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Topic: Butterfly Labs Forced "On Hold For Refund" for all my Single SC orders - page 9. (Read 59178 times)

sr. member
Activity: 247
Merit: 250
Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.

Except people who bought into ASIC scams, which currently make up about 25% of the threads in this forum. Those people will be wishing they had bought less.

Just because BFL has an ASIC does not mean they can provide ASICs to everyone who ordered. There are still many ways for things to go bad:

What if the chips produced have issues? Poor design can result in binning issues that render a large amount of chips unusable.
What if they burned up all the cash? Lots of startups and fledgling businesses put too much into salaries and infrastructure and run out of funds before the product is ready.

I worry that there are still too many what-ifs while they have such a huge backlog of unshipped orders. Venture capital companies would probably avoid them due to their president having a felony fraud conviction. Banks probably would not advance them factor credit for the same reason.

7 months late is a lot time to have a production line sitting around idle.

What if, what if, what if...
You sound more paranoid than Alex Jones.
What if the price of bitcoin falls to a dollar tomorrow. What if I get hit by a bus.
Investing is risky. I mine as a hedge for holding BTC. I make money mining, and I make money holding. It works. Like I said. I have FPGA units, and I am happy with them. Other than delays (which I fully expected, due to Moore's Law) I am pretty happy with BFL.

First of all:
Name:   chalidore
Account created: May 18, 2013, 11:05:58 PM

I what if'ed things that have already gone wrong.
Their chips had issues, they have had to go back twice (by their own admission) and redo them. The chips are still under performing.
They admitted that they have had a production line idle for 7 months.

There are things you can anticipate going wrong like bad design, overly optimistic planning, aggressive performance goals. Worrying about things like that is not being paranoid, it is called doing your homework.
You said what if BFL runs out of money. How does a company that makes money-making machines (the leading company in the industry) run out of money? Seriously, what are the odds of that happening?
Just because my account is new, does not mean I am new to Bitcoin.
Check Deepbit. I am the owner of ROBOT-ARMY. I have mined over 2500 bitcoins on Deepbit and over 200 on Slush. I have been putting off making an account on this forum because I don't feel like spending a lot of my time educating a bunch of stupid trolls. I had originally planned to use this forum to get rid of my GPU mining gear and buy ASIC/FPGA. It was never my intention to waste my time arguing with trolls. So much for that.

oooo big bitcoin baller chiladore.... noones cares how many you have mined, neither do we care about robot army or whatever crap you just said,
your answer back was really unintelligent , the point which K9quaint is making is that you can't dismiss 'what ifs'.
sure you could get hit by a bus tomorrow however if you use the green man lights as appose to walking across during moving traffic, you will have less of a chance of getting hit by a bus, its called RISK ASSESSMENT AND RISK LEVERAGING. which is vital for survival in anything.
Now BFL IS PLAGUED AND RIDDLED WITH RISKS ON A PRODUCT THATS HARDLY BEEN SHIPPED. on a risk scale out of ten i would give BFL a '9'
so yes you can buy BFL products, you can also go on satoshi dice and gamble 2500 bitcoins at a 100/1 odds
why arn't you doing that Chilladore, for the same reason people shouldn't buy BFL products
UNNESECCARY RISK
chiladore - troll
Your grammar is awful, and the all caps thing is so last century.
The amount of Bitcoin I have mined is totally relevant, as this is a mining forum. Anyone can go to Deepbit and see what I have mined.
I use the Bitcoin I have mined to buy new gear. I hit ROI on my gear almost a year ago, so I am risking nothing.
Some people like to wait for the light to turn green, even if there are no cars around. I have noticed when I am downtown large groups of people will stand on a corner waiting for a light to change, even though there are no cars coming. I usually jay walk in these situations, and when I do, several people that were standing there waiting follow me. Some people are afraid to go against a red light without someone else stepping off the curb first, and some refuse to walk until after the light turns green, but the anarchist that stepped off the curb first knows the satisfaction of leadership, and will also get to work/lunch before the followers do.
I don't work downtown anymore anyway. I quit my stupid job and became a full-time Bitcoin miner.
Call me a troll if you want. At least I didn't troll so hard that I lost my place in line for my ASIC. That would be the most epic troll fail ever.
hero member
Activity: 574
Merit: 500
Here's my profiling of - k9quaint - I wondered how old he was - here is my analysis (age in brackets)

Why does it matter who old is the speaker? I do not believe that it affects the validity of the facts or arguments put forward by them.

I thought it would be a good exercise in psychological profiling - you're next Smiley

First guess without even reading your posts is 21 - am I right?

[EDIT] you are not allowed to go and quickly remove your old posts as this is 'destruction of evidence'

I stand by my post history 100%. You are off by a factor of 2 on my age.  I am flattered you would spend so much time on me. I am a software engineer. My specialty is network security.
Either I am young at heart, or you are bad at profiling. I think I could live with either outcome.  Grin

Well, that surprises me - so you are 42 - there's no way you can see that in your posts - either you are immature or you just haven't learned much...

I think I could live with either outcome.  Grin

Edit: oh, and I am married. You could play for the Mets with that batting average.  Roll Eyes

[EDIT] now I know you are lying...
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
Here's my profiling of - k9quaint - I wondered how old he was - here is my analysis (age in brackets)

Why does it matter who old is the speaker? I do not believe that it affects the validity of the facts or arguments put forward by them.

I thought it would be a good exercise in psychological profiling - you're next Smiley

First guess without even reading your posts is 21 - am I right?

[EDIT] you are not allowed to go and quickly remove your old posts as this is 'destruction of evidence'

I stand by my post history 100%. You are off by a factor of 2 on my age.  I am flattered you would spend so much time on me. I am a software engineer. My specialty is network security.
Either I am young at heart, or you are bad at profiling. I think I could live with either outcome.  Grin

Edit: oh, and I am married. You could play for the Mets with that batting average.  Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.

Except people who bought into ASIC scams, which currently make up about 25% of the threads in this forum. Those people will be wishing they had bought less.

Just because BFL has an ASIC does not mean they can provide ASICs to everyone who ordered. There are still many ways for things to go bad:

What if the chips produced have issues? Poor design can result in binning issues that render a large amount of chips unusable.
What if they burned up all the cash? Lots of startups and fledgling businesses put too much into salaries and infrastructure and run out of funds before the product is ready.

I worry that there are still too many what-ifs while they have such a huge backlog of unshipped orders. Venture capital companies would probably avoid them due to their president having a felony fraud conviction. Banks probably would not advance them factor credit for the same reason.

7 months late is a lot time to have a production line sitting around idle.

What if, what if, what if...
You sound more paranoid than Alex Jones.
What if the price of bitcoin falls to a dollar tomorrow. What if I get hit by a bus.
Investing is risky. I mine as a hedge for holding BTC. I make money mining, and I make money holding. It works. Like I said. I have FPGA units, and I am happy with them. Other than delays (which I fully expected, due to Moore's Law) I am pretty happy with BFL.

First of all:
Name:   chalidore
Account created: May 18, 2013, 11:05:58 PM

I what if'ed things that have already gone wrong.
Their chips had issues, they have had to go back twice (by their own admission) and redo them. The chips are still under performing.
They admitted that they have had a production line idle for 7 months.

There are things you can anticipate going wrong like bad design, overly optimistic planning, aggressive performance goals. Worrying about things like that is not being paranoid, it is called doing your homework.
You said what if BFL runs out of money. How does a company that makes money-making machines (the leading company in the industry) run out of money? Seriously, what are the odds of that happening?
If they pre-sold 70,000 units at $179, but it costs $189 to build. They could mine with them before they sell them to increase their margins.
If their founders embezzled all the money and there is none left to fund production.

Just because my account is new, does not mean I am new to Bitcoin.
Check Deepbit. I am the owner of ROBOT-ARMY. I have mined over 2500 bitcoins on Deepbit and over 200 on Slush. I have been putting off making an account on this forum because I don't feel like spending a lot of my time educating a bunch of stupid trolls. I had originally planned to use this forum to get rid of my GPU mining gear and buy ASIC/FPGA. It was never my intention to waste my time arguing with trolls. So much for that.

Fair enough. Astro-turfing with sockpuppet accounts is a time honored tradition for scammers on these forums. I like all the data up front where everyone can see it.
hero member
Activity: 574
Merit: 500
Here's my profiling of - k9quaint - I wondered how old he was - here is my analysis (age in brackets)

Why does it matter who old is the speaker? I do not believe that it affects the validity of the facts or arguments put forward by them.

I thought it would be a good exercise in psychological profiling - you're next Smiley

First guess without even reading your posts is 21 - am I right?

[EDIT] you are not allowed to go and quickly remove your old posts as this is 'destruction of evidence'
sr. member
Activity: 854
Merit: 253
l0tt0.com
Here's my profiling of - k9quaint - I wondered how old he was - here is my analysis (age in brackets)

Why does it matter who old is the speaker? I do not believe that it affects the validity of the facts or arguments put forward by them.
hero member
Activity: 574
Merit: 500
Here's my profiling of - k9quaint - I wondered how old he was - here is my analysis (age in brackets)


https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.413829

money oriented (18)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.413915

helpful - at the very beginning (19)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.468318

latin quote - want's to be see as intellectual (20)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.483846

maths student - use of 'empirical measurement to a perfect world theoretical average' (22)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.486469

confidence growing - longer posts (22)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.487544

his first "you don't understand" post - mood is shifting (22)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.530845

want's to see source code - doubt he's a programmer (22)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.542978

no girlfriend/wife (22)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.554958

investigator (23)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.609990

beginning of abusive posts - still using Smiley smilies whilst being abusive however (23)

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.681009

discovered that you can use pictures to abuse (22)

More analysis to follow - although reading through this guys history it's starting to become very samey.

Age so far - 22
sr. member
Activity: 247
Merit: 250
Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.

Except people who bought into ASIC scams, which currently make up about 25% of the threads in this forum. Those people will be wishing they had bought less.

Just because BFL has an ASIC does not mean they can provide ASICs to everyone who ordered. There are still many ways for things to go bad:

What if the chips produced have issues? Poor design can result in binning issues that render a large amount of chips unusable.
What if they burned up all the cash? Lots of startups and fledgling businesses put too much into salaries and infrastructure and run out of funds before the product is ready.

I worry that there are still too many what-ifs while they have such a huge backlog of unshipped orders. Venture capital companies would probably avoid them due to their president having a felony fraud conviction. Banks probably would not advance them factor credit for the same reason.

7 months late is a lot time to have a production line sitting around idle.

What if, what if, what if...
You sound more paranoid than Alex Jones.
What if the price of bitcoin falls to a dollar tomorrow. What if I get hit by a bus.
Investing is risky. I mine as a hedge for holding BTC. I make money mining, and I make money holding. It works. Like I said. I have FPGA units, and I am happy with them. Other than delays (which I fully expected, due to Moore's Law) I am pretty happy with BFL.

First of all:
Name:   chalidore
Account created: May 18, 2013, 11:05:58 PM

I what if'ed things that have already gone wrong.
Their chips had issues, they have had to go back twice (by their own admission) and redo them. The chips are still under performing.
They admitted that they have had a production line idle for 7 months.

There are things you can anticipate going wrong like bad design, overly optimistic planning, aggressive performance goals. Worrying about things like that is not being paranoid, it is called doing your homework.
You said what if BFL runs out of money. How does a company that makes money-making machines (the leading company in the industry) run out of money? Seriously, what are the odds of that happening?
Just because my account is new, does not mean I am new to Bitcoin.
Check Deepbit. I am the owner of ROBOT-ARMY. I have mined over 2500 bitcoins on Deepbit and over 200 on Slush. I have been putting off making an account on this forum because I don't feel like spending a lot of my time educating a bunch of stupid trolls. I had originally planned to use this forum to get rid of my GPU mining gear and buy ASIC/FPGA. It was never my intention to waste my time arguing with trolls. So much for that.
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.

Except people who bought into ASIC scams, which currently make up about 25% of the threads in this forum. Those people will be wishing they had bought less.

Just because BFL has an ASIC does not mean they can provide ASICs to everyone who ordered. There are still many ways for things to go bad:

What if the chips produced have issues? Poor design can result in binning issues that render a large amount of chips unusable.
What if they burned up all the cash? Lots of startups and fledgling businesses put too much into salaries and infrastructure and run out of funds before the product is ready.

I worry that there are still too many what-ifs while they have such a huge backlog of unshipped orders. Venture capital companies would probably avoid them due to their president having a felony fraud conviction. Banks probably would not advance them factor credit for the same reason.

7 months late is a lot time to have a production line sitting around idle.

What if, what if, what if...
You sound more paranoid than Alex Jones.
What if the price of bitcoin falls to a dollar tomorrow. What if I get hit by a bus.
Investing is risky. I mine as a hedge for holding BTC. I make money mining, and I make money holding. It works. Like I said. I have FPGA units, and I am happy with them. Other than delays (which I fully expected, due to Moore's Law) I am pretty happy with BFL.

First of all:
Name:   chalidore
Account created: May 18, 2013, 11:05:58 PM

I what if'ed things that have already gone wrong.
Their chips had issues, they have had to go back twice (by their own admission) and redo them. The chips are still under performing.
They admitted that they have had a production line idle for 7 months.

There are things you can anticipate going wrong like bad design, overly optimistic planning, aggressive performance goals. Worrying about things like that is not being paranoid, it is called doing your homework.
sr. member
Activity: 247
Merit: 250
Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.

Except people who bought into ASIC scams, which currently make up about 25% of the threads in this forum. Those people will be wishing they had bought less.

Just because BFL has an ASIC does not mean they can provide ASICs to everyone who ordered. There are still many ways for things to go bad:

What if the chips produced have issues? Poor design can result in binning issues that render a large amount of chips unusable.
What if they burned up all the cash? Lots of startups and fledgling businesses put too much into salaries and infrastructure and run out of funds before the product is ready.

I worry that there are still too many what-ifs while they have such a huge backlog of unshipped orders. Venture capital companies would probably avoid them due to their president having a felony fraud conviction. Banks probably would not advance them factor credit for the same reason.

7 months late is a lot time to have a production line sitting around idle.

What if, what if, what if...
You sound more paranoid than Alex Jones.
What if the price of bitcoin falls to a dollar tomorrow. What if I get hit by a bus.
Investing is risky. I mine as a hedge for holding BTC. I make money mining, and I make money holding. It works. Like I said. I have FPGA units, and I am happy with them. Other than delays (which I fully expected, due to Moore's Law) I am pretty happy with BFL.
full member
Activity: 236
Merit: 100
Intoh aka josh is using a sock puppet as he knows that the moment one law suit is issued against BFL and won, the gates or narnia will be torn down and BFL will be having to spend probably ALL their money on lawyers as everyones going to jump on board as frankly this BFL BULLSHIT is getting old. who knows perhaps fraudulent activity will end up being discovered by these DOUCHEBAGS, does this company even get audited Huh?  to prove to the customers where their money has gone. HOW DO WE KNOW THAT BFL LABS ARNT GIVING THEMSELVES 6 FIGURE SALARIES WITH THE CUSTOMERS MONEY?
JOSH I KNOW YOUR READING THIS AND YOUR MONKEY IQ WHICH IS PORTRAYED BY YOUR RESPONSES TO CUSTOMERS IS NOT SMARTER THAN THE PUBLIC, SO CUT YOUR HORSE S**T! ****HOLE

 This what I am having trouble wrapping my head around.

 - Be an asshole towards people/customers on Bitcoin talk
 - Have your customers call you out on being an asshole
 - Punitively cancel your customers' preorders because they talked back to you
 - Former customer is sure to be silenced, slink away into the night, never to be heard from again
 - Continue to taunt their former customer that they seemingly have no legal recourse
 
 It never should have reached the point where I became as irate as I did. EVER.

 This is clearly not a normal business-transaction scenario. Certainly not like one I have ever committed myself to.

 To support and applaud these sort of business ethics in America seems foreign to me.

 
 


If you'll put it towards starting legal proceedings, I would be interesting in donating 0.5 BTC.

It's disgusting that people who obviously have some kind of attachment to BFL created sockpuppet accounts in order to taunt you and attempt to degrade you.

It will be funny to see them get owned by having to pay you damages.  I would be surprised if a letter from an attorney is not enough to get your order resinstated though.  At this point, they must know their despicable actions have put them in a bit of a bind.
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.

Except people who bought into ASIC scams, which currently make up about 25% of the threads in this forum. Those people will be wishing they had bought less.

Just because BFL has an ASIC does not mean they can provide ASICs to everyone who ordered. There are still many ways for things to go bad:

What if the chips produced have issues? Poor design can result in binning issues that render a large amount of chips unusable.
What if they burned up all the cash? Lots of startups and fledgling businesses put too much into salaries and infrastructure and run out of funds before the product is ready.

I worry that there are still too many what-ifs while they have such a huge backlog of unshipped orders. Venture capital companies would probably avoid them due to their president having a felony fraud conviction. Banks probably would not advance them factor credit for the same reason.

7 months late is a lot time to have a production line sitting around idle.
full member
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
In Gord We Trust
Josh's last blog on their forums dated 10-19-2012

Quote
Sorry guys! It's been a really busy day here at the Labs. I haven't had enough time to get to a lot of the posts on the forums today, but I will get to them this weekend, I promise!

I was holding on to some of the pics of our products, but Bitcoin Magazine wanted to publish a couple for their upcoming article in the November issue, so I went ahead and released them in the article section. Yes, they really are that small... that is a normal sized hand, not Andre the Giant holding it. You can see my sexy, sexy fingers in the first picture, holding the Minirig SC card.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_josh/26-busy-day.html

LOL they are really that small. LOL as if they really had anything to showcase that had any future meaning at all. Now 7.5 months later...still pretty much nothing.  Tongue

Quote
HolyScott - 10-19-2012 07:53 PM

    WHoooohoooo!!! We Haven't All Been SCAMMED!!!!!!

Ummm... Has NO ONE noticed that first comment to his blog post?
full member
Activity: 194
Merit: 100
Now they offer a 2Gh/s 'upgrade' on the 5GH/s thing $100.00


FLAME ON!
sr. member
Activity: 247
Merit: 250
Quote
I have 2 orders with them. One in October, one in January. I am annoyed that I don't have my hardware, however I have BFL FPGA units, and I love them. I knew what I was getting into when I ordered a product that did not yet exist. I psychologically prepared myself to not get my hardware until this summer, because anything before that would defy Moore's law. Difficulty will go up, price will go up, and mining will continue to be profitable. Those mining with the best hardware will have an edge. Those without ASIC will be butt-hurt and jealous.

chalidore I'm genuinely curious about 2 things:

1) What do you think the odds are that you will receive your product in 2013?  

2) Would there be any point in the future where you would cancel your preorders because they are no longer profitable?

Thank you. Honestly would like to hear your thoughts.
1) Considering that they had a working prototype at the last meet-up, and some of the 5gh units are already shipping, I would say my odds are pretty good.
2) ASIC ROI is a good bet anytime over the next couple years. This is a game changer, and will become the new standard. The market will adjust to difficulty and available technology, but having the latest tech is huge. I am still mining with a sizable GPU farm, as it is still profitable. I seriously wish I would have bought more FPGA, but hindsight is 20/20. Next year I will be wishing I had bought more ASIC. Everyone will be.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1018
Buzz App - Spin wheel, farm rewards
Quote
I have 2 orders with them. One in October, one in January. I am annoyed that I don't have my hardware, however I have BFL FPGA units, and I love them. I knew what I was getting into when I ordered a product that did not yet exist. I psychologically prepared myself to not get my hardware until this summer, because anything before that would defy Moore's law. Difficulty will go up, price will go up, and mining will continue to be profitable. Those mining with the best hardware will have an edge. Those without ASIC will be butt-hurt and jealous.

chalidore I'm genuinely curious about 2 things:

1) What do you think the odds are that you will receive your product in 2013?  

2) Would there be any point in the future where you would cancel your preorders because they are no longer profitable?

Thank you. Honestly would like to hear your thoughts.
sr. member
Activity: 247
Merit: 250

I don't consider myself to be a paranoid person, but I've little doubt that there are pro BFL sockpuppet/shills plying their trade on the bitcointalk stage.

why? Becouse BFL has proved what a reputable company they are? so surely they wouldn't?
i think the opposite infact, BFL OBVIOUSLY doesn't have a PR team, so what else would be there tactic to entice customers and shut negative perceptions hhmmm well they COULD use SOCKPUPPETS as appose to a PR team to root BFL on bitcointalk.org and other related site which has a high concentration of potential customers..... this way its cheaper than hiring a PR team, so BFL can have more customers money to spunk on their salaries/bonuses for a job that could be done better by my pet dog......its a no brainer..... proof? they don't have a PR team what else do they use, and just see INTO3 comments, thats just josh all over,its easy to spot josh's word vomit

Furthermore who else would passionately back BFL

its either
1 - one of the few customers who purchased a BFL jalapeno and it has arrived
2- Someone who didnt purchase or purchased a BFL and hasnt arrived
3- BFL team aka josh

soo lets analyse this
1- one of the few customers who purchased a BFl jalapeno would have been annoyed they had to wait along time therefore i Doubt they would back BFL passionately like INTOHo3
2- someone who didn't purchase a BFL or purchased the BFL and it hasn't arrived - these guys are pissed off they havn't recieved a BFL product therefore wont back BFL, someone who didn't purchase a BFL (whether it be for whatever reason) are the most rational observers and if they read BFL history  they most certainly would not be passionately backing BFL.
3- that leaves BFL team - who are trying to save there ass
I have 2 orders with them. One in October, one in January. I am annoyed that I don't have my hardware, however I have BFL FPGA units, and I love them. I knew what I was getting into when I ordered a product that did not yet exist. I psychologically prepared myself to not get my hardware until this summer, because anything before that would defy Moore's law. Difficulty will go up, price will go up, and mining will continue to be profitable. Those mining with the best hardware will have an edge. Those without ASIC will be butt-hurt and jealous.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1018
Buzz App - Spin wheel, farm rewards
I continue to be surprised that the vast majority have not cancelled their pre-orders with BFL.

It's been shown beyond and reasonable doubt they lie, can not be trusted (for examples sneaking out of 2 big bets), and are incompetent (do not have the ability to make the 'pre-order' product as promised).

Why would anyone not request a refund? Unless you pre-ordered in the first 3 months or so, it is likely by the time your number comes around they'll have run away by then with your money or have gone bankrupt, and not to mention, difficulty will be so high that you probably won't even get your ROI. BTC locked up with BFL is money that you could have used in a 100 other great opportunities in the Bitcoin world.

The thing I've taken away as a personal lesson from this BFL fiasco is how important advertising can be. The company did an excellent job selling their 'products' with slick ads put on the right websites -- so much so that they are still selling a good amount of pre-orders, even though realistically, I'd put them at only having about a 5% chance of giving a ROI. That one element of the company has impressed me.
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
Josh's last blog on their forums dated 10-19-2012

Quote
Sorry guys! It's been a really busy day here at the Labs. I haven't had enough time to get to a lot of the posts on the forums today, but I will get to them this weekend, I promise!

I was holding on to some of the pics of our products, but Bitcoin Magazine wanted to publish a couple for their upcoming article in the November issue, so I went ahead and released them in the article section. Yes, they really are that small... that is a normal sized hand, not Andre the Giant holding it. You can see my sexy, sexy fingers in the first picture, holding the Minirig SC card.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_josh/26-busy-day.html

LOL they are really that small. LOL as if they really had anything to showcase that had any future meaning at all. Now 7.5 months later...still pretty much nothing.  Tongue
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
The ONE thing BFL has done well through all their endless shell games is to keep the money coming in while nothing but bs goes out...even this will eventually come to an end. I dunno if this is the beginning of the end or no, but I think their behavior is becoming increasingly outrageous. This seems indicative of a collapsing house of cards.

I don't consider myself to be a paranoid person, but I've little doubt that there are pro BFL sockpuppet/shills plying their trade on the bitcointalk stage.

Just wait for it. BFL is pretty silent these days.

Not much produced but talk if any at all.

Let's assume they have a working line of hardware at their now newly advertised specs.

Do any of us really believe they have enough money to satisfy all outstanding pre-orders in the queue of 11 months?

Hell no.

BFL does not want to talk about this because if they do then any attempt to sucker in more pre-order money is in vain. They are praying right now that enough suckers order their vaporware and are willing to wait....1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11+ months for their order.

The writing is on the wall and soon BFL and Josh's face will be on wanted posters if they do not run like wussies.
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