Topic: [ANN] Bancor | Protocol for Smart-tokens, solving the liquidity problem - page 353. (Read 375744 times)

OK, I stand corrected.  There was no "second" hidden cap.  The Bancor twitter feed said " the second the hidden cap transaction hits, it will be executed and the token allocation event will end."  The word "second" refers to time, not cap messages.  So they tried to kill donations at 250K ETH = $100M, but their kill message couldn't get through, so darn, they were forced to accept an additional unwanted 146K ETH and made an extra unintentional $58 million.  

This constitutes a monumental unplanned failure.  Everybody should have such problems.

Going through out whole things in telegram with devs yesterday, that not what happen.
Idk how the author get info?self interpretation or an opinion?
There are no second hidden cap.

Devs told that the transaction get clogged - lot of ppl still pending the transaction.
Ico hidden cap still not reach by 1 hour yet so they open it more for 3 hour.
(its not even wrong because the minimum time is 1 hour till max 14days until cap reach)
And they try to send the hidden cap stop transaction in the midst of the clogged transaction which result in that it didnt stop,exactly at 250k, and it end after 2.5 hour. Not exactly 3 hour.

Should i repeat again?
The rule stated that every bounty program will end
On 30th june or when ico over, which ever come first.
The reward are paid weekly. Stated when everyone join and report for signup.

The manager accepted ppl to join till saturday and close it after that.(due to overwhelm reponse)


They did the right thing here.

Is it traded somewhere yet?

You forgot to include Einstein's lesser known theorem of E=Poloniex²

Which simply states that regardless of the merits of any ICO, if it trades on Poloniex shortly after, ICO speculators will make money.

Mathematical proof: Gnosis

Friend, you and I have yet to converge on the same reality.

https://www.ethnews.com/bancor-token-offering-breaks-140-million

"On Bancor's end, via Twitter, the company reported that a massive attack coinciding with the token offering affected its website and application.  As a result, the mechanism which the token offering was operating under, a hidden cap, became stuck with another transaction and failed to trigger. In light of the network difficulties, Bancor opted to extend the minimum time for the token offering by approximately three hours, or until the second hidden cap was met, whereupon the offering would end. When the second hidden cap was hit, Bancor had raised 396,720 Ether and sold 79.3 million BNTs, valued at the time of the offering at more than $142 million."

We bought into BNT not ETH....This doesn’t automatically make BNT worthless or the business model a scam, because we’re buying into Bancor’s potential (good or bad).

The cap was not changed/raised, or at least there is no discernible proof that it was as it was hidden until 80% was reached.  The first hour was the minimum ICO period, not the expected ICO period.
  
The minimum time for the ICO to run was increased by 2 hours to compensate for network issues during most of the first hour.  A good move by Bancor who were having to make a quick decision.  
  
[Even if the cap were hit within the first hour, the ICO would have continued until that minimum period elapsed.  The fact that they increased the minimum time seems to have displeased some people who have misunderstood *cough Crypt0dude cough*, but imagine the genuine displeasure (had the minimum time not been extended) by the masses who wanted to invest but couldn't due to the network overload.]

Everybody who contributed Eth will have received BNT to their wallets.

The cap was 250,000Eth and the results of the ICO can be seen on their website: https://bancor.network/fundraiser

Again, thank you for proving me right. Everything I've said is true, again. People have been burned, because of people like you. This is proof nobody should not listen to anyone in here, because you are getting sucked in fantasyland where there is no rationale. Thank you for learning the mentality in here. I know enough now about psychology in these threads and what kind of folks are operating here. Have a good one.

I will just start boldly. The Bancor business model is pretty close to a scam. I am sure you will not take my word for it, because this is my first post. In fact, I made this account because I find it bizarre that no one is talking about this. Let's be honest, which one of you truly tried to comprehend their mathematical proof? Not a single person who invested at least, because otherwise they would not have wasted their money. I will try to explain a little.

They collected pretty close to 400k ether. Essentially what they do, is keep .8*400k ETH = 320k ETH to themselves, and call the remaining 80k reserves. They will express this 80k in a different coin, called BNT. They assign 100 BNT to 1ETH that they received. That means there is 500BNT for every 1ETH in the reserves. Essentially, if everyone would want to convert their BNT back to ETH, they would get 1/500 ETH per BNT. Wait you say, in the white paper it says that the starting price of 100BNT will equal 1 ETH! This is true, this is where the mathematics uses a trick to hide what is going on. Their pricing formula, P=R/(S*F) ensures that the first BNT sold will be sold at a 'fair' value, namely equal to the amount of ETH you spent to buy it in the first place. After the first sell, things get worse rather quickly. Let's illustrate this by a little example:

Lets say that 10% of people who own BNT sell it back to ETH via the smart contract. For the initial price we get: P = 80k/(40m*.2) = 0.01. All looks fair. Then after the sell we get 40m*10%*0.01 = 40k,  P = 80k-40k/((40m-4m)*0.20) = 0,00556. Ouch, the price almost dropped to half value from the 10% sell-off (this is different if there are many small transactions but I will get to that later).

If people buy the same amount of BNT, this is what happens: P = 120k/(44m*0.20) = 0.01364. The increase in price is not nearly as interesting for the next person. But again, this will be lower for many small transactions.

I created a plot assuming transactions are made in small batches of BNT coins. We find that the BNT value drop VERY quickly when people start selling, and does not rise nearly as fast. Essentially this just makes BNT an undesirable coin. Another weird thing about their system is that it does not consider convexity. This means that big transactions will get very different prices than many small ones. This just does not make sense, but they don't care as they simply took your money.
http://imgur.com/a/f9yLy

If you are still not convinced, consider this. They literally admit to taking 80% of your money. All they give back is some mathematical trick based on 20% of the ether that you gave them. Do you really believe they just generated x5 value out of thin air? Sorry, but math does not work that way. I would recommend getting rid of your BNT asap, or you end up all the way on the left side of the graph. I am sorry that this news comes a bit late for some of you... I didn't read their methodology until last night Sad

Maybe now you can start to add up why the ICO was strange in various ways.

As final words, don't just believe whatever I say. Think about it for yourself. I gain nothing by convincing you of whatever I write here, I am simply sharing thoughts.

I agree with that, but I understand them, I would be mad if I would miss this nice ICO

so many haters, I believed most of them missed the ICO?
 

so many haters, I believed most of them missed the ICO?
 

I will just start boldly. The Bancor business model is pretty close to a scam. I am sure you will not take my word for it, because this is my first post. In fact, I made this account because I find it bizarre that no one is talking about this. Let's be honest, which one of you truly tried to comprehend their mathematical proof? Not a single person who invested at least, because otherwise they would not have wasted their money. I will try to explain a little.

They collected pretty close to 400k ether. Essentially what they do, is keep .8*400k ETH = 320k ETH to themselves, and call the remaining 80k reserves. They will express this 80k in a different coin, called BNT. They assign 100 BNT to 1ETH that they received. That means there is 500BNT for every 1ETH in the reserves. Essentially, if everyone would want to convert their BNT back to ETH, they would get 1/500 ETH per BNT. Wait you say, in the white paper it says that the starting price of 100BNT will equal 1 ETH! This is true, this is where the mathematics uses a trick to hide what is going on. Their pricing formula, P=R/(S*F) ensures that the first BNT sold will be sold at a 'fair' value, namely equal to the amount of ETH you spent to buy it in the first place. After the first sell, things get worse rather quickly. Let's illustrate this by a little example:

Lets say that 10% of people who own BNT sell it back to ETH via the smart contract. For the initial price we get: P = 80k/(40m*.2) = 0.01. All looks fair. Then after the sell we get 40m*10%*0.01 = 40k,  P = 80k-40k/((40m-4m)*0.20) = 0,00556. Ouch, the price almost dropped to half value from the 10% sell-off (this is different if there are many small transactions but I will get to that later).

If people buy the same amount of BNT, this is what happens: P = 120k/(44m*0.20) = 0.01364. The increase in price is not nearly as interesting for the next person. But again, this will be lower for many small transactions.

I created a plot assuming transactions are made in small batches of BNT coins. We find that the BNT value drop VERY quickly when people start selling, and does not rise nearly as fast. Essentially this just makes BNT an undesirable coin. Another weird thing about their system is that it does not consider convexity. This means that big transactions will get very different prices than many small ones. This just does not make sense, but they don't care as they simply took your money.
http://imgur.com/a/f9yLy

If you are still not convinced, consider this. They literally admit to taking 80% of your money. All they give back is some mathematical trick based on 20% of the ether that you gave them. Do you really believe they just generated x5 value out of thin air? Sorry, but math does not work that way. I would recommend getting rid of your BNT asap, or you end up all the way on the left side of the graph. I am sorry that this news comes a bit late for some of you... I didn't read their methodology until last night Sad

Maybe now you can start to add up why the ICO was strange in various ways.

As final words, don't just believe whatever I say. Think about it for yourself. I gain nothing by convincing you of whatever I write here, I am simply sharing thoughts.

No. Manager wont know when the campaign gonna stop.

The rules posted, since day one stated that the campaign will end at 30th june or when ico end, which ever that come first.

So no, he didnt know if it will end one 12th june or not.

But its fair what he did. Closed it at ico.  

And its already mention by manager when you all signup in beginning that you will be paid weekly, not daily.

'reports are submitted weekly. sicne everyon signed up on different dates, unfortunately some people will not be elidgable to submit their next report if the fundraiser has ended before their next weeks report is due'

hello dev,, i can't login with telegram for bounty program ??