bit pit - (LP, ESMPPS, 8-decimal payout, SSL, API, 0% fee, Almost 0% Stales!) - page 15.

irosaurus

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: hugolp on July 13, 2011, 02:50:41 PM

Why not create a whiltelist system, like slush?

I think there is one problem, I guess most of the people don't have a static IP. Mine for example is changing every day at 6am. so how would the pool know, that it is still me and would not reject me, because the IP is unknown?

Quote from: hugolp on July 13, 2011, 02:50:41 PM

EDIT: the stale thing is weird. I get amazing stale count, but suddenly I get like a burst of stales, for example this just happened:

Code:

pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:48, d228fc62, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:53, 39d74dee, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:56, 400c5ad2, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:58, e044bf7e, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:50:07, 658b753c, _rejected_

It happens in random cards and only in this pool.

Except for this "bursts" of stales the stale count is amazing.

I experienced the same. I am using GuiMiner, so I have no exact log, but I saw it live in the stats Wink

happened today at around 0:20am (or is it 12:20pm?) I had about 2-3 stales in a row. between 0:40-1:40am there where 5 and between 1:45-2:00am (UTC+2) there where even 13... Undecided

but I guess it was a good day today - 3 blocks found Cheesy

small reward for the long block Wink

and the hash rate ascends, too - nice to see

cheers iro

owowo

newbie

Activity: 43

Merit: 0

Quote from: lowentropy on July 13, 2011, 06:02:46 PM

Wow, looks like we've solved 3 blocks today Shocked

See, variance isn't always horrible

it isn't when it's on ur side, then it's ur best friend, most commonly called luck ;o)

flower1024

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1000

i am not sure about that anymore.

but if the pool is very small and have very few hashrate left when the hoppers leave it could be a problem.

now i like the idea to just deface them. a prop pool could make a stats page showing how much people gained from hopping (eg got less in long rounds and more in short ones). and then let your users decide if its worth (without names of course. maybe even the hashrate should be obfuscated - so one with 5GH leaving (regulary) at 0.4 is as bad as one with 100MH).

but dont forget: if hoppers are on your pool and you have a fast round: they did also their work. its just a problem if most miners are hoppers and leave at 0.4 - so there maybe is just not enough hashrate left (but anyway: who would join a pool with an hashrate that low? - that counts even for hoppers).

otherwise the estimated reward of all other miners will raise up.

Wuked

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Quote from: owowo on July 13, 2011, 05:05:19 PM

Quote from: lebuen on July 13, 2011, 06:57:52 AM

You don't "like" other systems... that's ok. But with prop and realtime stats, you actually get ripped off by pool hoppers, so you'd be better off with PPS.

can u explain how the "ripoff" by the hoppers work?
I think prop is the most fair system because u get what u mine, ok the variance is high in how much u get due to the no. of shares a block has is different, but I think pps is just promoting hoppers. Because the pool with the highest BTC/share has the best offer for the miner.

correct me if I'm wrong i looked here https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_pool_reward_FAQ and came to the conclusion.

Proportional with real time stats is the most abusable system by hoppers.

lowentropy

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Wow, looks like we've solved 3 blocks today Shocked

See, variance isn't always horrible

owowo

newbie

Activity: 43

Merit: 0

Quote from: lebuen on July 13, 2011, 06:57:52 AM

You don't "like" other systems... that's ok. But with prop and realtime stats, you actually get ripped off by pool hoppers, so you'd be better off with PPS.

can u explain how the "ripoff" by the hoppers work?
I think prop is the most fair system because u get what u mine, ok the variance is high in how much u get due to the no. of shares a block has is different, but I think pps is just promoting hoppers. Because the pool with the highest BTC/share has the best offer for the miner.

correct me if I'm wrong i looked here https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_pool_reward_FAQ and came to the conclusion.

hugolp

legendary

Activity: 1148

Merit: 1001

Radix-The Decentralized Finance Protocol

Quote from: lowentropy on July 13, 2011, 03:12:41 PM

Quote from: hugolp on July 13, 2011, 02:50:41 PM

Why not create a whiltelist system, like slush?

We've certainly talked about it, but I'm not convinced yet

We may end up there, though.

Slush pool adds automatically the IP of the user to the whitelist (from the web browser), while allowing to add new IP's in the account screen. The people less experienced usually has the miners in the same IP, and the people that has big mining systems know how to add an IP to a list.

Also, I believe (but Im not sure) the whiltelist is off by default and only goes on when there is an attack on the pool.

lowentropy

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Quote from: hugolp on July 13, 2011, 02:50:41 PM

Why not create a whiltelist system, like slush?

We've certainly talked about it, but I'm not convinced yet

We may end up there, though.

Quote from: hugolp on July 13, 2011, 02:50:41 PM

Except for this "bursts" of stales the stale count is amazing.

Wow, that is weird! It wasn't even after a new block or anything. I'll have to find out what's causing that. Thanks for the tip!

hugolp

legendary

Activity: 1148

Merit: 1001

Radix-The Decentralized Finance Protocol

Quote from: lowentropy on July 13, 2011, 02:16:38 PM

If anybody notices their miners idling a lot or returning error messages, please let us know at the support email address; a few IPs out there are running up against our request rate limits, and we'd like to work with you to get you full access. Thanks!

Why not create a whiltelist system, like slush?

EDIT: the stale thing is weird. I get amazing stale count, but suddenly I get like a burst of stales, for example this just happened:

Code:

pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:35, 15e344e4, accepted
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:35, 6a9587b6, accepted
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:38, 3fa0e6a4, accepted
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:48, d228fc62, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:53, 39d74dee, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:56, 400c5ad2, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:49:58, e044bf7e, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:50:07, 658b753c, _rejected_
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:50:17, 0608dbdc, accepted
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:50:33, 957bcb54, accepted
pool.bitp.it:8334 13/07/2011 21:50:42, 67c6fe07, accepted

It happens in random cards and only in this pool.

Except for this "bursts" of stales the stale count is amazing.

irosaurus

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: lowentropy on July 13, 2011, 02:16:38 PM

If anybody notices their miners idling a lot or returning error messages, please let us know at the support email address; a few IPs out there are running up against our request rate limits, and we'd like to work with you to get you full access. Thanks!

yesterday between about 5 or 6pm to 8pm (UTC+2), I had over 200stales. my mining power is about 215mh/s, so quiet a lot Undecided

but since that it seems stable and i have a stale rate of ~0,4%. so keep on the good work and don't let any ddos kiddies do that again Wink

and not to forget, congratulations to everybody, block 8 was really fast - too bad that my ISP had problems exactly 45minutes before the block was solved and my connection to the web was cut Cry

about the discussion on how to scatter the profit to members. as I am not always mining, I would also prefer a method different to slushs pool. don't know how the method is called, but it sucks that it's score based and your score rapidly falls when you're not mining...
does has someone maybe have a link where the different methods (smPPS,MaxPPS, PPS and prop.) are properly explained?

cheers iro

lowentropy

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

If anybody notices their miners idling a lot or returning error messages, please let us know at the support email address; a few IPs out there are running up against our request rate limits, and we'd like to work with you to get you full access. Thanks!

lowentropy

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Quote from: dominatro on July 13, 2011, 01:40:26 PM

There was a big storm here, flooding, lightning, and water went all over my running hardware. This was just before the long round finished. I had to wait a day to make sure it was dry to even see if it still worked after I moved everything. I'm even surprised it still works after I saw water splash straight into my fans and all over the computer boards. There was water,paint, and dirt on top of capacitors and all the fans. Even the harddrive was on the ground when water poured over it while it ran, and it still works. I was standing in the water on the floor when lightning struck and I felt the current.

But unfortunately that means I missed the good luck streak here, I started mining again now, but in the chaos I forgot my password. Could you add a reset password from e-mail feature?

We certainly will, it's high on our list of things to do - in the meantime, if you will please email support, we can help you out.

hugolp

legendary

Activity: 1148

Merit: 1001

Radix-The Decentralized Finance Protocol

Quote from: OldChap on July 13, 2011, 01:11:10 PM

I hopped in around day 10 of the long round. I thought there would be some benefit to the pool to have what at the time was another ~5% of hashing power. I consider that the hours I spend mining * hash rate are paid the same to all.... I guess I am saying would someone explain the problem with pool hopping...I don't see it

Hoping in is not a problem, the problem is hoping out.

dominatro

newbie

Activity: 15

Merit: 0

There was a big storm here, flooding, lightning, and water went all over my running hardware. This was just before the long round finished. I had to wait a day to make sure it was dry to even see if it still worked after I moved everything. I'm even surprised it still works after I saw water splash straight into my fans and all over the computer boards. There was water,paint, and dirt on top of capacitors and all the fans. Even the harddrive was on the ground when water poured over it while it ran, and it still works. I was standing in the water on the floor when lightning struck and I felt the current.

But unfortunately that means I missed the good luck streak here, I started mining again now, but in the chaos I forgot my password. Could you add a reset password from e-mail feature?

OldChap

newbie

Activity: 27

Merit: 0

I hopped in around day 10 of the long round. I thought there would be some benefit to the pool to have what at the time was another ~5% of hashing power. I consider that the hours I spend mining * hash rate are paid the same to all.... I guess I am saying would someone explain the problem with pool hopping...I don't see it http://serve.mysmiley.net/confused/confused0024.gif

flower1024

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1000

i think all that counts is the percentage of users jumping.

if there are more than > 10% a long block will even take longer, on a VERY long block it shouldnt really matter as your reward get higher over time.

and: pool hoppers do make it more possible for very short rounds - as there is more hashing power

so: at the moment i am unsure if they do any harm at all....

zoro

full member

Activity: 226

Merit: 100

i like only prop in a large pool >100GH. pool jumpers should be no more than 10% i guess, no real influence to the pool's luck.
am i wrong?

roos

full member

Activity: 157

Merit: 101

Im all for the system used on the first block. A scoring system with very short alive times of the share really gives everyone that contribute when the block is found a fair share of the lottery win and it doesnt keep new people from joining in on long blocks.

Really, propotional is not propotional at all, its more like redistribution from lucky shares to unlucky shares. That is fine in a sense, but mostly its effect is encouraging hopping and making people who like to optimise their winnings (like myself) restless and likely to change pools when the blocks are slow.

1bitc0inplz

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Quote from: flower1024 on July 13, 2011, 08:05:10 AM

like your pool too! keep going!
just have a small problem with firefox 5: can't change my payout address (switched temporary to ie and it worked)

Keep up the conversations, this is excellent food for thought. I do like hearing all sides of a discussion like this.

Also, thinks for the bug report in Firefox 5. I will look into that shortly.

flower1024

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1000

what do you think about just print a list of users (maybe without names) which profits most in a "pool hopping"-way?

means: calculate how much they get in fast rounds and how much they get in slow rounds..."free" it of their hashrate (sorry.. dont know how to say that in english correctly).

so all users can see who and how much they gained from hopping
- then it would be possible to vote them out (or do additional steps if it is just to much)

if you hand me your db scheme (not the data) i may come up with a nice statement (if you use nosql, just give me that schema)

like your pool too! keep going!
just have a small problem with firefox 5: can't change my payout address (switched temporary to ie and it worked)

Topic: bit pit - (LP, ESMPPS, 8-decimal payout, SSL, API, 0% fee, Almost 0% Stales!) - page 15. (Read 80771 times)