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Topic: Butterfly Labs Forced "On Hold For Refund" for all my Single SC orders - page 4. (Read 59168 times)

legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/3026-forced-refunds-7.html#post37603

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Quote
BFL_Josh   Employee
 
Xian has been banned again (Does this make the 3rd or 4th time?) and his posts removed. Same goes for Jordin.

Poor guy is spending thousands of dollars for nothing. I think he may be off his meds or something. Thanks for compiling all the memorable quotes by Xian. I see he's removed some of them, though, as they don't show up there. Love that rewriting history he's doing, heh.

As for the topic of the thread, it's gotten way too convoluted to deal with here. Your purchaser will need to contact CS directly and try to sort it out. I'm honestly not sure what's even happened at this point, if anything. To my knowledge, we have not started canceling orders yet, unless CS has instituted a new policy that I'm not currently aware of.

---

So lets see here

- Josh lies on the BFL forums to all his customers
- I call him on it in their own forums citing specific examples and even take the high road of formally posting an apology. Have my lawyer call Jordan to discuss his case.
- Josh deletes my well reasoned and cogent comments and continues his taunting

 See a pattern developing ?

 Remember. I'm the bad guy here folks.

Hypocrisy: I post comments. Josh deletes them. I'm the one rewriting (or deleting) inconvenient history.
Irony: The thousands Josh is going to need to spend on their own lawyer when dealing with mine.

 And on a personal note, I really cannot understand how or why he is acting so completely irrationally with respect to this, almost like he finds this funny or as a joke Sad This is not normal behavior. It's so easy for him to do the right thing here, and it's really sad we're now going to have to put Newton's Third Law into motion legally Sad

 So much for trying to resolve this as adults.
full member
Activity: 532
Merit: 104
MLM means Multi-Level Marketing. In case anyone is wondering.

This is not an accusation, simply a definition for those that do not know what an MLM scheme might be.



They are considered bad because the resellers at the very bottom never make their money back. Only those at the start of the pyramid make their money back and then some.

Could you not find a picture of Josh ? or are your photoshop skills to shit ?

Like your drive recovery skills asshole ?
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
Thanks for debunking that conspiracy. Google was wrong ! *gasps*

Actually..
descr:          Netrouting Telecom Sweden
country:        SE
http://dazzlepod.com/ip/94.185.85.171/
hero member
Activity: 568
Merit: 500
Actually..
Queried whois.ripe.net with "-B 94.185.85.171"...

Information related to '94.185.85.0 - 94.185.85.255'

inetnum:        94.185.85.0 - 94.185.85.255
netname:        SE-NETROUTING
descr:          Netrouting Telecom Sweden
country:        SE
admin-c:        NN1175-RIPE
tech-c:         NN1175-RIPE
status:         ASSIGNED PA
mnt-by:         NETROUTING-MNT
changed:        [email protected] 20120524
source:         RIPE

person:         Netrouting NOC
org:            ORG-NA302-RIPE
address:        Boyleweg 2
address:        3208 KA Spijkenisse
address:        The Netherlands
phone:          +31 880454600
e-mail:         [email protected]
abuse-mailbox:  [email protected]
nic-hdl:        NN1175-RIPE
mnt-by:         NETROUTING-MNT
changed:        [email protected] 20120504
source:         RIPE

http://dazzlepod.com/ip/94.185.85.171/
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
@ Xian
Could you check your PM's? (I sent you a message last night about something you mentioned yesterday)

 Sorry bro. Have been busy this morning. Check PM.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1003
@ Xian

Could you check your PM's? (I sent you a message last night about something you mentioned yesterday)
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
GG Google GeoIP information. Thanks for debunking the conspiracy SLok.

... Coincidence ?

---
From:    [email protected]
Subject:    Suspicious sign in prevented
Date:    June 2, 2013 1:00:19 PM CDT

Hi Christian,

Someone recently tried to use an application to sign in to your Google Account - [email protected].

We prevented the sign-in attempt in case this was a hijacker trying to access your account. Please review the details of the sign-in attempt:

Sunday, June 2, 2013 6:00:19 PM UTC
IP Address: 94.185.85.171
Location: Florissant, MO, USA

EDIT: Wanted to post this coincidental event to the BFL forums, but it appears things have now gone into lockdown over there with needing moderators to approve posts.
legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
Jun.2.2013: Another lie

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/3026-forced-refunds.html#post37336

"BFL_Josh BFL is not doing forced refunds on anyone. Whoever you purchased through is lying to you."

Josh used the present tense. Maybe right that second they were not forcing a refund on anyone.  Cheesy

Quote
Please be advised that due to the adjustments described above, we need your confirmation prior to release of your order into the final build queue and on to final delivery.  It may also be a good time to review your purchase altogether relative to the bitcoin market as this is the last opportunity to do so.  If your order is not confirmed, it will be canceled and your money will be refunded.

"For those who don't jump through the hoop correctly, your order will be canceled, and we will go on record afterward stating that we don't do force refunds."
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
Jun.2.2013: Another lie

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/3026-forced-refunds.html#post37336

"BFL_Josh BFL is not doing forced refunds on anyone. Whoever you purchased through is lying to you."

Josh used the present tense. Maybe right that second they were not forcing a refund on anyone.  Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
Jun.2.2013: Another lie

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/3026-forced-refunds.html#post37336

"BFL_Josh BFL is not doing forced refunds on anyone. Whoever you purchased through is lying to you."
full member
Activity: 145
Merit: 105
Drama queen much?  Cheesy

 Drama is slowly getting warmed up. Suggest you stock up on popcorn.

 *hugs*
I already did. Imagine if KNCminer delivers before BFL? Grin
legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
I'm trying to understand how they can think to start offering chips for sale without having the ability to ship their own assembled and functional hardware in significant volume.

*boggles*

Am I missing something ? (other than 4 preorders for 60GHs Single SCs ?)

Makes sense to me.

Sell the chips, along with selling or telling folks were to get the other components, and give simple instructions as to how it all goes together. And it has to work because BFL did it a couple times, with a few more times to go. You saw the video. Even Mexicans from a temp service were able to put it all together.

For those who are slow, the above is sarcasm. The truth is they ain't got a clue as to how to make it all work, thus pawning off overpriced chips to you, implying it's a just a matter of connecting part A to part B, like an Ikea or Heathkit kit.

BFL is fucking you in the ass, and they ain't using any lube. And don't even think about bitching about it, otherwise they'll stop fucking you, making you go without. Think about it!
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1003
MLM means Multi-Level Marketing. In case anyone is wondering.

This is not an accusation, simply a definition for those that do not know what an MLM scheme might be.



They are considered bad because the resellers at the very bottom never make their money back. Only those at the start of the pyramid make their money back and then some.
hero member
Activity: 924
Merit: 1000
Mining Rigs in General almost look like MLM schemes given the difficulty rate of Bitcoin... what can we learn from warnings about MLM and BFL tactics so far somethings may or may apply but it is interesting to compare especially given the action of BFL to cancel Xian01's order.

http://pyramidschemealert.org/PSAMain/resources/12tests1.pdf

Quote
Twelve Tests for Evaluating a Network Marketing (MLM) “Opportunity”
By Jon M. Taylor, Ph.D., Consumer Awareness Institute

The following tests should help you avoid programs in which you will only be wasting your money, time, and effort.

THE OPPORTUNITY TEST

Were you approached primarily on the basis of the actual value and need for the products—or for the “opportunity?” If the latter, the program may be actually a pyramid device for enriching the company and a small group of upline distributors.

Another red flag to look for is promoters who talk of “getting in on the ground floor” or “riding the wave” of opportunity. Usually, the bulk of the income in these cases is already locked in by the founding distributors in the pyramidal hierarchy.

THE MARKET REALITY TEST

Also, ask if the company allows unlimited recruiting of distributors in an area—with no territorial protection or other provisions for preventing market saturation? If so, you may be buying a ticket for a flight that has already departed. You could be left holding a bag of empty promises and a worthless ticket.

THE PRODUCT TEST

Review the products offered and ask yourself:

Are products of consistently high quality, and do they carry a buy-back guarantee? Can all product claims (such as health claims) be backed up by reliable research? Are orders filled and shipped promptly? And are manufacturing and expiration dates printed on consumable products?¸

THE COMPENSATION TEST

While a few distributors at the top of the pyramid will be rewarded handsomely, as many as 99% (over 99.9% in some programs) of distributors beneath them will come away empty—most actually losing money, after subtracting expenses and product purchases. Also, in some programs, your quitting merely enhances the income of your upline—because income from your downline “rolls up” to those above you.

THE INCOME DISCLOSURE TEST

If less than 1% of all distributors earn the equivalent of a minimum wage for their time (after subtracting all expenses and MLM products purchased), you might want to consider a more profitable use of your money, time, and energy. (Some researchers estimate that for most MLM programs, less than 1% of distributors ever turn a profit.)

THE “PAY TO PLAY” TEST

This requirement (or strong suggestion) that you make large purchases of products over a period of time to qualify for increasing bonus levels or purchasing discounts is one sign of a product-based pyramid scheme. After months or years of fruitless effort and a garage full of products, some participants come to realize they have merely been paying into a pyramid scheme in the form of payments for unneeded products.

THE PRICE TEST

If products are priced at a premium to support a large network of distributors, then the premium portion of the price could be considered the pyramid portion. So if a MLM product sells for $40 and a comparable product would sell for $20 at a typical retail outlet, the $20 premium may be deemed the pyramid portion of the price and would flow to top distributors in typical pyramid fashion.

THE GOLDEN RULE TEST

How did you feel about the way you were recruited to do the business, and how do you feel about approaching your family and friends in the same way? How important are your relationships to you? Are you offended when they attempt to exploit your connection with them for monetary gain? Would you want to do the exploiting?

THE TIME FREEDOM TEST

The perennial dream of those with a pyramidal mentality is to be successful at recruiting a downline that will bring in enough money to support them so they won’t have to work themselves—thus giving them “time freedom.” They can then “leverage” their time by living off the efforts of others. If a recruiter promises that by working hard for a brief time period you will never have to work again, ask what percent of their top distributors are no longer actively involved with the company—and never attend opportunity meetings.

THE HONESTY TEST

Has the recruiter been devious or up front in his or her inviting attempts? And can the products and “opportunity” be sold without making exaggerated product and income claims? Ask for validation of each of the claims made.

If you find the truth frequently distorted, powerful and escalating incentives may be driving the recruitment. If normally honest persons feel the need to exaggerate
claims to sell the products and the program, you may find yourself having to do the same.

THE CREDIBILITY TEST

MLM promoters who don’t command respect themselves may lean heavily on the “credentials” or “character” of others involved in the “opportunity.” If such references are used to excess, watch out. Such credibility links can be deceptive. Why? Because the ethics of MLM are so tricky to sort out that respectable and high level people have been drawn into the most problematical of programs.

THE SUPPORT TEST

Does the company offer an adequate support infrastructure to handle a temporary burst of volume? Will your upline be there when you need them, or do they have a history of jumping ship when the next hot MLM deal comes along?

A FINAL WORD

If you have found this flyer helpful in deciding about participation in MLM, you could be doing your friends and family a favor by sharing this information with at least five of them. Then ask each of them to share it with five more persons, and suggest they tell each of them to share it with five more, and © 2000 Jon M. Taylor. This flyer may be reproduced in its entirely for consumer awareness, but may not be sold or packaged for sale without the author’s written permission. It has been designed for easy reproduction on 8½ x11-inch paper.

For more information on problems with network marketing and possible solutions, visit our website— http://www.PyramidSchemeAlert.org. Or email: [email protected] .
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
Drama queen much?  Cheesy

 Drama is slowly getting warmed up. Suggest you stock up on popcorn.

 *hugs*
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100
I'm trying to understand how they can think to start offering chips for sale without having the ability to ship their own assembled and functional hardware in significant volume.

*boggles*

Am I missing something ? (other than 4 preorders for 60GHs Single SCs ?)

Still missing those huh? Here I was thinking you'd already been made whole on those preorders...

Drama queen much?  Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1067
Christian Antkow
I'm trying to understand how they can think to start offering chips for sale without having the ability to ship their own assembled and functional hardware in significant volume.

*boggles*

Am I missing something ? (other than 4 preorders for 60GHs Single SCs ?)
hero member
Activity: 924
Merit: 1000
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