Author

Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 914. (Read 4671920 times)

sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 250
So I have been out of the crypto world for a week or so and now all of a sudden Poloniex has sold out to the goverment.
I still would like to trade but don't wanna bother with the KYC bullshit.

Is there any alternatives you guys recommend? I have tried Bittrex but the volume is very low compared to Poloniex.



I said some days before SHTF that we should look back at Bter as alternative, I was already using Bittrex so I guess I'll be fine.

If cryptsy or other exchange could implement XMR right now it would be optimal for them (and us).
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Again, I don't see why that's necessary. All wallets should be "noob wallets" because payment ID should not be the concern of the sender. Give me an address to send coins to. That's it. Any additional step is unnecessary.

right, i get it, and it seems we are definitely moving towards that in some fashion (serialized addresses / payment IDs), if we're on the same page.

in the meantime, though, i would argue that a stop gap solution is warranted. I don't know if you're lurking on IRC, but almost all of the folks that drop in (i.e., are there for one purpose and then leave) ask about the payment ID. i mean, i'm generalizing, but its a lot.

That's exactly why you're both right.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1008
Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Again, I don't see why that's necessary. All wallets should be "noob wallets" because payment ID should not be the concern of the sender. Give me an address to send coins to. That's it. Any additional step is unnecessary.

right, i get it, and it seems we are definitely moving towards that in some fashion (serialized addresses / payment IDs), if we're on the same page.

in the meantime, though, i would argue that a stop gap solution is warranted. I don't know if you're lurking on IRC, but almost all of the folks that drop in (i.e., are there for one purpose and then leave) ask about the payment ID. i mean, i'm generalizing, but its a lot.

I proposed (and luigi1111 designed) a stop-gap solution that I believe would work great, and should be fairly simple to implement. It's just a matter of somebody doing it (luigi said he might).

well marvelous. Sorry I guess I didn't fully understand it.
hero member
Activity: 795
Merit: 514
Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Again, I don't see why that's necessary. All wallets should be "noob wallets" because payment ID should not be the concern of the sender. Give me an address to send coins to. That's it. Any additional step is unnecessary.

right, i get it, and it seems we are definitely moving towards that in some fashion (serialized addresses / payment IDs), if we're on the same page.

in the meantime, though, i would argue that a stop gap solution is warranted. I don't know if you're lurking on IRC, but almost all of the folks that drop in (i.e., are there for one purpose and then leave) ask about the payment ID. i mean, i'm generalizing, but its a lot.

I proposed (and luigi1111 designed) a stop-gap solution that I believe would work great, and should be fairly simple to implement. It's just a matter of somebody doing it (luigi said he might).
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
Did you guys here? I'm a DEV NOW! I've been anointed the title of Monero Dev by the community:

Monero's dev to do list this year ~ FluffyPony, GingerAle and Smooth

1. Changing our copied GUI wallet color from RED to BLUE.
2. Create once or twice a week a thread about EVAN even though we have starting problems just like every other coin did.
3. We Cry"p"to about it in forums.
4. Wait for another coin like Byte to coin from or actually for Byte to do something new and we change colors maybe?
5. THIS IS IMPORTANT let's all pray that monero investors don't get mad at us and ask for a newer team to actually do some work.
6. Hope their investors don't do what OTOH did and moving on with DASH.


BOW BEFORE MY AWESOME DEVNESS.

It doesn't take much to move up in this cryptoworld, does it?

ROTFLMFAO! Cheesy


Beauty of open source is we are all developers. 
 
If someone understands cryptography and can code, they are welcome to jump in and prove themselves.  Hell, the devs even maintain an open irc channel. 
 
But this is the kick ass desert island we have all woken up on, and not everyone is a carpenter.  Some of us are hunters, and some are fisherman.  Point is, everyone can contribute to the island, and there's a lot of jobs and roles on the road to making it a success. 

I guess Primer got the job of village idiot on our island.  No wonder he is so bitter.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
You're correct. Only retards take stupid-looking selfies and post them on the official thread hours before a conference. Who's going to take him seriously ?!

I'm having fun and enjoying myself, you should try it sometime:)

PS. Wrote you a limerick:

There once was a troll known as Primer
Whose insults were simply to-die-fer
It's a snap being mean
When you're behind a screen
And in mom's basement you're a resider

A view from mom's basement : http://imgur.com/i2Vy6LU

Monero is not going anywhere with you at the helm... I can tell a loser from afar.

Dude you shouldnt talk with that big dildo on your desk.

LMAO
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1008
Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Again, I don't see why that's necessary. All wallets should be "noob wallets" because payment ID should not be the concern of the sender. Give me an address to send coins to. That's it. Any additional step is unnecessary.

right, i get it, and it seems we are definitely moving towards that in some fashion (serialized addresses / payment IDs), if we're on the same page.

in the meantime, though, i would argue that a stop gap solution is warranted. I don't know if you're lurking on IRC, but almost all of the folks that drop in (i.e., are there for one purpose and then leave) ask about the payment ID. i mean, i'm generalizing, but its a lot.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
Preparing for tonight's meetup in Brussels, Belgium.


Step 4: ride in the smallest elevator ever (seriously, you can just barely fit two people sideways):

...


Its not the elevator, its you. Fatso.  You look cheap, I'm not surprised.

Better a cheap look, than being stupid Cheesy Improving the look is easy...


You're correct. Only retards take stupid-looking selfies and post them on the official thread hours before a conference. Who's going to take him seriously ?!

I think the pictures are cool.  Wish I could get out more.
hero member
Activity: 795
Merit: 514
Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Again, I don't see why that's necessary. All wallets should be "noob wallets" because payment ID should not be the concern of the sender. Give me an address to send coins to. That's it. Any additional step is unnecessary.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
hrm, I seem to have lost myself here. Are we talking about 3 different things?

1. Serialized addresses + payment IDs
2. Stealth payment IDs
3. User-end payment ID prompts


I disagree. I don't want to be bugged when I make ordinary payments. I rarely use exchanges and there are no (?) payment processors in the Monero space. Payment ID, blank or otherwise, is almost complete uninteresting to me, and I don't want to be prompted to enter one.

Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Sure, if there were actually a good reason to keep payment IDs separate. Payment IDs are fundamentally an optimization that happens to be useful to the inner workings (and in particular one that was apparently added last minute with little to no thought behind it), not something that end users need to be explicitly aware of, especially not noob users. (But see below.)

Quote
Quote
Serialized payment IDs are already on the development goals document and have been for several months. It's something that is going to happen. The only real questions revolve around how to implement it.

The other real question is when. Don't get me wrong, i'm all for making Monero better and more awesome, but IMO there's no reason not to create something in the interim. If the when is another year, thats another year of users sending money to an exchanges address void, etc. Granted, this goes against the philosophy implemented for the database effort, in that if Monero Core devs had opted instead to use the glorified scratchpad thing, there would be less urgency for database development.

Agree completely, in the sense that easier short term measures to address a problem are fine, as long as it isn't a lot of work and doesn't get in the way of other development plans.

I don't see a problem with a pull request that adds a no-pid warning to simplewallet for example, especially if it includes a config option to disable it. The developers of other wallets will do what they want, but simplewallet being the reference can and does lead by example.

full member
Activity: 186
Merit: 100
Monero
Yesterday marks my one year anniversary as a Monero holder Grin
It started a speculative position from a tip a close friend gave me, and it has grown to become my only holding in crypto. Call me crazy, but I am a big believer and in it for the long haul.
hero member
Activity: 687
Merit: 500
So I have been out of the crypto world for a week or so and now all of a sudden Poloniex has sold out to the goverment.
I still would like to trade but don't wanna bother with the KYC bullshit.

Is there any alternatives you guys recommend? I have tried Bittrex but the volume is very low compared to Poloniex.

legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1008
though I think we just found the topic of the next missive.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1008
hrm, I seem to have lost myself here. Are we talking about 3 different things?

1. Serialized addresses + payment IDs
2. Stealth payment IDs
3. User-end payment ID prompts


I disagree. I don't want to be bugged when I make ordinary payments. I rarely use exchanges and there are no (?) payment processors in the Monero space. Payment ID, blank or otherwise, is almost complete uninteresting to me, and I don't want to be prompted to enter one.

Yeah, i've heard this argument before and I think a solution is to make another wallet available. Noob wallet. Designed for bitcoiners coming to Monero.

Quote
Serialized payment IDs are already on the development goals document and have been for several months. It's something that is going to happen. The only real questions revolve around how to implement it.


The other real question is when. Don't get me wrong, i'm all for making Monero better and more awesome, but IMO there's no reason not to create something in the interim. If the when is another year, thats another year of users sending money to an exchanges address void, etc. Granted, this goes against the philosophy implemented for the database effort, in that if Monero Core devs had opted instead to use the glorified scratchpad thing, there would be less urgency for database development.

edited
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
The reason why someone suggested the idea was to “fix” the problem of Bitcoin users not paying attention to the payment ID field and making deposits the recipient cannot match, if I remember correctly. (Didn’t find the original post or the source of the idea, so it might not be correct.)

That was only part of the reason. The other reason is that the crypto ecosystem generally operates on the concept of address = destination. In addition to the use case of exchanges, payment processors generate an address for an invoice. When you pay to that address, the payment is applied to the invoice.

Payment IDs exist in cryptonote because of the cost of scanning for stealth address payments. Separating the destination into two parts ("address" and "payment ID") is simply an optimization to allow faster scanning of a large group of destinations, but that really isn't something that users need to be concerned with. (Payment IDs weren't even part of the original design, but were added later, after the Bytecoin "reveal" i.e. launch, most likely when their exchange identified the problem by trying to actually process payments without it.)

Quote
What responsible wallets could also do, to educate users about the “reference field” (payment IDs), is to prompt the user if they really want to leave the payment ID field empty. That way the users at least confirm that they know what they’re doing if they transfer money with an empty payment id.

I disagree. I don't want to be bugged when I make ordinary payments. I rarely use exchanges and there are no (?) payment processors in the Monero space. Payment ID, blank or otherwise, is almost completely uninteresting to me, and I don't want to be prompted to enter one.

Serialized and stealth payment IDs are already on the development goals document and have been for several months. It's something that is going to happen. The only real questions revolve around how to implement it. Once it is implemented there is little doubt it will be adopted by payees because of the vastly reduced support costs associated with explaining the separate payment ID concept to users who don't really care about it, and dealing with failures when that doesn't happen properly.

Stealth payment IDs are fine, and good for the case where payment IDs aren't assigned in a proper one-time use manner (the same issue solved by regular stealth addresses preventing Bitcoin's rampant, but in-theory unnecessary, address reuse). And indeed they can be encoded smaller (hex is dumb compared to base 58). But even if they are little shorter, Monero addresses(+pid) will still be extremely long (too long to memorize, and too long to be a drop-in replacement for BTC addresses), so I don't see much of a benefit there from the shorter length itself, in practice.

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we would soon get users who would want to pay to several of those addresses, but since this is technically not possible we will forbid that

This is an artifact of the how payment IDs were tacked onto the system at the last minute (after release in fact). There is no reason why a payment ID shouldn't be (optionally) attached to each destination, not the transaction itself. Failing that, any wallet presented with an attempt to send to multiple payment IDs can break up the transaction, just as they do now for transactions that are too large.

legendary
Activity: 1105
Merit: 1000
A few counterpoints for discussion:

Instead it will make the address technically more complex (instead of 2 bits of information it would be storing potentially 3). Also one has to remember, if you introduce such feature you can pretty much never remove it.

Agree and agree, though I don't see either as real barriers. It is prudent to consider these.

2. Ratify and implement stealth payment IDs (much shorter), can be expressed in both serialised and non-serialised formats

Has any work or discussion been done on this? I'd love to read about it if it's logged somewhere.

hero member
Activity: 795
Merit: 514
So I tend to agree that serializing the address + payment ID overcomplicates the issue. In the meantime, during these growing pains, I think the available wallets should be "dumbed down" to recognize that 90% of users are coming to Monero from Bitcoin, and the other 10% are the aliens that invented Cryptonote. And so the wallet should go "hey your sending money into the void, do you want to add a payment ID?"

GingerAle, if you owed me $50, payable by check, should it not be enough for you to simply write me a check for $50?

Is it reasonable for me to demand that you include a specific memo that, if forgotten, may result in the loss of your money?
hero member
Activity: 795
Merit: 514
Keep in mind the plan is to eventually serialize payment IDs into the address anyway.

This proposal is not to replace the current functionality, but to add optional new functionality for merchants to generate unique "receiving addresses" on the fly.

My philosophy is that it's not our place to dictate how these tools should be used, but instead to provide the functionality for the merchants and transactors to use them as they see fit.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
Update!!

Well I lost it all. My hard died on me. I was able to sync with bitmonerod (thanks for the help by the way). However, my .keys files went down with the hard drive... 534 Monero's!! almost a year worth of mining down the drain.

Well, i still have 1.5 KH/s worth of mining power. Back to the drawing board....

Word of caution to all - BACKUP/SAVE your stuff! Don't be me!!!



Sorry to hear that.

Just wanna give the following tip.

Depending on the drive, and if it is a mechanical problem, SOMETIMES turning the drive upside down gives you enough access time to get some files out.

I also read that getting it really cold (freezer) and then copying files quickly works for some people.  Sounds crazy but might be worth a try.  If monero ever gains a lot of value paying 2-3k for recovery will be a non issue.
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 4597
1. Is there a problem with older browsers (like Safari 5.1.10) and mymonero.com?
When I tried that browser version, i get an invalid key prompt (with all private key prompts typed properly), but I was able to get a wallet on a newer Safari.
2. Second question: is it safe to login using something called public keys, consisting of three items (public address, view key and spend key) or it is better to use 13 private keys for login, as tedious as it is?
3. Do you need transaction ID every time you want to receive funds?
4. What items/keys do you need to send funds?

perhaps this sounds naive, but the system looks quite different in use comparing with bitcoin, so I would appreciate the answer to these questions.

Glad to help.

1. Do not know off hand (someone else [fluffypony] may, so not going to look into it right now)
2. Either method is equally safe, IMO. Revealing either one to a third party means they can steal your funds. Seed is easier (though longer if manually typing) in that it's just one text box (for copy/paste purposes).
3. For receiving funds, it behaves very similarly to BTC. Give someone your address; they send funds to it. You don't need to "do" anything to receive them (verifying that you received a transaction is a different story).
4. Assuming you're logged into MyMonero already, you'll just need the receiver's public address to send them funds. If it's an exchange or other service, they'll probably provide you with a payment ID to use as well, so they can differentiate your transaction from other users'.

Great, thanks
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