Topic: [ANN][XCN] Cryptonite | 1st mini-blockchain coin | M7 PoW | No Premine - page 68. (Read 578501 times)

Lol I think that may just be because bitcoin is falling like a lead balloon.

good news! price reflecting it

i pointed a rig at it.  you should change the getting started settings. shows instructions for nist5.

Yes I have some news, the open source block explorer I'm working on is almost finished. I've got to get some sleep now but there's not much left to do so it should be released within 24 hours.

Devcoin is outstanding, I support it fully, but the distribution really is limited. It is more like a club or clique coin, a way to show support but not practical as a currency in the long term.

Or some results from testing and spreading some hash over ? I'd really like to know if the stratum works at suprnova

seems like we are way off topic.  any news about xcn?

By the way the majority of devcoins are essentially mined by human creative work: 180M coins were distributed to people who earned shares for developing open source software, completing bounties, writing on devtome, which pays 1 share for between 700 and 2000 words according to writer's quality.  The number of shares acts as the effective difficulty in earning devcoins, which is getting harder and harder (just like bitcoin mining). The coin has been around for more than 2 years but devtome is a fairly recent addition.

It does not need to be a 'solveable' PoW. When for example two or more people compete in a game they are matching human qualities against human qualities. A 'game' context would also solve the language issue since anyone could mine without knowing a specific language.

In general terms I will admit that you are a developer and I am not so I can't answer very well your points. But in this instance it is a fresh enough concept that the limitations you might see could be solved simply by starting from scratch. The only things to be taken for granted are 1) an electronic currency 2) mineable only by individuals 3) without regard for the level of tech they can afford etc.

A person should prevent it from being a gambling currency, in other words some purpose and skill should be involved. Aside from that it isall developer issues and problems to figure out how it could be done. Out of my depth ha ha.

Looked at the wiki for Amazon Mechanical Turk and am fascinated by it enough to look into it more later.

I am not a dev nor anything else but just an observer who thinks it is obvious that human mining is the next big step.

Also my resources are near zero in every category so although I support the concept fully someone with abilities and resources will have to do it. I think it is good to discuss this kind of thing publicly since maybe someone else will read and get a useful idea but I mention it here because bitfreak or some other dev might do something with it. If you and bitfreak discussed the issue some good might result.

Although I am not a dev or coin person etc I do know enough of other things to respect the potential of 'human mining' and also to understand in some way the long term impact of that step once it is taken. It certainly goes past bitcoin.

Would be cool if anyone would share some love @ suprnova .. Now that I got the Stratum up no one is mining 

As a lack of a AMD GPU miner i cannot mine myself (with gpu) .. I would if I could..

The solution cannot be quickly verified by computers unless the solution is already known, but the point of a PoW algorithm is that no one knows the solution until some one finds a solution. The example I gave about the programmer writing an algorithm is a better approach because the solution can be easily verified by a computer, it just needs to run the algorithm and make sure it produces the correct output. The other problem with a captcha approach is that you need a way to decide where the captcha images come from, which requires centralization.

Captcoin

what about a captcha type thing? thats easy for humans to solve

I don't really think it's possible to create a human mineable coin. The problem is you need a PoW algorithm which is hard for bots to solve but easy for humans to solve, but it also needs to be easy for computers to verify the solution. There is no easy way to meet those requirements. The problem space would have to be so huge that a bot wont have any chance at finding a solution by randomly searching for one, but it should be solvable by applying creativity and logic. For example when a programmer is faced with a problem he must apply creativity and logic to write an algorithm which can solve the problem. If he were to randomly try every possible algorithm he would never find a solution, but by applying human reasoning skills he is able to write an algorithm capable of solving the problem. That is the sort of PoW problem required to make a human mineable coin.

I think you'd have to do something like Amazon Mechanical Turk where people submit tasks and have to pay for them, and then the system allows, but does not require, humans rather than bots to preform the tasks. People won't pay human-labor prices for tasks that can be automated, they will simply automate them, so such a market naturally attracts tasks that can't be automated.

Turning that into a mining algorithm is another matter. I can sort of think of ways that could work, but I'd have to take some time to work through the details, and I don't have time for it right now. Feel free to PM me to exchange ideas if you are working on this seriously.

I'm sorry it wasn't clear what is meant by human mineable.

It means a person performs a task on the computer that cannot be performed by bots. It would be cutting the edge of artificial intelligence to keep the coin a step ahead of automators.

1 person sits at a computer.

It could be a 15 thousand dollar computer in Seattle, a 600 rupee used tablet in Delhi, a smartphone perhaps.

They mine manually for x hours and reliably get about y coins. Some people will get y +10%. Some will get y minus 10%. But they all get roughly the same regardless what they can afford.

Will you and I mine these coins? Of course not. The people will be making like 0.1 usd per day. Grunt work.

Will it be a successful algorithm? It is about 100% sure that the first truly human mineable coin will get more publicity than any altcoin since bitcoin. Equally obvious the algorithm will progress similarly to bitcoin. First local game currencies like huc. Next a coin with more progressive intent but still primitive. Then a coin like primecoin that uses the labor, human in this case, more productively then simply running in circles.

The challenge is to develop the coin in a way that stays ahead of automators and to anticipate the effect the coin might eventually have on local economies, i.e., anticipate problems that might arise.

A person could then ask what step would folllow that in altcoins.

"Good old Bitcoin" is only good if you're extremely careful about hiding your identity(creating new addresses for every transaction, not posting your address on forums, website, not resuing addresses etc)...Most people aren't so it isn't that anonymous for them.  

I somewhat agree. But there is always a catch to it, then for example it will be more profitable to own a bunch of low-grade computers, and people will thus collect bigger and bigger farms. Distribution is definitely one of the hardest issues to solve.

What I would like to see is a node-based reward system, like Darkcoin's masternode concept, where people are rewarded for anonymizing and fortifying the network. And it should of course also, like you pointed out, be easy and accessible for everyone.

Aside from anonymity features there is no more certain way to guarantee the success of a coin than human mining. It is a sort of holy grail, impossible to find right now, since coins are stuck at the moment on catering to miners.

The first coin that is truly human mineable / 1 man hour on a cheap computer in Lima Peru equals the same mining capacity as 1 man hour on an nsa supercomputer / will be in the top 5 in market cap weeks after it begins.

A lot of things make human mining difficult but it is probably the next truly big step in altcoins.