while everyone else was left out....

Isn't Darkcoin closed source though? And I thought they were thinking of copying the ring signature idea as it offers enhanced anonymity? Monero is many, many times cheaper than DarkCoin too.

No, it is open source... https://github.com/darkcoinproject/darkcoin . DarkCoin was originally forked from litecoin.

That said, Monero likely offers a much higher degree of anonymity then afforded by DarkCoin.

Quote from: surfer43 on May 21, 2014, 05:50:27 PM

Quote from: xibeijan on May 21, 2014, 05:45:35 PM

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind.

So.. it is only a proof of concept because it doesn't have a GUI? Several GUIs are coming for cryptonote, a few from the bounty and two (one nice, one basic) from Boolberry devs. Max time for a fully functional GUI is two months. Basic ones will be ready well before then.

There are already alpha GUIs right now.

Ya, let the GUIs come with time. I see this as a non-issue so far.

The biggest thing Monero would benefit from right now, is a GPU miner. CPU-only is a guaranteed way to put the majority of the coins in the hands of criminals/botnet owners.

Darksend and the Masternode stuff is not open source Wink

?

CPU only is fine, Darkcoin was supposed to be cpu only...but that didnt last long.

It doesnt matter for a Botnet if they launch minerd or cgminer, there are tons of Botnets on Litecoin

phzi

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Quote from: mr_random on May 21, 2014, 05:47:22 PM

Quote from: xibeijan on May 21, 2014, 05:45:35 PM

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind. DarkCoin has also Masternode mining which opens a new dimension for mining.... more incentive.

Bytecoin devs are elusive and have been mining their own coin since 2012 while everyone else was left out....

Isn't Darkcoin closed source though? And I thought they were thinking of copying the ring signature idea as it offers enhanced anonymity? Monero is many, many times cheaper than DarkCoin too.

No, it is open source... https://github.com/darkcoinproject/darkcoin . DarkCoin was originally forked from litecoin.

That said, Monero likely offers a much higher degree of anonymity then afforded by DarkCoin.

Quote from: surfer43 on May 21, 2014, 05:50:27 PM

Quote from: xibeijan on May 21, 2014, 05:45:35 PM

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind.

So.. it is only a proof of concept because it doesn't have a GUI? Several GUIs are coming for cryptonote, a few from the bounty and two (one nice, one basic) from Boolberry devs. Max time for a fully functional GUI is two months. Basic ones will be ready well before then.

There are already alpha GUIs right now.

Ya, let the GUIs come with time. I see this as a non-issue so far.

The biggest thing Monero would benefit from right now, is a GPU miner. CPU-only is a guaranteed way to put the majority of the coins in the hands of criminals/botnet owners.

surfer43

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"Trading Platform of The Future!"

Quote from: xibeijan on May 21, 2014, 05:45:35 PM

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind.

So.. it is only a proof of concept because it doesn't have a GUI? Several GUIs are coming for cryptonote, a few from the bounty and two (one nice, one basic) from Boolberry devs. Max time for a fully functional GUI is two months. Basic ones will be ready well before then.

There are already alpha GUIs right now.

AlexGR

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Quote from: blaaaaacksuit on May 21, 2014, 05:45:20 PM

Quote from: AlexGR on May 21, 2014, 05:42:00 PM

Quote from: smooth on May 21, 2014, 05:37:04 PM

Scalable I guess not in an abstract sense, I would have to agree. I was only really disagreeing that it is an urgent problem. At anything close to 8x the transaction size of BTC, I don't see a crisis.

You should. Every weakness of MRO could be improved by BCN devs in a second iteration and say "hey, you know what? BCN was the original but had problems... In terms of scalability it was DOA (dead on arrival). Now we fixed those problems and we launch BCN 2.0 (another coin), with new blockchain tech etc etc, that can scale". RIP BCN1 + clones + our money.

You sure anyone would trust the devs of BCN at this point?

They have a proven track record of delivering an effective anonymous solution. If they replace premine greed with an IPO, Bitcoins will be flooding their way.

Quote

Isn't Darkcoin closed source though? And I thought they were thinking of copying the ring signature idea as it offers enhanced anonymity? Monero is many, many times cheaper than DarkCoin too.

Darkcoin is opensource. DarkSend is closed source while in development. It might take a month or two to get to opensourcing, after RC3/4/final.

Darkcoin has two options for V2. One is ring signatures. If it bloats the blockchain to non-scaleable levels, it'll probably take the second option. The other is encrypted transactions while mixing - or something to that effect.

mr_random

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Quote from: xibeijan on May 21, 2014, 05:45:35 PM

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind. DarkCoin has also Masternode mining which opens a new dimension for mining.... more incentive.

Bytecoin devs are elusive and have been mining their own coin since 2012 while everyone else was left out....

Isn't Darkcoin closed source though? And I thought they were thinking of copying the ring signature idea as it offers enhanced anonymity? Monero is many, many times cheaper than DarkCoin too.

xibeijan

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Activity: 1232

Merit: 1001

DarkCoin is way ahead. The Monero is just a proof-of-concept and command-line hacker only. It's far from a stable wallet that the average user can use. Miles and miles behind.

Bytecoin devs are elusive and have been mining their own coin since 2012 while everyone else was left out....

DarkCoin is the clear winner. It also has also Masternode mining which opens a new dimension for mining.... more incentive.

blaaaaacksuit

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Activity: 280

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Who cares?

Quote from: AlexGR on May 21, 2014, 05:42:00 PM

Quote from: smooth on May 21, 2014, 05:37:04 PM

Scalable I guess not in an abstract sense, I would have to agree. I was only really disagreeing that it is an urgent problem. At anything close to 8x the transaction size of BTC, I don't see a crisis.

You should. Every weakness of MRO could be improved by BCN devs in a second iteration and say "hey, you know what? BCN was the original but had problems... In terms of scalability it was DOA (dead on arrival). Now we fixed those problems and we launch BCN 2.0 (another coin), with new blockchain tech etc etc, that can scale". RIP BCN1 + clones + our money.

You sure anyone would trust the devs of BCN at this point?

AlexGR

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Quote from: smooth on May 21, 2014, 05:37:04 PM

Scalable I guess not in an abstract sense, I would have to agree. I was only really disagreeing that it is an urgent problem. At anything close to 8x the transaction size of BTC, I don't see a crisis.

You should. Every weakness of MRO could be improved by BCN devs in a second iteration and say "hey, you know what? BCN was the original but had problems... In terms of scalability it was DOA (dead on arrival). Now we fixed those problems and we launch BCN 2.0 (another coin), with new blockchain tech etc etc, that can scale". RIP BCN1 + clones + our money.

darkota

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Quote from: fluffypony on May 21, 2014, 05:19:24 PM

Quote from: darkota on May 21, 2014, 05:05:50 PM

Pretty much nothing...

I believe Darkcoin will be the #1, go-to, anonymous coin as it will have Masternodes, Ring Signatures, and I2P, while forks of Bytecoin such as Monero, HoneyPenny, Quazarcoin, etc will be lesser anonymous coins.

Masternodes: allows a bad actor to DDoS the legitimate nodes whilst maintaining a private network of their own nodes, and being able to observe and control the mix of transactions. It would be extremely trivial for law enforcement to create the semblance of anonymity whilst being able to fully monitor and control it, all because of the convenience of masternodes.

Ring signatures: I hope Darkcoin implement ring signatures in less than 6 months and in a manner that is not overly kludgy. The more coins that use the technology, the more refinement it goes through, and the more we can address challenges together.

I2P: we have decided this is a non-starter - forcing clients to run Java just introduces an additional attack surface and a set of dependencies. Monero already works through TOR.

I'm sure Darkcoin won't depend on the Masternodes for anonymity as much once Ring Signatures and I2P are implemented. The nodes might just serve as an incentive to help maintain the network...unlike Bitcoin where hosting nodes does nothing to help you personally.

I2P, while java may introduce additional inconveniences at first, I don't see much of a threat, especially when it can be improved upon over and over with Dev's like Evan...

So overall, masternodes might be an incentive, while the I2P and Ring Signatures are the real anonymity...still leaving Darkcoin ahead of the competition.

lohveh

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Quote from: Nekomata on May 21, 2014, 05:30:52 PM

Quote from: darkota on May 21, 2014, 05:05:50 PM

Quote from: Coindacioius on May 21, 2014, 04:53:06 PM

I think Monero looks like a very promising crypto right now.

However, what will be Monero's competitive advantage after Darkcoin implements ring signatures?

Pretty much nothing...

I believe Darkcoin will be the #1, go-to, anonymous coin as it will have Masternodes, Ring Signatures, and I2P, while forks of Bytecoin such as Monero, HoneyPenny, Quazarcoin, etc will be lesser anonymous coins.

I believe Monero will be the #1, go-to, anonymous coin as it has Cryptonote algo and Ring Signatures, while forks of Bitcoin such as Darkcoin are lesser anonymous coins.

Monero will be the #1 on the pump&dump scheme

smooth

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smooth on May 21, 2014, 04:53:33 PM

Quote from: Johnny Mnemonic on May 21, 2014, 04:39:42 PM

- is MRO scalable? No. Ring signatures add enormous bloat to the block chain that will become a big problem very soon.

I'm not sure about this one. It has been five years since bitcoin launched. That's roughly 3 doubles in Moore's law terms. I don't think typical MRO transactions are a lot more than 8 times larger than typical BTC transactions. Pruning will eventually become an issue, but again looking to the BTC example, in five years exactly zero has been done about pruning in BTC (though SPV clients have become common). Something will need done, but it is not urgent. I don't hold up BTC as a role model in terms of development, but it does show that these sorts of problems can exist and not cause crippling failure for several years.

There is certainly a cost to the way the anonymity features, but it isn't as if the cost doesn't come with an huge offsetting value proposition. It does.

In any case I definitely agree with your other points, about user-friendliness and "getting it out there." There is much work to do.

My question is the same, but with a different answer. Is MRO scalable? Maybe not - each transaction that is broadcast on the network has a small computational cost for EVERYONE with a node, IIRC. You have to check to see if it's for you.

Scalable I guess not in an abstract sense, I would have to agree. I was only really disagreeing that it is an urgent problem. At anything close to 8x the transaction size of BTC, I don't see a crisis.

biggernugs

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Personally I like MRO, but it's amazing how fast some people give up on a coin. It has a ways to go but when it arrives it will be well worth it.

Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1969. (Read 4670562 times)