Topic: [ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin" - page 235. (Read 1151373 times)

I agree with you on this point, as much as I think dooglus is an honorable person you should never keep all your clams in one clam basket. I keep a small portion on his site, but a majority of what I have stakes in multiple wallets. More people staking and less clams in a centralized location makes for a better network. We could solve the issue now if people would just take half of what they have on Jd and stake on a local wallet.

I'd just like to add that Doog has brought a large amount of value to CLAM and continues to, it's not exhausted, it grows daily. It's kind of a miracle we are where we are to begin with, but I have hope that we will make it through these realities that have been borne out over the last months. The integrity of Just-Dice remains, the use of Just-Dice remains and grows, and CLAM will be great. We are going through a pain period, but the market is smart if you watch it. It's reacting well to the digger. It's making him sell CLAMs at an absolute steal. People will be rushing to buy them at 10x the price sooner than it seems, in my estimation. The investors of JD have shown that they are resilient, however they are composed, as this price drop has been managed beyond what should have been possible.

Well, he could dig some and buy some more. The entire market cap of CLAM is less than a million dollars at the moment, so it's by no means impossible for someone wealthy to mess with the coin "for the lulz".


That's true, but I don't think it's their responsibility to do so. They make the coin available to us, and we are free to use it how we like. I found the coin and decided to use it at Just-Dice. The client wasn't in a state that worked for me, so I made a bunch of changes to it to make it work how I needed it to work, and contributed those changes back to the open source codebase. That's how it's meant to work - provide the services you want to see, and don't wait for "people at the high levels" to do it for you. In fact there are no "levels" - you're free to use and build CLAM however you like.

1. Certain people creating shady services that benefited from the value you brought to Clam

No need for me to point any fingers I am sure its very clear to most


2. The uncertainty of more large holders/diggers with questionable ways they happened to have so many addresses

Clearly the large digger benefited immensely from the Value you brought to clam

Its just seems to me like many variables are out of your(most everyones) control

I guess everyone knows another 500,000 free clam holder could pop up tomorrow and its what we all signed up for

Control isn't a question of whose money it is in this case. Doog has the keys, so they have control, simple as that.

I don't see this as a problem the way CLAM is now (being used mostly as a chip at just-dice). The way it stands is actually closer than most crypto projects to some kind of workable model for sustainability and value growth the way I see it. CLAM actually has a valuable use which is to make bets or invest on just-dice. There are substitutes... other dice sites that use btc, other crypto gaming avenues, but a big reason I am a long term CLAM holder and will continue to be is that I find Just-Dice to be the best crypto gaming and investing experience that there is. And as with most things that are the best, the margin is wide between it and the competition and this is seen in the site's passionate users.  I think that's really the best reason there is to buy CLAM today and hold it for long term value appreciation from this price. People will continue to bet at Just-Dice at a suitable ratio of total bets / total coin supply (and at a growing rate) to a point where there will be active trade in the coin for the long-term (as there is currently).

Considering this, the proprietor of the economic engine behind this self-contained value ecosystem (i.e. Doog) having control of >50% of active coins (as has been the case for about a year at least). Is not a problem. It is not ideal, but is far less problematic than a dice site denominated in BTC because of the adverse incentive that would exist for the proprietor to violate trust and "break" the coin by doing an attack. The idea is that Doog wouldn't benefit from this because it would ruin the site once discovered and subsequently the coin would not have much value at all. Doog has every incentive to keep the coin healthy and employ as much security as possible to keep its functioning healthy.

A site operator of a btc-denominated site could much more easily violate trust because their offloading of the money would be far less difficult being soaked up by the btc ecosystem which covers a million different things rather than just one.

At this point, a digger would have to dig roughly 250k wallet addresses to be able to 51% attack the coin - an exceedingly unlikely proposition, and the number increases by approximately 300 per day.

The thing that I have wanted to write a long post about and have not gotten around to is that value is created by having something to do with the coin, and while there are certain other sites where you can transact with CLAMs, its adoption for non-gambling purposes has been very low. And it seems like the people involved in CLAM at the high levels have been content to not extend any effort into anything other than JD.

I am working on a website where you will be able to purchase items (ones people will want) with CLAM, though unfortunately the coin processor I am using (Coinpayments) does not support CLAM, so the transactions will be done manually. But a big part of my reason for doing it is answering the call of people in JD chat who say "I wish I had something I could do with my CLAMs other than switch them back to BTC and cash out" or who don't want to sell them on the open market because they don't want to negatively impact the price.

It's actually up already, but in "gamma testing", so I'm not doing any promo yet. If you catch me in JD chat, I might spill the beans.

There is no way to know how many accounts one investor might have.

The danger of 51% attacks is very real until and unless the coin becomes much more widely distributed and used for more things besides investing in the JD bankroll. Most people trust dooglus (or the coin would have no value) but things can go wrong. The site can be hacked. He might sell it. Or, he might turn bad after all.

More large diggers are probably an advantage for security especially if they stake their own coins. If they invest in JD or sell to people who invest in JD then it is no change. It's pretty unlikely that a single new (huge!) digger is going to come along and dig up enough to 51% attack by himself and that becomes even more unlikely the more coins are dug up (including by this current whale digger) and staked.

I think there are a lot more CLAMs than usual on the poloniex orderbooks.

I made updated "dig charts". It's pretty clear that the rate of digging has picked up dramatically:

Yes, but it is not Doog's money, but from the investors, and there is no one big investor: http://just-dice.blogspot.de/search/label/bankroll

It's cute that people say this, but JD has controlled more than 50% of the coin supply ever since I've been using it. It's over 70% currently, peaked around 77% recently, somebody big divested, it would seem.

I don't understand what you mean. Can you explain?

He said that he will do that. No vote is going to be able to stop him doing it, even if that's what people wanted.

I guess the vote is about whether to change the rules for future diggers. There's another 14 million undug CLAMs out there, some of it in big wallets...

curious already wrote that he/she is done with digging in a few days (not enough time for a vote and change), but not selling. Personally I agree with curious that digging is a good idea, because it will distribute more CLAMs, probably mostly at market price at Poloniex, if another whale finds some addresses. The danger of 51% control is low.

Too bad that there will be no doogcoin, would have doubled my investment, but then maybe not, because people would have lose faith in CLAM then and would not trust the new coin either. But I like the idea of adding new voting features to CLAM.

Yes many digger have got much value that JD created.

Its becoming very apparent how many people have been skimming off the back of dooglus

I think digger came out and will dig up all his clam fast because digger afraid there will be a vote on reduce or remove digging.

That snapshot idea is sounding better and better

Doesn't prove you are the digger, but confirmed. BTW, it is cheaper with the escrow feature on just-dice

Hi Mr. Digger.

Isn't it a curious curiosity that your name is so similar to the creative creator of CLAM?

Congrats on digging so many CLAMs.

Some random intrusive questions - feel free not to answer any you don't like, of course:

* is this mostly all one big BTC wallet, or have you been collecting a bunch of wallets?
* is it from a real service, or was it created just for the sake of having a lot of addresses?
* how many BTC did you make so far from digging and selling?
* do you have an account on Just-Dice? I'm sure people there would like to talk to you "live"

don't say your curious around dooglus. he may take it the wrong way