Topic: XMR vs DRK - page 46. (Read 69755 times)

Thanks.

I have been called both a "frothing nutjob" and now a "fanboy" in this thread, so if nothing else, my skin is thicker for it. So, thanks again.

Unlike you, I wouldn't automatically forgive the devs of the single coin I have focused on since swimming through the sea of filth called Altcoins if they were to completely deceive the community and then say "Oops, my/our bad."

Way to take it personally when I posted my "ad hominem."

OK, and at this point I'll let you think you've triumphed in that little exchange.

Classic stuff.

Until you show me statistics about the mining community, then please shut up. You're not making any sense and I'm starting to think you're a troll. I've presented studies, facts, all you've presented is your ignorant "opinion".

It's fair? Are you dumb? Now, you're just letting your investment do the talking. Shame, I used to do the same.

Let me explain it simpler for you:

1) Dash/Darkcoin was released on linux only, to which less than 2% of computers on Earth have installed
2) There were 500 coins per block at release
3) Over 1million coins were instamined in 10 hours
4) Another 1million+ coins were instamined in the next 30 hours
5) The instamine stops
6) The developers of Dash cut the block reward by more than half
7) They then cut the coin supply from 80million to 20million(Way more than half)
Viola, in that period of time, the extremely small amount of linux users(Which happened to be the developers mostly and friends we can infer) mined over 2million Dashes, all while instantly making those Dashes worth over 3x more than they were when they first started mining, since they cut the coin supply.

BTW, to make that story even sketchier/scammier, at the time, Dash had no future, there were no plans to add anonymity to it, It was called Xcoin back then. This further shows that the instamine was intended and was mostly done by the developer, as there were absolutely no incentives for regular folk to mine this coin since it was just a random clonecoin with no future back then(Still is now, but has more features).
Is that easy enough for your small brain to understand?

Yeah, right  
Nice ad hominem.
I am an investor and unlikely crypto afficionado (unlikely, as I am the end user type of guy, no coder or IT guy) and when I read about that instamine story, I did not care at all about Evan, I did not know him. I was initially worried and then I thought "well, he messed it up, but ok, let`s move on, as he seems to be honest and the DRK guys are not too worried either". That was almost a year ago. During that time, Evan kept delivering and seems to me to be a nice competent guy. It has been a year during which everybody and their mom could have mined or bought DRK/DASH. Even I was able to do it.
By the way: I am also rather impressed by the XMR devs and have some XMR as well, as this is rational investor behavior to diversify your portfolio, unlike fanboys who put all eggs in one basket or have signatures showing they have a single affiliation to a single coin - that`s cultish behavior if you ask me.

No dude you're full of shit...general statistics on the global computing population don't represent the mining community. Do some research on mining.

Sounds like your opinion is based on your own experience of mining. You know that people run scale-out mining operations on AWS, with Linux? You think the serious GPU guys are putting hard disks into all their rigs and installing fucking billyware?

Sweet jesus


I said _nothing_ about that. All I said was that a coin launching with linux-only, windows-only or whatever only is TOTALLY FAIR. You don't have to mine it if you don't want to - how is it unfair?

I'm using statistics and surverys done on the subject, so you are in fact pointing out "facts", not inaccuracies. And according to those statistics 90% of all computers have windows, thats the simple fact. There's no getting around it, and yes you are trying to justify it, don't tell me otherwise when it's obvious by your wording and sentences.

It is extremely, extremely dishonest/unethical for a coin(dash/darkcoin) to have had 500 coins per block being emitted, to which over 1million coins were mined in under 10 hours, then another 1million mined for the next 30 hours, all on linux(Which less than 2% of all computers have). Then the block reward was cut from 500/200 per block to under 100, and finally the coin supply was cut from 80million to 20million, instantly making the instamined coins rarer and much, much more valuable(Over 3x more valuable instantly). There's no other way to put it, Dash/Darkcoin's instamine was a scam.

Cults are usually quite fond of their leaders. This case would be no exception.

Yep. I didn't mine Monero or any of the CN coins at launch or ever for that matter because I found installing and configuring that stuff too much of a work. And I tried to mine as many coins at launches as possible. But I'm not crying about it as I know it was my fault for being lazy.

For someone who is familiar with mining Bitcoin and Litecoin clones, installing VirtualBox + Ubuntu is much easier than trying to install and configure Monero on Windows. Or at least it was at the time of the launch, I'm sure they've made it easier by now.

Look I'm really not trying to justify the 'instamine', I'm just pointing out innacuracies in your post. You talk about the entire computing population of the world when estimating a percentage of miners running Linux.

Loads of CPU & GPU miners run Linux. There are dedicated, bootable Linux distributions designed specifically for mining like BAMT and SMOS.

Big GPU farms run Linux. You think it's easier to run loads of windows installs than USB-bootable BAMT?

Also, I don't see it as unethical to launch on CPU-only, wintel-only, linux-only - whatever-the-fuck-you-like-only.....it's up to you how you launch and up to miners if they mine or not. Miners are free, to do what they want, any old time...

Well you could have/can mine/d with windows for xmr. Windows isnt difficult(90% of all computers use windows).

As someone who is incapable of mining either on Linux or on Windows with all that complicated configuration stuff, I am outraged that neither Dash nor XMR have delivered easy plug-and-play miners way before. I feel scammed.

As Wolf0 showed in his thread about the x11 algo, it's basically a less efficient version of Scrypt, it is in no way special. It's extremely unethical, most altcoins I've seen allow you to mine on windows. It would have been a different story of the block reward/coin supply wasnt cut by more than half, but it was, which really makes this instamine a scam of sorts. Like others have also said, there are no other possible explanations. It's either it was a deliberate scam(Which most seems like it) or extreme, extreme incompetence.

I know lots of miners that don't use linux and use only windows, with me being one of them. Those figures can be applied to this field, the extremely disproportionate amount of people that use linux generally vs windows can also show that more people use windows here to mine than linux. It wouldn't make sense otherwise. You're trying to justify something(the instamine) that simply cannot be justified. I tried as well as I said before last year when I unfortunately supported this crap.

It is really a coincidence that they chose one of the least used operating systems on the planet? I think not.

I don't think those figures should apply to mining....it's a specialist area of computing. You really need figures to show percentage of mining rigs running on linux. Not sure what that would be, but I do know lots of miners run linux.

Anyway, I do suspect they might have launched on Linux to make mining more exclusive...either that or they couldn't be arsed with making windows miners - it was a completely new algo after all.

Even if they did deliberately exclude windows I don't see this as particularly unethical, it's just the way they chose to launch. Anyone could have put the work in and got mining on Linux.

As I've seen another user post this I'll use it, According to surveys etc done on the subject, less than 2% of all computers have linux installed. It's not a question of "Can users access linux", it's a question of "Do users even have linux installed to use". The fact that the instamine was reserved for the extremely small pool of linux users only(To which evan and internetape were), shows that it was intended. There's absolutely no reason for him to have released it on the operating system that less than 2% of all computers have installed, instead of windows for example, to which more than 90% of all computers have installed. Hell, even Mac/IOS would have been better. All these things like the block reward/coin supply being cut by more than half, not having a fair relaunch etc, put together shows just how irredeemable and downright dishonest dash/darkcoins instamine really was.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems

Not sure but I'd imagine 90% of CPU miners have at least access to Linux.

Even if you run Windows, VirtualBox+Ubuntu is free, so not having that option is just stupid.

Are you dumb honestly? 90% of people use windows, hardly anyone uses Linux. It's so funny to see you trying to defend Dash's instamine, which was literally a scam. It's funny because I used to be a supporter of Dash/Darkcoin, and would let my "investment" in the coin do the talking, disregarding any sense of morality for supporting a coin with a scam instamine, just like you right now. I still hold darkcoin, but I obviously don't support it, it's just a pump and dump to me now.

OK, since Masternode blinding has been a major bone of contention in this thread, I did some hunting for posts about the subject.

Here's what Evan posted recently:


The formula therefore gives the following probabilities with increasing numbers of compromised masternodes:

  - 3 rounds with 10 masternodes is ((10/2300.0)^20)^3 == 1.9784716837512123e-142
  - 4 rounds with 1000 masternodes is ((1000/2300.0)^20)^4 == 1.1528508353537028e-29
  - 4 rounds with 2000 masternodes is ((2000/2300)^20)^4 == 1.39371e-05

I also found this analogy posted by someone else on the probability of tracing a transaction:


And this infographic:



Even if you take the super-extreme example of comprimising 2,000 masternodes (over 85% of the network) there is still only a .00139% chance of tracing an individual transaction.

yeah man, super-convincing contribution you just made 

I, nor anyone else I don't think disputes the cryptography used in XMR.

This is all covered in the debate thus far. Seems to me you've just read Fluffy's long post and sat back, arms folded, thinking 'yep we've won'.

Read the debate...

now you just sound like a fanboy.

you should know that the debate continued well past fluffypony's post you linked, including the part where he got it totally wrong about how darksend works....