Topic: [ANN] KRAKEN.COM - Exchange with USD EUR GBP JPY CAD BTC LTC XRP NMC XDG STR ETH - page 159. (Read 628889 times)

what law? Kraken is not license so with what right do they require documents?

Kraken is operating out of law.

Hi Bonez0r

One more thing:
You wrote: "to make sure that person can't withdraw the money and disappear with it".

1. If you launder money, this is a crime. To act like if someone is committing a crimt must not be based on a suspicion, but on a court's ruling.
It's not the way that some person of kraken's staff can decide whether or not some user is laundering money. (you know it's bullshit anyway, as the real money-laundering happens in USD through casinos and hotels, as well as the known money-launder banks like HSBC. They lauder 5 x the complete amount of all bitcoins per day.)

2. "That person" is identified to them. Just because my passport, I used as ID-document to Kraken 3 years ago, expired 2 years ago, I'm still the same person. I receive the money to MY bank account inside an EU-country under my name. I withdrew to that account some times, already.

How could I possibly "disappear with the money"?

Even if someone is really laundering money on kraken, it's not kraken to procescute and investigate, punish and take, but LAW ENFORCEMENT. Police, judges, lawyers would be engaged in this. And in case that person would manage to disappear, law enforcement would have to hunt him - NOT Kraken.

The ONLY think kraken must do, is NOT LET HIM TRADE. The "laundering" is done through TRADES, not by withdrawing!

But they LET ME trade and then immediately take my money!

If they have reason to believe some user is laundering money, they must
a.) not let him trade
b.) denunciate his data to LE

They are not allowed to:
1. punish the person
2. take the persons money/assets to enforce some action/reaction on the person

If the person accused for money laundering can proof before court that he is NOT guilty, he is compensated for the losses created by the investigation and confiscation of his funds.
When kraken desides that "now we have all information", I may simply continue, but the damages their actions made won't be compensated.

Kraken behaves clearly UNLAWFUL. Many companies do, but that is no argument. But Law Enforcement is happy about such unlawful companies, because they make their (LE's) work easier. So kraken behaves UNLAWFUL, but in prospect of LE - thus no one cares.

Kraken can simply blackmail people, hold funds, create damages - and if it proves that the person did nothing wrong, the damage remains on the suspect. Police cannot do this, so their happy if companies behave like private LE without the DEFENSE for the suspect.

In normal juristical view, the suspect is NOT guilty as long as his crime has not been proven.
For Kraken, I'm GUILTY (I'm treated like a criminal - damage is put on me) - as long as THEY do not have the TIME to accept my documents! You see the difference?

Regards
BS

Hi Bonez0r

Well, you are just "quite right":

"Money laundering regulations" could be miss-used for everything...

A company must make sure to comply with the regulations and NOT LET PEOPLE LAUNDER MONEY. So when they are unsure whether a user is laundering or not, they must PUT ON HOLD THE TRADING-functions for this user until the situation is cleared.

Kraken ist NOT Law Enforcement! Even Police cannot take your money simply because they might have a suspicion of a crime! There must be a JUDGE, who decides that your money will be confiscated and you have all possibilities of the juridical system to defend yourself.
Kraken takes according to their decision: no judge, no defense, just simply blackmail and theft.

If kraken would present to me a official paper of a JUDGE telling them that they HAVE TO HOLD MY MONEY, because of an official-investigation (not some private-company-investigators!) is showing that some crime is going on, THEN, of course, they must hold the money. Then, of course, they must show that their "CANNOT" is due to a COURT's desicion that they can scan and show to me.

But saying "of some regulation asks us to do this" is too weak argument. Where the regulation is written that banks /private companies might simply hold other people money in case that those people did not UPDATE some information they never knew they have to UPDATE it? SHOW me teh RULES, not just blablabla, show me the paragraph, the law.

Example for you, Bonez0r: the law says: when you see a crime, you must try to hinder it or try to hold the suspect until police comes - as long as it does not endanger you. If I go to the marketplace, see someone who looks suspicious, go there, take his money, and tell him: "I don't give back your money until you prove to me that you are not a criminal, to me you look suspicious!" - what is that? Theft, camouflaged as something "according to some regulation".

We came to a situation when a private company (kraken), purely on their guess or suspicion can take money from their customers to enforce a wished-for behaviour, so kraken is a private LAW ENFORCEMENT?

Very simple: if kraken would think I was laundering money when using their system, they must not let me use their service (exchange) but to confiscate my money, a "thought of a private company" is not enough. To confiscate money, a JUDGE must make a decision, it must be announced and defense must be allowed.

Think about this: why should a re-newal of my ID proof I'm NOT laundering? Of if I answer to a question? Wouldn't I lie if I'd launder money?
What kraken asked me about is  NOT any proof that I do not launder money! They asked for a  proof: "yes, I'm still the same person dealing with you"! I already proved my identity to kraken. If they think it expired, OK, I send evidence again. But taking my money is nothing else than theft and it's sad to see that meanwhile it's enough to say "some regulations somewhere of someone give me the right to take away your money, if I think you.../if you do not..." that is the END of "law and justice".

You people, we people, MUST make clear that private companies are NOT Law Enforcement and whenever a company like kraken starts behaving like it was God, the Allmighty, can take what they want and do what they want, just need to say "it's because of some regulation!", it MUST NOT be accepted.

It's deceit, if it was about stopping me from possible money-laundering, kraken would need to hinder the TRADE, not the withdrawal.

I do comply to MY COUNTRIES anti-money-laundering rules. In case that a court asked kraken do hold my money, I want to see that court's decision kraken is action upon.

But, actually, Kraken is acting upon their own decision and taking/holding customers money is theft, so simple as that.

I'm asking other users of kraken that have been miss-treated by kraken, support and policy, to contact me (PM) and sue kraken for this behaviour. They PRETEND it's because some obscure rule, but actually it's their own decision.

Kind regards
BS

Hello Dargo,

I've been trading with Kraken now for a few months and I noticed few hours ago that your site seems to load slower than normal. I checked my internet speed and I can verify that it is not in my network's problem. Do you happen to have issues right in your site?

There is one simple reason to hold your funds: AML (anti money laundering) regulations. Kraken is required by law to put withdrawals on hold if they are not sure about the ID of the user. Why your ID is suddenly not clear is another matter and i have no idea what caused it. But does it not make sense to you that if someone is laundering money, that the logical thing to do is to make sure that person can't withdraw the money and disappear with it? Nobody is saying you're laundering money, but this is why that regulation exists and you somehow became tangled up in it by mistake.

Sorry,  you write nonsense.

The only acceptable reason to hold withdrawals is in prospect of the customer, when there is suspicion that the account was hacked.

In case that you need stronger evidence, you must put the TRADING on hold (your service) and allow withdrawal of funds (money of customers) in the way that the user can use other exchanges instead as long as you need for acceptance of the new, stronger ID-evidence.

It is NOT MY problem that you change your policy and without prior notice of such a change you ask for stronger evidence - just after a trade was made.

If you would really act according to that need, you would block trading and offer an UPLOAD for such a file. You would not blackmail users by taking their money, call it "put withdrawal on hold" and have not "enough time due to so many tickets".

In case that is takes so many days for the evidence to become accepted by you, it must result in a loss for your company by not providing service to such customers in the waiting queue.

Instead, you forward the loss to your customers and tell me that it is MY problem that YOU have too many tickets open. It would not be MY problem, but YOURS, if you would have blocked my trading and let me withdraw my Bitcoins. Then I could use other exchanges...

It's not MY issue, it's YOURS. You made it my by acting like a thief and I doubt that you will pay for my losses due to your "having to many open tickets", will you compensate me?

And concerning the question about "re-sale" of Bitcoins: everyone  re-sells Bitcoins - in case that he has not mined them before. Most people do not mine, thus naturally, nearly everyone who sells them, is re-selling them. I sell Bitcoins that I bought before.

Once again:
If you need to get more evidence about a user, then any user will understand that he can either provide the evidence and continue using your service or stop using your service and withdraw what is on his accounts at your exchange.
I'm not arguing about that.

But not letting users withdraw their money is a different thing. That is how the MTGox's scam started. No bank would and could do this by their own decision - but in the only case: when the bank is bankrupt and they simply CANNOT release money because it's gone.

In case that you want to answer, tell me what exactly do you mean with: "and we cannot release funds until we have this updated information".

A) why you CANNOT? What law is applied that hinders your company to behave like a serious company? Tell me the evidence for this "CANNOT" - until you will do so, I believe that kraken just decided by own decision, that they WANT NOT. Most likely to put more pressure on the customers.

B) in the case that you would NOT receive updated information by a user, will you confiscate his funds? If so, please show me the paragraph in your T&C and the law of your country allowing you to confiscate funds of people you let trade, but later decide that you need more information about/from them and they do not want to deliver them to you.

Regards
BS

We're sorry for the delayed responses - support is currently slow due to a heavy volume of tickets. In some cases we have to ask our clients to provide stronger evidence of identity and clarify how they are using the account and we cannot release funds until we have this updated information. If you sent the ID confirmation photo unencrypted as an attachment, I don't see this attachment in the ticket. We did get the encrypted version and will decrypt it as soon as possible (only a few people have access to our key, so this step can take some time). We could have been more helpful to assist you in sending us the ID confirmation photo and I also think we may need to clarify the question we have about how you are using the account. So I agree that you didn't get the best service in this case. We are working to resolve your issue as soon as possible, but unfortunately it's going to take some more time.

DIRE WARNING!

Kraken put my EUR-withdrawal on HOLD - 10 days ago and plays on time not releasing it!

I saw this "HOLD" 4 days after I initated the withdrawal (I would NEVER expect it as I used the same account I was using many times before) and contacted the support.

I'm using kraken since 2014... 5 days ago support told me that my documents used to verify Tier3 expired in 2015 and I had to supply new identity proof. I should supply the picture-proof (even though I'm neither from US, DE nor JP)

Anyway, I did as I was asked to do, but there is no possibility to upload it, the exchange-pgp key is not usable for the support and it took 3 days until I received a link where to get the support's PGP key. (the exchanges is on the website, I used that but the support "could not decrypt")

I was so pissed by kraken destroying all trust from me that I accidentally sent the ID-picture and answer to question un-encrypted at first.

The support ("William") wrote back that he has it decrypted by someone else and than they will see how to continue. But I send it un-encrypted by my fault. I send the same encrypted then, but supprt had all he needed already un-encrypted.

I send all information asked for, one time un-encrypted, one time encryted - but still kraken holds thousands of MY Euros does not want to release them... until... until?

My questions:
1. when ID-information is needed to be updated, why you take my money to ENFORCE this but then do not hurry AT ALL to get it done?

Wouldn't it be correct to either block the account until the information is presented - so trading cannot take place, but withdraw is possible - or just simply ask for it and keep the account as it is? It was OK trading for 3 years, no information changed, but now kraken needs to put MY MONEY on HOLD to then have LOTS OF TIME to "make the impression to check the ID-information"?

2. I have been customer of kraken from beginning of 2014. My ID-card that was scanned in 2014 and expired in 2015, this does not mean that I changed my identity.
Anyway nothing happened, I was exchanging 1-4 times per month and now, 2nd of February 2017, I just exchanged like the many times before and wanted to withdraw TO THE SAME bank-ACCOUNT that I have been using since many months with kraken!

Nothing changed, same proceedure as I did many times - BUT this time, my money was put on HOLD, to enforce receiving information from me that could be delivered without HOLDING MY FUNDS.

BUT KRAKEN HAS PUT MY MONEY ON HOLD - since 10 days now. The support is extremely BAD and slow. I receive ONE (1) answer per 24 hours but my money is still "ON HOLD".

I had a lot of trust in kraken, that is all gone by now. It looks to my like the MTGox-case. They simply took my money and starting to argue some sh*t.

Once again:
I'm tier 3, registered and ID-prooved in 2014. 4 days ago, I supplied all information asked for - three times (taking 3 days because of kraken!!) - but my money is still on hold.

I must assume that kraken is taking the "MTGox-way" and this WARN ALL PEOPLE: DO NOT USE KRAKEN! THEY TAKE YOUR MONEY WITHOUT REASON and keep it!

Do not use kraken, it's behaviour is customer-unfriendly. If there was really some information needed, they can ASK FOR IT WITHOUT KEEPING MY MONEY.
If I would NOT deliver the necessary information, they could block me from further trading on kraken.

BUT, there is NO reason to HOLD MY MONEY other than that they DO NOT HAVE IT / want to steal it or have stolen it already.
Most likely they try to find stupid reasons to put withdrawals on hold because they are bankrupt.

I will inform you about further steps.

BS
Withdrawal ACCXMUK-XB4HD7-UMVSHM
User-Id: AA45 N84G GNHY N33Y

If you PM me your ticket number I'll escalate your ticket with support.

Thanks Dargo for getting back to me. I submitted a report but no response as of yet - is there much of a backlog? I've been with kraken for quite a while and haven't had this issue before so it's rather worrying to see the "permission denied" message.

There isn't a general issue with withdrawals, so create a support ticket and we'll look at your account.

Has anybody got withdraw orders going through? I'm trying to take out my coin but getting permission denied.

Edit: EUR withdrawals has the same issue.

Thanks

If you send me your support ticket number I can look into it for you.

Hello,

Tuesday, I made a deposit two days ago, but the funds are still not available. Normally, the funds are crédited fastly..

I have already sent a mail this morning.

Have a great day

Got my coins out just in time it seems, thanks for your help if you had anything to do with it, support got back to me a couple of hours ago before all the chaos.

We're working to restore access to the site. Trading via API is still possible, but the performance is degraded. The best place to get updates is by following our status page.

https://status.kraken.com/

Had 520, 502, and 504 Cloudflare errors (used two browsers, + mobile phone), while trading seems to be continuing??

Sent. Almost two days now waiting for support replies and the whole week trying to withdraw without success, completely ridiculous. Deposit went pretty smooth though.

Coin Name:Bitcoinplus  Symbol:XBC


Technical Specs


POW Algorithm :X13. Block reward is currently Zero - Note Proof of Work is used only to secure the network where necessary.

POS Stake Reward :20% Annually. (Calculated per 365 days)

Minimum Stake Age :12 hours (Coins must be in the wallet for 12 hours before being eligible for Staking)

Coin Reward Maturity:110 Blocks (Once newly created coins have reached 110 block confirmations they will become spendable)

Block Time:60 Seconds


https://github.com/bitcoinplusorg/xbcwalletsource

www.bitcoinplus.org/

https://poloniex.com/exchange#btc_xbc

-----------------------------------------

thanks Dargo for your fast support