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Topic: [ANN][XEL] Elastic Project - The Decentralized Supercomputer - page 219. (Read 450523 times)

ImI
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1019
Maybe we could vote in the client itself.

XEL holders can vote for or against using "any input" instead of just the first for redeeming the genesis block.
If >50% vote for yes, then this feature gets enabled for all those who did not vote "no". So, those who vote against that will definitely have their genesis block entry redeemeable only by the first input address.

What do you think? This seems "democratic" to me and everyone who does not want this feature, doesn't get it Wink

Why to vote? Smiley

I mean why not to enable that behavior for all the donations by default? It will allow some users to redeem, who otherwise will not be able to do that.
So there are benefits of having that feature ("redeem using any input address").

Lets now think what are the possible drawbacks of that approach. I can see only one: it could create some hypothetical security hole - if coins were sent from online wallets, where some of the keys belong to the online wallet owners, it is possible that online wallet owners will redeem the coins and steal them that way... Is this correct..?
Is there any other drawback?

And... am I thinking in the right direction here...?

What you describe would not happen in reality I think. The only wallets I know of are those, who use multisig-wallets to send the funds from. Multisig wallets are those starting with a 3....

The real drawback of this approach would be only if something like that happened:

1. Someone donated 100 BTC from his QT wallet.
2. The money came from 10 different addresses in one transaction
3. The first input is his "main wallet". Absolutely correct and he keeps this private key secretly
4. As the other wallets of his are empty, he posts the private key to one of the other addresses in some public online forum, in an example python script that he posts. I mean hey, he wasnt aware of the change that we are discussing.
5. Everyone can redeem his XEL

Hmm....proposal: Stick to the terms, give out the XEL that were redeemed correctly and then (after a period of time) reconsider again. Eventually (after there is no conflict with another person) release the XEL.

From a legal perspective its obv safe to just stay to the terms conditions and not pay out those funds, which maybe less then 0.1% eventually anyways.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1168
Maybe we could vote in the client itself.

XEL holders can vote for or against using "any input" instead of just the first for redeeming the genesis block.
If >50% vote for yes, then this feature gets enabled for all those who did not vote "no". So, those who vote against that will definitely have their genesis block entry redeemeable only by the first input address.

What do you think? This seems "democratic" to me and everyone who does not want this feature, doesn't get it Wink

Why to vote? Smiley

I mean why not to enable that behavior for all the donations by default? It will allow some users to redeem, who otherwise will not be able to do that.
So there are benefits of having that feature ("redeem using any input address").

Lets now think what are the possible drawbacks of that approach. I can see only one: it could create some hypothetical security hole - if coins were sent from online wallets, where some of the keys belong to the online wallet owners, it is possible that online wallet owners will redeem the coins and steal them that way... Is this correct..?
Is there any other drawback?

And... am I thinking in the right direction here...?

What you describe would not happen in reality I think. The only wallets I know of are those, who use multisig-wallets to send the funds from. Multisig wallets are those starting with a 3....

The real drawback of this approach would be only if something like that happened:

1. Someone donated 100 BTC from his QT wallet.
2. The money came from 10 different addresses in one transaction
3. The first input is his "main wallet". Absolutely correct and he keeps this private key secretly
4. As the other wallets of his are empty, he posts the private key to one of the other addresses in some public online forum, in an example python script that he posts. I mean hey, he wasnt aware of the change that we are discussing.
5. Everyone can redeem his XEL
hero member
Activity: 994
Merit: 513
Just hodl ur elastics  Grin

Sounds ironic, but I hardly have any  Sad  I threw in less than 4 BTC in it. So if you will, I am working here exclusively for you guys!

Less than 4 BTC… Hardly any… I don't even own 4 BTC. My donation is just a tad above the minimum required, actually.
legendary
Activity: 2576
Merit: 1073
Maybe we could vote in the client itself.

XEL holders can vote for or against using "any input" instead of just the first for redeeming the genesis block.
If >50% vote for yes, then this feature gets enabled for all those who did not vote "no". So, those who vote against that will definitely have their genesis block entry redeemeable only by the first input address.

What do you think? This seems "democratic" to me and everyone who does not want this feature, doesn't get it Wink

Why to vote? Smiley

I mean why not to enable that behavior for all the donations by default? It will allow some users to redeem, who otherwise will not be able to do that.
So there are benefits of having that feature ("redeem using any input address").

Lets now think what are the possible drawbacks of that approach. I can see only one: it could create some hypothetical security hole - if coins were sent from online wallets, where some of the keys belong to the online wallet owners, it is possible that online wallet owners will redeem the coins and steal them that way... Is this correct..?
Is there any other drawback?

And... am I thinking in the right direction here...?
member
Activity: 122
Merit: 10
I want to update the XEL reddit thread.
Can some please tell me when we go live?
Also please reply some importants points regarding this project.

Thanks!
full member
Activity: 168
Merit: 100
Now you think:
Great, I donate 1000 BTC, and back up the private key 1ABCDEF...

Now, in fact your transaction is 1000.0001 BTC (because of the fee). BitcoinQT pulls in the dust from the change address as the first input and you are screwed if you missed creating a back up of 1DEADBEEF:

Hmm.. i always was under the impression that you have ONE private key that you can sign all the addresses in your wallet with. So lets say i backup my wallet.dat, then i should be able to sign all addresses that belong to that certain private key including the dust-adresses?

You can list all adresses in yout wallet with "listaddressgroupings"

and show each private key with "dumpprivkey [your public key here]" command

ok, as i understand it we would have a problem if someone had not made a backup of his WHOLE wallet but instead just made a backup of ONE of his private keys, right?





yep
ImI
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1019
Now you think:
Great, I donate 1000 BTC, and back up the private key 1ABCDEF...

Now, in fact your transaction is 1000.0001 BTC (because of the fee). BitcoinQT pulls in the dust from the change address as the first input and you are screwed if you missed creating a back up of 1DEADBEEF:

Hmm.. i always was under the impression that you have ONE private key that you can sign all the addresses in your wallet with. So lets say i backup my wallet.dat, then i should be able to sign all addresses that belong to that certain private key including the dust-adresses?

You can list all adresses in yout wallet with "listaddressgroupings"

and show each private key with "dumpprivkey [your public key here]" command

ok, as i understand it we would have a problem if someone had not made a backup of his WHOLE wallet but instead just made a backup of ONE of his private keys, right?



full member
Activity: 168
Merit: 100
Now you think:
Great, I donate 1000 BTC, and back up the private key 1ABCDEF...

Now, in fact your transaction is 1000.0001 BTC (because of the fee). BitcoinQT pulls in the dust from the change address as the first input and you are screwed if you missed creating a back up of 1DEADBEEF:

Hmm.. i always was under the impression that you have ONE private key that you can sign all the addresses in your wallet with. So lets say i backup my wallet.dat, then i should be able to sign all addresses that belong to that certain private key including the dust-adresses?

You can list all adresses in yout wallet with "listaddressgroupings"

and show each private key with "dumpprivkey [your public key here]" command
ImI
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1019
Now you think:
Great, I donate 1000 BTC, and back up the private key 1ABCDEF...

Now, in fact your transaction is 1000.0001 BTC (because of the fee). BitcoinQT pulls in the dust from the change address as the first input and you are screwed if you missed creating a back up of 1DEADBEEF:

Hmm.. i always was under the impression that you have ONE private key that you can sign all the addresses in your wallet with. So lets say i backup my wallet.dat, then i should be able to sign all addresses that belong to that certain private key including the dust-adresses?
hero member
Activity: 513
Merit: 500
Sounds ironic, but I hardly have any  Sad  I threw in less than 4 BTC in it. So if you will, I am working here exclusively for you guys!

Well, I think we are all in agreement that a good chunk of the BTC donated should come your way, right? Who controls that? And why aren't they paying you?
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1168
Just hodl ur elastics  Grin

Sounds ironic, but I hardly have any  Sad  I threw in less than 4 BTC in it. So if you will, I am working here exclusively for you guys!
hero member
Activity: 910
Merit: 1000
If the "any input" approach is helpful for some people who otherwise are going to have difficulty in redeeming, then it would be good if it is added imo.

indeed.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1000
Reality is stranger than fiction
If the "any input" approach is helpful for some people who otherwise are going to have difficulty in redeeming, then it would be good if it is added imo.
hero member
Activity: 910
Merit: 1000
Just hodl ur elastics  Grin

Finally  Wink  I need to get a job, right now I am doing nothing else than Elastic living off my savings.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1168
so the upcoming release will be the mainnet? we can redeem soon?

I think one more testnet, and if all goes smooth we're good to go!
In the last testnet we can test things like redeeming, new retargeting, etc.

Finally  Wink  I need to get a job, right now I am doing nothing else than Elastic living off my savings.

Quote
so i don't want any vote now.......

In the proposed scheme you could just ignore it, do not vote at all and simply redeem!  Wink
But i would be interested in what all the community members here think of that idea!
ImI
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1019
Maybe we could vote in the client itself.

XEL holders can vote for or against using "any input" instead of just the first for redeeming the genesis block.
If >50% vote for yes, then this feature gets enabled for all those who did not vote "no". So, those who vote against that will definitely have their genesis block entry redeemeable only by the first input address.

What do you think? This seems "democratic" to me and everyone who does not want this feature, doesn't get it Wink

Have to eat something, feeling like Homer at the moment.  Wink

legendary
Activity: 1330
Merit: 1000
Maybe we could vote in the client itself.

XEL holders can vote for or against using "any input" instead of just the first for redeeming the genesis block.
If >50% vote for yes, then this feature gets enabled for all those who did not vote "no". So, those who vote against that will definitely have their genesis block entry redeemeable only by the first input address.

What do you think? This seems "democratic" to me and everyone who does not want this feature, doesn't get it Wink

i already saw my balance in genesis.

so i don't want any vote now.......

so the upcoming release will be the mainnet? we can redeem soon?
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1168
Maybe we could vote in the client itself.

XEL holders can vote for or against using "any input" instead of just the first for redeeming the genesis block.
If >50% vote for yes, then this feature gets enabled for all those who did not vote "no". So, those who vote against that will definitely have their genesis block entry redeemeable only by the first input address.

What do you think? This seems "democratic" to me and everyone who does not want this feature, doesn't get it Wink
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1168
So they ended up sending a TX where some micro-change is input as the first, and the actual "bitcoin address" for which they backed up the private key ended up on the second place.

How is that possible? They sent a TX from an address they dont have the keys? Thats a multisig-issue right? They sent from coinbase and coinbase/xyz hold the keys to no1 of the input-address?

The Coinbase debacle is one other point on the questions list.

But for now, imagine you have a wallet with an address 1ABCDEF...  that contains 1000 BTC. And you have a few garbage addresses that you don't even know of as they are "hidden" change addresses, for example 1DEADBEEF which contains some meaningless dust, say 0.0001 BTC.

Now you think:
Great, I donate 1000 BTC, and back up the private key 1ABCDEF...

Now, in fact your transaction is 1000.0001 BTC (because of the fee). BitcoinQT pulls in the dust from the change address as the first input and you are screwed if you missed creating a back up of 1DEADBEEF:

Inputs:
1DEADBEEF ... 0.0001BTC
1ABCDEF..... 1000 BTC

Output:
Whoever: 1000 BTC

Miner fee:
0.0001 BTC

XEL go to:
1 DEADBEEF... and not 1ABCDEF...

Reading the terms should raise extended awareness to not do things like that, but that maybe does not apply to the "average joe".
hero member
Activity: 792
Merit: 501
I found two small transactions - nice job

regards
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