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Topic: BFL 6 May 2013 ASIC Update - page 5. (Read 23362 times)

hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
May 08, 2013, 11:33:08 AM
#76
Avalon chips will be a couple months off (they even announced they would be), but they're not vaporware. Avalon has shipped roughly 72000 chips. BFL has shipped roughly 70.

Does anybody know why they have only 70 pcs? If they've made the ASICs they should have thousands.

legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1007
May 08, 2013, 10:44:04 AM
#75

And to add to that Joshy-boy can't even pay up his 1000 BTC bet with Runeks or at least prove he paid it.

And the 1000 charity donation BFL needs to make...


He claimed he paid both. Of course, he didn't say which transaction it was in...

Really? Can you show us where he she paid both? Why not show us the transactions? Maybe he has something to hide? YES RETARD INABA THAT IS YOU WE ARE TALKING!
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
May 08, 2013, 10:10:48 AM
#74
He claimed he paid both. Of course, he didn't say which transaction it was in...

 AFAIK, the 1000 BTC charity bet is still outstanding, and no proof hase been offered that the personal 1000 BTC bet was honored.
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
May 08, 2013, 10:09:07 AM
#73

And to add to that Joshy-boy can't even pay up his 1000 BTC bet with Runeks or at least prove he paid it.

And the 1000 charity donation BFL needs to make...


He claimed he paid both. Of course, he didn't say which transaction it was in...
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
May 08, 2013, 10:04:00 AM
#72
I think this Project is and was for BFL too much ...

Orderded tons of "minirigs" boxes without any protoyp
ordered much boards without Chips ...
ordered Chips without knowing how it works and lost 5000 Chips ( 5 Wafer )

and now they get results to hot ... = new boards ... = new Boxes ... = new Design ... = new Price ...= New Boxes again .... =

 This is indeed the very scary part for all of us preorder customers. With ASIC Miner starting to ship consumer units, and Avalon firing up the next batch, BFL needs to get their shit in order very soon, or they risk collapse from bad PR and complete loss of faith and confidence.

 We're facing the possible reality that all our money will be lost not because BFL was a ponzi scheme, but because they were just that incompetent at pulling this ASIC project off, and ran out of money before they were able to resolve their problems and regain confidence from the community.
sr. member
Activity: 470
Merit: 250
May 08, 2013, 10:01:02 AM
#71
What really kills me is that they still have devotees who think that they will ship in two weeks! It's shocking how gullible some people are. You BFL investors should have pulled your money out months ago and collapsed the house of cards like we did with bASIC. The bitcoins that I received as a refund from Tom made me more money than your mythical ASICs ever will.
KS
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
May 08, 2013, 05:33:35 AM
#70
BFL = bunch of overcocky cowboys.

BFL= Bloody Fecking Late / Bunch of Fecking Learners / Biggest Fool's Lottery etc etc
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1473
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
May 08, 2013, 04:44:40 AM
#69
I think this Project is and was for BFL too much ...

Orderded tons of "minirigs" boxes without any protoyp
ordered much boards without Chips ...
ordered Chips without knowing how it works and lost 5000 Chips ( 5 Wafer )



That's what I keep telling people since months ...




BFL = bunch of overcocky cowboys.


And to add to that Joshy-boy can't even pay up his 1000 BTC bet with Runeks or at least prove he paid it.

And the 1000 charity donation BFL needs to make...


They keep dragging their feet on anything of SUBSTANCE.

Yet they shoot off their mouths on a whim. LOL so fucking ironic.

ALL TALK
hero member
Activity: 1162
Merit: 500
May 08, 2013, 04:03:59 AM
#68
I think this Project is and was for BFL too much ...

Orderded tons of "minirigs" boxes without any protoyp
ordered much boards without Chips ...
ordered Chips without knowing how it works and lost 5000 Chips ( 5 Wafer )



That's what I keep telling people since months ...




BFL = bunch of overcocky cowboys.
hero member
Activity: 1484
Merit: 500
Across The Universe
May 08, 2013, 03:57:46 AM
#67


Won't scale to 72GH/s for 340 USD... more like 10.000 USD, which is in line with what Avalon is charging.

BFL might be trying to get economies of scale as they (possibly) realized they shot themselves in the foot with pricing. Then again, their ASIC is on a smaller process so each unit might be cheaper than the Avalon ones (so many variables...).

The Avalon 66GH/s has been measured at 620watts by at least one owner, and uses 240 chips that run at 275MH/s not 300MH/s even at 300MH/s we would be talking over 40watts per 16chip Klondike board. Personally I would wait until the chips have arrived, been fitted to a board and measured running before making efficiency and cost claims. You might suddenly find the 16 chip board needs more cooling or who know what other issues.






+1

I think this Project is and was for BFL too much ...

Orderded tons of "minirigs" boxes without any protoyp
ordered much boards without Chips ...
ordered Chips without knowing how it works and lost 5000 Chips ( 5 Wafer )


and now they get results to hot ... = new boards ... = new Boxes ... = new Design ... = new Price ...= New Boxes again .... =

and next ? they learn they must paid Bills over one Year without sold any product ... NOW all sales are final it was to be dangerous to pay more refunds with the compete dealys and old hope ... they learned they need first a protoyp to calculate some one ...

for over 1 Year  i know it BFL never hold the first date .. because the make some mistakes with the FPGA .... but i get a little bit hope they learned about her old mistakes

first product FPGA = 10 Month Delay
second one = ASIC = now a delay from ?7 mpnth ? ( ict - May ) ??
KS
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
May 08, 2013, 03:52:38 AM
#66


Won't scale to 72GH/s for 340 USD... more like 10.000 USD, which is in line with what Avalon is charging.

BFL might be trying to get economies of scale as they (possibly) realized they shot themselves in the foot with pricing. Then again, their ASIC is on a smaller process so each unit might be cheaper than the Avalon ones (so many variables...).

The Avalon 66GH/s has been measured at 620watts by at least one owner, and uses 240 chips that run at 275MH/s not 300MH/s even at 300MH/s we would be talking over 40watts per 16chip Klondike board. Personally I would wait until the chips have arrived, been fitted to a board and measured running before making efficiency and cost claims. You might suddenly find the 16 chip board needs more cooling or who know what other issues.






I'm not sure what you're saying. Even if BKKcoins needs to add 10 or 20 or 30 USD in the BOM, say for cooling, then end price for a 240 chips machine will be around (lazy math coming) 15*400 USD = 6000 USD, without shipping and PSU. That's bang on with the 75BTC (8475 USD) that Avalon is asking, at the current BTC/USD value (around 113 as of this post), assuming Avalon wants to make a profit, 30%-40% seems like a reasonable markup (6000*1.30= 7800 USD, 6000*1.40 = 8400 USD).

BFL OTOH is so much cheaper it's scary. Maybe they figured they could release their ASICs at those prices and totally underestimated the demand. Now they realize you actually need a whole infrastructure behind their production, probably need to hire more ppl and have generally increasing costs (not to mention their engineering blunders). Ramping up fast is messy. and costly.

I think BKKcoins is in the right numbers, ballpark with Avalon. BFL is so much cheaper it is actually worrying.
erk
hero member
Activity: 826
Merit: 500
May 08, 2013, 01:45:31 AM
#65


Won't scale to 72GH/s for 340 USD... more like 10.000 USD, which is in line with what Avalon is charging.

BFL might be trying to get economies of scale as they (possibly) realized they shot themselves in the foot with pricing. Then again, their ASIC is on a smaller process so each unit might be cheaper than the Avalon ones (so many variables...).

The Avalon 66GH/s has been measured at 620watts by at least one owner, and uses 240 chips that run at 275MH/s not 300MH/s even at 300MH/s we would be talking over 40watts per 16chip Klondike board. Personally I would wait until the chips have arrived, been fitted to a board and measured running before making efficiency and cost claims. You might suddenly find the 16 chip board needs more cooling or who know what other issues.




legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1473
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
May 08, 2013, 01:42:01 AM
#64
or they ordered tons off avalon chips and sale them with their stuff  Wink

LOL that would totally be in line with a scam.

hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
May 08, 2013, 01:36:46 AM
#63
or they ordered tons off avalon chips and sale them with their stuff  Wink
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1473
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
May 08, 2013, 01:24:06 AM
#62

Understood, but the Avalon chips are vaporware atm, possibly months off. Have they published the schematic and open source board design yet? It was meant to be May

Avalon chips will be a couple months off (they even announced they would be), but they're not vaporware. Avalon has shipped roughly 72000 chips. BFL has shipped roughly 70.

LOL when you really look at the truth, it must hurt being BFL
KS
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
May 08, 2013, 01:23:41 AM
#61
So instead of 8 chips, the single will use 16 chips, it is a nice move that leaves a lot of room for chips. I remember that they said the test for running at 500Mhz is problematic but chips can run stable at 300Mhz, e.g. 4.8GH per chip

So if BKKcoins actually builds a functional Klondike, a 16 chip board that could clock to 300 Mhz per chip on a 10 cm x10 cm square at 32W as a DIY project in a few months what the hell has BFL been doing these past 10 months?

Quote
Each Klondike board has a 6 pin PCI Express power connector allowing efficient powering of many boards from a decent ATX PSU. A 16 chip board should be capable of 4512 MH/s and consume about 32W power. A low cost Corsair CX-600 PSU should easily power 16 boards using readily available power splitters. This provides for 72 GH/s off one low cost ATX PSU.


And costing roughly https://github.com/bkkcoins/klondike/blob/master/docs/Parts%20List.pdf what only $26.48 per manufactured board with runs of 25+ board minimum and $8 for an Avalon chip and then and in heatsinks with fans, the psu and time and sweat you could put have the following.

16 Avalon Chips............................  $128.00
1 Board......................................... $ 23.68
Corsair CX-600 PSU.......................... $70.00
1 Extruded Al Heat sink and fan.........  $16.00
Blood Sweat Tears.........................  $100.00
USB cable........................................ $2.00
32+ Watts.
4.8 GH/s
No extra shipping charges
Easily scales to 72 GH/s

For 340 USD?

Hmmm.

I see a tough road ahead for any BFL products if the Avalons DIY'ers get this working. This might prove the end of BFL considering this will be open source.


Won't scale to 72GH/s for 340 USD... more like 10.000 USD, which is in line with what Avalon is charging.

BFL might be trying to get economies of scale as they (possibly) realized they shot themselves in the foot with pricing. Then again, their ASIC is on a smaller process so each unit might be cheaper than the Avalon ones (so many variables...).
legendary
Activity: 3878
Merit: 1193
May 08, 2013, 01:22:06 AM
#60

Understood, but the Avalon chips are vaporware atm, possibly months off. Have they published the schematic and open source board design yet? It was meant to be May

Avalon chips will be a couple months off (they even announced they would be), but they're not vaporware. Avalon has shipped roughly 72000 chips. BFL has shipped roughly 70.
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1473
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
May 08, 2013, 01:17:29 AM
#59
Is it just me, or is anyone else laughing that Josh Zerlan refers to himself as "The Josh" ?

He's gone straight from Douche to Ultra-Mega-Douche, bypassing Douche-Bag, Super-Douche, and Giant-Douche altogether !

He has one more level to achieve: Pussy Pansy Running Away when things go south  Cheesy

He reminds me of PirateAt40 and how he made so many bold claims then could not deliver on a single one and then went silent like a pansy boy.
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1473
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
May 08, 2013, 01:15:08 AM
#58
This will be mass produced (if it works) and replicated locally across the world... BFL will not get a second run at this. It could be game over for them and given their delivery delays I can't see anyone going with them ever again when these cheaper and better built alternatives come out in a few months.

I am waiting on my 540 chips... and my plan when they are up and mining is to reproduce the boards locally here in Indonesia for the Indonesian market only. I won't be the only person doing this trust me things have changed and BFL will have to either change or face the fact they will be pushed completely out of the market.

Understood, but the Avalon chips are vaporware atm, possibly months off. Have they published the schematic and open source board design yet? It was meant to be May



I have much more confidence and trust in AVALON than BFL. AVALON has a good track record for the most part as opposed to BFL.

Wouldnt surprise me if AVALONs chips arrived and were assembled and shipped before BFL got their units to their 10+ month waiting customers.

 Tongue
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1473
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
May 08, 2013, 01:12:16 AM
#57
Another useful BFL thread ruined by trolls.
Are there no mods?

I am use to a forum with over 10,000 active members, where mods would have deleted half the posts in this thread in seconds as off topic or abusive.



You know, people wouldn't bother trolling BFL if they made some actual progress and delivered. You shouldn't blame people for "trolling" at this point.

This...+1

I dont ever troll AVALON...because they haven't taken 10+ months and had millions of $. Oh and they actually finished their first batch at least.

BFL ....nothing but PR/MEDIA units sent out totaling < 40.

Pathetic.
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