Topic: btt - page 91. (Read 407332 times)

I understand what you're saying, I just don't see a lot of viable alternatives. The "economics of current hardware availability" is the overriding theme with all mining assets at this time and cannot realistically be separated from the discussion. That said, raising the price of shares was done in part to slow the sale of shares and therefore the dilution of assets. This was one of my stated purposes several pages back...and it worked. The recent spike in sales is plainly due to the news that Avalon batch 2 is shipping and yes this is adding to company reserves and future shareholder value.

Keeping the Avalons separate ignores the basic premise of the entire company, but I'll play along. The contract states that we'll bulk purchase ASIC mining hardware. When it was written the company had one ASIC mining product on order and I'd lain the groundwork for large future(bulk) purchases from the very same company, but that company is now extinct and we moved by shareholder vote to another vendor. Our plans changed out of necessity...not design. I very much doubt that shareholder value would've been better protected by locking in a large order with BFL following the collapse of BTCFPGA and that was the only alternative at that time. Again, decisions had to be made with the information available at that time, not the information that's available now. The risk that we'd be unable to add ASIC mining gear in the near term due to lack of availability is precisely why I proposed a modest expansion of the company's GPU hardware several months ago, also accomplished by shareholder vote.

Cheers.

Hahaha 

lol

A domain name squatter! Excellent, we're growing!

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/auction-sale-basic-miningcom-basicminingcom-214191 

Hi lunarboy. The contract is correct, there will be no more than 5000 shares outstanding without a majority shareholder vote to increase this number. When I set up the company, prevailing wisdom was to set things up with more shares issued than ever needed so that requests for more shares to be issued would be unnecessary. Shares outstanding are updated daily on the company spreadsheet and in several places on btct.co. When this number reaches 5000, bASIC-MINING will have only it's reserves and growth fund for future expansion as stated in the original contract(OP). Many assets on btct.co are set up this way and yes it is somewhat confusing. I apologize for that.

To be crystal clear...shares in the asset issuer account do not have any rights. They cannot vote and they do not receive dividends.

Cheers.


Essentially correct, though I'd describe the remaining 95k shares in the asset issuer account as issued, but not authorized. At any rate, they'll not be going anywhere without shareholder approval and I've no plans to seek such approval at this time or in the foreseeable future.

I think I have it figured out, there are 5000 shares authorized in the IPO, 100,000 total authorized, but after the 5000 requires shareholder approval and will follow the same 4:1 split with creativex getting 1 share for every 4 sold.

How many shares are there?

It looks a little confusing. Stockholder agreement states "5000 shares of bASIC-MINING will be offered at approximately
.33BTC each and the funds raised in this IPO"

yet further up it states shares outstanding "Outstanding 3832 / 100000 Issued"

Does this mean from the IPO only 3832 shares have been issued and the rest are still being bought? Further whats with the 100000 in total? Does this mean that there is potentially another 95000 to be issued in the future.?

i agree with this.... larger than .01 intervals would be more appropriate so that at least the shares are gaining significant value. doesn't reward the early invester enough.

I'm having a little issue with what's going on atm in terms of the issuance of shares.  With 50 shares offered every .01 btc we are getting diluted and nothing is happening.  In 99.9% of business's that are as well funded as this one they do not issue shares they do buy backs to reward shareholders.  with 1k btc in the bank I really don't think there are any short or long term funding issues at all.  And since what seems to be going on is waiting for lower prices on products why is there a need for that much btc and even more as the price rises.  I think the issuance of shares needs to be tempered down until there is some sort of real expantion plans.  We are obviously waiting on the avalons but why keep diluting the expected dividends to current shareholders. 

lol, I have no interest in these shares for the reasons I stated.  I had some, and was frustrated by the fact that I was invested in cold storage, and couldn't do anything about it, and moved my money elsewhere (to AM) in time to double up.

This isn't a year or even 6 months ago, when you could buy mining equipment and get your money back in a few months.  Tons of people are interested in bitcoin mining and are willing to pay somewhat absurd prices for them.  I happen to believe there isn't going to be some magically obviously profitable hardware available any time soon or even ever again (at least for buyers), and think that this return of capital is eventually going to happen.

What about an AMC pre-order?  They have lots of Avalon chips on the way.


Fast-Hash-80 80GH/s Bitcoin 2013 Special 20% Off Special Good Thru 5/21/2013

http://virtualminingcorp.com/shop/index.php?id_product=8&controller=product

BTC 68.00

Tons of expansion options too!

Clearly he is trying to shake weak hands to buy cheaper shares, but looks like treasury shares are still selling just fine

i.e. Don't feel the trolls

Hi carnitastaco, thanks for your perspective. A few things to keep in mind.

First, I fairly recently suggested an increase in dividends paid from company cash on hand. This was met with near unanimous disapproval, so I shelved the idea.

Secondly, the current situation is due to ASIC hardware vendors that offer products they cannot deliver in a timely fashion or at all(BTCFPGA, BFL, and to a lesser extent Avalon). When founded the company was to have received it's first ASIC mining rig within days, this did not happen, and those delays were met with further delays, and then cancellation of the product. There is little any of us can do about this, and the mining companies that chose BFL gear exclusively have fared worse. I like everyone else can only operate on the information available at the time.

If you're not arguing that "asicminer blades are a great investment or that the avalon chips are a must buy", then what are you arguing? Those are the options available at this time and only one of them will result in a viable product in hand in the short term. While it's difficult to find a smart way to deploy capital at this time, I believe that will change in the near future and I'd like bASIC-MINING to be prepared to take full advantage of the opportunities that present. We've all seen how quickly opportunities can be missed, Avalon batch sales, ASICMiner auctions, etc.

I've made the current situation abundantly clear to investors and potential investors alike so that informed decisions could be made. I've tried to update the website daily to keep investors and potential investors informed of exactly what's transpiring. This hardware is expensive and many cannot afford the initial investment so we're pooling resources to help overcome this problem. This is stated on page one of this thread.

Many see bASIC-MINING and it's Avalon pre-orders as a way to diversify their portfolios in addition to ASICMiner, and not necessarily as an us or them scenario.

Cheers.

Then why are you holding 950 BTC (up recently from 600ish)?  Return some or most of the money to shareholders if you have no idea what to spend it on- you can always do a secondary offering, or resume retaining some portion of divs for reinvestment. 

I hope people who are buying Basic realize that most of what they are buying is just a pile of bitcoins that you aren't doing anything with.  Good for the safety of the investment, but bad for the return.  If you return funds, you let investors decide whether they want to invest in your batch 2 and 3 avalons without having to tie up half the share value in cold storage at no return.

I'm not even arguing that the asicminer blades are a great investment or that the avalon chips are a must buy, just that you're a supposed mining company that has raised a ton of money and (according to you) has no use for it.

heres a quote from March 25-


but that is EXACTLY what you've done since then.  You've deployed 0 new hashing power while the projected value of the incoming hashing power has declined precipitously.  Going forward your share of hashing power will only decline unless and until some ASIC manufacturer puts some hardware up for sale at a price thats obviously profitable, but why should we expect that to happen when demand is so high at asicminers prices?

Honestly, comparing this company to asicminer based on the expected dividends at the moment you get batch 2 is a joke- here you are buying a continuously decreasing (due to dilution) share of an avalon or two with continuously decreasing profitability (due to difficulty as asic hardware saturates the market) and a pile of BTC in cold storage.  With Asicminer you're buying continuously INCREASING hashing power (due to continuing rollout), a share of hardware sales (at a price CreativeX thinks is unprofitable for buyers, or in other words, profitable for the seller) and importantly, a piece of future hardware development- gen 2 sales and hashing and etc.

Anyway, good luck to creative and to shareholders, just my .02.

I still think .62 BTC/share is cheap for where it'll be once even the first ASIC gets delivered.  As mentioned earlier in this thread, the daily dividend is going to jump substantially immediately, and with around 1000 BTC on hand and growing, bASIC will be in great position to increase their hashes by leaps and bounds once ASICS become more available. 

You can always buy MININGCO.ETF which sets it's NAV based on the 7d average, last updated bASIC-MINING at .50 as a way to slide in a bit cheaper

Yikes, shares getting scooped up fast today!  Was waiting for a bank transfer to clear to get some more, looks like I might not be getting as many as I planned!   

Great work, the community has needed something like this for some time. Would add that it would be nice to see 'shares in issue/total shares' and IPO price/date on the information pages of each company.

Only thing I would wish for is ability to compare with another security on BTC-TC, but great job with what you have !

Gorgeous chart, really nice work. Tip sent.

Edit: Going over the chart reminded me that I'd intended to change my contact email from att.net servers to broadstripe.net servers as att.net has been unreliable of late. I've asked burnside to make this change.

Shareholders, please contact me at [email protected] if you need to reach me or simply PM me here. I'm occasionally slow, particularly on weekends, but I'll get back to you.

OP updated to reflect this change.