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Topic: [ANN] Sia - Decentralized Storage - page 408. (Read 1382189 times)

hero member
Activity: 543
Merit: 501
September 03, 2015, 12:39:55 PM
I think it might have something to do with the new 0.4.0 client which did not meet the expectation.

Sad

hmm I guess not. Do you care to enumerate exactly where it falls short? I think we fixed most of the things in 0.4.1 but it depends on where your priorities are.


Because Siacoins are not an investment. To me the supply model doesn't make any sense if you are concerned about the price per Siacoin.  If hosts set the price of storage, and Sia is divisible, why design a coin that increases so exponentially?  You could have 21 Mil Siacoins and storage would cost just fractions of a Siacoin.  People have no incentive to hold Siacoins right now.  Why would I pay for Siacoins right now when the supply will increase 4x in the next year.  If anything, people are overpaying for Siacoins right now.  Siafunds are the investment, because you are collecting Siacoins by doing nothing.  Or am I wrong here?

The focus is definitely not on making siacoins valuable, but I have been using it as a bit of a yardstick, and I think other people have as well. I will point out that Sia's inflation curve is substantially softer than Bitcoin's during every point in the first 12 years. But it makes sense that the price would be suffering right now as the supply will be doubling again over the next 3 months. That does mean that siacoins are cheap, and newcomers can get a pretty substantially slice of the pie for only a single bitcoin.

But I also think you are wrong about them being worthless overall. There is still a very strict long-term supply on the siacoin, and the price of siacoin has a hard floor based on how much people are using the storage. If people are doing $10,000,000 per month in storage over Sia, then depending on how they set up their contracts there will be a minimum market cap of between $50M and $250M for the siacoin, and that's assuming that people are essentially dumping siacoins as fast as possible. Such a market cap, even 5 years down the road, would put the price of siacoin substantially higher than where it is today. If you believe that Sia has the potential to hit this kind of throughput or more, then the siacoin looks like a very good investment in addition to the siafund.

I don't think most traders are looking at it like that though. And, given that the supply is going to be doubling again in the next 3 months, I'm guessing it will be reasonable to see the price fall some more by Christmas. Though, I really do think that interest in the project is going to pick up in a big way before then, and that should be beneficial for the price even if people are afraid of the large inflation over the coming months.

But, as many have been saying, the really important part here is to pay attention to the storage, pay attention to the number of users, and make sure that people are actually using the system. 0.4.1 will be ready soon, I think that will help.

I am a bit split. A lot of people want me to finish the mining pool, but that's going to take me probably two weeks, and it's going to be two weeks that I'm not spending on storage features. Luke is going to be able to, very shortly, commit most/all of his time to storage features. Even if the price is getting hit hard, it's pretty clear to me that the Sia ecosystem as a whole is advancing. We've got a set of volunteer developers now! That's a huge deal, and it's support that we haven't had up until this point.

Sia is moving in the right direction.
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 250
September 03, 2015, 12:13:29 PM
Why is the price being hit so hard  Huh

People are running away from Sia like it's a toxic investment, I just don't get it.

Because Siacoins are not an investment. To me the supply model doesn't make any sense if you are concerned about the price per Siacoin.  If hosts set the price of storage, and Sia is divisible, why design a coin that increases so exponentially?  You could have 21 Mil Siacoins and storage would cost just fractions of a Siacoin.  People have no incentive to hold Siacoins right now.  Why would I pay for Siacoins right now when the supply will increase 4x in the next year.  If anything, people are overpaying for Siacoins right now.  Siafunds are the investment, because you are collecting Siacoins by doing nothing.  Or am I wrong here?

An increase of 4X for a pow coin for one year less than one month after the launch seems pretty reasonable for me.
Most of pow coins had such an increase in their beginning.

On the other side, I repeat what I have said : kilo sia would be a better unit of account on exchange both for psychological reason (people prefers high price to give a feeling of value) and for the bid/ask  relative spread (minimum 10% for a price of 10 sat).
I still think there is an element of investment that has to be there. If you believe SIA will gain mass adoption then there is a speculation factor to buy coin while cheap and in its early days as in Microsoft or apple stocks... ( I know that a huge comparison) but for the sake of argument  Grin
sr. member
Activity: 445
Merit: 255
September 03, 2015, 12:06:55 PM
Why is the price being hit so hard  Huh

People are running away from Sia like it's a toxic investment, I just don't get it.

Because Siacoins are not an investment. To me the supply model doesn't make any sense if you are concerned about the price per Siacoin.  If hosts set the price of storage, and Sia is divisible, why design a coin that increases so exponentially?  You could have 21 Mil Siacoins and storage would cost just fractions of a Siacoin.  People have no incentive to hold Siacoins right now.  Why would I pay for Siacoins right now when the supply will increase 4x in the next year.  If anything, people are overpaying for Siacoins right now.  Siafunds are the investment, because you are collecting Siacoins by doing nothing.  Or am I wrong here?

An increase of 4X for a pow coin for one year less than one month after the launch seems pretty reasonable for me.
Most of pow coins had such an increase in their beginning.

On the other side, I repeat what I have said : kilo sia would be a better unit of account on exchange both for psychological reason (people prefers high price to give a feeling of value) and for the bid/ask  relative spread (minimum 10% for a price of 10 sat).
legendary
Activity: 1470
Merit: 1004
September 03, 2015, 11:55:03 AM
Why is the price being hit so hard  Huh

People are running away from Sia like it's a toxic investment, I just don't get it.

Because Siacoins are not an investment. To me the supply model doesn't make any sense if you are concerned about the price per Siacoin.  If hosts set the price of storage, and Sia is divisible, why design a coin that increases so exponentially?  You could have 21 Mil Siacoins and storage would cost just fractions of a Siacoin.  People have no incentive to hold Siacoins right now.  Why would I pay for Siacoins right now when the supply will increase 4x in the next year.  If anything, people are overpaying for Siacoins right now.  Siafunds are the investment, because you are collecting Siacoins by doing nothing.  Or am I wrong here?
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 250
September 03, 2015, 11:38:29 AM
Hey gang, I am not panicking lol still holding all my mined coins AND buying up a more as I can from other forms of mining. I think we will see a huge turn around as soon as there is demand for it. Right now there really isn't any. So anyone buying coins are doing so because they understand SIA and have been using it like most of us in this thread. To the average investor who hasn't studied SIA, their not buying yet" and with no mass users for storage I think is only to be expected to see what we are seeing with price. My advise buy em up cheap now while you can! and hold  Wink
hero member
Activity: 763
Merit: 500
September 03, 2015, 11:22:32 AM
Why is the price being hit so hard  Huh
People are running away from Sia like it's a toxic investment, I just don't get it.

The price was about 10 sats before Polo added Sia. It is not really a hard dump. It is just not raising up as we expected with the new exchange and new client and a planed marketing campaign which is on hold now and has not started yet. I think it might have something to do with the new 0.4.0 client which did not meet the expectation. With a better client (UI client as well) and a marketing campaign, we should get some new users and see better price.
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1000
September 03, 2015, 10:16:20 AM
If we grow by more than 4x over the next year, the price should increase substantially.

It looks like the number of coins will increase 4x over the next year so there will need to be 4x the holders just to keep the price from dropping.
hero member
Activity: 543
Merit: 501
September 03, 2015, 09:18:02 AM
To keep the price steady, Sia needs to grow by 4x over the next year.

Your goal is to prevent the price from rising?

prevent it from dropping lol. If we grow by more than 4x over the next year, the price should increase substantially. I believe that we will easily grow by more than 4x over the next year.
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1000
September 03, 2015, 09:11:48 AM
To keep the price steady, Sia needs to grow by 4x over the next year.

Your goal is to prevent the price from rising?
hero member
Activity: 543
Merit: 501
September 03, 2015, 08:45:10 AM
But I think the major one is lack of clarity to what the total coins will be. I'm hearing 4 billion and then a continual 30,000 added. But tohers are quoting larger numbers.

I wrote a script to tell you how many coins there will be at block height X, and then give a rough approximation of what date that will happen.

http://play.golang.org/p/h_UftCe8-3

It would be nice if someone could turn this into a graph

That was a rookie error by the dev if is this is true. I'm not sure why the dev is puzzled by the price when the emissions are so high, so early on.

Perhaps so. Right now there are 4.7 billion coins. Exactly 1 year from now, my script estimates that there will be 19.6 billion coins. And 2 years from now, 31.0 billion coins.

The inflation curve is much less than Bitcoin's inflation curve for the first year. But at the same time, the first year of bitcoin's were worth almost exactly nothing and were owned by 1 or 2 people total.

To keep the price steady, Sia needs to grow by 4x over the next year. That seems virtually inevitable to me. This week alone Sia grew by about 15%. (despite the price crash)

I'm guessing the supply of coins will also drop fairly substantially one a mining pool is out. There are a lot more people who will be happy to mine on their home rigs and that will push margins down for the giant farm miners, which will send many of them to other coins. People mining on home rigs are less likely to dump.
member
Activity: 97
Merit: 10
Inch by Inch,Play by Play
September 03, 2015, 08:37:04 AM
Why is the price being hit so hard  Huh

People are running away from Sia like it's a toxic investment, I just don't get it.

maybe miners that sell as soon as they get the coins (not really supporters)
member
Activity: 97
Merit: 10
Inch by Inch,Play by Play
September 03, 2015, 08:34:10 AM
Sia only recently popped back on my radar after being mentioned on another site I visit frequently.  

Which was?...  (just curious Smiley)
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
Hyperspace snail
September 03, 2015, 08:14:07 AM
Maybe Taek can shine some light on this
member
Activity: 100
Merit: 10
September 03, 2015, 08:08:44 AM
How quickly will SC be emitted?  I've read total supply will be over 14,000,000,000 in less than a year and is only ~4,000,000,000 now.

That was a rookie error by the dev if is this is true. I'm not sure why the dev is puzzled by the price when the emissions are so high, so early on.
legendary
Activity: 1106
Merit: 1000
September 03, 2015, 08:07:25 AM
Why is the price being hit so hard  Huh

People are running away from Sia like it's a toxic investment, I just don't get it.



its two things. Some think Storj has already done this so it can look just like a copier, the fact that in may way SIA is first to market needs to be emphasized.

But I think the major one is lack of clarity to what the total coins will be. I'm hearing 4 billion and then a continual 30,000 added. But tohers are quoting larger numbers.
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1000
September 03, 2015, 07:13:46 AM
How quickly will SC be emitted?  I've read total supply will be over 14,000,000,000 in less than a year and is only ~4,000,000,000 now.
legendary
Activity: 1106
Merit: 1000
September 03, 2015, 06:48:51 AM
Definitely this will be the invest of the year. Feel sorry for those miners who are dumping gold for two bucks.

SIA will easily rise to +1M $ market cap in the next two-three months ONLY with rumors and speculation. If Taek keeps working hard (we all expect so), we could see SIA at +10M $ cap or more in just a year. It's not an investor irrational dream, these are facts. If SIA works like it has to be, we all will get filthy rich.

Please Taek keep going with your good work and don't worry about the price. Smart investors are behind this and we are just accumulating at a minimum cost (thanks to some miners, of course).

For those afraid investors: Look at mkt cap: 100K $. Grin Grin Do you really think that this is the real value of SIA? What a joke!

1+M $ mkt cap in 2-3 months. Mark my words please. Wink

You forgot to calculate the 250million sia mined per week..


Marketcap is Marketcap....doesn't matter if there is a bazillion coins, the total value is around $100,000 i.e. silly cheap.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
Hyperspace snail
September 03, 2015, 06:34:22 AM
GUI Client not working here. Comes up as a flash and poof its gone.

Tried these 3

Sia-UI-v0.3.3-beta-win32.zip
Sia-UI-v0.3.3-beta-win64-CPU.zip
Sia-UI-v0.3.3-beta-win64.zip

All the same..
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1017
September 03, 2015, 06:27:57 AM
Definitely this will be the invest of the year. Feel sorry for those miners who are dumping gold for two bucks.

SIA will easily rise to +1M $ market cap in the next two-three months ONLY with rumors and speculation. If Taek keeps working hard (we all expect so), we could see SIA at +10M $ cap or more in just a year. It's not an investor irrational dream, these are facts. If SIA works like it has to be, we all will get filthy rich.

Please Taek keep going with your good work and don't worry about the price. Smart investors are behind this and we are just accumulating at a minimum cost (thanks to some miners, of course).

For those afraid investors: Look at mkt cap: 100K $. Grin Grin Do you really think that this is the real value of SIA? What a joke!

1+M $ mkt cap in 2-3 months. Mark my words please. Wink

You forgot to calculate the 250million sia mined per week..
newbie
Activity: 1
Merit: 0
September 03, 2015, 05:42:05 AM
Definitely this will be the invest of the year. Feel sorry for those miners who are dumping gold for two bucks.

SIA will easily rise to +1M $ market cap in the next two-three months ONLY with rumors and speculation. If Taek keeps working hard (we all expect so), we could see SIA at +10M $ cap or more in just a year. It's not an investor irrational dream, these are facts. If SIA works like it has to be, we all will get filthy rich.

Please Taek keep going with your good work and don't worry about the price. Smart investors are behind this and we are just accumulating at a minimum cost (thanks to some miners, of course).

For those afraid investors: Look at mkt cap: 100K $. Grin Grin Do you really think that this is the real value of SIA? What a joke!

1+M $ mkt cap in 2-3 months. Mark my words please. Wink
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