Topic: AURORACOIN - Empowering Financial Freedom - page 94. (Read 138034 times)

It is the same with crypto as with any other commodity. You can buy fish here in Iceland for ISK on the open market, export it, for the sole purpose of selling it for foreign currency. But then when you have foreign currency the currency controls kick in and force you to exchange the currency to ISK within a few days.  

So if you buy Auroracoin or Bitcoin for ISK, then sell it for USD, you must exchange the USD back to ISK to apply with the currency control laws in Iceland. On the other hand if the purpose of you buying Auroracoin is to use it as currency within Iceland and never trade it for foreign currency, the currency controls laws do not apply.



I'm sure there will be consequences for those that will use Auroracoin to circumvent the currency control laws, but not for those that have the intention to use it for commerce in Iceland.

I'm also sure that parliament will copy/paste European laws regarding crypto when the EU has created these laws.

So you are saying if i sell aur to friend and he decides to change it to bitcoin on a foreign exchange i will go to jail? We 3 foundation members stated in the op will be staying here in iceland and have no plans of moving (it´s a great place to live ). Hope no one i have handed money to in the past has done anything illegal with them, if so i might be spending a lot of time in jail by your definition.

The portion in Roudik's article that you allude to, goes like this,
emphases mine:


He is reporting the situation as it was, namely that no suppliers of goods and services accept
AUR at the moment, hence the coins cannot be used for purchases. He then goes on to cite the widespread
view that the use of alternative cryptocurrency such as AUR is mainly for speculative
purposes.

He is not making any claim about goverment restricting the use of AUR here.

Also I think a lot of people are confused about what "legal currency" means here. ISK is a legal currency,
dollar is a legal currency.

If a currency is not "legal", it does not mean that it is illegal in the sense of "not permitted to use". It means that it is not backed
by laws, and lacks the official state protection. You use non-legal currency at your own risk, and this point is stressed in
the official publication of the Central Bank of Iceland, and indeed in most central bank statements about cryptocurrency.

The notable difference with Auroracoin and Iceland, compared to other cryptos, are the tight capital controls that
try to prevent leaking of national currency abroad, but as said before, it does not have bearing on actual use of AUR in
exchanging goods and services, although it does hinder speculative investment within Iceland. Or such is my understanding
at least.

Added...

Thanks for setting this up Molecular!

More of this and less talk is needed for AUR. I am done with trying to get my point across so I am going to let it go and give you people a chance to prove to your investors that we made the right choice. I will sell at 75k as promised so you need to make the coin worth that much. Follow this persons example and make it work.

All I am going to say is that when the government figures out that people are using AUR to get into bitcoin and get funds out the country those 3 foundation members better be out of the country. The price will skyrocket but we don't want these guys who are breaking the law to make us money to go to prison. You are living in la la land if you think you there won't be consequences. It's no wonder 70% of the team is not even Icelandic and sitting comfy in their own countries. Make sure your 3 foundation members get out of Iceland when that exchange goes up!

If this is the case, then someone should get in touch with Dr. Roudik and brief him of the facts. The Library of Congress is an important resource for American lawmakers, world policymakers, journalists and students - more so its branch, the Law Library of Congress. Imagine how many people are laboring under the assumption that Auroracoin is without any utility. If Dr. Roudik is sufficiently convinced, who knows, he might write a new analysis and the LoC could be updated. There are only three cryptos (Bitcoin, Litecoin and Auroracoin) mentioned in the entire LoC - the biggest library in the world, containing over 158 million books and documents. Take advantage of this rather than allowing statements like " they cannot currently be used for payment of goods or services in Iceland" go uncorrected.

I knew it was an interesting question !

Thanks guys.

https://imgflip.com/i/lsbtz

This is just not correct. Either based on false information or misinterpretation of facts.

Cryptocurrencies are not by any means illegal in Iceland nor is there any restrictions to use it to trade goods and services. We are setting up an exchange here in Iceland where Icelandic people can buy and sell Auroracoin for ISK. Before we went ahead with that we had our lawyers send out official letters to The Central Bank of Iceland, The Financial Supervisory Authority and the Directorate of Internal Revenue (IRS). Each gave us an official reply back stating what we already knew as I have talked to them directly before but this was to make it official.

What it stated:
They don't consider cryptocurrencies to be a legal currency as that requires that a consumer must be able to have a claim to an central issuer of a currency according to laws nr.120/2011.
Current laws of Iceland do not protect consumers for possible loss of cryptocurrencies in case an exchange that holds consumers cryptocurrencies fails their duty or in case a payment goes into the wrong hands.

Now the part that is the source of all the misinterpretation and misunderstanding.
Icelandic laws do not require that any special permission needs to be given from the central bank for trade with cryptocurrencies. However the central bank states that when it comes to currency trade the central bank has their role according to laws nr. 87/1992 and that applies to cryptocurrencies like anything else. It is the central banks view that there is no authorisation to buy foreign currency of an financial institution in Iceland nor to move foreign currency out of the country in regards to business with cryptocurrencies.

Current laws do not assume any other possible intervention of the central bank for the type of business that you describe in your request other than what is stated in this letter.


We got the same answers from the other institutes all pointing towards a joint statement they did at the time of Auroracoins initial release. That statement holds pretty much the same as the official letters we got back from them.

The Financial Supervisory Authority
http://www.fme.is/utgefid-efni/frettir-og-tilkynningar/frettir/nr/2041

The Central Bank of Iceland
http://www.sedlabanki.is/utgefid-efni/frettir-og-tilkynningar/frettasafn/frett/2014/03/19/Advorun-til-almennings-um-syndarfe-e.-virtual-currencies/
http://www.sedlabanki.is/utgefid-efni/frettir-og-tilkynningar/frettasafn/frett/2014/03/19/Notkun-syndarfjar-getur-fylgt-mikil-ahaetta/

Directorate of Internal Revenue
http://www.fme.is/utgefid-efni/frettir-og-tilkynningar/frettir/nr/2041

Ministry of the Interior
http://www.innanrikisraduneyti.is/frettir/nr/28881

Ministry of Finance and Economic Affairs
http://www.fjarmalaraduneyti.is/frettir/nr/17813

So what this translates to is that there are no restrictions for people in Iceland to buy, own or trade cryptocurrencies. It only states that we do not get an exception from the currency restrictions and buy foreign currency for the purpose to buy cryptocurrency. Meaning that it applies to cryptocurrencies like anything else here in Iceland.

All these links to laws and articles are in Icelandic but for those of you not speaking Icelandic I would think Google translate should give accurate enough information.

It is perfectly legal in Iceland to pay for goods and services with other things than ISK, as long as you pay VAT and all other taxes. For hundreds of years barter has been the the way Icelanders did business.

We sent formal letters from our lawyer to the Central Bank and the Financial Supervisory Authority in Iceland regarding opening a business in Iceland trading Auroracoin/Bitcoin, operating a brokerage business for crypto, buying and selling Auroracoin/Bitcoin in Iceland on behalf of customers. Both the CB and the FSA sent us formal replies warning of the risk of crypto but saying that there are no laws that prohibit doing such business in Iceland. The FSA also confirmed that we don't need a money transmitter license for these kinds of businesses.

Auroracoin and Bitcoin are not seen as "currency" by the Icelandic government, since they are not issued by a foreign state and are not issued as debt by the issuer. Therefore laws such a the Icelandic Foreign Exchange Act do not apply.

This is also the reason we are opening an ISK/AUR exchange located in Iceland, where there will be no FX trade, just ISK and crypto.

Very good question - and I asked in the skype group to Pétur-Hermann-Hlynur from the Fondation (each time it remind me Isaac Asimov):

[19:46:26] Hermann Finnbjörnsson: we sent 3 formal letters from our laywer to all goverment agencies here that handle finace about the exhange and everybody replied in the same mater "The existing laws do not provide for potential involvement of The Central Bank of Iceland, the operations of the kind described in your inquiry"
[19:47:11] Hermann Finnbjörnsson: we have the letters and would not be doing what we are doing without the knowledge we could proceed

[20:33:48] Hlynur Þór Björnsson: We sent formal letters to the Central Bank and the Financial Supervisory Authority in Iceland. Both sent us replies warning of the risk of crypto but saying there are no laws that perhibit doing business in crypto. The FSA also confirmed that we don't need a money transmitter license for an exchange or for buying and selling crypto for customers.

Just read this analysis of the legality of Auroracoin and Bitcoin in Iceland by Dr. Peter Roudik of the Global Legal Research Center : http://www.loc.gov/lawweb/servlet/lloc_news?disp3_l205404097_text

If I am reading this right, Auroracoin is not recognized and cannot be used in payment of goods or services in Iceland. At all. It can't also be traded on exchanges based outside of Iceland or with non-Icelandic clients, since the Icelandic krona cannot leave the country (as per the Icelandic Foreign Exchange Act). I think the devs have very limited options with Auroracoin, and one wrong statement or move could see them breaking Icelandic laws.

So what is the end game, here? Surely this is all not a matter of speculation?

I'll ask the team to add this to the OP.

Thanks, mate!

-Fuse

I saw the other one on Auroracoin forum, but btctalk is more accessible to me, so I made:

[AUR] Auroracoin market observer

Well cheerio mates, my time with AUR is done. Best wishes to all those that continue with this project, keep your heads held up high and don't let any of these scammers bring you down. Peace brothers!

The business model of this project can be implemented in Iceland. Auroracoins most amazing asset is its acceptance by young people in Iceland, teenagers especially.

The business model for the start party is aimed at employing young people to plan and host profitable events.

If the auroracoin foundation sponsored such an initiative in Iceland they would win the support of everyone between the ages of 12 and 45 in Iceland.

I just want to say thanks to those traders for preventing the coin dumping under 21000 sat, look like some traders were dumping hard today but I expect pump soon.

The only ''party'' I would like to get is one in Iceland with you guys - alongside a serie of meeting-conference, and for witch we would pay with AUR.  I can see this happening in 1-2 years (but i'll visit iceland before for sure, my wife and kids want it real bad).  For the AUR party in iceland, I'll bring some local beer - we are getting pretty good at it lately !

Care to elaborate how you think throwing a party in South Africa is going to get AUR up to 75K? You want me to organize a party in The Netherlands as well? I think we'd better stick with building a solid base with good core code and local (Icelandic) campaigns.... But don't you worry, you will be able to sell your AUR for 75K eventually, just not because we quickly hype the coin to that level for you....

Hey guys, I'm crowd funding an events company and am asking for your support. Check out my website www.thestartparty.co.za
And pm me if you would like to donate to my project on www.startjoin.com/party