Topic: A Theory on what pirateat40 is doing - page 5. (Read 40018 times)
i guess with his volume he is always sell high at peaks putting the price down and then buy back at a lower price, he will do it again and again. this approach push the price up for bitcoin which is not so bad at all.
Is it possible that having all this HYIP activity might be driving up the price of bitcoins?
I have long had the impression that being used for HYIPs can be quite effective promotion for an online currency, albeit as in e-gold's case it can also maybe have a downside eventually.
Could it be that Pirate, or the powers behind pirate, have a few million bitcoins, or maybe more than a few millions, and hit upon the idea of giving some of them away as "interest" as a way to increase interest in bitcoins and actually drive up the price of them as more and more people buy some in order to get in on these high "interest" rates?
I haven't checked all his exact terms; if I was free to pay back everyone at any moment and shut down cleanly thereby, and had a way to make over 7% a week, maybe it would be useful to borrow at 7%, make over 7%, taking my cut of the profit in fiat, then do so again next week rather than risk any of my own profit, safely stored as fiat, in the next week's operation? As soon as I hit a bad week I could shut down or decide I have enough reserves built up to risk another week...
-MarkM-
I have long had the impression that being used for HYIPs can be quite effective promotion for an online currency, albeit as in e-gold's case it can also maybe have a downside eventually.
Could it be that Pirate, or the powers behind pirate, have a few million bitcoins, or maybe more than a few millions, and hit upon the idea of giving some of them away as "interest" as a way to increase interest in bitcoins and actually drive up the price of them as more and more people buy some in order to get in on these high "interest" rates?
I haven't checked all his exact terms; if I was free to pay back everyone at any moment and shut down cleanly thereby, and had a way to make over 7% a week, maybe it would be useful to borrow at 7%, make over 7%, taking my cut of the profit in fiat, then do so again next week rather than risk any of my own profit, safely stored as fiat, in the next week's operation? As soon as I hit a bad week I could shut down or decide I have enough reserves built up to risk another week...
-MarkM-
Can´t one view the potential of bitcoin as the new world reserve currency ?
There is the precious truth which lies in the heart of any ponzi ( spoken by Amsel Mayer Rothschild himself( the old Frankfurt school of monatary theory tyranny) :-)
"Let me control the money supply of a nation and i don´t care about any law or rule". -- Because the "elected" cronies are all bought up.
In Bitcoinworld nobody even pretends to be elected, everybody should and is worshipping pirate cause he now controls the moneysupply and is at the helm
to decide when how and who is busted and who is been saved....everybody to the rows!! 7 % newbies a week in bitcoinland should be attainable for quite a while...
and after that coming down from 3600 % interest to 0.6 % yearly may take easily another 100 years before the best ponzi in town needs to bust...but by the there is still some quantitative easing invented to transfer in the blockchain.
Long live pirate....let us built him a memorial!!
Zyk
There is the precious truth which lies in the heart of any ponzi ( spoken by Amsel Mayer Rothschild himself( the old Frankfurt school of monatary theory tyranny) :-)
"Let me control the money supply of a nation and i don´t care about any law or rule". -- Because the "elected" cronies are all bought up.
In Bitcoinworld nobody even pretends to be elected, everybody should and is worshipping pirate cause he now controls the moneysupply and is at the helm
to decide when how and who is busted and who is been saved....everybody to the rows!! 7 % newbies a week in bitcoinland should be attainable for quite a while...
and after that coming down from 3600 % interest to 0.6 % yearly may take easily another 100 years before the best ponzi in town needs to bust...but by the there is still some quantitative easing invented to transfer in the blockchain.
Long live pirate....let us built him a memorial!!
Zyk
Makes zero sense. You suggest he's giving away money to those who would otherwise fall for scams.
Also, congrats to managing to be early adopter enough to actually profit from the scam. In case you're withdrawing your initial investment, of course.
Also, congrats to managing to be early adopter enough to actually profit from the scam. In case you're withdrawing your initial investment, of course.
I doubt it. Why operate a HYIP passthrough when you could be the HYIP yourself?
Yes. In addition, his paper volume is too large -- illiquid exchanges would hinder buying back from Fiat.
Also, for a pass-through to a larger HYIP, the starting phase with forced withdrawals and general growth limiting would make no sense. And he'd profit less.
It's direct.
I doubt it. Why operate a HYIP passthrough when you could be the HYIP yourself?
http://www.corporationwiki.com/Unknown/Unknown/gpumax-technologies-llc/101278778.aspx
Zach Nakaska - Managing Member
Trendon Shavers - Managing Member
Michael Thalasinos - Managing Member
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/michael-thalasinos/54/a8/396
President/Owner
Jetpack Cayman
"February 2012 – Present (7 months) Grand Cayman"
Searching for "Jetpack Cayman" doesn't turn up much besides a 3 like facebook page and a few videos from a jetpack vendor
This is quite a suspicious place to start a business after launching service that resembles a money laundering scheme (GPUMAX) and one that resembles a ponzi (BTCS&T)
Zach Nakaska - Managing Member
Trendon Shavers - Managing Member
Michael Thalasinos - Managing Member
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/michael-thalasinos/54/a8/396
President/Owner
Jetpack Cayman
"February 2012 – Present (7 months) Grand Cayman"
Searching for "Jetpack Cayman" doesn't turn up much besides a 3 like facebook page and a few videos from a jetpack vendor
This is quite a suspicious place to start a business after launching service that resembles a money laundering scheme (GPUMAX) and one that resembles a ponzi (BTCS&T)
I suppose it also depends on whether Bitcoin is a currency or commodity. Apparently this has been discussed elsewhere, perhaps you could find pertinent information there.
I very much suspect this has little to do with whether Bitcoin is "currency", "virtual currency", "money", "a commodity", "stored value" etc., as the issue here is whether or not US withholding taxes were withheld and paid to the IRS on US source income to non US persons. In what form this income was paid may turn out to be moot. The potential liability can be up to 30% of all the interest paid by BST, with a valuation in USD based on the BTC / USD exchange rate at the time the interest was paid.
Why this is relevant for those of us that have no relationship with piratat40 or BST and in fact may not even live in the United States is that because of the size of BST relative to the Bitcoin economy, an IRS audit of pirateat40 and BST can have an impact on the BTC / USD exchange rate. How it will impact the BTC / USD exchange rate is not clear to me at all.
Here is a thought. From the information on this forum it is fair to say that pirateat40 is a US Person and that Income from Bitcoin Savings and Trust is subject to US Tax Withholding on Foreign Persons. http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/international/article/0,,id=106981,00.html Bottom line the IRS will want its share of the 7% per week interest, and if the lenders have not filed that proper paperwork with pirateat40 and pirateat40 has not sent the appropriate withholding taxes to the IRS this can get real interesting.
The deposits and interest are in Bitcoin. There is no tax code for Bitcoin.
I doubt very much that the IRS would take that point of view here, otherwise you set a very dangerous precedent. Pay people in Bitcoin and legally avoid taxes. By the way barter transactions are taxable are they not?
Yes, barter is taxable. The question becomes, when do you tax Bitcoin earnings? I would have to assume at the point of conversion to fiat, but I am not a CPA (and I doubt they know either).
Edit: Or possibly at the point of "possession". But I seriously doubt the IRS is capable of dealing with any Bitcoin related taxation at the present, and probably not for quite some time.
My understanding is the fair market value in USD at the time of the transaction. In this case when the interest is paid. As for the IRS been able to deal with this, it may be as simple as an IRS agent typing "bitcoin exchange rate" into a search engine, getting the BTC / USD market rate from MtGox and assessing and auditing accordingly.
Here is a thought. From the information on this forum it is fair to say that pirateat40 is a US Person and that Income from Bitcoin Savings and Trust is subject to US Tax Withholding on Foreign Persons. http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/international/article/0,,id=106981,00.html Bottom line the IRS will want its share of the 7% per week interest, and if the lenders have not filed that proper paperwork with pirateat40 and pirateat40 has not sent the appropriate withholding taxes to the IRS this can get real interesting.
The deposits and interest are in Bitcoin. There is no tax code for Bitcoin.
I doubt very much that the IRS would take that point of view here, otherwise this sets a very dangerous precedent. Pay people in Bitcoin and legally avoid taxes. By the way barter transactions are taxable are they not?
Here is a thought. From the information on this forum it is fair to say that pirateat40 is a US Person and that Income from Bitcoin Savings and Trust is subject to US Tax Withholding on Foreign Persons. http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/international/article/0,,id=106981,00.html Bottom line the IRS will want its share of the 7% per week interest, and if the lenders have not filed that proper paperwork with pirateat40 and pirateat40 has not sent the appropriate withholding taxes to the IRS this can get real interesting.
Well after a couple of month I'm currently only risking my profit. So every week I take the interest out as pure profit.
So ponzi or not I'm a happy man
That is not true. You risk a lot more than that if you continue to intentionally receive fraudulent transfers of other people's money. Willful ignorance is not a defense.So ponzi or not I'm a happy man
http://utahsecuritiesfraud.com/2010/08/02/clawback-lawsuits-how-investing-in-a-ponzi-scheme-can-bite-you-twice/
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/05/30/victims-of-li-ponzi-scheme-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/
Quote
CBS 2′s Lou Young spoke with Greg Ameo, who said that the trustee handling Cosmo’s collapsed investment firm is demanding even more money.
“Fifteen grand, and I lost over $160,000. I think I’m getting screwed twice, basically,” Ameo said.
The recent charges are part of a claw-back proceeding. Anybody who withdrew money from their accounts at Agape World, Cosmo’s Ponzi front, within 90 days of its collapse, can be ordered to pay it back. The claw-back even applies to money that was part of the original investment, officials said.
“Fifteen grand, and I lost over $160,000. I think I’m getting screwed twice, basically,” Ameo said.
The recent charges are part of a claw-back proceeding. Anybody who withdrew money from their accounts at Agape World, Cosmo’s Ponzi front, within 90 days of its collapse, can be ordered to pay it back. The claw-back even applies to money that was part of the original investment, officials said.
Well after a couple of month I'm currently only risking my profit. So every week I take the interest out as pure profit.
So ponzi or not I'm a happy man
So ponzi or not I'm a happy man
Now when a buyer comes along he sells the buyer BTC from his inventory and then goes into the market buys back the sold BTC. He needs to generate say 10% a week in commissions in a flat market in order to pay his lenders and make a profit. This is actually not that hard to do. In a bear market July 2011 - December 2011 he makes an additional profit because he is effectively short the market between selling his BTC from inventory and buying them back in the market in order to replenish his inventory.
How does he generate 10% a week exactly? Sure, if you have some magic way to generate 10%/week, you can offer people 7%/week interest. But that's a mighty big if.It might be possible pirate made 100% already and he is just paying it out a little at a time at 7% a week. If he bought at $4.5 and it goes to $9 then that's 100% profit.
Now when a buyer comes along he sells the buyer BTC from his inventory and then goes into the market buys back the sold BTC. He needs to generate say 10% a week in commissions in a flat market in order to pay his lenders and make a profit. This is actually not that hard to do. In a bear market July 2011 - December 2011 he makes an additional profit because he is effectively short the market between selling his BTC from inventory and buying them back in the market in order to replenish his inventory.
How does he generate 10% a week exactly? Sure, if you have some magic way to generate 10%/week, you can offer people 7%/week interest. But that's a mighty big if.It might be possible pirate made 100% already and he is just paying it out a little at a time at 7% a week. If he bought at $4.5 and it goes to $9 then that's 100% profit.
The fact that people can reason this way gives me a measure of how well a Ponzi can prosper. Doubling of price is a 50% LOSS for him for every Bitcoin that he converted to fiat then, stop. But he’s smarter than this, and probably kept them all in his wallet ready to pay dividends at due time
Now when a buyer comes along he sells the buyer BTC from his inventory and then goes into the market buys back the sold BTC. He needs to generate say 10% a week in commissions in a flat market in order to pay his lenders and make a profit. This is actually not that hard to do. In a bear market July 2011 - December 2011 he makes an additional profit because he is effectively short the market between selling his BTC from inventory and buying them back in the market in order to replenish his inventory.
How does he generate 10% a week exactly? Sure, if you have some magic way to generate 10%/week, you can offer people 7%/week interest. But that's a mighty big if.It might be possible pirate made 100% already and he is just paying it out a little at a time at 7% a week. If he bought at $4.5 and it goes to $9 then that's 100% profit.
Except his liabilities are in BTC, so to make 100% profit trading he would need to sell high and buy lower. However, I don't believe that trading the volatility is the source of pirate's income.
[lots of BS skipped]
He has now effectively hedged his downward risk.
[lots of BS skipped]
He has now effectively hedged his downward risk.
[lots of BS skipped]
This is a new kind of hedge. Let's now borrow at 3000% APR to hedge some insignificant risk. This is some genius hedging here, lets pay 3000$ to remove risk of losing 100$ Right! Here is a simpler option, get
Now look, no need to waste a few pages to explain some convoluted unworkable and completely pointless scheme. Just one-two sentences and it is all simple and clear.
Vlad should make a 5000 BTC bet if he really thinks this way
Now when a buyer comes along he sells the buyer BTC from his inventory and then goes into the market buys back the sold BTC. He needs to generate say 10% a week in commissions in a flat market in order to pay his lenders and make a profit. This is actually not that hard to do. In a bear market July 2011 - December 2011 he makes an additional profit because he is effectively short the market between selling his BTC from inventory and buying them back in the market in order to replenish his inventory.
How does he generate 10% a week exactly? Sure, if you have some magic way to generate 10%/week, you can offer people 7%/week interest. But that's a mighty big if.It might be possible pirate made 100% already and he is just paying it out a little at a time at 7% a week. If he bought at $4.5 and it goes to $9 then that's 100% profit.
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