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Topic: [ANN][XCN] Cryptonite | 1st mini-blockchain coin | M7 PoW | No Premine - page 147. (Read 578501 times)

full member
Activity: 288
Merit: 105
most of time is spent in hashes on CPU, but that can change if somebody optimizes the difficult hash functions, and is only true because the

The hash implementations looked reasonably decent to me. Perhaps that is not the case, I haven't looked carefully, but it is at least trying to be fast. See Tuning at http://www.saphir2.com/sphlib/

There might be some advantage on the 512 hashes to dump the upper bits of output since I think they are not used. I'm not sure how far back into the hash algorithm this is effective, but my guess is not that far.


Reorder is working on something with midstate on 1GH. Can be improved further I believe. Can also prepad the hashes. Bunch of things can be done. sph is not bad just doing things that don't need to be done repeatedly.

All bits of the hashes are used. The product is some nearly 3000 bit number which is hashed into sha256
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
I'm still getting many rejects on http://xcn.1gh.com, accept rate is pending between 72-85% on 5 different boxes.

Any ideas, reorder? Anything miners can do?
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
most of time is spent in hashes on CPU, but that can change if somebody optimizes the difficult hash functions, and is only true because the

The hash implementations looked reasonably decent to me. Perhaps that is not the case, I haven't looked carefully, but it is at least trying to be fast. See Tuning at http://www.saphir2.com/sphlib/

There might be some advantage on the 512 hashes to dump the upper bits of output since I think they are not used. I'm not sure how far back into the hash algorithm this is effective, but my guess is not that far.





full member
Activity: 288
Merit: 105
I'm rather a fan of the PoW, seeing as how i wrote it and all. I think nobody has really sat down to think about how hard that "silly multiplication"

Have you actually profiled it? I have, and most of the time is currently being spent in the hash functions, not the multiply. Granted that is CPU not GPU, but I'm skeptical that multiply will be a major bottleneck. Someone may prove me wrong, we'll see.


On CPU multiplication is highly optimized, for GPU even the oh so hard to do methods will have big time problems. I'm willing to believe that most of time is spent in hashes on CPU, but that can change if somebody optimizes the difficult hash functions, and is only true because the CPU is so efficient at multiplication.  Like I said I think doing the hashes on GPU and multiplying it on CPU will turn out to be the setup. How much that buys you I don't know. Maybe you triple performance of a 4770k by adding a 750ti? Whatever it is won't be any sempron with 1x pcie. Maybe a 750ti goes same speed as 4770k by itself. These are all possibilities that don't seem highly advantageous to me.  Still going to get mopped up by a dual xeon on EC2 without the capital costs.

Pretty sure nobody has it, although Wolf has been quiet for the past day. I'm working on it.

AMD GCN, for instance, performs any VALU operation in 4 clocks. mul_hi and mul_lo are two disctinct operations though, so it takes 8 clock to multiply two 32-bit ints in all running threads. An addition or bitwise operations take 4. Multiplication is obviously not the bottleneck in this design.

This is true but it depends on what you think of as threads. thing is a barrel processor and a "clock" really takes as many cycles as it takes to get through the barrel. Really you have to figure instruction issuance rates which is the SIMD width * number of cores * clock rate. The number of resident threads in the barrel does not increase issuance, only the probability and instruction is able to issue on every clock.

Also GCN has only 24bit multiplier and there are some extra instruction for combining even 32bit multiplies into 64. You need 4 mul + some adds. And then you have mul_hi mul_lo. So it's a whole mess of instructions. Not to mention amount of memory required. Probably to big for lmem so you have lots of load/store traffic going on.
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1000
Do we have an emission curve?
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
Welcome to ...
★★★ CRYPTONITE 1GH POOL ★★★

--> xcn.1gh.com <--


Any nodes?
My wallet cant sync (
Seeding works pretty well, actually. Here are a few running now, just in case: 216.51.224.242, 210.64.51.11, 58.220.3.208, 71.8.128.127
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
I'm rather a fan of the PoW, seeing as how i wrote it and all. I think nobody has really sat down to think about how hard that "silly multiplication"

Have you actually profiled it? I have, and most of the time is currently being spent in the hash functions, not the multiply. Granted that is CPU not GPU, but I'm skeptical that multiply will be a major bottleneck. Someone may prove me wrong, we'll see.

AMD GCN, for instance, performs any VALU operation in 4 clocks. mul_hi and mul_lo are two disctinct operations though, so it takes 8 clock to multiply two 32-bit ints in all running threads. An addition or bitwise operations take 4. Multiplication is obviously not the bottleneck in this design.
member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
It would be nice if the people walletmining with CPU farms would use proxies to make it a bit less unfair for normal miners.  As it is now they are hogging all the blocks AND all the inbound connections on anyone who has a listening daemon!

You can just ask them to send 10% of their coins to your wallet. Will be much more simple for them. Forget about fairness, new algos are created for unfairness. There is no another reason to launch a coin with different algo than instamine it using closed mining software.

I think even gmaxwell would disagree with you there.

This is how you introduce a new algo: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/cuckoo-cycle-speed-challenge-2500-in-bounties-707879

Agreed - that incentivizes people to release better miners.
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
Welcome to ...
★★★ CRYPTONITE 1GH POOL ★★★

--> xcn.1gh.com <--


Any nodes?
My wallet cant sync (
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
I'm rather a fan of the PoW, seeing as how i wrote it and all. I think nobody has really sat down to think about how hard that "silly multiplication"

Have you actually profiled it? I have, and most of the time is currently being spent in the hash functions, not the multiply. Granted that is CPU not GPU, but I'm skeptical that multiply will be a major bottleneck. Someone may prove me wrong, we'll see.
full member
Activity: 288
Merit: 105
I'm rather a fan of the PoW, seeing as how i wrote it and all. I think nobody has really sat down to think about how hard that "silly multiplication" is for GPU's and ASIC, and there is no evidence that a GPU miner has been created. I'm working on one in spare time to prove how much it will suck. I mean it will work, but won't be massively faster than CPU. Especially if someone sits down to optimize CPU for AVX. The ultimate combination is probably GPU for hashing and CPU for multiply. Might get somewhere doing that but it's a whole new kind of rig to have that kind of balance.

Lemme give you some numbers:

750ti = 160 32x32 bit multipliers @ 1gz = 160B 32bit per second
4770k = 16 64x64 bit multiplication per clock @ 3.6ghz = 57.6B 64bit muls ~= 330.4B 32bit per second

Theres no fighting that. It is raw ALU power.
legendary
Activity: 980
Merit: 1000
well, I decided to give this coin a shot, found out there's no pools, boo, so i set up a wallet to solo mine on 4 different i7 computers, been almost 24 hours now and one of them did find one block, so i guess that's good? hurray? can't really see how fast it's mining in the wallet, used to seeing my hashrate and accepts flying by on the GPUs i mine with. all i can say is that in task manager the wallet's cpu performance is at %90+ so it seems to be working.

my concern is the price, it seems incredibly inflated. there's over 300,000 new coins meing mined a day, so in 10 days this will have as much coins as cloakcoin for example (of which the price seems appropriately compared to) but after that it's just going to get diluded. in 20 days it will be worth half as much. to me this seems unsustainable.

i've never heard of a coin with 1.84 billion coins that's been worth 8000 satoshis. that on it's own is just very impressive, but I gotta say, as an investor, i'd be looking to short this right now, no way this is a sustainable price unless you want to valuate this being worth as much as 100x doge right out of the gate. 10x maybe i'd believe, but not 100. this is silly.
member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
It would be nice if the people walletmining with CPU farms would use proxies to make it a bit less unfair for normal miners.  As it is now they are hogging all the blocks AND all the inbound connections on anyone who has a listening daemon!

You can just ask them to send 10% of their coins to your wallet. Will be much more simple for them. Forget about fairness, new algos are created for unfairness. There is no another reason to launch a coin with different algo than instamine it using closed mining software.

I think even gmaxwell would disagree with you there.
sr. member
Activity: 299
Merit: 250
This shit is going down the drain as soon as someone forks it and make a fair release with gpu miner at very launch. This is DRK all over again..Price after only  4 days passed is just ridiculous. Anyone still dumb enough to buy will just be a bagholder.

Just fork it and use a different PoW.

If you want people to be able to mine at all on CPUs while also having GPU miners, use Cryptonight (from Monero), otherwise just use whateever X-blah variant is popular now or even Scrypt or SHA. If the mini-blockchain is the thing that makes this valuable then there is no legitimate reason to concoct a brand new PoW.

I'd also suggest the slow-start reward thing I mentioned several pages back. Ramp up the rewards over the first week or two so whatever initial launch issues there might be (bad builds, not enough seeds, etc.) get fixed before the full reward kick in.

That's the way to do it! Looking forward for Cryptonite's monero !  Cool
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
This shit is going down the drain as soon as someone forks it and make a fair release with gpu miner at very launch. This is DRK all over again..Price after only  4 days passed is just ridiculous. Anyone still dumb enough to buy will just be a bagholder.

Just fork it and use a different PoW.

If you want people to be able to mine at all on CPUs while also having GPU miners, use Cryptonight (from Monero), otherwise just use whateever X-blah variant is popular now or even Scrypt or SHA. If the mini-blockchain is the thing that makes this valuable then there is no legitimate reason to concoct a brand new PoW.

I'd also suggest the slow-start reward thing I mentioned several pages back. Ramp up the rewards over the first week or two so whatever initial launch issues there might be (bad builds, not enough seeds, etc.) get fixed before the full reward kick in.
sr. member
Activity: 299
Merit: 250
This shit is going down the drain as soon as someone forks it and make a fair release with gpu miner at very launch. This is DRK all over again..Price after only  4 days passed is just ridiculous. Anyone still dumb enough to buy will just be a bagholder.
hero member
Activity: 781
Merit: 501
I dont find blocks... at firts, this coin was a fail, anything works fine...

you're failed, not the coin. Loosers always complaining, jeiling all the time.
full member
Activity: 168
Merit: 100
I dont find blocks... at firts, this coin was a fail, anything works fine...
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250


Eventually. It is not even started yet.

Great, looking forward to it  Smiley
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
1gh pool almost boo, why?


It's not first minutes

Code:
[2014-08-02 18:18:12] accepted: 139/170 (81.76%), 1257 khash/s (yay!!!)
[2014-08-02 18:18:14] thread 30: 60522 hashes, 39.43 khash/s
[2014-08-02 18:18:14] accepted: 140/171 (81.87%), 1257 khash/s (yay!!!)
[2014-08-02 18:18:14] thread 14: 71655 hashes, 39.43 khash/s
[2014-08-02 18:18:14] accepted: 141/172 (81.98%), 1257 khash/s (yay!!!)
[2014-08-02 18:18:39] thread 27: 1042917 hashes, 39.23 khash/s
[2014-08-02 18:18:39] accepted: 141/173 (81.50%), 1257 khash/s (booooo)
[2014-08-02 18:18:45] thread 16: 1294598 hashes, 39.30 khash/s
[2014-08-02 18:18:45] accepted: 141/174 (81.03%), 1257 khash/s (booooo)
[2014-08-02 18:18:46] thread 14: 1276110 hashes, 39.38 khash/s
[2014-08-02 18:18:46] accepted: 141/175 (80.57%), 1257 khash/s (booooo)



This looks like a problem on our side indeed, we are investigating. It will not require updating minerd when fixed.


Thanks for the pool Smiley

Are you going to release a GPU miner too?
Eventually. It is not even started yet.
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