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Topic: [ANN] Spondoolies-Tech - carrier grade, data center ready mining rigs - page 544. (Read 1260354 times)

sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
In order for the SP30 to become non-profitable, it has to mine less then 100$ a month.

Before we worry about end of life recovery of operating costs, we need to worry about recovering the capital costs.

It is very unlikely that the September SP30 will ever pay for itself before it operates in the red.

I am talking science to you but you are just trying to hypnotise me by repeating "it will never ROI". If you don't start talking sense I will have to stop answering.

Ok Zvisha, please answer the question I posed for Guy earlier. Please present the case for Sept. SP30 customers recovering the cost of their purchase. Identify any assumptions you make about network difficulty or other factors and provide a reasonable rationale for them.

I know you are a rational man, now is your chance to show us how the Sept SP30 is likely to recover its cost.

I am not SP marketing and this is just my private opinion.
I don't expect the network to significantly grow beyond 300PH. There is no new technology that will allow that that will ROI. People will have to invest same money into HW that they did in last year, but they will not get the same profit. I don't see people creating hundreds of PHs in the next 6 months.

er don't mean to rain on the parade..but that means (likely imho) that the beg of sept 2014 sp30 I have ordered will be basically a large 'door stop' by say December (the elec use at 15c kwh here....so essentially a "Lot" of the equip end of summer and beginning of fall will not ROI ...due to the simple fact that every one shot their "load' then and no $$ nor any real reason vs say btc price by december to get miners...ie all the lemmings (equip purchases in that time frame) have essentially went 'lemming' and jumped off the cliff at that same time?

(off i go with the thundering herd over the cliff..the freeddom of free flying lemmings)

again not a slam but enlighten please (i have no ego left go to it)

Searing

Mate, you are not averse to mining alts. I'm doing pretty nicely on my coin of choice at the moment with an SP10 and 2 x BFL singles.
i'm outperforming BTC by quite a bit - however there will still be blinkered and unimaginative trolls flooding the thread here demanding to know about ROI and some of us will still get swept up by it - that's the entire purpose of a troll, to spread FUD and limit business.

I'll say it again, while the SP30 still sells at $5k, it's a profitable investment, whether that is a fact which is appreciated or not, is not really my concern.
It just shows that some people are unable to do the slightest bit of research and will always remain blinkered and narrow minded.
Yes, cash out to BTC at every chance you get, by all means - doesn't mean you are shackled and bound to mine BTC - which some seem to be.

copper member
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1465
Clueless!
In order for the SP30 to become non-profitable, it has to mine less then 100$ a month.

Before we worry about end of life recovery of operating costs, we need to worry about recovering the capital costs.

It is very unlikely that the September SP30 will ever pay for itself before it operates in the red.

I am talking science to you but you are just trying to hypnotise me by repeating "it will never ROI". If you don't start talking sense I will have to stop answering.

Ok Zvisha, please answer the question I posed for Guy earlier. Please present the case for Sept. SP30 customers recovering the cost of their purchase. Identify any assumptions you make about network difficulty or other factors and provide a reasonable rationale for them.

I know you are a rational man, now is your chance to show us how the Sept SP30 is likely to recover its cost.

I am not SP marketing and this is just my private opinion.
I don't expect the network to significantly grow beyond 300PH. There is no new technology that will allow that that will ROI. People will have to invest same money into HW that they did in last year, but they will not get the same profit. I don't see people creating hundreds of PHs in the next 6 months.

er don't mean to rain on the parade..but that means (likely imho) that the beg of sept 2014 sp30 I have ordered will be basically a large 'door stop' by say December (the elec use at 15c kwh here....so essentially a "Lot" of the equip end of summer and beginning of fall will not ROI ...due to the simple fact that every one shot their "load' then and no $$ nor any real reason vs say btc price by december to get miners...ie all the lemmings (equip purchases in that time frame) have essentially went 'lemming' and jumped off the cliff at that same time?

(off i go with the thundering herd over the cliff..the freeddom of free flying lemmings)

thus your point is ..with no 'real' equip purchases after that point due to difficulty ...all will level off at that point in that buying equipment as a home user will be dead?

again not a slam but enlighten please (i have no ego left go to it) and er perhaps i am too harsh but hardly comforted in the fact it will level off 'difficulty' wise with the early demise of my sp30 due to the amount of equipment hitting the skids....(ie home mining is dead vs return..long live large PH farms)

if what I say has any truth...well that is pretty much how i time my investments ...the tail end of the dog..so I guess it makes sense

Searing
hero member
Activity: 714
Merit: 500
Quote
Don't host it
Even in the US, there are hosting options below residential power rates of atleast half of the states.

Also, please explain to me how you expect the exponential increase of deployed hardware to work, without exponential price increase of BTC and at a fixed amount of generated bitcoin (which is actually decreasing).

Unless somebody builds the uber miner in his basement, with virtually no NRE he would still need to get either a MASSIVE loan or huge investments in order to even get 5PH, let alone the amount needed for exponential growth.
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
Personal text my ass....
There are plenty of ROI calculators out there. Some let you input all sorts of data and you'll be able to exactly see if any miner will make its money back. While there are some variables which we don't know the exact numbers, most of the time breaking even is much harder than it was 1-2 years ago. Tips to making sure you ROI:
Don't pre-order
Get a discount on the hardware
Don't host it
Try for free electricity
Keep the rig running efficiently. (clean those fan blades)
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
Personal text my ass....
**Originally posted in SP30 group-buy thread (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7499925)**

I just returned from a trip to Israel last week and was lucky enough to drop by the Spondoolies-Tech office.  All of the staff were all very friendly and I was treated very warmly.  Their office is located in a high-tech area of Israel, with their building right next to HP and Intel offices.  It is in a clean and secure facility.  I was able to meet with Guy (CEO), Kobi (COO), and Gadi (VP Marketing and Sales) - http://www.spondoolies-tech.com/pages/team.  I was shown and took a picture of the SP30 unit (without ASICs - http://imgur.com/elpsFfC).  Everyone I dealt with was intelligent, competent, and has a very forward-looking view of the company and bitcoin technologies.  IMO this seems to be the best team with the best product in the bitcoin mining hardware space.  I have been very satisfied with my SP10 units and am looking forward to receiving my SP30 in August.  If you dont have one on order yet get it while you can!




Sorry, August batch was closed a long time ago, so telling people to go ahead and order one isn't very informative. There also have been discussions about any high priced pre-order would ever break even. After you come down from from your visiting high, run some numbers and you'll see what all this means. Have fun.
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
Personal text my ass....
6TH/s @ 2,500W for $5,000 (8.8 BTC) in September.

Assume delivery on September 1st. (optimistic)
Assume low electricity cost of 5c/kWh
Assume difficulty increases of 15% per period (conservative, we're currently 4 days from an estimated jump of 29%).

The result? A net loss of 0.7 BTC before turning it off in June 2015.

What am I missing here?


+ $300 for freight shipping.
sr. member
Activity: 672
Merit: 250
Most Advanced Crypto Exchange on the Blockchain
Why hosted? A real man keeps his miner in his house and uses it for a pillow.  

I replaced my mattress with SP10s. Keeps me warm at night.

Call me a liar if you want, but I had BOTH of my SP10s in my bedroom / aka operations center
for almost 2 weeks till I got them hosted.  I miss the buzz but not the $30 a day electricity
bills.

Zvisha, what are the newest improvements to the firmware?
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
^^^

Thanks!

What about DC2DC current limit?

EDIT: It is in the DC, I have several SP10s. With your recommendations some of them are hashing around 1450 some around 1400. What's the way of fine tuning every each miner for optimal maximum performance?

Thank you.
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
Zvisha,

Can you please recommend power settings for SP10 on 208V, 35C ambient?

Thanks a lot!!!

EDIT: Firmware 1.4.8


Depends on ASIC corner and DCR.
Recommend settings for most miners: start DC2DC - 0.660, max DC2DC - 0.73, PSU - 1260, fans - 90% (unless it's home and then set maximum tolerable). If you take fans below 70%, bring you PSU limit down to 1100 or 1200 (look at ASIC temps not to be all over 113), and start DC2DC to 0.65.


Note that DCR type 1 is sensitive to heat, it really likes being in sub 25C for better hash rate.
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
Zvisha,

Can you please recommend power settings for SP10 on 208V, 35C ambient?

Thanks a lot!!!

EDIT: Firmware 1.4.8
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
Anyone upgraded to 1.4.8 yet?  What's your experience?

Right now, on 1.4.6, sometimes the miner does not respond after rebooting (using the reboot button on the GUI).  I can SSH but after entering the username (root), it wont ask for the password.  I would have to power cycle.

Right now I experienced a problem where restarting the cgminer keeps timing out, so instead of using the reboot button on the GUI, I used SSH.  After doing so, it doesn't come back up (cannot ping it).

I can't power cycle now since I'm not on premise (using remote software).

These situations are very frustrating.

I didn't see this problem in my environment lately
There are 2 things that need power cycle: Over-current in AC2DC caused by too high PSU limit or starting voltage, or stuck I2C, that should not happen and did not happen in version 1.4.xx.
 
If you know of such problem in your miner, I can recommend upgrading it only when there are people in DC that can restart it.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
Anyone upgraded to 1.4.8 yet?  What's your experience?

Right now, on 1.4.6, sometimes the miner does not respond after rebooting (using the reboot button on the GUI).  I can SSH but after entering the username (root), it wont ask for the password.  I would have to power cycle.

Right now I experienced a problem where restarting the cgminer keeps timing out, so instead of using the reboot button on the GUI, I used SSH.  After doing so, it doesn't come back up (cannot ping it).

I can't power cycle now since I'm not on premise (using remote software).

These situations are very frustrating.

I have upgraded, some of these issues seem to have been fixed but one: after rearranging pool data, I found that I still need to restart minergate to make sure my pools hook on.
legendary
Activity: 1098
Merit: 1000
Zvisha is giggly because he worked on SP30 FW for 12 hours straight and now he is in sleep deprivation.

Then, login a huge overtime and "hit the sack", LOL
Cheers

I can not sleep without understanding if SP30 will ROI or not  Undecided

Love it Smiley
hero member
Activity: 677
Merit: 500
Anyone upgraded to 1.4.8 yet?  What's your experience?

Right now, on 1.4.6, sometimes the miner does not respond after rebooting (using the reboot button on the GUI).  I can SSH but after entering the username (root), it wont ask for the password.  I would have to power cycle.

Right now I experienced a problem where restarting the cgminer keeps timing out, so instead of using the reboot button on the GUI, I used SSH.  After doing so, it doesn't come back up (cannot ping it).

I can't power cycle now since I'm not on premise (using remote software).

These situations are very frustrating.
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
I don't expect the network to significantly grow beyond 300PH.

Sounds about right, but only while bitcoin is priced around $600. The next bubble will make buying new hardware highly profitable once again.

Actually, even if network hits 500PH, the SP30 still makes 0.7BTC per month.
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
Why hosted? A real man keeps his miner in his house and uses it for a pillow.  

I replaced my mattress with SP10s. Keeps me warm at night.


Some people complain SP10 is a bit on the loud side Smiley

I get in now why he (Zvisha) is so giddy and jocular now.
Perhaps, we will see that magic number (~$100/mo) afterall....(deals in China/SE Asia)?


Zvisha is giggly because he worked on SP30 FW for 12 hours straight and now he is in sleep deprivation.

Then, login a huge overtime and "hit the sack", LOL
Cheers

I can not sleep without understanding if SP30 will ROI or not  Undecided
legendary
Activity: 3892
Merit: 4331
Why hosted? A real man keeps his miner in his house and uses it for a pillow.  

I replaced my mattress with SP10s. Keeps me warm at night.


Some people complain SP10 is a bit on the loud side Smiley

I get in now why he (Zvisha) is so giddy and jocular now.
Perhaps, we will see that magic number (~$100/mo) afterall....(deals in China/SE Asia)?


Zvisha is giggly because he worked on SP30 FW for 12 hours straight and now he is in sleep deprivation.

Then, login a huge overtime and "hit the sack", LOL
Cheers
legendary
Activity: 3878
Merit: 1193
I don't expect the network to significantly grow beyond 300PH.

Sounds about right, but only while bitcoin is priced around $600. The next bubble will make buying new hardware highly profitable once again.
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
Why hosted? A real man keeps his miner in his house and uses it for a pillow.  

I replaced my mattress with SP10s. Keeps me warm at night.


Some people complain SP10 is a bit on the loud side Smiley

I get in now why he (Zvisha) is so giddy and jocular now.
Perhaps, we will see that magic number (~$100/mo) afterall....(deals in China/SE Asia)?


Zvisha is giggly because he worked on SP30 FW for 12 hours straight and now he is in sleep deprivation.
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
In order for the SP30 to become non-profitable, it has to mine less then 100$ a month.

Before we worry about end of life recovery of operating costs, we need to worry about recovering the capital costs.

It is very unlikely that the September SP30 will ever pay for itself before it operates in the red.

I am talking science to you but you are just trying to hypnotise me by repeating "it will never ROI". If you don't start talking sense I will have to stop answering.

Ok Zvisha, please answer the question I posed for Guy earlier. Please present the case for Sept. SP30 customers recovering the cost of their purchase. Identify any assumptions you make about network difficulty or other factors and provide a reasonable rationale for them.

I know you are a rational man, now is your chance to show us how the Sept SP30 is likely to recover its cost.

I am not SP marketing and this is just my private opinion.
I don't expect the network to significantly grow beyond 300PH. There is no new technology that will allow that that will ROI. People will have to invest same money into HW that they did in last year, but they will not get the same profit. I don't see people creating hundreds of PHs in the next 6 months.
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