Topic: [ANN] Freicoin: demurrage crypto-currency from the Occupy movement (crowdfund) - page 7. (Read 68048 times)

lol

That is normal for p2pool, and does not affect your payout. You may also try http://freicoin.us/

I would be greatful if someone can recommend a decent active pool to mine Freicon ,

on p2pool i get about 13% rejects no matter how I adjust difficulty and that is only with 40 ghs

Could some of you big asic players please join us in p2pool for freicon ..... we have not hit a block in more days than i can count

Hop in for a while please http://pool.freico.in:9638/static/

WTF?
I mean...Where's the FAQ?

Freicoin was added to voting at Comkort exchange.

Good luck!

We would rather not distribute at all and let the coins disappear through demurrage, than do so in a rushed, unfair, centralized method. If we destroyed the private keys to the foundation funds, the coins would still enter circulation at around the same rate as bitcoin.

Distribution should have started a year ago which is where my idle comment comes from. It is good to hear that it has now started using your chosen system but I hope it is not too little too late.

That's not true, the distribution has already started:

http://foundation.freicoin.org/#/donations
http://freicoin.freeforums.org/matched-donations-program-update-t732.html


I don't think there's any problem with SHA256 that needs to be solved [1]
Scrypt miserably "failed"[2] at being anti-GPU and it seems we will have scrypt ASICs soon as well [3]
There's no algorithm (and will never be) for which you cannot build specialized hardware, and in fact (according to some developers like gmaxwell) it seems that memory-hard algorithms ASIC will have a greater advantage in terms of power consumption over GPUs than SHA256 ASICs have. They will also be harder to design and build so there will probably less producers competing (thus causing more centralization, precisely what alt proofs of works are supposedly try to fight).

More importantly, with SHA256 you can have merged mining and leverage the greatest super-computer in the world: the bitcoin network itself.

For all these reasons and probably more I'm missing, no, we have no interest in working on an alternative hashing algorithm.

[1] http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-developer-jeff-garzik-on-altcoins-asics-and-bitcoin-usability/

[2] https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/artforz-and-coblee-gpu-mining-litecoin-since-the-start-63365
     https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.808501
     https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/heres-why-no-one-was-gpu-mining-litecoin-from-the-start-143659

[3] http://www.coindesk.com/alpha-technology-pre-orders-litecoin-asic-miners/

I would encourage anyone that takes issue with the Freicoin Foundation to express your grievances and propose constructive solutions: how should the foundation spend those coins?

We've taken a hardline approach that the foundation will only spend coins in ways which are chosen in a decentralized way by the community (e.g. matching donations to any registered non-profit). If we are unable to distribute coins quickly enough by these mechanisms then they will simply demurrage away and are issued to miners over a longer period of time. We are okay with that, as a fallback plan if community agreement cannot be reached.

There are other decentralized, distributed, p2p mechanisms that we would like to use to handle issuance, such as the republicoin proposal: using proof-of-stake voting to determine how the coins should be spent on an ongoing basis. There are a small number technical issues that need to be worked out, and a lot of infrastructure built before republicoin could be rolled out. We can use some help on this.

Here maaku has started an discussion about republicon. Who wants help to make decision making fully p2p feel free to join and help developing republicoin!
http://freicoin.freeforums.org/republicoin-design-discussion-t738.html

With simply voting through hashing power I see a big waste of energy, there must be something more democratic and energy friendly. Lets help to find such an algorithm!

Freicoin foundation had lots of time to move but seemed idle with the 80% of initial coins. What a shame for such an interesting solution of demurrage. It is very tempting to put this into a new coin with no foundation as the fork you linked in was not a genuine attempt, more of a protest against the solution chosen. Demurrage is a great idea but unfortunately one that people do not want. If the world could be rebooted to use this perhaps it would work, but not in the world we live in.

Perhaps there is time now to retry demurrage, there needs to be a new tier of crypto using a different hashing algorithm. Currently solutions are scattered and there is no standard. Perhaps this is a good time for Maaku to work on the next hashing standard and put demurrage at the top of it

Yes, this is the centralization point of the matched donations distribution. But any censored nonprofit can publicly denounce us.
No one has done it so far.


Yes, profits tend to zero when time tends to infinity in perfect competition (something purely theoretical), so seigniorage to miners should tend to zero with time as well.
The rest is burned in mining costs, basically providing more security than users are paying for.
This is completely anti-ecological and therefore not aligned with Freicoin's core values.
The very inventor of proof of work-based scarcity refers to this as a "environmental crime".   

I cannot stress this enough, avoiding this waste is the primary reason behind the Freicoin Foundation, supporting nonprofits is just a nice side effect, the "less worse" distribution in my opinion.


I thought you were for demurrage.
Maybe you can find someone here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/freicoin-frc-fork-without-80-of-coins-given-to-freicoin-foundation-134629
That didn't worked because the Freicoin community didn't think like him, but you could just start a completely new chain.

I won't oppose to a second demurrage cryptocurrency, but the freimarkets crowdfunding thread (or this thread) is just not the right place for starting it.

Please, advertise it for free here:

http://foundation.freicoin.org/#/trade

Hello there,

Reddit ALTcointip bot has just announced its 2nd round of signups for a list of supported cryptocurrencies.

Please see the announcement for details. Thanks!

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Yes, we're assuming some level of trust, but not very high.

If we're honest, the only way to be sure about it is researching
every non-profit address and the charities themselves, or trust
someone else's research.

But if we cheat, it only takes a researcher to locate the proof of
fraud in the chain and show it to everyone.


Future Freicoin users may have to trust that someone took the time to
audit the public accounting of an organization that no longer
influences freicoin supply in any way.


Oh, I get your point now.
You're saying "if only miners donate to the non-profits and 100% of
miners mine at a loss only to give 100% of their earnings to the
non-profits, both systems are equivalent."
If frc is valued at 1 usd, miners profits should tend to decline so
that "production costs" equal 1 usd. But if miners are not counting
the 1 frc they receiving but the 1.1 frc the non-profits will get,
they will be ok with incurring 1.1 usd donation losses.
I'm assuming 10% donation matching by the foundation.
But miners can't mine 800 M frc in 3 years, so someone else will have
to make donations too, even assuming all miners donate everything
they get. And the matching of those donations cannot be counted as
production costs by the miners.


I need to repeat that miner's profit are also seigniorage and bitcoin
also has it. But ANY seigniorage is more efficient than costs because
at least someone gets the value instead of it being completely
sacrificed by the community as a whole.


Well, that's very likely to happen, at least at the beginning, but
it's not the end of the world, someone will buy them and they're
already distributed. Of course, the ideal situation would be for them
to spend the FRC directly, but they converting to BTC and spending
them directly would help expand cryptocurrencies too, and it's not so
much to ask because there's already many things being sold for BTCs.

Maaku and I plan to operate a FRC/BTC exchange and offer automatic
conversion from it. So if you have FRC deposits, you can withdraw/pay
BTCs to any bitcoin address directly (and viceversa).

But for merchants that accept both, you will probably prefer to pay
FRC directly to save bitcoin's transaction fee, the trading fee and
the gap between bids and asks.


Ok, then just trust my word or ask to them yourself: although they're
still reluctant to use freicoin because of how different it is from
mutual credit, there's many people in the complementary currencies
movement that consider it a great improvement over bitcoin, and at
the same time changes a little bit their perception of bitcoin, which
they tend to criticize aggressively.
Finding out that the issuance doesn't require mining but you still
need it for security seems to make them accept the general concept
better.

Is anything actually going on with this alt?  What has the "foundation" been up to?

I see the exchange rate is well below a penny now...

The average time to solve a block is 29.73 minutes, since the algorithm change, a value which is declining as Freicoin miners realize they should not overreact to fluctuations in the difficulty.

Since the changeover in May 3,748 blocks have been solved.