LOL 
Topic: Black Arrow Customers - Consumer Complaints Links - page 3. (Read 20514 times)
Do we have an option to hire debt collectors in China or Hong Kong to chase down BA. But I am sure we will be able to hire hitmen for BA there LOL
LOL
Out of general interest, who has had a response lately from HK police?
Can we just treat this shill as BA treats it's customers in their own thread? ie delete all posts from lexx2k?
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
I have no legal background so I'm not sure if I can be of much help, but I thought I'd offer.
I'll be in Japan in October and could take a quick trip over to China if it would actually accomplish something.
Meet with the consumer council or talk with the police. whatever.
I have an order with BA from December for 10x X1s, got nothing.
Asked for a refund in June and numerous times since, so far nothing of course.
I'll be in Japan in October and could take a quick trip over to China if it would actually accomplish something.
Meet with the consumer council or talk with the police. whatever.
I have an order with BA from December for 10x X1s, got nothing.
Asked for a refund in June and numerous times since, so far nothing of course.
P.S.: Alex Sovu in a chinese prison - now that's a TV show I'd watch.
Sadly I wouldn't be surprised if he's never even been to China, unless he has some good fake papers for this "Alex Berk" alias, because I would imagine it isn't exactly a good idea for someone in his position to be crossing borders all willy-nilly.
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
1) The BTC wallet used to recieve preorder fund is still untouched. The "oy vey there's no money" lie is just that - a lie.
2) Even if BA files for bancruptcy, at least then personal liability comes into play, mostly for gross negligence and/or fraudulent intent. So even if we don't get our money back, either the criminals @BA pay up with their private assets, or they go to jail. Win-win.
P.S.: Alex Sovu in a chinese prison - now that's a TV show I'd watch.
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
Tell your boss / lover / other side of your brain (whichever it is) Alex Sovu that the only way to get out of any of this is to refund all pending orders that he has failed to service.
Just wanna bump this up to the top its getting down there... 
Please leave negative feedback for Lexx2k and david. 
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
We might have cared about this 5 months ago when it was profitable to mine with them. Since the miners are completely worthless now, all we have left is to go after Black Arrow.
Just wanna bump this up to the top its getting down there...
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
Lexx, everyone knows you're a shill.
Everyone has already lost their ass already. the minute you broke the price matching promise to your customers these were no longer worth squat- and that's before they started catching on fire.
I've asked for my money back several times, as have many other people, and the only way to get anything back is to go to court at this point. You've left us no choice. It was the actions of Black Arrow and it's refusal to uphold it's obligations that have led to this.
Beyond that, we've got multiple statements that the money wasn't raised from pre-orders, Chinese law states that the money used on pre-orders has to be kept in a separate account, people can see their BTC sitting in the wallets they were sent to, and Black Arrow is running around sponsoring conferences and developing new chips. There is money there.
we'll see you in court.
good call out!! See your dirty ass in court BA. Looks like this bunch of criminals are scared. They should be...
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
Lexx, everyone knows you're a shill.
Everyone has already lost their ass already. the minute you broke the price matching promise to your customers these were no longer worth squat- and that's before they started catching on fire.
I've asked for my money back several times, as have many other people, and the only way to get anything back is to go to court at this point. You've left us no choice. It was the actions of Black Arrow and it's refusal to uphold it's obligations that have led to this.
Beyond that, we've got multiple statements that the money wasn't raised from pre-orders, Chinese law states that the money used on pre-orders has to be kept in a separate account, people can see their BTC sitting in the wallets they were sent to, and Black Arrow is running around sponsoring conferences and developing new chips. There is money there.
we'll see you in court.
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
People don't realize one thing, even if you take everyone and go for refund, if company really spent money on parts they won't be able to refund you and will file bankruptcy instead, that means no one will get anything, not hardware not software if i understand that part with bankruptcy correctly. Or if someone could explain how it works.
I would suggest all victims to chip in whatever amount you can in this law suite in order to escalate the process and cover associated fees or if someone needs to go Hong Kong to meet Police / Hong Kong Consumer Council if necessary. Ofcourse, this is up to Bticz who is organising the campaign.
Thanks Pentax!
First of all, I really appreciate all these efforts to do something about this.
I have given my info on my 3 BA orders to Bitcz.
I have a couple questions;
1. Is refusal of delivery necessary for legal standing? (I'm guessing this is a lawyer question).
2. If delivery happens without signature, is that different for the case? If so, what are the recommended actions?
I'm sure Im not the only one who has these questions. I understand the answers may be sensitive and PM material. I understand BA monitors all this, and I understand they have no issues with punishing and tweaking the queue.
They are sitting (yeah they are not plugged in, right) on a batch of X3s until safety issues with PSUs are resolved. I imagine when these ship a sizeable amount of customers who wish to take a legal venue on a late, misrepresented, and to date unsafe product will be facing similar questions.
I have given my info on my 3 BA orders to Bitcz.
I have a couple questions;
1. Is refusal of delivery necessary for legal standing? (I'm guessing this is a lawyer question).
2. If delivery happens without signature, is that different for the case? If so, what are the recommended actions?
I'm sure Im not the only one who has these questions. I understand the answers may be sensitive and PM material. I understand BA monitors all this, and I understand they have no issues with punishing and tweaking the queue.
They are sitting (yeah they are not plugged in, right) on a batch of X3s until safety issues with PSUs are resolved. I imagine when these ship a sizeable amount of customers who wish to take a legal venue on a late, misrepresented, and to date unsafe product will be facing similar questions.
Hi,
Yes these are mostly questions for the attorney's at this point.
And yes, BA is without question monitoring these conversations, so most of this will have to go to the land of PMs, aside from mass messaging which has been done to this point to try to get people pointed in the general direction of joining the action.
Even a lot of that will go to private communications here shortly and some things, such as strategy and filing dates etc., may not go out en mass at all. I know now that will piss some people off, although people have to understand that legal strategy can't be disseminated to the whole list of claimaints without running a huge risk of information leaks.
I am hoping the attorneys can issue a statement soon that will give people more guidance on what to expect and reassurance that this is not some scam. I'm looking for the same information, for what that's worth. I've been in court plenty of times for business reasons, although never as part of a group filing, so I've got a lot of questions also. As Btcz has been dealing with the lawyers I have not yet had the chance to talk to them directly.
I'll be happy to answer what questions I can if anyone would like to ask via PM, but don't have a whole lot right now, really, not being an attorney myself. If I were we'd have been in court a loooooooong time ago. ;-)
Give me a day or so to respond. Contrary to BA's apparent assumption that I'm an unemployed drunk with too much time on my hands, I've got a real job, which keeps me hopping pretty good. I'm often logged on much of the day but away from my desk for most of it, and on the weekends I've got a wife and home to tend to like a lot of people, but I will respond with the best information I can offer as soon as I possibly can.
First of all, I really appreciate all these efforts to do something about this.
I have given my info on my 3 BA orders to Bitcz.
I have a couple questions;
1. Is refusal of delivery necessary for legal standing? (I'm guessing this is a lawyer question).
2. If delivery happens without signature, is that different for the case? If so, what are the recommended actions?
I'm sure Im not the only one who has these questions. I understand the answers may be sensitive and PM material. I understand BA monitors all this, and I understand they have no issues with punishing and tweaking the queue.
They are sitting (yeah they are not plugged in, right) on a batch of X3s until safety issues with PSUs are resolved. I imagine when these ship a sizeable amount of customers who wish to take a legal venue on a late, misrepresented, and to date unsafe product will be facing similar questions.
I have given my info on my 3 BA orders to Bitcz.
I have a couple questions;
1. Is refusal of delivery necessary for legal standing? (I'm guessing this is a lawyer question).
2. If delivery happens without signature, is that different for the case? If so, what are the recommended actions?
I'm sure Im not the only one who has these questions. I understand the answers may be sensitive and PM material. I understand BA monitors all this, and I understand they have no issues with punishing and tweaking the queue.
They are sitting (yeah they are not plugged in, right) on a batch of X3s until safety issues with PSUs are resolved. I imagine when these ship a sizeable amount of customers who wish to take a legal venue on a late, misrepresented, and to date unsafe product will be facing similar questions.
All
IF YOU HAVE NOT DONE SO ALREADY AND WANT TO JOIN THIS ACTION BEING ORGANIZED BY BITCZ FILE A COMPLAINT WITH THE CONSUMER COUNCIL IMMEDIATELY. THE LEGAL TEAM IS REQUESTING IT AND THAT JIBES WITH WHAT THE PEOPLE I TALKED TO TOLD ME ALSO.
The Consumer Council will request some documents and need to establish that this is a Hong Kong registered company before they will agree to pick it up, therefore:
Send the annual report http://www.kiwi.nz/blackarrow/PS300015776549_01.pdf
along with the documents they have requested. Those documents are:
1. The invoice showing you paid
2 your bank or payment records showing the payment
3. any e-mail or support discussions you've had
4. The annual report referenced above.
Here's the link to file a complaint if you decide you want to do that.
https://www.consumer.org.hk/cc-complaint/index.php?lang=en
Also indicate that their TOS indicates Hong Kong law and paste that in to your message.
http://www.blackarrowsoftware.com/store/terms-and-conditions-en.html#purchase
15.2 Applicable law and dispute resolution
16.2 1 This Agreement shall be interpreted and applied in accordance with the law of Hong Kong S.A.R. of PRC.
This is all the information they will need to pick this up. They have been very helpful and responsive.
IF YOU HAVE NOT DONE SO ALREADY AND WANT TO JOIN THIS ACTION BEING ORGANIZED BY BITCZ FILE A COMPLAINT WITH THE CONSUMER COUNCIL IMMEDIATELY. THE LEGAL TEAM IS REQUESTING IT AND THAT JIBES WITH WHAT THE PEOPLE I TALKED TO TOLD ME ALSO.
The Consumer Council will request some documents and need to establish that this is a Hong Kong registered company before they will agree to pick it up, therefore:
Send the annual report http://www.kiwi.nz/blackarrow/PS300015776549_01.pdf
along with the documents they have requested. Those documents are:
1. The invoice showing you paid
2 your bank or payment records showing the payment
3. any e-mail or support discussions you've had
4. The annual report referenced above.
Here's the link to file a complaint if you decide you want to do that.
https://www.consumer.org.hk/cc-complaint/index.php?lang=en
Also indicate that their TOS indicates Hong Kong law and paste that in to your message.
http://www.blackarrowsoftware.com/store/terms-and-conditions-en.html#purchase
15.2 Applicable law and dispute resolution
16.2 1 This Agreement shall be interpreted and applied in accordance with the law of Hong Kong S.A.R. of PRC.
This is all the information they will need to pick this up. They have been very helpful and responsive.
reposted from another thread:
Alright everybody, here's the deal. I'm the journalist behind the CryptoCoinsNews article about BA responding to the accusations we received in an anonymous news tip. Since then, I've been tipped on a lot of other happenings in the BA world that sound malicious.
I'm on mobile, and for some reason can't post the article link. Excellent. If you want to look it up, it's on CCN.
So I did the digging, found truth to the accusations, and reached out to BA for response. They responded, so I printed it. If you all notice, I did not take sides. I presented each side, laid everything out on the table (including pictures and facts) and printed their response.
BA did not trick me. They simply addressed the accusations. But some people may have took CCNs printing of that to be taking a side, and that side is BA. That's not the case.
I need proof. I need something tangible and solid. There's a lot of people here making a lot of claims, that sound really feasible, but I have no facts to print. Submit news tips to CCN with proof, and I'll print it. You want BA's bad side to be shown? Show it to me, with hard evidence. That's what I need to print a story.
I'm on mobile, and for some reason can't post the article link. Excellent. If you want to look it up, it's on CCN.
So I did the digging, found truth to the accusations, and reached out to BA for response. They responded, so I printed it. If you all notice, I did not take sides. I presented each side, laid everything out on the table (including pictures and facts) and printed their response.
BA did not trick me. They simply addressed the accusations. But some people may have took CCNs printing of that to be taking a side, and that side is BA. That's not the case.
I need proof. I need something tangible and solid. There's a lot of people here making a lot of claims, that sound really feasible, but I have no facts to print. Submit news tips to CCN with proof, and I'll print it. You want BA's bad side to be shown? Show it to me, with hard evidence. That's what I need to print a story.
update on lawsuit:
reposted here
"All,
I have about 50 users so far who've sent details in reply to my posts here, and another 50 or so from bitcointalk.org
So far, i have orders recorded at roughly 1 million usd still outstanding in one form or another.
By the end of this week i should have enough to present the the legal team so they can start to construct the case to present to the court
Any of you who still wish to add your name to the list, please drop me a mail at [email protected]
Again, this is direct orders place with BA and not with resellers for Batch 1 and Batch 2"
anyone still looking to get on this contact him here:
"Please send to [email protected] the following details:
Order date
Rough figure on how much was spent ( please do not supply order numbers yet..this will be a job for the legals to obtain directly from you )
Contact details ( Email will suffice at this stage )
Brief paragraph outlining steps you have taken to resolve issue with BA directly ( i.e. direct communication, complaint to consumer council, local better business bureau, local state senator etc.. )
Expected resolution that would satisfy you ( i.e. full refund, delivery of goods etc )
Bticz"
He also has a thread on this forum
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.8710397
reposted here
"All,
I have about 50 users so far who've sent details in reply to my posts here, and another 50 or so from bitcointalk.org
So far, i have orders recorded at roughly 1 million usd still outstanding in one form or another.
By the end of this week i should have enough to present the the legal team so they can start to construct the case to present to the court
Any of you who still wish to add your name to the list, please drop me a mail at [email protected]
Again, this is direct orders place with BA and not with resellers for Batch 1 and Batch 2"
anyone still looking to get on this contact him here:
"Please send to [email protected] the following details:
Order date
Rough figure on how much was spent ( please do not supply order numbers yet..this will be a job for the legals to obtain directly from you )
Contact details ( Email will suffice at this stage )
Brief paragraph outlining steps you have taken to resolve issue with BA directly ( i.e. direct communication, complaint to consumer council, local better business bureau, local state senator etc.. )
Expected resolution that would satisfy you ( i.e. full refund, delivery of goods etc )
Bticz"
He also has a thread on this forum
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.8710397
Jump to: