Topic: BitMarket.Eu has closed down - page 31. (Read 204282 times)

It was just my mixup in the withdrawal code. There was a check to find if you can make a withdrawal depending on your "on hold" balance, but there was a bug in it (I didn't have time to test it properly unfortunately), which is now fixed.


BCB, crazy573 is talking about withdrawal of funds that he deposited yesterday. These were new funds, hence he had full right to withdraw them.

I will make a post about current funds/balances later today.

Is M4v3R allowing selective withdrawals to quite the more vocal creditors? 

All creditors should have equal claim to funds due.

Sound like the financial shenanigans continue. 

M4v3R.  Could you or have you posted a current financial statement of funds currently on deposit and funds due to creditors?

Or if your potential investor/buyer could state here that they have looked at your books and have a plan in place for recovery of creditors funds.

Somethings is fishy....

Bitcoins received.
So if I made a bigger withdrawal it would have worked straight away? This doesn't make sense to me at all

That shouldn't happen. It's probably because you have a bigger "on hold" balance than the one you tried to withdraw. I've already processed your withdrawal and fixed this bug. Sorry for this.

I just made a withdrawal and my funds got frozen again and I got the message "withdrawals will not happen".
So you opened the site again, but still we can't use it. This is ridiculous
I'm done with Bitmarket, you fucked things up and you still don't know what you are doing...

You can find it under Offers tab. There is a note in red font that tells you that you're unverified, and provides a link. But from what I see you already verified on Bitmarket with your eBay account. Maybe you just don't remember it.


You had your funds "frozen" because you wanted to withdraw them before I implemented the "on hold" mechanism. It was done so you can continue depositing, trading and withdrawing new bitcoins like before. Today I moved all frozen withdrawals to this "on hold" state, to be sure how much exactly Bitmarket owes to its users. From latest data it seems that the number is a bit smaller than I announced earlier, a bit under 19000 BTC.

What is the difference between "On Hold" and "Frozen"

My On Hold amount increased when I performwd a trade. What is going on?

Thanks

Fahmeed Farooq

Is it really online? Where can I find that verification process, because I just want to have a look at this process but there is no indication for something like that in my account profile.

I'd like to announce a quite big change in verification system. The verification is now needed only for buyers. That means you can sell your BTC on Bitmarket without going through verification prodecure, which requires you to have eBay/Allegro/Bitcoin-OTC profile, or sending ID scans. This is because it's nearly impossible for a seller to scam the other party on Bitmarket - he can't withdraw his BTC that are part of active transaction, and he can't cancel it without agreement of other party.

In near future I will further simplify both buying and selling, because now there are some misunderstandings on how it works for some people.

Edit: I have also moved all frozen transfers to "on hold" balances. It will make easier managing them.
Also, someone has suggested that I should create means for selling and buying these "on hold" bitcoins, so people who need money quick could sell them at a discount, and other people seeking an investement could buy them. What do you think about this?

Ok, thanks for confirming.

The other withdrawal I meant is 25 BTC, 10.10.2012, 11:58:45. It is still marked as non-confirmed on the site, although is should be this transaction: http://blockchain.info/de/tx/ef47f7fdc3f4305a464219d345f18adb0183be70defb9e91e78cebb0aaae4d12

Hello,

I have registered two of your withdrawals, for 302 BTC and 5 BTC. The second one was processed on 15th december. You can check that on blockchain.info.
I've updated your frozen balance to reflect this.

Imho, the fees should go to all creditors (including the investors) right away, just not sure if distributed equally or in chronological order.

One tiny chance I see of turning this disaster around has to do with the fact that bitmarket is a service that is much needed. I just don't know how I can trust it anytime soon. It must be 100% assured that people who trade on the side can withdraw their coins. I will wait and watch the situation for a couple months before making a decision.

What's the strategy for getting people their money back?

Do we wait for the fees to build up until we have 20k worth of bitcoins?

Or every month, however much has been earned, will be distributed amongst the users who have frozen bitcoins?

OR will this new company bail you out entirely?

Many thanks

Hello M4v3R!

To make sure: in December 2012 and before, funds that could not be withdrawn were marked as "frozen" in the overview after a withdrawal attempt (and they continued to be shown as frozed, even after the withdrawal was executed). Then you changed something in the end of December, and after that the funds waiting to be withdrawn did not appear in the overview at all. So now I have two withdrawals pending, totaling 327 BTC, but the account balance says 0 BTC, (0 BTC frozen).

Please check if that is the behavior that you intended and if my claims are well registered.

Acount: hafey

Yes, I am still in charge of Bitmarket, but that will change. I understand that this is cruicial for the exchange to be credible again.
If deal we're discussing with mralbi gets executed, he'll receive full control over exchange and stored funds. As he already stated, he already has a registered company, that can back BitMarket operations. I may, or may not be technical administrator / provide support for the site - that will be for him to decide. I will still be rensponsible for reimbursing users funds, though, it's not that I want to run away from all this. Every Bitcoin that is part of this deal will go to compensate users.

Edit: One idea I have which will enable Bitmarket to make money (which will be used for reimbursement), is to enable people to buy Bitcoin via Paypal using the service. We already did this once with mixed results, but I have confidence that this time I have measures that will make this possible. I'll announce this as soon it's done.

So you unconditionally guarantee that these sites are no fraud either? That´s nice to know In case of fraud I will contact you...


I´m not sure what that means. I just made a suggestion how it could be possible to solve the bitmarket issue...

Stopped reading there, WTF are you talking about? What about Bitstamp, Bitcoin-central, Bitcoin-24 and Btc-e?

Btw, I'm kind of tired listening to "sockies" these days, meet my Ignore-hammer.

For a unscrupulous individual, there would be no problem claiming that funds are lost in the Bitcoinica debacle a long time ago, when in fact it's only said to cover recent theft.

When the incentive is a lot of money, it's incredible what some people do.. Perhaps evidence already was presented, and in that case, disregard my message, if it is proven beyond doubt, but most things can be faked in the digital world.

At this point, one could chose to trust the operator, or one could chose not to trust the operator. There is a possibility that the operator has indeed learned his lesson, and will never do it again,
but we cannot be sure of this.

My advice would therefore be to shun BitMarket.Eu altogether.

"The only way not to lose is not to play."

So will I. Despite this very unpleasant situation, my experience with the users of bitmarket.eu are very good and I don´t see a trustworthy alternative to bitmarket at the moment. Nobody knows if, for example, bitcoin.de won´t be a fraud in future. Everybody knew that bitcoin is still in the early adopting phase and there is a good chance of a total loss. So I´m not mad as hell but looking for way of evolving bitcoin trading and - of course - get as many bitcoins back as possible.

The only thing that isn´t clear for me yet, is the how-to of payback of the lost bitcoins. If my calculations are correct, with a fee of 0,25% there has to be a transfer volume of about 8 million bitcoins until the ~20.000 lost bitcoins are earned. Assuming 2.000 BTC transfer volume per month it would take ~334 years (!) to earn the 20.000 BTC (calculation:  100 x 20.000 / 0,25 = 8.000.000; 8.000.000 / 2.000 = 4.000 / 12 month = ~334 years), not including cost for servers etc. This seems unachievable despite my strong believe in bitcoins... But: If every user of the 38.000 bitmarket users is willing to give 0,5 BTC, the job would nearly be done. I don´t know how many accounts are afflicted by the lost - it would be interesting to know and to calculate how much every afflicted account would have to give to return all funds in short(er) time. In my case it would be a better deal to invest (let´s say) another 10 BTC to get my 45 BTC back. I´m willing to do this if there are enough users who think the same way.

That said, I want to propose to payback this investment as well but for the worth of BTC at the moment of investment - meaning, for example: I transfer 10 BTC now. It´s worth about 10 EUR per BTC. So you owe me 100 EUR. Let´s assume the stock price rises further. When you are able to payback, you don´t owe me 10 BTC but 100 EUR, payable in BTC. So if the stock price is 20 EUR per BTC, you have to return 5 BTC to me. If stock price is 5 EUR per BTC, you pay 20 BTC. No money would be lost by investors, only the advantage of rising stock price and, of course, any interest. It would be like buying BTC for 100 EUR at this time to the current stock price. It´s not ideal, but I think this is a far more realistic way to get everyone paid back than expecting the return of same amount of bitcoins invested in this way.

Also, I could image a way of partly return over time: Depending on the BTC collected by fees/donations etc. and the lost BTC of the account, you, M4V3R, could payback in parts. Assume there are 2.000 BTC available of the lost ~20.000 BTC, you could restore 10% of every afflicted account. In my case it would be 4,5 BTC, in case of mralbi it would be 62 BTC. And: When everything is paid back you could give the investors of today an incentive by reducing transaction fees for them.

But, M4V3R: Don´t fuck it up again! Make it as transparent as possible. Do your support and general communications very well. Be an excellent webmaster. Get other people like mralbi involved. It is the foundation of trust which you have to earn again.